settler

Very true the program I'm setting up is for health and longevity mainly. Found out this very nice basic instructions, it may be of use to some one: http://www.maguibagua.net/fundamental_skills/1_circle-walking_basics.html I check Sun Zhi Jun Cheng style it looks good also, he is very good at what he does, as Mjjbecker mention before. Hes style is more martial applicable, fluently and with more speed.

Very true, that's why i included Taiji yang short form in my training program. The principle of Bagua is circular motion. This can be walking in circle or doing circular movements with the arms. If you inspect Yang form, you will see all arm movements making circles. It makes it a Bagua training also. That's why its so effective and has been the most adopted form of Taiji.

I kind agree with you, but I'm a very resourceful person, but must people will not get with right. To difficult yes it is. Just because of that level, doesn't mean you should not try it. It was very difficult to reach American continent for the Portuguese in those tiny boats but they did it. Didn't they? If you American you could easy be speaking Portuguese instead of English, if they whet north instead of south. English, Spanish and others became so good at the seas because they improved Portuguese boats. "Overcome yourself" - Cristano Ronaldo soccer player.

The Guman (male) or Gumanri (female) went to Jesus and told him we give you all the property in the world, he wisely declined. Property at the cost of your health? Look at Steve Jobs, plenty of prosperity but where is he now? What good is property at the cost of your heath? Stay away from any kind of realm, or spirits, that is just tricks to pull you there, so they can increase they're influence over you. There isn't much difference from being possessed and incorporate a spirit, in one case you accept the presence of the spirit and in the other case you don't accept. There is no, "I'm in control of a spirit", is just there manipulating your mind, melting with you. Until he reach a great influence, at that point you can no longer determinate what is you or what is the spirit. Sure he will give you property, all the stuff that you wish, more you have, the more he melts with you. And less you will be in control of your life, more you will be manipulated. For what purpose? I don't know exactly why they do this, why they don't have a body of there own? Maybe they misused what God gave them and they got this huge amount of Karma. They will need to wait hundreds of years just to incorporate again. They prefer to shorten the waiting time and possess bodys to have a life again. This is just a guess, the why is beyond my knowledge. Some people have a stronger will, they will be more resilient to this manipulating, but in the end they will be like any one else, a human body with a broken will. When your will is broken, people will abuse you easily, they laugh at your face, you will have no respect at all, no health, no prosperity, no dignity, no determination, no future. Broken will, happen when, the level of manipulation is so great that all your energy is consumed by the spirit, you will have none left to do your life. You don't believe my word? Look at the documented cases of extreme spirit possession where mind manipulation, reached the level of broken will. People will just stay there, looking at you all day long, with no energy to do any thing. If they haven't diseases, why don't they do any stuff? The spirit is consuming it all. For what purpose? I don't know.

You are on the right approach, have seconds opinions is the best, if you don't know where to start. I was a big practitioner of meditations for long time, now i discover Moving meditation of Qi training and i don't do anything else. Moved from a, not moving at all, to don't stop moving. Both ways work, with the drawback in meditations of not producing any results to your health. At lest they don't add that body maintenance. Which without your body will degenerate fast if you don't exercise. We don't have time to practice all things, we have to choose. Now i choose practices which do more in last amount of time. Yoga do much more then a simple meditation, in the ration time/result. In Yoga you have a all-in-one practice, a bodybuilding, exercise and a meditation. Or a Mantra which is by far a superior form of meditation, does much more for less time and effort. If you didn't already, read my topics "building concentration with a mantra" or a "full training program" they have additional information.

Thanks for the information. Liu style is great, and worked for me, i know there are a lot more out there, i cant experiment them all. You can correct your self in from of a mirror, i practice in front of a big one. But yes, if you can access to a good master that will be great. But if you can't you have to manage on your own. If we could gather 100 people paying 30 euros you get 3000, probably enough to contact a Chinese master like Liu to come to Europe to teach for a couple of days. That amount of money probably is enough to pay for hes expenses give him some cash and also to rent a space for 3 days for a nice group to train. Schools have those big gyms they can rent for extra cash, people could sleep there, the floor is made of nice wood. In the summer they are free for long periods of time and for a low cost. They also have all necessary conditions like WC and showers. Or you could go in to a more comfortable and expensive approach. Who says 30 also says 40 or 50 euros... depending on the conditions that He asks to come... Much more cheap for all to do this way, then 100 people pay each 3000 euros to go to Chine to train for a couple of days. Now you can consider learning the basic moves from the DVD. If you get in to an event like this, you need to have something to show.

Spirits are quite a danger to use. When the spirit incorporates it trades energy for information. That's how so many masters have a great influence over they're disciples they use spirits. Most vampire of energies are done with spirits. They have the ability to channel energy out of people, open holes in other people auras to get that energy out of them. If i where you i get my self away from any spirit practices at all. Although you might have an energetic level that means nothing to spirits, besides they can start manipulating your mind in order to get you down at an emotional level to increase they're influence over you. To be near people that use spirits i advise you develop your will, once they are inside if you a susceptible person, they can make a huge damage. Although you can use them for several things, they consume your own energy, soon enough you will be tempted to drain others energy to compensate for the leakage. And be aware of masters and spiritual leaders they might not be exactly what they say they are. If they are truly pure why are they around people trying to get stuff out of them? Open your eyes and you will see the truth. Jesus of Nazareth: a true spiritual person, gives its meal to others, the last 2 fishes and breath. If he truly loves he gives and not takes. Spiritual masters come to our events to receive? How do i speak to a spiritual master that came to my house to take back? Best wishes, use common sense

Many people wonder what is a yin and a yang training. Never saw a book discussing this issue and took me quiet some time to discover this by my self. Yin forms are: wild goose, Dragon and Tiger. Yang forms are: Tai Chi, Baguazhang. (I will discuss this styles because are the ones i have experience ). Yin forms project energy in the direction of your own Chakras to open them. This doesn't provide a filling of well being was yang does. Once a Chakra is open you can do stuff width it. For example, if you open the hand Chakras you can project energy to heal people, or if you open the Thirt Eye you can establish communication with out using any words. Yang forms work by creating a force to generate energy which is then absorbed by the body, with grounding, circling and screwing. Tai Chi works manly in grounding, Baghazhang in grounding, circling and screwing. Yin practice can be dangerous, when you open your Chakras you can project "energy", also can others in to you. Some people complain they are drained in public places or near other people. When a person does not have opened Chakras he can't release negative energy and steal's to neutralize it's own negative. Excessive yin training drains energy, which can be harmful, low levels of energy make you vulnerable to diseases. You will be a person with great control over the energy with none to use. Yang training is less problematic but if you create to much energy the body start burning out, the excessive energy force the internal organs work more. This is an extreme situation and you will fell very hot. Wild Goose is much better then Dragon and Tiger, if i was choosing one i go with Wild goose because is cleaner. Dragon and Tiger creates to many layers of complexity. Bahuazhang in general is much more superior to Tai Chi, but if you planning to be a master you hold want to learn Tai Chi to initiate students. Manly because the complexity of Bahuazhang. An anonymous youtube grandmaster says: "when you separate Yin from yang you achieve high practice". I agree with him, in order to achieve high levels of Chi you will need to master Yang exercises and Yin. To complete the Yin training you will need to prevent others from stealing energy or gaining control. To prevents this you can't project emotions which establish a connection used to steal energy. Yang training specifically Baguazhang is very useful in strengthen your character which then helps to projects less in to others, which can help to decrease these theft's of energy. The use of both styles is the better way. If you chose Wild Goose and Baguazhang, you get a good balance. A reason way this topic was not referenced before probably is the fact that Wild Goose was release to public only 30 years ago, before you could not have access to a full yin form. My Facebook group: http://www.facebook.com/groups/120949884603379/

Ok i will look it up to check it out. Life is a learning process...

I was discussion my line of thought in this other two topics you might read them for extra information: "Building concentration with Mantra", "Yin training vs Yang training". Program: 15m - Mantra - Jesus prayer in john 17 5m - Taoist breath - by Bruce k Frantzis 7m - Ba Duan Jing - Shaolin form, Shi Deyang 5m - Tai Chi - 24 form simplified, or standard 3m - Fire Dragon Palm - Lu Zijian junction between Bagua + 5 elements + Tai Chi 15m - Baguazhang - Liu Jingru Cheng style 3m - 64 hands - Liu Denkun's Bagua + xing yi 15m - Zhan zhuang - Standing meditation 10m - Yoga - Mainly warrior II, could add Triangle, Cobra Mantra Qi training don't train the mind, it does a maintenance to the body. Its an energetic training, capable of exercise the body. You may want to train the mind also. Tai Chi The 24 standard is a nice form to start, almost all Qi practitioner knows it. you can executed it 5m minutes. Simplicity and efficiency thats resume it, its so soft that can serve was a harm up. 64 Palms The coordination at a fast speed develops concentration, which Tai Chi and Baguazhang don't do that much. So you have that extra in concentration and a know how in to self defense. This may be optionally. Fire Dragon Palm This is a stable and mature set of exercises. They are so short when finished you say only this? But they work well, they open the body to allow the energy to flow. I definitely include in any program. Baguazhang This is the Top Qi training, if you are serious about your training then you should consider learning a form of Baguazhang. Zhan zhuang A classic form of meditation, you need it to take your Qi to the next level, that inner observation from stillness add a lot to your training, most schools do it, you can't remove it from your training. You can short it but removing is a mistake. Also can help bodybuilding. Yoga Yoga is good if you don't over extend it, its a great bodybuilding, meditation and exercise. A nice all-in-one. The warrior II is much more better for bodybuilding then a full horse stance, because it put less tension in your heart. If you want to take your Qigong to the next level you should read this books: "The roots of Chinese Qigong", "The secrets of youth", "Embryonic Breathing", "Small Circulation". They are all from Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming. They have the base theory of Qigong, why it works, they are not a training program. If you need it read the book "Qigong Empowerment". A Good book on Tai Chi and Baghuazhang is also advised. If you can find a good master great! But then, without the base theory you will not understand what you are doing, you are just following instructions. I have trained with a few good masters and also without them. If you really committed you will do great on your own.

You need to know that the mind learns much more what he does, then what it listens or reads. Like if you discuss a subject it is more likely that you remember it. I got a instruction DVD, lets say from the 64 hands from Liu Denkuan's, its divided in 8 sets which contains 5 to 9 movements per set. First learn only the first 3 movements. Repeat only these 3 until they are well known. 20 to 40 times per day. Then add 3 more, now do all 6, the first 3 already learn and the 3 new ones. Repeat again until known. When you completed this first step, you have learn the movement's in raw way. But there's more to it. The second step is to perfect the movements to get benefits from it. For that you need to find the Chi in the movement. For this you need to fell the movement. With VLC player you can slow down the movie to watch the movement's in close detail in order to perfect them. If you perfect your movement close enough to the master, you will realize that in perfection you get close to feel the Chi. You can fell it by your self, this can take you a lot of time. To do it in your own movements. Perfection by it self get you close to the feeling. If you go learn with a master, first it will take you a lot of time just to learn the movement's. Because the master will do the all set in a row. These will consume you a lot of time. For me its just a wast of time. What you need is just the first 3 movements and not the all set. After you learn the raw movements, the instructor can serve a purpose, because now you know where to look in order to perfect the movements. To achieve a good flow of the movement to get you the Chi. But you can do this with the DVD in slow motion. By systematically observe and practice. I found that mixing several different styles its better to learn the flow of Chi. But it can be just me. Keep in mind although i have a level of Chi i'm not a master. I can put my Cat's to sleep with sending them Chi, i have 2, one wild and one meek. The meek one falls asleep much easier and the wild much harder. If a dog comes after me in the street barking i send i'm some Chi and it goes away. Being perfect on what you do and practice on a daily basis its the only way to produce results. And use a high ranked form like "24 form, Tai Chi standard". Those 1001 forms from youtube are just pointless. This can be a little boring, but well... how really do you want to learn it?

There are many styles out there not many have a true value, some time a go people believe that Tai Chi was the most advanced system. Now some masters saying Baguazhang is probably the most advanced. Bruce K. Frantzis says this openly. Do you know how many Chinese schools study and improving Baghazhang and Tai Chi? A lot! Has much was i respect those family hidden styles, i have to be suspicious about them. If they don't bring solid prof of results or better then those already practice by every one else. Them i must say, they are pointless. Why you want to learn and practice something that no one else what to? If is truly better, go ahead, demonstrated why your results are superior. Show other schools results and show your own, explain in detail, get your self the public attention. Low quality videos in Youtube are = to pointless. Build a instructional DVD and win your self good money. Maybe you can't win good money this days on DVD's, at lest you did a favor to mankind. And to replay to Zanshin and Informer.If both of you came here to argue, you win. Take the argue award and go home.

This is hilarious. You are the True Chi Master! Or not! You say We? as if you own others will? interesting aspect.

Anamatva Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming : "A Yin and Yang can contain another Yin and Yang." watch this video: http://www.qimagazine.com/video.html - "Daoism and the Skyeye - Part 3" Michael Tse says in the video "doing one side of the Bagua circle walking is Yin so to balance you need to do both sides, right and left. To be Yin and Yang". But you could do one circle to left side, and then make 2 circles to right side, and one more circle to left. You still achieve balance correct? Normally people do 2 circles to the left and 2 to the right, but doesn't mean its the only way to achieve balance. Its like in a mathematical problem, there is no right or wrong way to do it, was long the result is right you can chose the complexity you desire to finish the problem. Is this is correct? If you divide a training program in 2 parts, a set is centered in absorbing energy, you can say its Yin , and another centered on gaining energy, you can say its yang. Combining the 2 you will have a yin and yang training. This achieves balance. Is this is correct? Whats preventing you from dividing your training in a Yin and Yang manner? As long you know what you are doing... Some one post "I didn't open any Chakras". It have to do with the fact of your past life's, some people can be born with all Chakras open and others with none. And if you are a stubborn and hard listening people you will not achieve high levels of Chi training, because you don't have the flexibility to fell and manipulate Chi. watch the master performing Wild Goose I, and watch he doing around 50% exercises in to is palms to open them, and watch him send energy to the sky eye at a certain point to open also. Just because you can't do it doesn't mean it will not serve for others. ChiDragon is this explanation misleading to you? And for those saying i don't have Chi level, I didn't judge you. Its only you trying to control others. Some comments made me remember of Christ accusers, they believe they where in control because they needed to, but in the end was Crist who was in control all along. It has to do how much you are open minded. When i post the topic Yin training vs Yang training i assumed that you people have read this 2 book "The roots of Chinese Qigong", and "Qigong Empowerment". 2 books that any forum will tell you are the base theory of Qigong. You could have asked "how did you get to that results". I would have answer this way and that way. That's open minded that's Christ path. That's Chi flexibility to be able to deal with problems in a soft manner. No one is forcing you to read. Yet you keep coming back. Please inform me of your problems and I will fix them for you. Thanks for the lack of knowledge and the inflaming it make's me look good.

This kind of comment are beyond pointless: Sinfest :: JohnC Icon :: First of all with out a scientifically approach we still live in the stone age. Second why all this obscurity? if you know so much explain your training. Explain how many hours do you train per day, what kind of results do you get, what kind of forms do you use, why it work and why didn't work. The theory that I'm speaking of and which is the base for my researches/study are from Dr. Yang, Jwing-Ming, hes study's and research won him "book of the year". where are those pseud-master? Still learning in caves? Still in obscurity? Don't post this garbage here! Bring me solid prof of your training as i did, as i tried to explained, if you don't have any experience in a daily training capable of measure don't post. If you don't have any experience with Baguazhang, wild Goose, Dragon and Tiger, and Tai Chi don't come to this topic. Posting your Likes and dislikes don't concern me. An attitude of like and dislike is dangerous to your self and to others. Experience things by your self, don't allow those pseudo-master to govern your life. The theory and training is open for all who seek it and wish to learn and dedicate them self's to learn. Bring me your masters and i show them the real Chi. I speak for my self I do not speak for others. If you don't have any useful thing to post don't post. Keep it to your self. Are you still looking for a master to train you? are you still waiting for your mother to spoon feed you? Do you have the capability to learn for your self? What kid of people are you? I see limited people and limited approaches and views to the Chi training.

Concentration is one major aspect in the Chi training, but most people don't know this and set it aside considering a minor aspect. A Mantra is a very simple and highly effective method to develop concentration. The Mantra is the repetitive reading of a poem or a prayer. I have chose the "Jesus Prayer to the world" to be used was my Mantra. A remarkable mind and a great person, hes words not only inspire was they develop more easily concentration. They also develop a connection with the divine world. When we repeat the same text over and over, it becomes clear the mind is running away from tedious and repetitive tasks. Although you want to read the text it seems the mind was hes own will. Keep bringing the wondering mind to the text, and you will develop high levels of concentration. This high levels of concentration serve to aid you in the Chi developing but, will reduce your stress levels, create a state of peace and calmness. The prayer is in the Bible "John Chapter 17". Read the Mantra daily and repeat 3 times, is more or less 15 minutes per day. Not much trouble for what you getting in return. I have a Facebook channel where i share some information check it out: http://www.facebook.com/groups/120949884603379/ Before facebook groups where public pages. But now you need to login before you can see the page.

That might be a matter of schools, the schools that i learned was Zen Buddhism, inside the Zen there are also several schools like Soto and Rinzai the 2 main ones. All of them have their own approaches to enlightenment. It's not of Zen tradition to use Mantras, as I'm aware, they use Koans. They are very strict in what kind of techniques they include in there training, they believe the problem lies inside the learner and not in the technique. Mantras came from Tibetan Buddhism, never learned any techniques from them, learn Mantras on my own. To conclude, if they use the Heart Sutra from the Zen tradition "beats me".

Informer There are some misunderstanding's about yin and yang. Yin and yang is not an absolute thing is relative, its kind of Eninstein theory of relativity explained by the Chinese people. To have hot you need cold, to have male you need female. The body absorbs and releases energy, in that way you can say that the body is Yin yang. Because the governing vessel is connected to the back where is an area which releases energy and the thrusting vessel is in the front in a area which absorbs energy. This is a theory, and only a theory no one have the tools to prove this in a scientifically measured. They starting to prove acupuncture not by measurements but by results and that's a far fetch thing yet! Sinfest Check this site for a free book, its well explained http://globalqiproject.com/the-eight-extraordinary-meridians.html you can send it to your friends for enlightenment.

Sinfest thanks for your comment. Tell me what is your experience in the training, please point how what is wrong and what is right.

Jetsun Good point Concentration is being in the middle between yin and yang which is the love energy, love does not discriminate if its good or bad. When you are in the middle in the heart Chakra or love energy you develop high levels of flexibility, you don't favor Yin or Yang you are in the middle, highly flexible. Lets inspect Jesus words for flexibility to see if hes in the middle: "...that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. 22 I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: 23 I in them and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me..." Hes speech is always going from him to the father and from the father to disciples and from the disciples to him self. Is not favoring any thing this means independently of what is inside the text that he is in the middle because is not favoring any thing. "Some meditation methods focus your awareness into a single point, while others stress that you need to expand your awareness not focus it, yet they are both supposedly after the same thing". So to build concentration from a Mantra is better that you use words like the ones from Jesus because they are between Yin Yang, they jump a lot, they don't discriminate that much. They naturally train concentration, if you want to brute force, you can conquer your taste by not letting your mind wonder and keep bringing it back to a point so that you may be in the middle. Expansion is the same thing, in that case you will also in the middle because you are not discriminating any thing. The Buddhists call it the middle path, the heart Sutra. They don't mean the heart they mean the heart Chackra which leads to the middle between Yin and Yang. Its the only place where you can relay focus, and when you realty focus you can see the true reality, the divinity etc. When you develop the heart Chackra you can control better your energy because it expands the consciousness and where the mind goes Chi will follow. In resume the concentration is important not only to spiritual developing but also for Chi developing, that's why its in there, there i also mean the program I'm building for higher Chi developing, and for people who wish to incorporate a mantra training in there own program.

Edward M "...Most greek orthodox members chant it throughout the day, not just 3 times..." Let me explain how did i get to that number. At first i was repetitions 20 times, which gives 1 hour to 1.30h. But that consumes a lot of time, so i start reducing the numbers of repetitions until 2 or 1 per day, lather i understood that 3 is a right number to get benefits without that extra consumption of time. I got to this number in order to incorporate the Mantra in a Chi training program. When you are building a training program you can't use all methods, you have to choose which ones work best. But you are right it can be used in any other way, if you need to wait in the dentist for half an hour, if you bring the Mantra, you can better use your time. This can be your main practice, but was explained it's a complementary part of a training program. Jesus speaks about this connection with other entities, in the Prayer to the world: - "who connects to me will be connect to God", he also says that he is the only man who can connect other people to God although this people didn't achieve the merit yet to do so by them self's. I was in big trouble and i attempted to free my self from this for many years, but with no success, this stuff was coming back to me over and over again, no matter how hard i tried. Until one day i turn to Jesus Mantra, and start to receive this huge chain of events in my life, i could not understand them all, they exceeded my mind capability of comprehension, but in the end they fit them self's together in a master plan that release me. Sure any entities can give you some results, but depends on who you what to connect and how big you want to see results.

Hello