Rishi Das

I definitely agree that on an individual basis, awakening leads to a much more "rich and full" experience of life; that being said in our seeking of realization we look to be extracted from the wheel of cyclic existence pointing me in the direction that while life might be a lot more "rich and full" it is still pretty mundane and something we become totally comfortable letting go of. The way I see it is that upon realization, communing with the divine is all that is, in that regard it seems obvious that everything becomes much more beautiful; that doesn't take away from the fact that offering Seva to the world is about all that's left. My statement however was more or less directed toward a mass awakening of the world and all sentient beings therein. That being said, that's just the vibe I get when I attend to those thoughts; I guess my little egoic mind just doesn't see the point of physicality if all was realized by all; more or less I see the fun as coming from ignorance to knowing, almost like a game of hide and seek. EDIT: I don't mean to come off as knowing, that's definitely not even close to the case. What I say is pure opinion and more or less what I have pulled from experience up until now.

If all the masters, gurus, realized beings (whatever you want to call them) got together, what would they even have to discuss? What would be the point of such a gathering besides residing in the presence of another human being that knows what's up? Taking a shot in the dark, i'd say it'd end up being one big meditation session, each individual just enjoying the moment, abiding in the divine as they always do. Were you hinting at the possibility that if all these people gathered in a large group they would be able to summon up some magic powers that would enlighten the world, possibly create peace on earth? That begs me to ask the question, where's the fun in that? From all that i've learned, a big part of realization is understanding that one must, let be, what is. I think the real point is exactly what you pointed out, "to each their own." In my opinion one has to be hungry for realization, and then with that hunger work diligently for it. The walking Buddha's I assume understand this and so do not go about pushing anything on anyone. In my opinion it doesn't have to do with a lack of care in people or the fates of the masses; more like people and the masses having a lack of care in what these realized beings have to offer. When the cords of attachment to the world are cut, they find themselves here only to offer seva; to help along those that seek to truly know truth. I guess my question is, what point would the world have if everyone were to awaken all at once anyways? The answer that seems to come is that the play of consciousness would be over; and then what? We decide to play again?

Thank you for the heads up Trunk, much appreciated brother. Will definitely be staying up all night.

Thanks for the quick and informative response Harmonious, much appreciated!

Definitely some great advice that's already been given. Just to add my 2c As prescribed to me by my teacher: Try bringing the tongue to the roof of the mouth. No need to make it uncomfortable, just rest it up there in the most natural position possible.

Do you think a combination of Kelp, Spirulina, and Chlorella is over doing it? I've been doing a bit of research online but can't seem to find a straight forward answer. At the moment I currently take my fair share of both spirulina as well as chlorella but this thread has peaked my interest about iodine and it's effects not only on the thyroid but also on it's effectiveness at breaking down the fluoride build up. If you don't mind me asking Harmonious, what was/is your regiment as far as taking kelp?

Spirulina. Chlorella.

I think the problem is in the fact that "I" doesn't want enlightenment to exist; and so as long as "I" is in the drivers seat, enlightenment will always come and go. The tools for that little project are pretty much laid out on this site, in a pretty damn good way I might add.

From my point of view: your self has nothing to see, no where to stand, and nothing to label; and so it begins, a mystery of sorts at it's finest

I'm sorry if I came across as alluding to the statements faultiness; to clarify I simply mean't that while the statement seems appropriate the quality behind the words does not seem sincere. I merely mean't to point out that I believe you could benefit from a sincerely devoted practice, and a teacher that knows what they are talking about. The fact is that you really don't have to do anything, by being still and paying close attention, you will meet yourself. Plain and simple. Every thought is merely a thought. I would argue that being aware is not doing at all, in fact being aware occurs in all that doing your talking about.

From my take, you have a good way of articulating things you have pulled from the literature, so in that respect a library may not be best for you. Making statements is one thing, however understanding those statements through experience is completely different. If your interested in this sort of stuff, find a practice you enjoy, practice it, and then simply let arise what naturally arises. On a better note, find a teacher who knows a practice, practice it, and then simply let arise what naturally arises.

Thank you OldGreen. It is interesting, isn't it? The other day I read somewhere that Sadhguru (Isha) started and finished aviation school in 4 days; justice isn't done unless I mention it takes the average avid learner at least 4 months to actually acquire the knowledge to complete aviation school. Just wanted to share, I thought that was pretty interesting too. So anyways to keep this thread on topic, i'll just throw in my 2 cents. How attached are you to the idea that your ideas are you?

Are you asking a question, or stating your opinion?

Simply put and very beautiful, the follow up also added a quality that I definitely enjoyed. From personal experience, what your saying is definite truth, and for that matter, very well produced which definitely made me smile; so thank you. All in all, I guess one could refer to it as "sex," never really thought of it as such but it definitely allows me to understand tantra on a whole new level; so thank you again. From my experience, it just penetrates so naturally, so much deeper and so much more divine; to call it sex seems to me, almost disrespectful. When one is truly dealing with universal energy there is ultimately no place to hide, the divine pervades your every cell and the process of self realization begins regardless if one is ready or not. To not go about the process with a deeply rooted respect seems pretty faulty to me. Coming from my little egoic point of view, most are not sincere and do not long for understanding of these very simple yet very profound concepts, therefore the western mind instead clings to the new age fad for belonging and finds fascination in looking to analyze, categorize, and understand the "mystery;" "flippancy" is really a great way to articulate it. To me, the problem lies in the fact that once open, Pandora's box doesn't shut and what's inside might not be that fluffy cute little puppy one thought they might find. While the sincere may bask in the bliss, the faulty may very well be squirming through in terror, and as the saying goes, "one who plays with fire, is bound to get burned," point being one should stop and read the disclaimers before pulling out the crowbar. From what i've gathered and come to conclude: pure sincerity, true devotion, and a deeply profound respect for such sacred matters are a must when "cultivating the way." That's just my 2c anyways EDIT: I appreciate the bump OldGreen, some really great stuff was added to this one.

I've got a remedy for that... horse stance! Do you mean, "deep information coming in via cosmic chi?"

It's really a lot more simple then we are making it out to be... So what do we really know? - A book in a biographical format is published on Master Wang Liping; it tells who he is, what his experiences have been, and what he is about. - Master Wang Liping holds retreats for people interested in learning what he has to offer. He charges what he charges, he presents what he presents, it is what it is. - There are people on this forum that have studied with Master Wang Liping and have taken away something that they find to be worth there time and space. If it feels right to you, then go for it. If it doesn't feel right to you, then don't. If you go for it, follow through with all your heart; dedicate yourself, give yourself to it, expect nothing, take away everything. The knot gets tighter as you pull harder; release, surrender. Needing proof for everything, leaves us at the tip of anything. First, we must know what we want, then, it's about surrendering and the gentle embrace.

Moving without movement, the divine pervades my every cell and wu wei becomes a reality. Just my experience with it.

Very inspiring, the perfect thread to come home to after a week of being gone.

While only being on The Tao Bums for a short period of time, my gratitude for this site is at an all time high and only looks to be increasing from here on out. To everyone who contributes, I want to say thank you, without all of you none of this would be possible and for that I am forever grateful. During my time here I have learned a lot about the Taoist Arts and all that comes with them, from internal alchemy to the actual importance of everyday practice, The Tao Bums has really allowed me to open up in ways I never thought possible. Like everyday of my life thus far, today started out very positively...I woke up. That being said, today held something in store for me that was truly and experience in which words can't really begin to describe...I was introduced to "life force" by a man with some serious juice...Hundun. Not only did he welcome me into his home, Hundun poured me some delicious tea, introduced me to a couple of friends, and made me feel welcome and loved from the moment I stepped through his door; having never met him before in my life I was honestly inspired by the generosity and sincerity he expressed, never once making me feel the slightest bit uncomfortable. After chatting a bit we got down on a little shaking, and some Zhan Zhuang; boy oh boy just being near the guy made me tingle all over, not to mention the transmission that continues to leave me buzzing which i'm sure will continue to unfold as the days progress. All in all the experience was something which words can't really even begin to describe. While i'm still relatively new to all this, one thing is for certain, The Tao Bum Hundun has some serious sauce and I am so very grateful he shared some with me. Without The Tao Bums non of this would have been possible, so as I said before; thank you everyone for contributing and making this site a very special place, I appreciate you all very much.

I agree. Although it seems like for some people, letting it all out has caused some problems as well. Thanks for that response steve, I appreciate it. Some really great insights there that I think a lot of people could benefit from, especially me. Like heretic, mystic seems very appropriate. I think living spontaneously, letting things flow as they arise definitely needs to be eased into, at least if your on your own and have no real support. It seems like if one were to just jump into this sort of lifestyle, things could get shaky pretty fast not only within oneself but also with society in general. I know that from personal experience, while deep within my being it all seems like very positive change, easing into spontaneity has really confused a lot of my family and close friends. I have found a lot of people are uncomfortable with me just being, while it's not necessarily even big changes, the people who thought they had me pinpointed best just don't seem to understand.

I appreciate the recognition Marblehead, although if the post was left uncommented on that would have been ok too; just the fact that it got views is enough for me to know that people saw it and were able to receive my appreciation for this online community. Either way I appreciate your response, it definitely triggered some good thoughts on my end. I never really thought about it as being a place for the release of pressures from everyday experience. It makes total sense that writing it out releases it. Now that I look at it from that perspective it explains a lot about music, poetry, storytelling, movies; pretty much everything where expression could be embedded. I guess a question that piggybacks off that is exactly what the title of the thread states...can words even express a feeling? Are those pressures really released through writing, or is it simply better to just allow them to release as they come up no matter the situation? Wouldn't that be truly living in the moment, letting the energy of each and every moment flow the way it intends to? Society sets up all these rules, restrictions, guidelines on how we must act in public, even how we must act in private to some degree; by rising above and letting the inner radiate outward, wouldn't we be truly living, never having to release pressure because pressure never arises. The word heretic seems to come to mind, I feel as if I understand and appreciate the word a bit more.

I'm still pretty young, 22 so I don't have a huge base of life experience to go off of; that being said I can say that recently I have personally witnessed several people that after having identified the lies, are awakened all the sudden to a new realm which one may call "spiritual," myself included. As with the Taoist Alchemical Arts, we convert jing to qi, qi to shen, finishing with shen back to Tao. These "revolutions" are just now starting to take shape. In a way awareness has emerged and so the stages of alchemy may begin to take place on a much larger level; point being that it all comes in stages of development, one must first understand the microcosm before engaging and understanding the macro. Society as a whole must first deal with the physical blockages that hold humanity back before we move on to the next stages of the process. While the "revolutions" taking place may fade out, the fact of the matter is that they are continuing on strong. What is the definition of "spiritual" anyways? Is one that is still dealing with the physical not on a "spiritual journey" yet? In my opinion life and everything in it encompasses spirituality; these "revolutions" that are taking place could possibly be the beginning of something big, while they just as possibly may be nothing at all. Humanity as a whole has been "spiritually oppressed" for sometime now, so much so that individuals today are only aware of the fact that they have been lied to and that they don't like it; people are beginning to understand that the lies aren't working for the majority and they want to fix them. Once the process of eradicating the lies has taken place, what then...spiritual revolution? "A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." Lao Tzu

Too cute!

This is a great thread, I really appreciate all the contributions. The past couple weeks I have taken up zhan zhuang and it is really amazing how much it allows one to feel themselves. While i'm just getting into the practice I have already begun to feel myself on a much deeper level; I have noticed this translates to an increase in feeling throughout the day which keeps me feeling very grounded. As of now after about an hour of spontaneous qigong, I move into standing wuji, after about 30 minutes of that I go for another 30 minutes in "embrace the tree" pose, finally finishing up with about an hour of wuji hundun qigong and some self tui'na massage. While I have been practicing natural flow as well as wuji qigong for a couple months now, I have found that the introduction of ZZ really helps my cultivation of mind/body altogether. As a newbie, I have realized that for me, seated meditation is still a bit of an advanced practice; zhan zhuang has become an excellent replacement for seated meditation, as it allows me to get into my body in a way I have never really experienced. As of now I am not sure that i'm prepared to involve myself in a ZZ challenge; that being said I look forward to increasing my time in these stances so that sometime in the future I can challenge myself to some long standing sessions.

Water vs. Fire method? What are your thoughts? How do you go about your practice? Is it all about the journey, or is it more about reaching the finish line (whatever/wherever that may be for you)? I have been reading Relax Into Your Being by Bruce Frantzis and find these concepts so very interesting. On one hand, there is the water method that pretty much can be summed up as, "[This] method is known for not forcing things, for literally letting things occur in their own time...Whatever you do must feel comfortable." On the other hand the fire methodology employs a bit different strategy in that, "[Practitioners] of the fire way are true believers in the idea that, in matters of spiritual attainment, the end justifies the means. Their methods are known for their willingness to emphasize force." Frantzis later goes on to talk about "the big trap" and how it relates to the immature practitioners addiction to psychic power. He states, "Emotional maturity is the absolute necessary foundation upon which spiritual power must be built." Obviously tending toward the water method, Frantzis writes, "Fascination with fire, force, opening channels, and having powerful awareness of what [one] can do with energy [one] is producing often leads to a spiritual dead end. It rarely makes one spiritually free." This leads me to ask the question, do you think practices like Mo Pai are almost a kind of "trap" for people just starting out in learning the arts? Videos, like the one of Sifu John Chang almost set the stage for newcomers to right off the bat assume that siddhis are the ultimate goal of the arts which totally takes away from the real purpose of the practices themselves, not to mention that it seems like most people never end up attaining even close to what JC has. I guess Mo Pai really comes to mind because lately I have seen so many threads related to the practice and it seems as though most of it is based around a real fascination with psychic power and its attainment. As a true newbee, it has for a time lead to a bit of confusion and almost taken me off track from my ultimate goal, which is complete and utter knowledge of self. I see the siddhis and think to myself, "Wow that's pretty freakin cool" and then find myself looking more into it with total fascination, which ultimately results in time being taken away from the practices I could be doing instead. For me this book has really driven home the importance of just, "letting things occur in their own time." If at the end of my journey I come to find that I have no "magic powers" i'm ok with that, it's not my reason for being here and it never was. My point for posting this was to really ask all of you what your purpose for your practice really is? Why do you practice the things you do? What drives you on a daily basis to wake up and continue that which you have started? I know their are many of you here that have some really great insight and experience in the arts and i'm really just interested in what it's all about for you. I appreciate you taking the time to read this, and would love to hear some responses. EDIT: Topic Title