flowing hands

Lao Tzu or Li Erh Xian Shi to give this great man his proper name, wrote down his teachings on bamboo slithers and gave them to the border keeper. What we have today is copies of this original work. In ancient times scribes used to copy works and very often put their own interpretation of what they were supposed to be copying. Hence we do not in effect have the complete original. My version transmitted to me is what he told me in English. Li Erh was a real person, not because I am taught by him as proof but because it is recorded that he existed and people have traced their family back to him. Jesus was a Daoist shaman like me but not so formalised as me. He was the student of an ancient Daoist Immortal called the 'Immortal of times past'. He lived in the northern heaven, which was unusual as the greater majority of Daoists live in the eastern heaven. Jesus is not coming, I have come instead and will tell people of what is to come and what is real and false. Religion is a scurge of the world along with greed and politics. People need to be led back to nature not into religion. When jesus talked about 'god' he was refering to his Immortal master, not to the creative forces that created all that there is. If he was, he would have said 'she'. The Christian church has treated women like second class citizens (still does) and yet, creativity and birth arise from the female. No heaven born religion would ever treat women in such a way. Here one can use this guide to see what is true and what is not. Why is it so dificult? because people find it hard to let go of what they have and what they think, their minds are choked with greed and desire for more than what they need. Our society and most of the world is based on this. It is far harder for us today because our world is based not on the attainment of natural wisdom, but on material attainment. The trouble is the way society has been based, means that for any personal choice and freedom one has to be wealthy to afford the luxury of time. We are trapped by this. I am trapped by this also, I suffer the same as everyone else. I therefore have understanding and have to snatch times to practice and cultivate. I have no person paying my bills for me so that I can spend my time in cultivation! But if we do not practice and only practice the art of making money, then how is the world going to be a better place for all living things to be in? If we don't practice to hold all life sacred, let go of our greed for unnecessary things, which means very different things to each of us, how are we to begin to open our minds and have a better understanding of ourselves, our fellow human beings and other life, let alone anything else?

Thats just nonsense and misunderstanding! The Dao means many things; as I sit here and type I am following the way of typing, it has a name, it has a manifest for Dao has come into being for I am alive you are alive and the rest of the world is alive. Though I might not know its origin I know it exist, because it is the creator of all things and therefore I call it Dao "for lack of a better word". Dao is part of everyday life, we breath and move in it, it is with us all the time, it nourishes our bodies and lays us to rest when it is our time. We are living breathing embodiments of the Dao! We can be named!

Anybody can tranlate the DDJ, if they have the original! Gia fu Feng translated according to his own view what the characters mean't to him and so do thousands of others. The Dao is not something that can be defined as scholarly, philosophical, spiritual or practical. It is one mans view of the world and how it works and of human interaction within this. We all can do this to some extent. Lao Tzu of course was the incarnation of a God, he was surrounded by a culture that was destinctly shamanistic. He was enlightened, so what he said has great importance to us all in the way we live our lives. When Lao Tzu was alive in a mortal body, people persued the Dao as a way of life and anybody who was learned in this way was greatly revered. Almost all people then wanted to become wise. Now most of the Chinese want to be rich and get their first Ferrari! I have many times thought about writing down my own thoughts on the Dao. As the years roll by I learn something new about the world and about human nature. But I can't see myself in any way surpassing the great perception of my Master. To know the self as Lao Tzu says requires great strength, very few people have the chance to really know themselves or the ability to change. It does take a life time of a teacher showing you through circumstance and realistic situations to know something of yourself. Words are very easy to say, deeds are more difficult. The self is the greatest challenge anyone could have.

Its called freedom from bondage and takes to some talent and definately perserverance and a very good teacher who has trod that path !!! The body may suffer but the mind has gone else where, so pain and suffering are relieved to some extent. If you read my DDJ on my site it was given to me by Lao Tzu, it is the classical in the best possible English words we could find to express what he wanted to put over. Although some meaning is lost in the translation because some words do not have a direct translation in our language and undersatnding of the world around us. Good luck from me

To add to what I said earlier and what MH & Manitou said the 'self' is the key to all things, its knock-on effect to the world is ENORMOUS. Really the idle mind chatter is a beginners perception of what is changing, going deeper than this one can realize that there is no difference from one life to another and one can experience being a completely different life in the same body. We are but energy with a cellular over coat, but we are all the same!

The nature of all things is simply to be born, to find a way to live and reproduce, to grow old and die. Within this there is the multi faceted interactions of humans with humans, other animals and life with humans, other life with other life, the underlining energy that gives life; the universal princple, the real understanding of the unversal principle. Being at one with heaven and earth, you will still have a body and have to do a boring job to pay for your life! But once you have been enlightened you can look forward to an everlasting life as a spirit. To meditate is to start to let go of all the things that you have learnt, all the things that you are, until the mind is completely empty. Once there you can be what you want to be for you are at one with the great source.

Well to me how I interupt this chapter is thus; Practice meditation/qigong, empty the mind and master the self. Be at one with other life and follow the eternal flow of the complex interaction of all life that is interwoven with each other. Note that because we as humans have stepped out of this, disaster is following in the path we tread. With this practice we can feel and know the source. Knowing the source we will be at one with heaven and earth. We have cultivated the self, we have understood the nature of all things, we have transcended being and non being, of working without doing, of limitless possibilities. We will obtain the divine as we are at one with the Dao. We will transcend returning as we have entered into oneness with the Dao.

Good post! Exactly what I have been taught. I learn and practice external/internal arts, there is no difference, one cannot practice one without the other. I once was asked to judge at the national champs. and was thought I did internal arts till I said "no", so they asked me to do the external and the weapons, so afterwards I said I don't do external either. This confounded the whole categorisiing of Chinese Martial arts!

Yes to deveop qi one has to do particular exercises to tighten the lower dan tien. The lower dan tien is like a battery, apoint where evolution formed a means of storing energy to continue giving energy to all cells. The body through time and practice has to adapt to higher levels of energy. If this is not done slowly, particularly the nervous system can be damaged beyond repair. There are many ways that one can develop qi and its uses. The heart is the second point of spiritual practice, Dao Xin. Dao Xin is the way to Immortality. The DDJ tells us all. My website has a freedownload of my masters DDJ. You will see that it contains many passages of Dao Xin. All other points of energy can then be cultivated once these two points are cultivated. When one starts on the path of Dao Xin, the desire for power or energy is long forgotten and although one may become extremely powerful, the desire has gone to ever weild it.

I have experienced logging off problems, I do wonder whether there is any mal-ware on the site?

Hey you guys, I've got to say alot of what you are talking about is not right IMO. I am the student of Immortals and so have been taught the 'way' of Immortality. There have not been any Immortals for over 1,500 years. To become an Immortal takes far more than the systems you are talking about. There are in fact only two dan tiens that are important in the body, the rest develop only as off shoots from the development of these two. Without proper development of these two all is empty!

Tony Parsons doesn't know a fig!!!!!!!!

What is to come of the world in the near future is not a light thing!

Breath is actually the first source of generating qi. The air that we breath contains qi. All beginners should learn how to breath using their diaphragm and tightening the lower dan tien. This is the very root of qi gong and as Chuang Tzu said a true man's breath comes from his heels upwards. If proper breathing is left out, then its no good. Anyone can simply dance and breath properly and start to stimulate their qi. Any movement will do, breathing properly is that important to qi. Opening the gates of Heaven and earth are also important. Once the proper breath has been established then the movement is important to coincide with this. Some qi gong some people should not practice others are ok. A good teacher is a must.

"bearing yet not posessing" "the soft and the yielding" "water" "Dwell in the infinite" "mystery upon mystery" "unfathomable" "deep" "spirit" "gentle and weak" "supple" "heart" "mercy" "silence" "creation" "formless" "indefinable" "great mother of all things" "Heaven" "universe" "Dao" Some female principles and words used in the DDJ. Dao Xin is the ulimate understanding of all the five themes and more, but lets carry on with practicle examples of this. 'Bearing yet not posessing'. A female principle. The female gives birth to the next generation, most species, certainly not all nurture them and help them to be able to survive. In humans, although one can see many who don't tend to look after their off-spring, tend to love them and give them their value. When it is time for them to stride out on their own thats when we wish them well in all their endeavours, knowing we have done our best. We can apply this principle to other aspects of our lives. We love but we have the wisdom to see and value the other person/s so that we may help them be what they want to be, even though we may think it is not right. We can love the world or anything else, but we have the knowledge that it must follow its own course. Now we are getting into 'wu wei'. Wu wei is a female principle. And where does wu wei come from......the female shaman......bearing yet not posessing.

? ...........I don't think you know what you are doing.

Mmmm from me also...............

To claim that the DDJ was written by many and just a collection of thoughts is a typical western intellectual standpoint. We know that Lao Tzu existed as a person the records show us that. Men and women like me through the many thousands of years have been in 'contact' with Immortals including Lao Tzu. We know that he exists as an Immortal. We all can interpret what Lao Tzu wrote according to our differing perspectives. Thats not to say we are right. What I have given is probably the most accurate English version one could get. Many Chinese words do not have a similar word that conveys the same meaning in English, thats where the difficulty lies. Lao Tzu learn't of the 'way' because he was part of a very rich shamanistic culture when he wrote the DDJ. If you translate the DDJ from a humanist or any other view point you will get a different meaning. If you tranlate it as it was supposed to be written from a deeply reverencial shamanistic culture, then you will get the real meaning. You can toy around all you like with the meaning but you will gain no realisation of any meaning if thats what you want to do. Lao Tzu is a real person, he exists as a spiritual entity. As we all do when we 'die', whether we become an Immortal is the great difference. If Marblehead translated the DDJ, him being a confessed non spiritualist, scientist and general anti religious person, he would translate the entire work according to his view, which I am sure he would say he would (no offence MH!). Thats not to say he dosen't appreciate somebody elses view, but we would not see some very important passages apppear and the whole meaning of those passages completely missed. Some of those passages pointing us to the great meaning behind all life and Immortality. But because MH doesn't do this it would be missed out. So I have given the complete works directly from Lao Tzu without bits missing, from a Daoist point of view and remember Daoism comes from shamanism, from the recognition of the great spirit behind all things.

I don't think its anything unusual!! We all judge it all depends from where and what we see or perceive. Even the Immortals don't judge others, but some feel they are even above them!!!

In not recognising the spirit in all things, in not seeing the energy that links and binds us all together the DDJ may as well be empty of all wisdom and knowledge. But it isn't, it expounds quite clearly about this and it would not be what it is if it was a simple manual of life, devoid of the very foundation that gives life. For the spirit was there first and only from this spirit did life burst forward in the cycle of change and evolvement. From this spirit and connection, so shamanism was born. It had never left life, but was foresaken for 'Godly' principles and material advancement. The DDJ is shamanism personified; it is the manual of shamanism that we all need to realise the value of life itself and find our own connection, each one of us.

Wu wei is a product of wisdom and cultivation, of realisation. But it is more than the simple 'blankness' of a new born babe. For in wisdom we take no action at certain times because we see the wisdom of our non interference being better in the whole picture or in the long run. A new born babe takes no action because it cannot, it is what it is, but the beauty of the new born babe is that it is not full of stuff. So in cultivation and self realisation we have to get rid of all this stuff until we are like a new born babe. Empty but full of the Dao. Simple. I don't mean its simple to do, I mean simplifying our Natures. When I mean the Dao I don't mean just the 'way'. I mean the path of the heart; 'Dao xin' that leads us to enlightenment and ultimately to Immortality. Dao xin cannot be taught, it is a long journey of many years of practice. Dao xin can be shown or taught by an immortal; they will help you to become enlightened. These things are part of the true understanding of the DDJ which we have not really touched on. I once said on here that the DDJ is a complete works, it can teach anyhting you want to know but it requires complete dedication and understanding.

Although I agree with most of what you are saying here, I think Li Erh was refering to, a bit like TCM, the process of wholeness and well being, which means finding balance between yin and yang, the five elements, the conditions of heat, cold etc. etc. For example life was formed with certain environmental conditions which are dependant on elements being in balance with each other. So balance is about leveling out the way things are and work well together and independantly. The new born babe is about becoming this state, not necessariyl wu wei, for wu wei is a intellectual understanding and a desicion not to take action. But a new born babe enters the world completely empty, they have no realisation, only evolutionary instincts. They are in effect untainted.

I can tell of a NDE I had when I was a novice shaman. I was sleeping in my parents house in the early morning. I suddenly awoke completely frozen unable to move a muscle. I was being attacked by a maleveovalent spirit and it intended to kill me. It was early light and as the realisation that I was frozen stiff by its power and unable to defend myself I saw my spirit half come out of my body and left arm (yin) apply the 'fa' which drove the spirit away. My spirit moved back into my body and I could then move. The incredible thing was seing the spirit form of my own arm and body outside of the physical arm. I did not control my own spirit, but it came out as a last resort to defend the physical body. Which leads to many questions about the spirit and concious control and union of both mind, body and spirit. Which controls which?

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