flowing hands

Trouble is many people who like the thought of Dao magic can easily be drawn into his web, there's no Dao police!!!

When I started this thread I didn't think we would get sixteen pages!!!!! For all those Trump supporters on the thread I see Michael Cohen is dealing out the dirt on Trumps behaviour. I think Trumps got more to worry about than not going to the Paris Climate meeting

Vested interest manipulate facts to show what they want. Take your average medico legal claim the so called expert witnesses, the doctors never seem to find anything wrong with the claimant if they can get away with it. For it is the insurance companies who pay their wages. Any claimant who gets a rightful payout because of a report done by a surgeon will result in that surgeon not being used again! Same with scientist and politicians.

Now you really are nit picking and letting yourself off your own responsibility. Did I say in my thread that I wanted to discuss the ins and outs of climate change and whether one believes its real? Short answer NO! Your statement about Germany actually doesn't tell the truth, a case of manipulation which you've clearly stated you don't like. In the production of electricity Co2 went down. It was due to transport that co2 levels rose not the use of clean energy. Without the use of clean energy Germany's co2 would be far greater. See how you manipulated the truth to try and falsify statistics!

Very mixed grammar here for someone who corrected mine! Who are you talking about me or you? Dao and way are the same thing. Trump did not want to go to the last climate change meeting because his scientist and his heavy polluting industries would mean they would have to do something to change what they were doing. They didn't want to because it doesn't make the $'s. So they will gamble the $'s while they are busy polluting the world on scientist's reports who are biased and have a political agenda. You have hijacked my thread, made it into a 'lets keep making lots of money and continue to pollute the world anti climate change argument, when I simply asked people about what they were doing to help other diminishing life and climate change, which for selfish ends you have blatantly denied and ignored, because you think that evidence from such people who are in the field looking at biodiversity can see what is happening, are lying!!! It would have been more appropriate to have started a thread of your own about how you think we are not extinguishing other life forms and there's no such thing as climate change. Who would I believe, a Trump admin. or scientists who have no political agenda. It is really an easy choice for me, because true spiritual followers of the Dao 'Love the world as their own selves'. I personally don't want to chance my luck on the worlds healthiness on the Trump admin. Some of course love the $ more and will continue with their lives doing nothing to diminish the effect on other life.

You have picked up on a reply that was not responded to you!! Well you will receive what you have given or done in your life in one way or another and I certainly am not telling you how to live your life, but I am trying to show you and others that if we are as so called followers of the way, we should be taking personal responsibility for our actions when there is something that is going on whether you use ten pages to discredit it or not. Dao writings talk about the way to live. If you don't agree with those, I wonder why you are here. When talking about manipulating data, the Trump administration has been so guilty of doing just that. Why, because USA is the second highest polluters in the world.

Climate change is one part of it as in my original post I show the stats about what is happening to the world by human activity. Loss of species is also caused by climate change as well as loss of environment by human introduction of other species.

Are they facts or do they suite a persons country that are heavy polluters? You haven't actually really answered my original post, just nit picked at anything positive that anyone could do to help, so you can just go ahead with whatever life you live and ease your own conscience by being negative about anyone's efforts to do anything.

There is huge evidence to show that human activity is destroying species at an enormous rate, it may not all be by climate change, but certainly 96% of only a few animal species does show that somehow we are altering environments and taking over land that is making it impossible for other species to live. Species loss on such a great scale is enough to cause many drastic changes. Remember the wise words of Chief Seattle "Man did not weave the web of life, he is merely a strand in it. Whatever he does to the web he does to himself."

I think you must work in one of the industries that are heavy polluters, otherwise you wouldn't be so pro active in trying to dismiss anything that anyone says about what is happening to the world, whether its climate wise or loss of species and I ask what qualification if any do you have to hold your opinion, so proactive against humans causing anything at all bad? Take the case of the complete imbalance of species that now inhabit the Earth.It surprises me because you are saying things that really don't add up and things that are very much against the Dao; almost like a troll who will just keep putting things in a thread that is not adding to my original post, but sidelining it for your own opinions.

I think you are being provocative for the sake of it and I'm not wasting my time on you.

If you act like the stream of the universe and perceives its properties then you will have achieved this!

How you perceive the world is how you will act!

Well I'm not a climate scientist but I do know one and I know that scientist who are involved not in climate by biodiversity are saying and quoting those figures. I tried googling it and it comes out a similar figure. That's all I know. But I can see the vast drop in wildlife in my own area, every field either full of sheep, cows or pigs. No room for anything else!

The principle of no principle does not rely on describing things as'male' or 'female' or of Tai Ji, it simply uses collective wisdom that teaches us that a soft principle brings about a better conclusion. Our spiritual book the DDJ is about that; of letting go of rigid ideas. Remember it is a great book, but it is about how one can perceive the world and oneself to the benefit of all.

That's a very silly statement. If the world is spread over by meat on legs that humans have done and pushed out all the other species, are you really saying that this is natural and part of the balanced way?

I think its good for one's soul, even if its that, to do something even very small. It would be nice to get the figures between 4%wild animals and 60% cows etc more equal.1000 species lost every month is a lot of life.

What we do know since measurements were taken that the sea has risen by a significant amount.

This verse is about making yourself soft; that's not slow or dumb. It's about sticking to a principle of no principle; therefore one can overcome the challenges that life throws at you. It is as simple as that.

But for thousands of years there has been dramatic events and freak weather, that doesn't say that human pollution and interference is not causing more changes and greater changes now.

I've got to say you are always contrary. Personally I have lived a very simple life, so I have experienced that and it is obvious that modern technology and medicine has kept people alive longer. This really is not the point, but what can we do with the situation we find ourselves in now? We will ignore the nasayers who are just trying derail the thread, because they think that science has told them that in the USA Climate change doesn't exist. There are very strong political reasons why this is coming from the USA.

Doing something is better than nothing. The reality is that there are far too many humans that not only require feeding but many people have got used to a very materialistic lifestyle. I used to live for some time without electricity, I was young then and could do everything manually. Naturally as we get older we can't run around (although I still seem to) like two year olds. So I then had some appliances that were electrically powered to help my daily life. I have to work still to earn an income. In my younger days (up to my late 30's) I cycled to work and back, fifteen miles of hilly roads. Now because my work has changed I need a van. Without it I can't do my work. So life actually traps us into doing things that we don't necessarily want to do. If I was rich I wouldn't need a van or mant electrical aids and I could spend my time more at one with the Dao way of living. But most people are trapped one way or another. What I was interested in is what have people done in their own lives to help the fastening climate change?

You are nit picking, OK what do you fancy? There is always a trade off. Nor is the mining for various minerals used in smart phones, laptops etc. The production and dangerous nuclear generators of course produce plutonium used for making bombs. I really can't make any life changing bombs out of my solar panels, can you? The only clean energy production is probably an old wind mill or water mill. What would you prefer? A years holiday in the centre of Chenobyl if you like, or producing solar panels? One has to look at it in a balanced way. If you prefer Chenobyl, then go there and see how long you last. I'm not pretending, and delusion is not a pollutant, it is sometimes a dream/hope for a better life that people have when their lives are plighted. Do you remember Chenobyl or three mile Island? I am certainly not deluded, this is the last thing I would ever be. I am a very practical and skilled person who's feet are firmly placed on the ground. Currently, solar panels will last for up to 20-25 years. Not everyone has the chance to live in the countryside, so solar panels on house roofs offer a 20-25 year generating time that yes they have to be produced, but once up and running will save CO2 being produced else where and produce clean energy. Collectively, production may cause CO2, and some destruction of the environment mining for silicon etc, but if enough are produced and used over an extended period, alot of CO2 can be saved from going into the atmosphere. There is no risk of Chenobyl! If you are deluded about Chenobyl and the terrible risks, do some reading. I know what I would prefer, we had nuclear fall out hit our country from another and many animals and crops had to be destroyed and certain areas could not be visited.

You are being facetious, I did not invent the technology, but I am using it to power this computer which comes from the sun. I use this energy to power my home. I am taking personal responsibility for my own energy needs.In this way I know I am not being part of a system that pollutes and leaves radioactive substances still dangerous for thousands of years

But mine doesn't come from any power station, I generate my own! That's my sincerity. Your post is full of bad grammar and typos and its difficult to know your meaning! Is English your first language?