i am

I eat meat. Back when I ate it thoughtlessly, I had low cholesterol, low blood pressure, and good energy. Now I'm very conscious about it, and eat much less meat, and almost exclusively meat either I killed, or meat that I know how it was killed and feel ok about it. And...low cholesterol, low blood pressure, maybe slightly more energy than I used to have. Genetics might be a better determining factor for many of us than diet, at least as far as the cholesterol and blood pressure. I see many people who eat much worse than me, who don't suffer the negative reactions I do when I don't eat we'll. Anyway...humans can choose a vegetarian diet, and survive. This, among other things, sets us apart from other animals. So...I don't pretend to know enough about the tao or spiritual matters to know the answer. Just because I might be healthier eating good quality meat than no meat, does that mean its RIGHT to eat another animal? Just because I'm healthier? I don't know. I can't think of anything other than meat which could be argued as being healthy in the right amounts and quality, but has negative moral aspects surrounding it. I'm leaving out veggies and fruit because they all CAN be farmed without negative ethical consequences. Even though they often aren't. Clearly it's been a debate since we were conscious enough to debate such issues. Thousands of years, possibly. Maybe, in the end, it really is personal. Things die in order for you to live. No way around it. So maybe its only the unconcious eater, and the willfully ignorant eater who is immoral. It's the eater who, knowing they could never kill an animal and feeling that the only way they can continue eating them is to distance themselves so much from what they're actually doing that they convince themselves "meat comes in plastic from the grocery store" who is hypocritical and immoral. It's only someone who just plain doesn't think about their food, or consciously lies to themselves about their food, who is immoral. The rest of us are trying to find a way to understand what it means to follow nature, in an era of factory farms, assembly line meat, animals treated worse than inanimate electronics... If I only ate meat I shot wild or raised and killed myself, I would feel much better. Or maybe being constantly that close to the killing would push me towards vegetarianism...probably a good idea to find out.

Interesting. Since I heat the special ingredient in the butter for five minutes or so, the butter is liquid and is probably spread out fairly evenly through the dough. Still, I like your idea. An everclear tincture has worked very well for me too. But there's the everclear...but if you do it strong enough, it takes less than 1/4oz of everclear mixed with anything to do the trick. By the time it's mixed in with a glass of water, it's just a very herby tasting water. Anyway...back on topic. Smoke bad. Personally I have a healthy relationship with tobacco. I have a pouch of rolling tobacco at home. The last cigarette I rolled from it was in November. Once the weather gets nicer I'll start having one here and there. Never got a dependency, so I don't worry about it. Still not healthy...but one or two cigarettes a week won't hurt me more than the month I spent in china did...

Very common problem and why a lot of people think they don't like eating it. I'm not going to get into recipes, but you just start with a known amount, do a half or whole batch of cookies or whatever, and see what happens. Modify as necessary. The easy thing is that you never just eat a whole cookie or brownie. Especially if someone else made it! its almost always too strong. Eat 1/4 of it. See what happens. Usually that's right for me. 1/4 cookie. I'll admit its nice to eat a whole cookie, but one batch of cookies, in the freezer, lasts a long time when you're eating a quarter cookie at a time. If a quarter cookie is still too strong, put less in the recipe next time. Once you get to where you know "this much cookie does this to me", then you can both eat an amount you know is right, so you aren't too high, and modify the recipe. Eating is great for me because I can eat just enough to feel it, and it lasts hours. These days its getting rare for me. It's about run its course for usefulness with me. But it's nice to have a bag of cookies in the freezer for when I'm in the mood.

That's why edibles are so nice. No smoking.

Gang up? It's interesting that you come to the tao bums to argue. Your first post in this thread was argumentative, you continue to be confrontational and argumentative, and seem to be acting the victim at the same time. But are clearly, in your own mind, much superior to the rest of us. You have a Chinese username, and claim chi dragon is the only one who can take apart characters without defiling them?? I guess I read too much into it, but it seems you're saying "us" westerners somehow defile Chinese culture. Either way, you are not an uplifting person to interact with, and clearly I'm still learning which threads to keep myself OUT of. Bye!

And there's talk of defiling now? Are us westerners suddenly infidels to the Chinese also, or just to you?

Very good post. I think visiting china before committing to moving there is a pretty damn good idea. I love china and will go back...but it was a very eye opening experience...it is, for the most part, a dirty, noisy, crowded polluted place and its hard to merge with the culture, as a westerner. "Walking wallet" is right.

You can always put some braggs liquid aminos on everything you eat.

I can offend people without even trying

Yes. The good teachers who "cater" to westerners (and probably your average Chinese needs catering to, also) for the reason that they want to help people. So many people will NOT be committing their lives to spiritual or martial practice, but things like this can have a positivity effect on their health anyway. So should no one share these "secrets" with those unwilling to commit to the journey? That's the way it used to be, and a lot of arts were lost. I'm glad there are teachers who present this stuff in a way modern people find accessible. Many of those people, who would have never got into it otherwise, might find resonance there and search out a deeper practice. But I think it's fine for people to do some simple meditations and exercises "just for health".

Yes, if you really want to learn you need to immerse. It's not an easy language. The guy I know who picked it up the fastest moved to Beijing, took two taiji classes a day plus language coaching, every day, while practicing CONSTANTLY on his own. Going over the pronunciation of words as he rode his bike to taiji class at 5am, being surrounded by native speakers, etc. I think it took him about two years of doing this all the while living in China before he felt comfortable with basic conversations. What you're doing is good, but is more like easy preparation for a vacation to china, where you want a very tiny feel for the language. When I went, I got the first Rosetta Stone and did it for at least 15 minutes every day, plus flash cards, basic words and phrases. It did me only very, very basic good. Almost not even worth it, for how much good it did me. I needed much more than that.

Like him, you'd need to learn the language. Beyond that I don't know. Have you tried to find a way to contact him?

You'll find more info about the people answering your question than you will about zhan zhaung in those links from page one, especially the first link. I highly recommend reading it, though. For some reason chi dragon is happy to show you the topics in which he gets shown to be giving questionable advice, at best. You'll be fine with the book you have. This thread is long and full of argument also, but there are a couple GREAT posts, by Steve and by snowmonki are the ones coming to mind right now, on standing. Worth skimming if you find the time: http://thetaobums.com/topic/25395-what-does-standing-meditation-do-tofor-you/ But I'd say, practice from your book. If its a practice that really becomes a PRACTICE for you, then you can start digging deeper and reading up on more stuff. At its most basic, once you're sure your posture is correct and you aren't hurting your back or joints, it IS a very simple practice. But it can absolutely be taken deeper. I'm a total beginner, but that much I know. Anyone know how to get an iPad to stop clumping all my paragraphs together the first time I post? I've always got to edit to get them apart...

Except if you look into horse stance you'll also find something much more taxing and exhausting and painful....ask member Protector about that horse stance. Very different, and likely not what you want to be doing right now!

Yeah, it really does depend on how you were taught. But I think even with the most simple exercise, there's likely no end to how deep it can go. Unless you do it while watching tv. It's not like I know anything, I'm just guessing here that standing and watching tv may line some things up and give you more energy, but that's it. When I first started Master Lam's book, it seemed the idea was to relax every muscle in your body. Total relaxation. That didn't jive with what my martial arts teacher taught, but whatever. I'm standing for reasons other than martial, so maybe that's the difference. Then I finally got around to reading this, which someone posted a while back: http://imos-journal.net/?p=1138 And I think "work"? "Uprooting a tree"? Focused, "ready to act"? Well the next morning when I stood, if I imagined being as relaxed as possible, but visualizing trying to gently uproot the tree I was hugging...very different feeling. And I think, well where's this in Master Lam's book? Is his book just strictly for building more energy? Nothing deeper, nothing martial? But then I skim through the book again, and in the more advanced exercises, instead of just "holding the balloon", you start "filling the balloon". Imagining there's weight. Now suddenly you're doing some work, both with your mind and body. Sounds pretty damn similar to "uprooting a tree", doesn't it? Well, I think Master Lam's approach is, first, get people up and doing. Whatever it takes. Then, get them to learn to fully, totally relax in the posture, because that is by far people's biggest issues. Learning to relax your body in general, but especially in a zhan zhuang posture. Then, when you think they're reasonably relaxed and doing things right, start the real work of standing. Yeah, we can take shots at him for catering to Westerners, but the world has changed. It's great that there are still teachers who will only teach in the "old way", and not cater. But I for one am glad that certain masters have realized that if they want these teachings to survive into the future, and they care about people getting interested in them, they have to change things a bit. Is the fact that millions of people in the US practice a yoga that is at most superficially spiritual a bad thing? Or is it great that so many people are starting to pay attention to their health, and stretching, and quieting things down? And then a certain number of those people will get intrigued and start searching out the real thing. The same happens with Chinese martial arts and spiritual training. Those who get introduced in a way that's accessible to them, and the practice resonates with them, will seek out more traditional, disciplined training. But even though there are some teachers just out there to make some money and are watering things down and not doing anyone any favors, I think there are also a lot of teachers who are genuinely interested in spreading these teachings, and are "dumbing things down" a little, without sacrificing the core practice, to get more people interested. I would guess that they would still give deeper teachings to interested, worthy students.

And then later in the book he talks about bringing the concepts of zhan zhuang into daily life, mostly in a body mechanics way. He doesn't go too in-depth in any of the practice, he just makes sure your structure is right and you have the foundations. From there you can keep that as your practice, or dig deeper from other sources. So yes, you want to bring your practice into daily life, so that your entire life is "practice". But when it comes time to stand and do your (hopefully) daily zhan zhuang, you want to get to where you're not watching anything, and if you're listening to anything, it's just background/meditation music. You want your focus within, not without. But, whatever it takes, at first, to get you to do it! I think you should start out doing it without distractions. But if you need entertainment to get you to do it, then OK.

As you can see, there are all kinds of takes on this. Don't take any one person's advice as doctrine. But you will begin to recognize who knows more, and who resonates with you more. There are different reasons for practicing standing, and depending on what your reasons are, your practice will be different. snowmonki taught me that. One thing I can say is that if you follow Lam Kam Chuen's advice, you won't go wrong. People here can give you their opinion and knowledge, but Master Lam knows what he's talking about, and you don't need to second guess his advice. But absolutely, some of the things he advises in the beginning of the book seem to me to be strictly to get you do it, and stick with it. It might not be a good habit to get into; watching tv while standing...but whatever gets you to where do it, and keep doing it, is probably ok. He understands us Westerners and how little we can focus. So he allows you to "do other stuff" in the beginning, in the hopes that you'll stick it out and search deeper. If you actually get a practice going where you make a habit of it, then you can start doing it "right". You'll be getting the strictly health benefits, as long as your body structure is right, whether you're watching tv or not. You'll just get more mental and more physical results when you start to shut off outside entertainment and focus on your body. Do read those other threads, and don't be afraid to post questions if you need clarification on something. You'll always get a bunch of answer that conflict and sometimes contradict each other, but you'll start getting a feel for who you want to listen to depending on the reason you're practicing zhan zhuang, and little by little it'll be even more mysterious and hard to grasp as you start to realize the depth of it, but at the same it'll seem more and more accessible and less intimidating.

Interesting... That's good to know. I go through phases where it happens more than others. Haven't tried linking it to diet yet. I'll pay more attention.

Other than yogurt, diary kind of messes me up, even though I love cheese. Take out pizza destroys me. Messes up my system and knocks me out. Nap time. High salt messes with me, as well as heavy, greasy food. But the more of that stuff I eat, the more I crave it. Sugar messes me up. Luckily I have no strong relationship with sugar, ie it's not a temptation, like a plate of cheese and meat would be. They can set out all the doughnuts they want at work, I'm not touching them. But I love a couple squares of the 88% cocoa dark chocolate after dinner... I love potatoes but only feel good after eating them if they aren't fried. Boiled, baked or roasted potatoes treat me just fine. Ok. That's enough self indulgent "everybody listen to what I do!" talk for one night from me...

I'm a mix of Native American and European also. My weight is pretty constant, I can eat whatever I want, not exercise, and I stay the same weight. Or maybe lose weight from losing muscle. But I feel really good on a diet of moderate whole grains, lots of veggies, and good lean meat. I've been cutting way back on meat lately, partially because I didn't get anything hunting last fall, and I seem to be doing fine. I eat out at my favorite cafe twice a week and usually have red meat there, but otherwise I just have fish once or twice a week, and that's it for meat. I agree that there isn't a one size fits all diet, unless you're going strictly on spiritual concerns.

Which makes you an excellent teacher. Just sayin.

I can't add much, there's a lot of good advice here. I'd just say in my view canola is NOT a healthy oil. There are some oils that WOULD be healthy...if you made them fresh and consumed them immediately. But most nut oils, especially, go through nasty chemical processes to clean off and hide the fact that they've gone rancid and oxidized. Canola is one of those oils that for some reason got a big industry push as healthy, when its really not. It doesn't naturally have hydrogenated oils, but after processing, it DOES. The industry has gotten around this on the technicality that fresh pressed canola actually is kind of a healthy oil. It's just every canola you've ever bought in a bottle which isn't I've heard a lot about coconut, and I used it for a while. It's especially good for high temp frying. Not many healthy oils are good for this. If you find a healthy oil that says "for high temps", you'll notice that its been "processed to tolerate high temps", ie stripped, usually chemically, of its inherently good characteristics. Higher temp frying and healthy eating just don't go hand in hand, except maybe with the exception of coconut. Otherwise, animal fat is the only way to go, which may not be healthy, depending on what you're going for. Coconut oil has a lot of other great uses, too. You just need to be ok with the fact that your food will pick up some coconut flavor. Some foods more than others. I didn't like it with fried eggs, for example....

Yeah...welcome to the Internet! Or better yet, the world! It's full of people spouting off what they've heard, as though it were what they know. What's your point, exactly? I agree that people shouldn't act like they know when they don't. But this is not a forum for strictly experts. It's a place for those "on the way", and I like hearing from the vast majority of them! As long as, when its their opinion, or just something they've hear or were taught, they state it that way. I can't understand when people get on my case for saying "I've heard the point of this exercise is to get to 'this' point". Because I haven't experienced that point yet, my input isn't valid, or even welcome?

I am certainly interested.

Thank you. Not that it necessarily matters...they both look like good sites!