Long Yun

Wow. I favorited this just for reference, haha.

After glancing at the Cleary version, I've come to the conclusion that it's not quite the same thing as Inner Alchemy. The only things it has to say regarding energetics really are "...[O]nce you turn the light around, the energies throughout the body all rise. Just turn the light around; this is the unexcelled sublime truth." And the chapter "The Intercourse of Water and Fire" says that the true intercourse is sitting in "profound silence." Since the Wilhelm is incomplete, I have nothing to compare this chapter to. And I think the Microcosmic Orbit goes totally unmentioned... I'll be reading it again in depth next. Anyway, the Cleary version discusses Inner Alchemy as a strictly mental process, with no mention of gathering and purifying the three energies traditionally associated with Alchemy. Essentially it says, "Be still and quiet of mind and you've done Inner Alchemy because all the energies do their own thing when you just sit in emptiness." I don't know if I agree with that. While I admit that Inner Alchemy will require mental stillness as one aspect of practice, I think that there's a level beyond that. Right? Maybe I'm wrong. I'm going to try it soon I think. Just sitting in stillness shouldn't affect my ability to procreate... So, based on this, I think that the Cleary translation makes for a great starting point. I think that it is a meditation to still and pacify the mind, which I think is the first step in Taoist practice, but that it is not a complete guide to Inner Alchemy. That's not to say that the Wilhelm is a complete guide either, but it certainly seems more like what I consider Inner Alchemy to be than the Cleary does. So, I'll read the Cleary, learn the meditation and with a positive and open frame of mind, learn to not think. Then, I may consider doing other Alchemical practices. But I don't think I'm ready to practice any real energetic transformation yet. I'll work on stillness and perhaps clearing my channels of blockages, but nothing beyond that for a while. Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread, with a special thanks to JJ Semple and to everyone else who contributed their experiences. Peace. By the way, what parts of the method do you think relate to gathering and refining Jing, Qi, and Shen?

Thanks for your input, goldisheavy. I haven't tried it, so I can't speak for any whiz-banging What he says in the book makes sense, that closing off the eyes and ears and breathing through the pores protects keeps the outward "spending" of your three treasures from happening. And the posture and accupressure stuff is just to keep open passages. But what you say also makes sense. I understand what you're saying, and to be honest, I'm not sure how well Dr. Wu is sitting with me at the moment. In the book, he seems authoritative and honest for the most part. In a youtube interview I've seen of him, however, he seems like he waters down practices that are supposed to be for spiritual awakening into just mental exercise. (The video I'm mentioning is for opening the third eye, something I understood to be an advanced stage in inner work, by staring at a piece of white cloth and then sending your awareness outward.) The book also gives me a bad vibe at one point, where he says that the real fusion of K'an and Li occurs when one puts Qi into their hands, warms them, and massages the kidney area of the back... Just seems a little to physical... I had been assembling a manual on the practice, but now I'm not so sure if I should. If it's not something worth practicing, why go through all that trouble...

Haha! That's faster than I could do it

I think that stillness is essential. Whatever the method, if it helps you enter stillness/emptiness, it's a good thing in my opinion.

That's fantastic Leo! Let me know when you get it finished. I'd be glad to read a taobum's version!

I've been batting this around in my head this afternoon and haven't come to a conclusion yet. So I thout I'd relay my thoughts here, and you guys can tell me what you think. I remember reading (in "Cultivating the Energy of Life" maybe?) that at some point in Inner Alchemy (or maybe before, it's been a while since I read it) one must end anger and desire. I'm good on anger, I understand that part. But what does desire mean in this context? Is it sexual desire? Is it "wanting" things like physical objects or just "wanting" period? Or is it the same in this context as "attachment" in Buddhism? Maybe someone here can help me out with this. Thanks.

Haha! The prices some people place on knowledge...

I certainly hope they contribute. This thread is getting better and better.

I would just like to take the time to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread. I really feel like I've learned alot here. Let's keep it up!

So, based on Akrishi, the Hui Ming Ching is not applicable to the Golden Flower method. Right? Why would Wilhelm include it with the Golden Flower? (P.S: I hope my last post didn't come off as hostile. I wasn't accusing you of saying anything, Leo)

Ah, so Jing/Qi/Shen is still part of the process, just not actively "manipulated" by the Golden Flower method. That makes sense. But are you saying that the Hui Ming Ching is talking about the Inner Elixir? Wouldn't that be a different process than the Golden Flower?

I wonder how the Golden Flower fits in terms of Jing/Qi/Shen. From what I understand, Alchemy acends the natural order. That is myriad things, five elements, chien and kun, Tai-chi, and Wu-chi. If the primal spirit is beyond polar differences, we'd have to be talking about directly penetrating Wu-chi, essentially skipping everything before... Maybe the Golden Flower is a capstone technique, one to complete the Alchemy process? No, it mentions Kan and Li somewhere doesn't it? That's the Chien and Kun stage. Oh no, I've gone crosseyed... Perhaps my understanding of Alchemy is skewed. I can't wait to get my copies of this book when I go home!

We desire objects. Once these objects manifest, we are attached to them. I think I understand the distinction now. I feel silly for even having to ask, haha

Why is it not a good source for Inner Alchemy? Does Akrishi site any reasons? (Who is Akrishi by the way? )

Well, I was looking up info online about the Secret of the Golden Flower and came upon a wikipedia article of all things. I scrolled down to the bottom and saw something about Wang Liping teaching it to some Europeans. I clicked on "Taoist Wang Liping" and it gave me a brief article with some press releases and things, but at the very bottom of the page it had a link to a website. Is it his website? http://www.dao-de.org/dragongate/ I don't think this has been posted before, but if it has, I'm sorry and just disregard this thread. Just thought this was interesting...

Perhaps desire is a form of attachment? Or maybe vice-versa...

Well, Socrates taught stricktly in oral form as well. He believed that reading something left it too much up to the reader to infer what it meant. But I happen to think that if someone writes specifically, there is no guessing on the reader's part. I guess the reason to pass things on orally, is that once you truly understand something, you can help someone else understand it too, regardless of the words you use. If the same understanding is being reached, then there is no mistake (as in Chinese whispers, where all you do is memorize the words instead of understanding something).

And you can ensure that the hens are treated properly. Chickens are probably the most tormented animals around today. Well, the industrial caged ones, anyway.

I've heard that different types of crystals have different metaphyisical properties. I'm not a crystal healer but I do think that crystals, being created through powerful geologic processes involving incredible spans of time, both give off and absorb energy. If you're interested in finding out more just google "metaphysical properties of *whatever stone you're interested in*" You should come up with several new agey places. I like to stick to feng shui suppliers though. They often sell crystals that they think release a certain power, like citrine for wealth and quartz (rock crystal, like yours) for cleansing. And they're a little more Taoist I think

Just to repeat, and not to be a bother, does anybody know if Eva Wong has plans to translate this? I would be very curious in her perspective...

I'm making a mala and here are the beads I've chosen: 108 rudraksha beads symbolizing the destruction of ignorance 3 natural dzi resting beads to protect from evil and give good health 6 bone spacers to remind me of impermanence and come to terms with death 6 copper/iron/brass spacers to bring good health (Tibetan medicine metals) 1 undetermined material guru/stupa bead What should the guru bead be made from? Anyone know of any special, symbolic, or traditional materials for guru beads? Stone, wood, or seed. It doesn't matter to me. I just want it to have a deeper meaning than the cedar one I have planned. Cedar is only symbolic of smelling good

Finished the mala! I don't have any pics right now, but I really like the way it turned out. Used rudraksha, bone, dzi, and a lava stone guru bead with a smoky quartz stupa bead and a blue tassle. I left off the metal spacers, but I strung it on a white cord to incorporate the metal element. But regardless, I love it!

Does Eva Wong say anything else about the text in question? Does she say whether she will be translating it?