Nikolai1

Hi dreambliss, I have no doubt that you may need to make some outer adjustments to your circumstances. Its certainly time for you to move out and live on your own. But you need to start recognising that the bulk of your future happiness will come from inner changes not outer changes. Imagine you have a 40 a day cigarette habit but you can only afford twenty. Your cravings are making your life miserable. The outer adjustment would be to earn more money, so you can afford to live without cravings. The inner adjustment would be to quit smoking, to learn not to need them any more. Which of these is the superior strategy? The Law of Attraction is a rather dangerous idea. It makes people think that we can simply manifest the kind of things that our individual egos want. This is a very dangerous mixing of two mutually contradictory worldviews. Yes the LoA is eminently plausible, but only if we assume our fundamental identity to be that of a higher transcendent Self. Only then does it make sense. Learn to live as if you are this higher self. Treat each moment as if you willed it out of sheer love. This will make you satisfied with your situation, and you will be the living proof of the law of attraction. it is only when we gain a bit of inner contentment as a foundation that we have the courage the make the chnages in our outer circumstances that will match up with what we desire. With inner peace, making these changes will seem easy and natural and enjoyable - as if they were simply manifesting of their own accord!

11.00am - i have run out of milk and have cognitions about needed to visit the shop. I strongly believe that I am able and willing to go. 12.00pm - I am standing in the shop. The law of attraction merely maintains that our transcendent self recognised the cognition and then manifested the shop. The common sense view is that I simply made a decision and travelled to a building that pre-existed regardless of my beliefs and intentions. The truth is, its impossible to determine which of these is true. We can only decide one by invoking cognitive biases distinctive of that worldview. For example, I might seek to defend the common sense view by asking an outsider if the shop existed last year and was not manifested for the sake of the milk. But this act presupposes that there are pre-existing people able to serve as witnesses. The LoA advocate would simply assert that your higher self used the LoA to manifest the witness to suit the occasion, just as he did the shop. The immense importance of the LoA is not as some truth to believe in ouright, but a alternative perspective that can loosen our allegiance to the common-sense, restricted view.

The law of attraction is fundamentally unfalsifiable. If it doesn't work for you then the explanation given is that you don't believe in it enough, which then becomes more evidence for the theory that strong belief is necessary. All discussion over whether it does or does not work is therefore futile. What the LofA provides however is an alternative view of things. It presents the possibility, usually ignored, that the source of all that is on the outside is actually on the inside. It is a theory of immense spiritual importance, and until you recognise its plausibility - and yes, it is just as plausible as the common sense view - then you will be trapped in a world and vulnerable to its forces. In other words, you will remain unliberated.

A Course In Miracles

When things start to manifest in your life they appear through the same channels as they aways did. Food does not fall from the sky, but money to buy food, starts to appear in adequate quantities through new and perhaps unexpected channels. Money still comes in return for your labour. This is the way of the world. But earning the money feels effortless and perhaps new and exciting. And all this is a scene that you never could have pictured before. So Wayne Dyer is now earning money aboard cruise ships? I can guarantee you that from his perspective this is evidence of his manifestation wishes. You get what you wish for. It might be that WD values money more thanh the peace of mind that comes with the simple life. That's his call. Don't worry about what looks like hypocrisy. Just recognise that his life is consistent with the message of manifestation

Hi moonninite I think stage 7/8 is also pretty interesting, and from jeffs list I would put myself in that area. I think it's a time when you realise that your demons are pretty much conquered and inner peace never seems far away. It's like there's a confidence that nothing can really knock you ever again - like you have the tools and the awareness to nip anything in the end before it grows bigger. Life is pretty enjoyable so is not surprising that many are tempted to claim victory - particular when even death isn't feared. That feeling of being in a waiting room is inevitable when individual will power to achieve something is pretty much gone. In a strange sense we need to feel perfect and whole, ie enlightened, in order for our individuality to melt away. To feel like you have conquered is fine temporarily, but those with finer aspiration will realise there is more to be done...even when there is no will left to do it. When we reflect on this predicament it can be frustrating and a sense of stuck ness is inevitable. Personally I think the 'stuckness' is comes from nothing other than the tendency to self reflect. As we lose interest in our self hood, and our nonchalance about death shows this is already quite advanced, we shall cease to care about where we are headed and that shall be our advancement to enlightenment. Further surrender to what is is key!

Yes totally agree, and the disassociation with the physical can't happen until there is some alternative identity to step in place. That identity is just the feeling of identity itself, the feeling of 'I am' that is there whatever happens. In terms of illness, the symptoms - all the pain and discomfort - need to be felt as being one more instance of this 'I Am' But think about them as symptoms and that is what they shall remain. I'm sure you're pretty good at tuning into feelings in the body, just do the same for you symptoms except don't label them as anything, just feel them purely and directly and you'll realise that no symptom is a 24/7 concern. They flare up and need to be given pure aware consciousness and then they go away again.

Hi white tiger The most toxic belief of all is that you are a physical body with an illness. The beneficial beliefs that you have are that it might be healed - either through Qi Gong exercises, or some other form of medicine. But if you are spiritually developing then it might be that you are starting to graduate beyond both Qi Gong and Medicine. This is a very difficult stage, when, through spiritual awareness we start to outgrow what had previously helped us. Qi Gong, and all the accompanying theories about energy channels, dantiens and meridians are good, but not excellent beliefs to hold. The ultimate healing belief is to realise that You are not your body. Realise your true self and you will start to wonder how on earth you could be ill in the first place. This scepticism will eventually heal you. The hard thing for you is: your Qi Gong will never again heal you, and you need to let it go for yourself while realising that for all your students it still might be the best possible thing on offer.

I think a belief that holds me back is my belief that other people can't understand me. I marvel at people who are able to become spiritual teachers and talk openly about the most radical and world-changing principles. Even though I live, eat and breathe this stuff I keep it pretty much to myself, unless I know that I am talking to the like-minded - as on the website. I just feel like actually discussing this stuff with all the regular people in my life would leave them feeling very uncomfortable, and me looking extremely crazy. Yet it feels like I can't be fully content unless I can learn to share this stuff on a much more regular basis. My approach therefore is to just wait, and if anyone ever asks me something, or approaches me then I'll happily discuss.

I think you have to have a clear understanding of the true nature of thought. Thoughts are realities in themselves that have their own vitality and differ from matter only in terms of quantity not quality. You might say that they are simply at a lower level of light than that which appears to have solidity. Thoughts are like spores of pollen that have the potential to grow into solid oak trees, when given conscious attention. If we believe thoughts are private mental events then this belief will seriously compromise our freedom to manifest them. We shall only be able to manifest what we believe we can manifest. And our beliefs will of course follow the conventional lines of normal limited human agency in a world governed by natural laws. It is only when we start to realise our true selves, and experience ourselves as transcendental selves, that thoughts shall appear as objective things 'out there' alongside matter. The we start to see the similarities between thought and matter, rather than the Cartesian duality which is the normal view.

Hi all, I've been reading a bit of the modern Advaita guys - mostly Ramana Maharshi and Nisargadatta - and they both talk a lot about the four states of consciousness: 1) the normal waking state. 2) the dreaming state 3) the void state of deep sleep. And to these they add a fourth, which they say actually includes all the previous three, and is therefore the first and only state of consciousness. The term they use for this state is turiya. I find this fascinating and I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who has direct experience of this state? The reality of this fourth state completely changes how we think of sleep, for example. It suggests that the oblivion of deep sleep is actually directly experienced by us all, and that it is an error to think that we were unconscious. In other words, absence of thoughts, feelings etc is not unconsciousness, we only believe it is. The more we learn to transcend our walking state the more we learn to tap into this fourth state. But for me, I do not feel like deep sleep is an experience I have, rather it seems like i infer it by the gap in memories. So, if anyone can tell me how the experience of deep sleep feels, I'd love to here. A corollary of entering the fourth state is that dreams can be consciously directed just as our waking cognitions can. Is this the case? I look forward to hearing from you!

I'm not sure I can explain why but it seems to be a psychological fact that in semi-mystical experience ultimate reality is often construed in terms of one of the senses. For many people this sense is sight and reality appears as a very bright light that we realise is not 'of the world'. It is the 'light that lights the light' or the 'light above the light' in the words of St Augustine. For others, reality is construed in terms of the sense of hearing. The Aum is to sound what the light is to vision. Although I have various experiences with seemingly transcendental light I have had nothing ot do with sound and I'd be interested to hear from people that have?

Eye of the storm, I love it that you posted an image of the prism. Whenever I try and make sense of this stuff the metaphor of the prism returns to me time and time again. For example, reality can be known directly through awareness (white light) or, if we are not able to do this, reality can be 'refracted' into the various senses (sight, sound etc) and known that way In turn each sensory modality can be refracted Sight = white light refracted into the colours of the spectrum Sound = the primordial sound (Aum) refracted into the notes of the octave. Feeling = pure body consciousness refracted into the seven chakras Etc. The point of the spiritual life is to pass beyond the everyday refracted reality to the pure unrefracted Reality!

Yes this is how I understand the fourth state. It feels like I can go into it at will, and sometimes it descends upon me not at will. In meditation, (which is where I first learnt to recognise it) it can feel very pronounced and the otherness of the everyday world is striking. But clearly there are depths of this fourth state that I am no where near attaining. Both Ramana Maharshi and Nisargadatta maintain that they are in this state during deep sleep. They are conscious while their body is inert and snoring. This is extraordinary and fascinating. They are in a state of mind where the uncanny world of dreams and the 'real world' of waking consciousness are nothing other than passing moods, perspectives on reality but not reality itself. They are quite clearly living a completely different order of existence. So exciting and inspiring to think its there for our attainment if we want it! So that's why I'm interested in anyone who lives from the depths of this fourth state. I think awareness during deep sleep is a pretty good indicator that you are there.

Have you been officially diagnosed, or did you read some checklist and think 'yeah, that's me!' When narcissists read checklists of all the negative traits, they respond narcissistically, by saying 'that is SO not me! Diagnosis requires objective viewpoints, from colleagues, family and clinicians. It's very possible that your spiritual development has brought you to a place that many reach. It is the simple realisation that our motives weren't always pure and honourable. This doesn't make you narcissistic, just a person with increased insight into themselves and the normal human condition.

Karma/fate/ determinism are not real, just an intellectual angle on cause and effect in human lives. The complementary angle is freedom of the will. Too see both as erroneous views is the liberation. To believe in karma is to be bound by karma. Believing makes it real. Believing it blocks you from seeing things from the angle of freedom, which makes karma even more real.

Hi IAm No! I've never said that. I'm saying that the one thing that is needed is the transformation of our inner attitude. This transformation is the spiritual life. It is immaterial whether you are living alone on a mountain, or snorting coke after a hard day at the bank, if you are in that moment able to keep your awareness on the infinity within you then you are sacred yourself and all your actions are sanctified. What I see in your post is the opposite tendency. First, you took a job, doubtless because of the security it offered you, then you quit it because you were unable to tolerate the spiritual meaninglessness of it and your colleagues, and now you are in an anxious situation, feeling financially insecure but worrying about your soul and trying to concoct 'best of both world' solutions. While it sounds very rational, it won't work. In fact the very attempt is blocking you from finding the correct attitude on the inside. This attitude can only be found on a moment by moment basis, as you live in the midst of things. I think Ish showed a very good technique here: It is very hard to recognise that it is an inner attitude that is determining everything. At first we only recognise spirituality when we see it in other people, and then imagine that it is their outer behaviours that are the important thing. And what makes it doubly confusing is that the spiritually cultivated so often behave in similar ways - they do quite humble jobs, and live their lives in simple looking ways. But this is not some technique to follow. If we merely try to imitate them we will get nowhere! The simplicity of their lifestyle is the inevitable outer expression of an inner attitude where each moment is fine by them, and nothing in particular need be sought out. With time, this leads to a natural transformation in our lives when we, without even noticing it, cease investing and renewing in all the things that are unnecessary. Though some do this consciously and wilfully in the form of renunciation, for many of us it occurs unconsciously and can therefore be slightly alarming. It's quite shocking when even the nearest and dearest loves and interests reveal themselves as inauthentic means to get us happiness, and we feel unable to keep them going. Now you still like the idea of meeting friends in a restaurant. Don't be surprised if you start to feel indifferent about all that stuff. Look, I know you are out of work and need to take assertive action quickly. My advice would be to take the job which seems most bearable and stick with it. Make the work your practice. Face up to it, and attempt to rise above each irksome moment as it arises. If you are very steadfast about this, you'll find that the job will quickly become very bearable. You will also find that you will be able to rise above your pleasures too. And learning to step off the hedonic treadmill will give you the security that comes when you no longer need to spend half your earnings on fun. If you want to know more about me: I'm 38, not working this year as I've decided to stay home and look after our 3 kids, 9 yrs, 5 yrs and 11 month old. My days are surprisingly busy, and not particularly stimulating. There are near constant demands for my attention. I have no job to go back to, and no profession, other than work experience in care work to which I'll doubtless return. I have no pension, no securities, no investments. My own philosophy I put into practice on a moment by moment basis and it works. There comes a point when you have to very squarely face up to life itself, moment by moment by moment. If I become destitute and die I won't mind very much, although I love life and consider myself happier than anyone I know

This is another fallacy to beware of - that there is such a thing as 'spiritual work'. With the right inner attitude, any activity whatsover is spiritual activity. But, it just so happens that a person with inner peace loses the motivation to do certain jobs. The might, for example, find it hard to work in something like a bank because it seems so trivial and unimportant. But this doesn't make banking unspiritual, not at all. It just attracts people who don't have the inner attitude that we call spiritual, and doesn't attract those who do.

Really interesting post which of course sounds very prudent, but... This isn't possible, the two can't be held in stasis like that. One will grow at the expense of the other. It's just the way it goes. If your career hasn't taken off its because you never saw anything worth devoting yourself to. Your interest in the spiritual life was almost certainly undermining you in modern society. So which is it to be? Commit yourself to the spiritual world and you will ultimately gain all the security that you ask for. The ultimate security that you feel when you know you, in essence, are not an individual vulnerable to ill-health and death. The security that gives you the balls to trust the universe to supply you with all that you need without anxiety-based insurance policies. Or, give up on this. Turn away from everything that undermines you in the modern world, and create yourself material security while there is still chance. There is nothing wrong with this course. Most people follow it and even if its wrong, death will save you from feeling too much regret. It's this shilly-shallying between the two that is the problem, as you will certainly find out before long.

If she felt frustrated at her lack of opportunities, then yes, she was a failure.

I Am This statement can only apply to those who are seeking to derive happiness from the outside. Granted, it will probably make sense to most people. But to those who have found happiness on the inside, and by that I mean the spiritual joy, that is with them whatever they have or do, it makes no sense at all and is an entirely redundant statement. To such people it will truly make no difference if they live in a mansion or a barrel - their happiness is secured whatever. This inner ingredient can not be seen talked, about or measured. It plays virtually no role in modern happiness studies, who understand spirituality only in terms of things like community, meaning and friendship. Yet the person who has gained inner joy could be left alone on a mountain and suffer no deterioration in mood. Here you give your own account of the good life: By conventional standards it is sensible and wise, and recognises the folly of chasing material success alone. But still it takes little account of the spiritual joy that is the most necessary ingredient to happiness. What makes the spiritual life so challenging is that very, very often we find ourselves losing interest in our work, our sports and hobbies, and very often our friends. One of the first fruits of dedicated practice is that we find ourselves resembling the 'lazy, slobby underachiever' in that we lose all motivation to continue being what had always satisfied us in the past. Unfortuntely (or fortunately) for you, you are already showing all the signs of someone heading down this road. This is a very distinctive sentiment of the spiritual seeker: Already there is a gap between you and a huge swathe of society. This gap can grow and grow, it can invade all your hobbies and pastimes and certainly including what you now call *spiritual'. Immediately prior to spiritual realisation you may found yourself in a place of utter alienation from everyone and everything around you. This is where thoughts like this can lead you... And then the light comes, and you realise that there is a source of joy that requires nothing on the outside. Then you realise that all the conventional pleasures of life were never anything other than pale reflections of a happiness that was always within.

If you are able to be contented with a bowl of rice and soy sauce it is because you already have a solid stable happiness on the inside. Then you think - 'its only rice and still I'm happy' If you don't have happiness on the inside then you will and must find it on the outside. A Mercedes IS happiness. And its widespread recognition as a symbol of happiness IS the solid stability that the rice eater has on the inside. If you talk about inner happiness to most people they simply will not understand what you mean. The only happiness they recognise is that which makes people say to them "Gee, you have a Mercedes, you must be happy!' And they agree and have no suspicion that there is anything other. Rice eaters are a threat - they muddy the picture, make things confusing. The only justification for the rice eater's violence is that they point the way to a superior happiness. A happiness that others aren't trying to steal from you, or scratch with their keys as they walk by. But we mustn't expect people to overnight find inner happiness. Do not expect them to enjoy rice. No-one enjoys rice. The rice merely shows us that we are happy despite the rice.

Boy What Tibetan Ice said about the heart centre sound more like Ramana Maharshi, but RM and Nisargadatta are basically very compatible even if Nasrgadatta ghad no experience of the right-sided heart centre, I think you're being a bit harsh on him.

Forestemptiness Wikipedia consider this to be his trademark quotation: Similar sentiments litter pretty much each page of 'I Am That'. As far as technique goes this is his teaching. But you are right to suggest that something further will happen spontaneously, and that there is more to the message than just following the technique

forestemptiness why is this a mistake? I thought this was the point of the book?