RFunaki

Thanks for the clarification, 松永道 - and good luck on your translation - I'm sure it will benefit many people. You don't believe so? Can you please elaborate on why?

I believe his next seminars were going to start incorporating Yin Xian Fa, but the public seminars previously did not yet have it incorporated. Also, what are you basing the Yin Yang fusion information off of? The merging took place not with Wang Liping, but with another master of his, Jiang. I believe it was Lei Shan Dao Yin Yang Gong, and was seperate frm the path that Wang Lipings is teaching him. It could be incorrect assumption to compare them as the same thing. Thanks, - Rick F

Please, little1. Share. I find it odd that secrecy is criticized often on this forum, yet you seem to be dangling information for some other purpose. This wouldn't have anything to do to with a once interested member of the foundation forum that was banned, would it? One thing I have found pretty consistent is, with most (not all, most) - most all of those opposed to David, were once very interested - but were turned away because: 1) They couldn't get the info for free 2) They firmly believed in another system that wasn't "compatible" and it arose the possibility of difficult truths. Please, little1. Any new information that we do not know would be great. I am a student of David's, and I whole heartedly would like to hear what you have to say. Just please, no games.

Thank you for your informative and mature reply, de_paradise. I've been meaning to aggregate these claims and examine them to try to understand the collective negativity towards this topic on TaoBums - I might just do that and post it here soon so there can be a more balanced view.

Everyone is quick to bash, but not put their money where there mouth is?

Mike, I was a member of the Wenwukuan forum while it was still up. Comparitively, your posts now show you've undergone a great evolution. At least from my humble point of view - that's wonderful. I wish you good luck and success in your training. Thanks, - Rick F.

No, not the same person. Also, I am also a little confused how this relates to David. Why is his name in the subject, twice?

To my understanding, the empowerments/healing/demonstrations did not cost extra, it was the medicine - which they were not required or pressured to take. I believe those who were upset were upset only because they weren't informed ahead of time. This information is now posted in the student experiences section of the forum however, for future participants - I don't believe adding it to the site is necessary, as many have a clean bill of health, and don't need medicine. And even those who do have conditions, aren't required to purchase any. I'm really sorry you feel that way. I have met David, and he is very genuine, humble, nice person. Very down to earth - and so are the other instructors/assistants in Denmark. It's really hard to judge things from behind your computer. The only real way is to find out for one's self. Although, it's kind of circular - those who check it out have an affinity for the training/teachers - so they don't need convinced in the first place. So really, debating is kind of pointless - I just wanted to rebute the above so that no one got the wrong impression. I'm sure everyone has their path, and I hope everyone finds a path that they feel they belong on as I have. What I don't understand is why people have to attack things like this - his students range all over the gamut in terms of types of people,professions,age etc. The ones I've met are also great people, who are very happy with the training they've received. The training is worth while, and if you don't have an interest in meeting a master or what's entailed, training is comparable to many alike seminars. So where's the harm or foul? Best Wishes, - Rick F.

More could be said, but it's clear that it's pointless. Hopefully those that are inclined to check out what David has to offer will, and those who aren't - won't. I actually am a fan of a healthy debate, but just don't have the time for it. And I can see that this is just arguing for the sake of arguing. So it's pretty simple. To each their own, right? And we both go on our merry way. Best wishes, - Rick F.

Hello, I'm a new registrant to the forum, and just joined to ask some questions of my own, and share what little I know also. My name is Rick and I am also a student of David Verdesi's. Although, at my level (Fresh beginner) it's hard to even consider yourself a student (I went to the seminar in Denmark last year, and will be attending this year's as well) I do and don't understand what the anger is all about. I am not here to argue, but maybe we could clarify where the arguments are coming from, because to me, many of these questions have been answered, or just have NO definite answer. What is the confusion here? To my knowledge, David joined Yin and Yang - and this was demonstrated on all the students present at his achievenment, and some of the longer time students at a later point. Wether or not it's comparable to MoPai doesn't matter - most of the time the comparisons are made to MoPai levels because many of us came to understand these things from Kostas Danaos' books. So the comparisons are made for the benefit of realtivity. Also to doubt he was in the MoPai I'm confused with as well. Andreas was a member of the forum, and made a few posts in it's beginnings. A few of us sat and had tea with David before class one afternoon while we were in Denmark, were discussing how we all came to be there at the seminar. One of the students who was a member of Andreas forum (the forum that started up after the MoPai forum closed) mentioned how apparently Andreas intention was to get David to join the forum and publically teach, because of the other masters he knew and the doors he could open for sincere students. Which, is exactly what happened. David took more of a public approach, and with Sean's outreach to many places, many of us found David and the practice. Someone who also knew John Chang posted on the forum recently about David's achieving level 4, and from what I gather - in David's reply he told the student (Or at least, son of a student, I can't remember the context and don't have the time to search through the forum - the point remains the same however) his respect for John, and that he intends to visit him this summer. Also, I believe you are mistaken in saying that only one student per lineage per generation achieves Level 4. That is MoPai tradition. Even without basing that on what I learned from David - looking at the simultaneous cases in history of many of the famous Taoist masters will tell you different. (The more well known "7 Taoist Masters" among which were taught by Wang Ch'ung-yang all are said to have achieved in the same generation) I also don't understand the base of the argument - your basing what's true or not on what you know from a book about John Chang? What has John Chang proved to you? Do you know him or any students? And whether or not he is a student of Liping's? Students have met and trained with him with David. To my understanding, David will also be publishing books by his request. (I believe one is an edited version of Opening the Dragon Gate - which should be proof in itself as that's where most of us even come to know him) The PhD discussion and credentials I don't know myself, because like many of my fellow students, it doesn't matter. I do know that a fellow student had asked him when we all met once, a suggestion on a school to study at for comparitive religion/anthropolgy and what not (As that was David's field of study as well) - David elaborated on a specific university and gave him information on it, etc. He even wrote information on the university for the student. I don't know if this is where he studied or not though - but that's the extent of my knowledge their. I also believe he spoke in Cornell University (I believe that's the name of it - it's near Rochester, NY/Brockport. NY area - maybe I can look further into it after work) That was during I believe his last visit to the US which was in 2003. Someone might be able to find information on that. The arguments about left handed path and right handed path I can see where some people are coming from, but don't agree with. Which is fine. I can also see where vegetarians come from, and I myself don't believe in cruelty to animals, but love meat. So I eat it. What happens in slaughter houses and animal fur manufacturing and gathering is what's truly horrifyng, but yet many of those making arguments still eat meat. Even if I disagreed of the gathering of the chi from bulls (Which I don't) - how could I argue it, as I eat meat. That would make me a hypocrite. I think it's pretty simple logic. Because it's the taking of energy, and not meat, it's not OK. Where does the energy in the universe come from? The energy from trees, etc? Aren't we always taking from something? I don't provide these points to argue - I just don't understand the base of the argument. To the students I spoke to in Denmark, they have seen much and have no question about their practice or David. What's funny is, I also spoke to some first time studnets who were studying with David for the first time, and who don't necessarily believe in the atainment of powers, but still greatly respected David and his teachings, and spent the money for the seminars. I know one thing for sure, coming up with the money and the time to make it to Denmark was not easy, but it was one of the highlights of my life. I can't wait to go again this year. What I learned, the people I met, and the experiences I had are all beyond measure. I really hope this does not come off as rude, or inchorenet, I was in a hurry while writing this. To sum it up, I respect the opinions of those who posted on both sides of the argument - more power to both sides. I just hope we aren't arguing for the sake of arguing. And, for those who have an affinity for this practice and are thinking about doing it, follow your heart - not disconnected impersonal posts on a forum. If this is not your thing, find something that is, because finding a practice you can devote yourself to and learn from is a great gift of life. Thanks, - Rick F.

Hello, my name is Rick, I am new a registrant, but drop in every so often to read some of the topics that catch my eye. I wish everyone well.