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Everything posted by Stosh
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.I already made my case, Youve been snapping at folks who dont deserve it. Im already calm ,I dare you to match me.
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Notable sages / saints / mystics / philosophers
Stosh replied to eye_of_the_storm's topic in General Discussion
Dont be like that dude! is fairly strong reasoning. I think you should go ahead and list anti-heros But it aint my thread -
Bums is a self derogatory term in this case regarding folks of too much leisure (lazy) Its indicating a level of humility and self inspection. Though most of us have jobs , responsibilities and some pride. Hi there , welcome and , don't worry about the grammar.
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You seem to have been snapping at folks quite a bit , and been defend it in the name of free speech and free thought. If thats really the sentiment of your thoughts , then Its you who should consider the pressures on you that bring that to be, (again not to please me , not to please the FBI ). Turning the blame on its head wont change that for you. (whether you feel you have made a 'convincing' turnabout or not.) You are still making arguments which may be sound in some respects but are ultimately unethical ,,and you are still pitting the United States against China in a battle for one upsmanship. Even if those elements are there in Jetsuns comments there is no call that you have to stay with that track , you are still choosing it. Take a breath let stuff cool and take it up in a bit if its still valid.
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If one says what they know to be untrue , they have on some level admitted to themselves they cant respond with the 'real facts'. If a person wont admit a sound argument to change their mind , they are promoting their own ignorance So its not to please others that someone should choose to speak true. It is just in ones own expedient self interest , heck it can even be a matter of ones pride, that they feel demeaned being pushed into untruth. But the Tao Te Ching is a simple book made complex by foreign wind-finders and shadow-hunters Here is the line that I read as mocking in response to To find the wind and catch her shadow are not an easy thing to do. Saying that one has f***ed up what is simple (because they are foreign) and simultaneously use their own terms to describe them disparagingly especially when that person has spent so much time trying to uncover the the book to new audience in the most correct fashion he can ,,,, reads as mocking.. maybe you meant it otherwise , , Im willing to accept that as true, and Im willing to just walk away to see what is vindicated , but blasting some of the most reasonable folks that post on here and my own nationality repeatedly -does rub me the wrong way. Time passes , the blood cools
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I said trend to it, as in..( so you can see it for yourself that we have 'a' culture ) and its origins go back just as far as your own .. beyond the mists of time, and not isolated Yes, no matter where one goes -there are rules , sometimes they are vague, other times strict but although we may differ in degree of display ,everybody prefers a degree of respect For instance I tend to be informal with folks I respect and more formal with folks I dont even know (or dont like). Formalities are developed to mitigate potential hostilities due to accidental crossing of boundaries people I know and like , get preferred status , leeway and consideration , , they are not considered to be transgressing -by me- unless they get way out of control Others may display preferred status with increased ! formality , but dont mistake this difference as a total absence of respect. Genuine respect may or may not be there , it takes observance over time to tell the difference between it and the reverse , wouldnt you say -as well?
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Disrespect of cultures shows a lack of respect for mankind. Which believe it or not, includes American culture which trends to egalitarian. The novelty and creativity which it fosters, is an element some eastern schools wish to inculcate. Aint that dispelling ignorance ?
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I think I fit a description for philosophical taoist , and though you may disagree whether I fit the existing definitions, (or maybe just your own definitions ) I assure you I do . I do not, I repeat Not ,seek any divine revelations . As far as I can see there is no "divine" " anything ! " ( unless one considers ALL to be divine .. which leaves 'divine' to be meaningless.) and there is nothing that needs requires or generates worship from me. Please refrain from boxing me in so much with your own definition of yourself regarding this. Go ahead and speak your mind about yourself , but you aint all philosophical Taoists. Here and there its fine to go and speak for the grouping but said repeatedly as if it were some fact , begs re-clarification. And on the home turf of China the ttc has its own fair share of varied interps , its not like the country is of some monolithic opinion, its not. You or I can google up hundreds of translations for the first chapter alone in a minute or two, many of them -the renderings of native Chinese speakers. Cd doesnt require my defense but if you are going to mock him you should at least do him the respect of making a sound argument to go with it. Unless its true- stop saying it.
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As a nation, one decides to become involved or to retreat behind borders. Repeatedly ,the decision to stay isolated has caused nations to fall behind ,regress. And then they no longer retain the ability to handle what will eventually be coming their way. Involved , a nation cannot help but to interfere in the lives of people of the nations they interact with in some way or another. This makes retaliation inevitable, but it doesnt make bombings justified. Some people bomb due to hate , hate due to ignorance ,and have ignorance due to a refusal to accept engagement or change. Some folks seem in a rush to blame themselves and their country for the heinous acts of despicable people, other close their eyes to bless and condone what really didnt need to happen. Most conflict could be avoided if folks removed the artificial boundaries dividing them from their brother. There are no nations there are only individuals.
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There's one of them thar synchronicities again ! "There is no trying, only doing "
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Is there someones stuff I can read ,to flesh out or anchor my READ ?
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Thanks for the corrections and supplement. I usually feel like I am climbing uphill trying to explain my reading, and so any kind ofgetting the point is more than refreshing whether or not its completely in agreement on everything or not.
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The easy ways to gain certainy is to either post a photo here for me, or on flikr biird identification help group. Truly those folks really are amazing even wth a crappy photo. I still post some pix for them to check myself on new species till I am familiar. Grey jay shaped birds incude two mockingbirds and gray catbird. The dark one may also be brownheaded cowbird.The red on the rump is still consistent with the two finches but.. The differences are subtle enough to be difficult to communicate without visuals, and the details are fine enough between similar species to render recollection deficient until one has become familiar. All Ican offer is likely candidates. Youve got to make the final call unless you can get pix..My policy is not to count a species without a pic that can be disproven..but that is just my quirk . Like you said, seeing new and nifty ones can be enough too.
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Sorry to drop so far back in the thead but I'd rather answer, than pass on it. Cd and Rene and others can translate the individual characters which go together as a phrase (rather than distinct parts as in english) , I cant. .But I was told that the term is the guide of-to classical virtue. Allowing for real difference in viewpoint one should maintain (like a juggler) the various sentiments that could be indicated. The definitions and MEANINGS are all in doubt to some degree. Is the english choice for the word Tao right ? Is the choice for the word Te right ? Is the choice for the word Ching Right ? That being said , assuming 'Te' equating to our 'virtue' (trait of goodness) doesnt make any sense ( since good and evil are peception- perspective dependent ( one mans good is another mans evil)) ... and if Ching means 'classical' again the title makes no sense( because a virtue that is perspective dependent wouldnt hold in all circumstances.) Tao is known to have several meanings (such as what wise men of the times was looking for.. a guide to living.. like Confucious came up with ). 'Te' in the title is not understandable as a goodness style virtue for other reasons as well. Te , understood more as the integral spirit -nature of a thing- fits better. TTC then reads more like 'the natural way that things be' which isnt in contradiction to my view. I am not trying to make a linguistic argument for the interp of the words, it is highly contextual instead. Jumping ahead , Lao gives us the inverse to normal reasoning , demonstrates its viability with the literary device of the Sage, and the inverse of the inverse ( which is the normal view ) is left implied, because it is already understood to be valid. You cant guide people , by telling them , either go left or right , up or down , be fat or skinny , be smart or ignorant and so on, ,,If a person wants to get places you cant tell them " go left " without taking into account where they are, (and be of any help) so he has to make a choice in his guide. You have to go a step farther to see that the directives arent meant as they can seem to be worded. Ex.1 If you want folks to ask you for your input , you keep your opinions to yourself ,, thats reasonable because folks dont want to be invalidated.,,, then again , Why would you want to be asked your opinions and not respond?? Ex. 2 If yang gives way to yin , and yin to yang , then you have cycle and balance over time, if one side always wins as in ONLY The soft overcoming the hard, the cycles stop. To have any of the stuff be reasonable to other intelligent folks ( as in the word classic ) There must be some accounting for the Yin bias in the TTC. One has to put two and two together , often looking to our own lives and minds, to understand the meanings. You now have my solution to the paradox, the tome is not to tell folks how they should be ,it is giving us the options and relationships to consider things 'outside the box', for our health happiness peace and fulfillment! Just what an 'old heart' would wish to bestow on his grandkids and his people. Wow Im out of breath! Capisco paisano?
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Unlike many I would say cleverness is a natural trait for some folks , and it can be an expedient tool for all sorts of purposes. But the downside is when ones mental convolutions end up being actually a detriment , as in, when someone puts on a persona that they are not. Because if one's persona is liked , one doent know if thier genuine self is liked or whether its just the persona, the same goes for dislike. As far as Sageliness , again I am not traditional , I consider the Sage to be a literary device devised to demonstrate the validity of principals taken to an extreme, (and the prinicipals are just as valid in the implied reverse logic ,, so there are times when a persona is certainly the advantageous thing to present and the same goes for effort investment etc etc ) If I find out what I want to know it really isnt important whether I am percieved as clever or clumsy. As far as the stillness overcoming heat , the reverse is just as valid , the point is- that the things have a relationship which can be contrary to normal expectation. But thats just my opinion- not the concensus's.
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Taking a moment to take stock, he realized that polar bears live at the north pole and penguins live south of the equator! So he must be at Sea-world .
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The Gray Jay (Perisoreus canadensis), also Grey Jay, Canada Jay or Whiskey Jack,[2] is a member of the crow and jay family (Corvidae) found in the boreal forests across North America north to the tree-line and in subalpine forests of the Rocky Mountains south to New Mexico and Arizona. It is one of three members of the genus Perisoreus, the others being the Siberian Jay, P. infaustus, found from Norway to eastern Russia and the Sichuan Jay, P. internigrans, restricted to the mountains of eastern Tibet and northwestern Sichuan. All three species store food and live year-round on permanent territories in coniferous forests. Maybe they are Scrub jays? ( known as being very smart birds with interesting social structure) The other pink ones are likely house finches ( sometimes yellow instead of pink on males ), there is also possibility of purple finch,, they do look extremely similar. Brewers blackbird is certainly a possibility, though they tend be north of you, central florida and north. there are several birds that look very similar though. I Cant guess by description alone. Look at the beak and irridescence color carefully . Contrary to what my own considerations were , birds can be very localized in their habits , going to within yards of last years haunts (even though one figures they fly all over the place , which they may , just not very randomly )
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I am thinking it means ' mental boxes' as in free thought ' outside the box', but I may have missed her meaning as well. Goodnight either way , gotta get up early.
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If the setting of the universe, and the inviolable rules of it , defined by the context,is consistant with an 'entity' for you, you got me right, but I wouldn't call it such. Not caring is anthropomorphic description, nothing to pray to, no possibility of gaining favor, nothing to blame, no intent or design.
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I am more of the opinion, similar to Cd's on the definition, but taking it to be that tao equates more to the setting of emptiness in which things can be manifest,, 'finding 'equating more to opening up to groking the quale of it.It seems that renae, zero, yourself see it in quite a different light. (I don't get Cd's stance clearly, maybe its a blend and yet simpler)
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Frankly though, I see the tao as fact of the matter, not as a spiritual epiphany. It has spiritual repercussions anyway, but the tao doesn't care. Zippo concern and since you have some stuff in mind for your rituals I should leve you to it as well.
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Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer. Doesn't one of taoist texts suggest one not surround themselves with Yesmen ?
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if he is or isn't is not for me to dispense judgement on. Besides , a person can be entirely sincere and also very wrong.I was just addressing why a person might legitimately balk for a reason other than unjustified fear.
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The issue I am bringing up is about the symbolism. I like a glass of red wine too.Christianity uses wine, others abstain, A breathing exercise might replace consumption of an item, and be more in line with traditionalists.