64changes

Saving my cash for this one now, after enjoying Alex's weekender earlier in the year.

Your questions a bit complicated, but here goes. The channels you're referring too run slightly differently in everyone, as such, a precise answer is difficult. However, your own perception of those channels and how they work is as valuable as anyone else's. The point of this stuff is to learn & refine knowledge surely? So, my answer is really to stand still, zhan zhuang like, and feels the channels, experience them, and tally that to what you're taught, read, learn. Oh, and train more. Just my interpretation of the situation.

Pre-natal qi, like breathing liquid can be a scary place. But ultimately, we all did it for 9 months or so.

Do mean, that right now, I could be in a Bardo called Bridgett? Sorry, I was legally obliged to do that joke

No. It cant. If it exists, its something. Quoting Douglas Adams: God: I refuse to prove I exist, because proof denies faith, and without faith, I am nothing. Man: Ah, but what about the Babel Fish, its a dead giveaway, isn't it? God: Oh, I hadn't thought of that. And God promptly disappeared in a puff of logic. Man, pleased with his earlier success then went on to prove that Black is white. And got himself run over on the next zebra crossing.

I die in my dreams regularly, does that count? Often in quite mundane, sometimes in catastrophic ways. Everyone I've spoken to about this has at one time or another had dreams of being the last person on earth. Been some good movies about it too.

From the movie script: [Evey is allowed to leave her prison unexpectedly and finds she was actually in V's lair the whole time] V:[Entering] Hello, Evey. Evey: ..You...it was you... V: [quietly] Yeah. Evey: [gestures behind her] That wasn't real... Is Gordon-? V: I'm sorry, but Mr. Deitrich's dead. I thought they'd arrest him, but when they found a Koran in his house, they had him executed. Evey: [whispers] Oh God.. V: Fortunately, I got to you before they did. Evey: You got to me? You did this to me? You cut my hair? You tortured me? You tortured me! Why? V: You said you wanted to live without fear. I wish there'd been an easier way, but there wasn't. Evey: [whispers] Oh, my God! V: I know you may never forgive me, but nor will you ever understand how hard it was for me to do what I did. Every day, I saw in myself everything you see in me now. Every day, I wanted to end it. But each time you refused to give in, I knew I couldn't. Evey: You're sick! You're evil! V: You could have ended it, Evey. You could have given in, but you didn't. Why? Evey: Leave me alone! I hate you! V: That's it! See, at first, I thought it was hate too. Hate was all I knew. It built my world, imprisoned me, taught me how to eat, how to drink, how to breathe. I thought I'd die with all the hate in my veins. But then something happened. It happened to me, just as it happened to you. Evey: Shut up! I don't want to hear your lies! V: Your own father said that artists use lies to tell the truth. Yes, I created a lie, but because you believed it, you found something true about yourself. Evey: No... V: What was true in that cell is just as true now. What you felt in there has nothing to do with me. Evey: I CAN'T FEEL ANYTHING ANYMORE! V: Don't run from it, Evey. You've been running all your life. Evey: [gasping] I can't... can't breathe... Asthma... When I was little... [collapses while V catches her] V: Listen to me, Evey. This may be the most important moment of your life. Commit to it. They took your parents from you. They took your brother from you. They put you in a cell and took everything they could take except your life. And you believed that was all there was, didn't you? The only thing you had left was your life, but it wasn't, was it? Evey: Oh... please... V: You found something else. In that cell, you found something that mattered more to you than life. Because when they threatened to kill you unless you gave them what they wanted... you told them you'd rather die. You faced your death, Evey. You were calm. You were still. Try to feel now what you felt then.

Paraphrasing, a lot. V has Evey captured, imprisoned, tortured, for weeks, months even. Evey's only solace during this time is a small text written by hand on loo paper by the previous cell occupant, a young lesbian actress, who recalls all the happy times in her short life onto this tiny paper. Which Evey hides and re-reads repeatedly during her incarceration. After x time Evey is told she will be taken to the chemical sheds and shot. To which she complies without fear or resistance. At which point, V reveals the whole capture, imprisonment, torture thing was an elaborate charade to get her to give up everything but her faith. Once Evey looses her fear she is awakened to reality fully. Thus matching V's own awakening at the hands of his captors during his stay at a Lark Hill. I'd recommend you read the book though. Well worth it.

Anyone else here read "V for Vendetta"? Not the film, but the book. This is very similar to what V's character was trying to teach Evey. In order to see, you must let go, the more you hold on, the worse it'll get. A very old story, and one we should be teaching every 16 year old before they leave school.IMHO.

Everything stems from unbalanced energy my friend. Traumatic dreams are as likely to be from bad diet and habits than anything meta or magical.

Hi all, I wanted to share a little story, and maybe someone can tell me if this "state" I describe has a name. Confounded me for long time this. Waaay back in the late eigthies & early nineties I worked in Psychiatry, believing I was doing "good" work. This I continued for a few years and eventually studied to be qualified in Psyche nursing. During my studies I did a lot of drugs & booze & sex like most students. I also thought a lot about psychiatry and the human experience. 1 evening, a few days after doing a lot of mushrooms, I was meditating on what thoughts psychiatry couldn't classify, as everyone around me seemed to be "Ill" in some way or another. It occurred to me that the only way to get around psychiatry and not be classified as "Ill" would be to have no thought. So I did. No thought. At all. For 3 or 4 months! I continued going through most of the motions of living, eating, washing, dressing, etc. But had no thoughts around it. However in dealing with other humans I could feel there unconscious, pre-natal selves. that They were barely aware of. And in talking with others ( all mammals included) I found I could communicate directly with there unconscious. Suffice to say, it was a scary and magical time for me. And something i have tried to recreate or rediscover though meditation, qigong, bagua, etc for 20 years. I'm getting there, too, slowly. BTW. I was thrown out of psyche practice during this time, for being a nutter.

The amount of folk I know that have ended up turning to psychiatry, and come away hating there own Mothers is ridiculous. What I ended up with is probably more akin to the "Dead tree zen" alluded too earlier. But even that had some usefulness, more so than psyche, i believe.

I suspect most, if not all of us, already have all we need. Its just a matter of tuning in to listen whats there. And as always, "Buyer Beware"

Scientific method is really quite young compared to Daoist thought. Maybe you need to re-evaluate your methodology. Just a suggestion.

Thats true. Scared the shit out of me the first few times. Put me off meditation for a while. And I have wandered into the blank suppression state too, when things were unbearable. Not good. The key, with all these things, is to keep communicating, despite whats going on. Preferable with someone more experienced than you. And I've heard various tales over the years of Daoist or Buddhist teachers being able to consume vast quantities of mind altering substances and it made no perceivable difference to them. Once you have the way, these things all become nothing.

Thanks for that, good way of looking at it. Other mammals seem to have fairly similar structure (internally) and as such most of the same internal potential. Thats why, I suspect, we humans can develop such close relationships with them. I'm just guessing though.

I guess this illustrates the difference between western medicine, which is relatively young. And more traditional medicine, which, although much older, requires more from the patient, less from the guide, witch doctor, shaman, whatever. A story more about power than I thought, thanks for the view points. If you want to hold onto something ( your humanity even). Let it go.

The toughest bit to recreate is having no contents of thought. Not just a lack of thinking, but having no mental "furniture" to sit thoughts on. Best way i can describe it. Its a very strange 2&8 to live with, and not something I found pleasant at the time. Its only after years of Qigong I realise its value

I think that is a little enlightenment. There is no I, only Us. The Me you refer to is what were are told is your "self". This is false construct used to filter conscious experience though. Unnecessary, but an interesting toy to play with for a while. My 2p worth.

Hi all, Just to say hello and to mention I dont consider myself daoist\buddhist\whatever. But you lot seem to sit closest to where I am, so its to you I'm turning.

Bagua, Yichuan & Qigong. The more time I spend with them the less of a separation there seems to be. I'd like to learn a little Xingi too, but that maybe just greed.