Stosh

I don't think there's a magic incantation which will force you to respect someone else's decisions as being for them to make. But I suppose you could remind yourself just how much you resent people intruding on your own prerogatives. As a parent though , in the beginning I expect you'll need to encourage and discourage things as you see it best.. hopefully you recognize at some point when you're starting to be needlessly intrusive , and its time that you can start ,, not having to. Keeping it foremost , that you want that kid to be able to stand on their own , rather than just please you to avoid scoldings and so forth,, might help you restrain yourself.

I suppose it reduces derailing from the content perhaps , or it might replace a non-responsive snub with an indicator which not so harsh. If I have an active dislike about someone elses posting , its really mostly my responsibility what my sentiment is. It was suggested to me that I just use it for whatever I wanted it to mean.... I went with that... but would think it appropriate to just have a non-specific symbol. like ^

BTW ... never use old soda pop as a sugar replacement in instant coffee. If you're looking for an answer about where the original configuration of a thing goes when its transformed, its my opinion that it isn't really a thing they would wonder , since they were already conceptualizing that stuff was composed of elementary components, which, though rearranged were in and of themselves preserved. The configuration at any given time is a matter of ones perception , the incense is in their view a composite , not an individual material or truly distinct thing. The same would apply to a person, that essentially we are not distinct from the materials which comprise us, and therefore we ourselves would be an illusion built on a composite of what actually exists more fundamentally. Western science gets to that as well, but considers the 'composites' to exist with special natures of their own. But I think the taoist view sees these things as manifestations of a larger whole rather than different.

Im thinking there should be a passage for that. .... Saying Anything affects people,if they hear it. Question is though are they changed? I tend to think it goes in ears and out again,perpetuating through the unbounded manifest, for the most part.How long does petting my kittycats ears last?

But certainly one could extend it that the effects of ones transient moment of living , perpetuates.... Or that the idea that stuff is transient , can be demonstrated as bogus,,, generally speaking.

Yeah, I struggled a bit with that, and decided that in the day, if you blew out a flame literally, one couldnt see. Us, understanding light as as a perpetuating wave, is a bit much for that time. I certainly see other options, like yours, and just chose one. The sentiment being expressed, seems to me, to be contrasting a very transient view of light-knowledge-experience ... an event seeming to end instantly, ... to a more lasting situation. Im Choosing but one single thing , just to convey the idea , in this case, one lifetime. There are certainly more graceful extensions of duration too. Im reminded of the saying ,that "if you give a man a fish, it lasts him only for the day, but if you teach him to fish ,it lasts for his lifetime" . Similarly, if you improved his understanding or relationship with God, he may enjoy a grace everlasting. And also similarly we say diamonds are forever, though physics understands them to be evaporating -undergoing sublimation,,at standard room temperature and pressure, just very slowly. Good morning.

Well, it could be that the idea is just wrong, .. you dont really use incence as a fuel. But if one accepts these ideas as figurative suggestions thats not important.I suppose it could be rephrased, when the fuel burnt is incense, the effect perpetuates beyond the present . And then the meaning could be that when ones actions feed the spirit, the effects change ones life.

What mess?

Nah

Weird things happen , the important thing though ,is to dismiss them.

Confucius says... There are two possibilities, 1), that the master said only one thing,, and we can fight over it. 2) The master said many things ,one message for each of us.

Extricating.

I see , he came to the funeral to see an unusual man, found out he was being mourned , was disappointed , so he made a token gesture and left. Great story.

If Heaven equates to Nature and natures rule , its just unnatural to pretend sorrow for a stranger , the negative ramification for this error is a needless sorrow and wasteful behavior. ,, No gods ,and no hangman required.

It is said , Freedom from the rat race is death. or "all life entails suffering"

Ok but why is God preventing men from being freed ? and why has his opinion of Lao drooped because people mourned his death? (PS I think his death Would be an explanation for their grief ,,I used to like pizza hut, I no longer do. And I thought monotheistic god , savior of man preventing unhappiness, sits at odds with all of this, I thought the roots of Daoism were Shamanism or animism... Is Mr Qin Shi , a friend , or was he reverent of Lao as a great man , or what? ,, Now, he only offers weak condolences. His reason being what he has seen. If he was impressed by the overwhelming power of the mans effect , wouldnt he wail More , rather than make a flimsy gesture, turn around and go home ? )

Whats the "man of men" thing? I dont 'get' the loosening of the cord imagery at all. Can you explain how that metaphor fits life? If I may say ,, As you dislike Mair's, I feel similarly about Legge's , I hate it ,(though there is a common issue about the appropriate approach to the loss ,against excessive grieving being in tune with Lao's philosophy). To be specific about my disagreement with Legge , If Lao was so beloved , and inspired such emotion,as one is born with naturally ,,, it stands in contrast to discounting grief or joy , as having value. To me it doesn't make for a cohesive understanding of the philosophic point, , nor does the cord thing seem to be pertinent. Mair's version is cohesive , it all fits together , and most importantly ! it coincides with what I feel the Daoist teachings mean.

Yes , I'm now thinking , you're right , the point of the thing is the relationship of the living. I stand corrected. The first question one really would have is who the heck is this person? not his behavior, though he stands out for it. And his name if its Possibly 'Idle Intruder' points at it.

...maybe. I'd like to know if the proper wailing procedure attributed specific meaning to a certain number of wails, which might shed light on whether Chin yi was just paying respects , or actually touched about the death,though perhaps having heard about it a long time in advance so as to arrive at the place,... OR perhaps Mr Chin was from a rival 'school' and looked like an idle intruder. Was it plausible that he really was just hanging around a funeral of a friend? I may indeed be reading a closer relationship between the two than existed .. I dont know if he truly was an idle intruder , an acquaintance , or just looked like one to the other guests. When this sort of uncertainty is presented I usually assume that either is plausible to the author , and the story should be seen the same regardless .. that the mastery of Laos teaching would indeed make it indistinguishable if the person was close to the deceased or not. ( the dearest of friends seeming the most casual of acquaintances) My personal take is that they were very very close.

That last sentence Does ,not seem to fit, to me either. It seems like a personal additional summation . The sentiment, though can fit, I take it that the whole communication is that Lao ,having lived and taught equinanimity , and peace regarding acceptance,,,, was Ok with his own passing. His student, Chin ,while he loved the master, had learned the same, and so, didnt react as many did. Its like saying he , Lao,had gone to an even greater everlasting peace, the peace, that gods had, no needs ,no sorrows etc. Chin yi still has a soul that can love and feel deeply, he just moves on to accept ,rather than dwell in misery. I feel this passage is intended to enhance the precision of Laos message, that being human , we are still subject to sorrows, a ramification , of ones joys and loves, and we strive towards a perfection of peace thats beyond us as mortals.

Maybe , Tribulation , may fit better than 'punishment'.

Excerpt From the comments... "Confucius say [sic]: 'He who cooks carrots and peas in the same pot is unsanitary.'"

Its suggesting the issues of scale are relative , that ones ambitions desires and needs may be either scaled up or down ,, the same principles still apply. The issues before a King are the same ilk as that of the Peon. Why then set grandiose goals one cant easily reach? since we are not 'literally' in the same position, and minimizing what one expects or wants , make happiness attainable.

From the people who make the tea I suppose

I read it thusly, Ease, literally doing nothing, doesn't make it happy. (IMO, this negates the idea that doing nothing ,, literally,, --is not the way (" doing nothing , leaving nothing undone ") is meant. His existance, freed, makes him "useless" for being eaten. His nature, being unmodifed in the situation of being caged, may have certain advantages or disadvantages , but his or her nature is to be the marsh pheasant living the life of one. It cant help but but follow ,his or her nature, regardless of added difficulty or danger. Its irrational from the perspective of the human for it to fly away, but taking the nature of the Birds view as a starting point , there is rationality in its attempt to be free , it will sustain itself easy enough in the marsh. The food isnt the point either way, its just the nature of birds and people to want to be free , and it doesnt have to serve greater purpose , or even its own 'health and longevity' . Life is not , by bread alone , made whole. Edit for clarity , since I was at a stoplight, didnt want to retype the whole thing , so I just saved it for later, but by the time later came around I was busy with other stuff and so, never really go around to it in the prompt manner in which I had intended it to be responded to. So now Revisiting the post Im shocked at just how mangled I presented it , leaving that standing for all to be discomfitted by.. and post haste I have fixed it up despite some looks by my boss disapproving that Im goofing around on the computer whan theres legit stuff to be done. Though if I wrote it now I might go with Milton ,, The mind is its own place, and in itself Can make a heav'n of hell, a hell of heav'n. or Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heaven. Which is all pretty ironic since we had Olive Garden at a lunch meeting today and I had the angel hair pasta.. with chicken!