manitou

Refinement is a terrific word for the clearing-house dynamic - and a word used too seldom, IMO.

Darling, I totally invite you to expand upon this. Is there something you see in my unconscious that I'm missing? It's entirely possible, and I welcome your viewpoint.

....or

There's something that happened to my husband and I a few years ago that still has my head spinning. I offer this experience up to see if others have had the same sort of thing happen. We were driving a pick-up truck pulling a 5th wheel trailer on the freeway. There was an 18 wheeler in the lane to the right of us, about a half length ahead of us. He apparently didn't see us, and he started pulling over into our lane. His trailers were dead set to wipe us out - we were all doing maybe 60 mph. There was no time to feel fear - I recall just feeling a type of acceptance as to what was about to happen. No doubt. Then, all of a sudden, the world turned into slow motion, and the strangest thing happened. Sound seemed to stop (it had been very noisy), and it was as though some strange force 'picked up' both the 18 wheeler and our truck and trailer - and somehow arranged it so that our rig and his were in perfect alignment - and we all were 'moved' over to the lane to the left in a parallel way that defied Newtonian physics. Nobody struck anybody. If I were my young religious self, as I was, I would have said it was the unseen hand of God that picked both rigs up and gently manipulated them. But I no longer live in duality. The strangest thing of all was the slow-motion aspect of all of it. I realize that things will 'seem' slow motioned if an event captures our attention in a particular way. But in this case, it was as if Time HAD TO SLOW DOWN in order to physical cause the manipulation of the two rigs. Somehow, the normal time and space intersection was expanded to create the physical positioning of the trucks. So - as I have come to realize in the years since then - that We are the Manifester. I'm wondering if the absence of fear in both Joe and I (didn't have time for it, I guess) somehow enacted a time warp that was 'real' in the physical sense. Anybody had something like this happen before, where the ticking of Time changed radically?

Gotcha' on the "me story". It's anything but the Witness State.

Mark - nice post! I'm trying to see the reason behind the malady. You mention Tinnitus. I've been plagued with that for over 40 years. The physical reason it started, I imagine, is from the LAPD shooting range - back when they didn't offer head gear for the ears. They had a roll of toilet paper sitting on a bench, and you'd chew a wad of that and stick it in your ears. And then the gunfire would start, all 30 of us women shooting in an underground cement setting. Geez. But I noticed that this tinnitus is the very same sound (although greatly magnified) when you get into the Golden Stream - the golden source of consciousness. Now it's easier for me to tolerate, once I reached that place. I now look at tinnitus as the sound of "Shine", from the inside to the outside. So the physical cause was the shooting range - but as it is all Mind - why did I attract this to me? Why did I manifest it? This is the method I'm talking about that I use during deep dynamic healings. Sometimes we get lucky and the 'reason' is so obvious....like the quadriplegic teenager who was "frozen with fear" of his father, who forced him to enter a motocross race when the kid didn't feel that he could do it. Sure enough, he had a wreck and was quadriplegic for months. My husband and I got to the dynamic about the father, and once that was realized and a ceremony done, the boy is now recovering. We just had to get to the "truth of the matter", which is something I learned about by reading Mary Baker Eddy, although we don't 'go through Jesus' as she did. So diseases are true mysteries - and the common cold just drives me nuts. I know it's something real simple. I just thought of something! Maybe the common cold is manifested because Time needs to be slowed down for that person a bit. Maybe it's a way of enabling the correct alignment of something else to happen. Although I'm not satisfied with that answer either. What does the common cold do? It makes us sneeze, it stuffs up our nose - in general, it seems to affect most of our senses. I guess in a sense it 'grounds' us, because we feel metaphorically rather close to the ground when we have one. I'd sure love to figure this out...

What a beautiful secret this is.

GMP - I've got an idea for you. Practice 'sublime indifference' during the move. Let Mrs. GMP do the packing and moving. it should be a good trial for you to see if you can stay in the Oneness while she's hollering at you and chasing the puppy at the same time. I'll bet your spiritual growth would be incredible.....

It's occurred to me that this new Pope the Catholics have may be an enlightened one. His humility, his incredible love. But this is certainly not to say that all Catholic Priests are enlightened. Whoa. I agree with you that it can be seen when an enlightened one writes - all it takes is to open the book any place and see if the love is shining between the words. There are many on this forum who have all the 'information', but the love does not shine between their words. It takes enlightened eyes to see enlightenment. Many of here in the West have transcended the Jesus story. Personally, I had to totally walk away from it (being brought up with it) and I embraced the shamanic arts instead. And then I had to re-examine the Christian thing so that I wasn't carrying around a resentment towards it. But lo and behold - if you follow any path to the end you will end up in the Void, the hub at the center of the wheel. Even christianity - once you come to realize that Jesus was a fellow that found the Void. and he found it by Gnowing himself. He was an Essene - the more mystical branch of his religion. What do you consider the Christian mystic "me story"?

What a great post, IMO. I've had those terrifying moments also, where we're so far out that our personality seems to fall away and reassemblage is a huge enigma. Don Juan Mateus, when he was teaching Castaneda how to travel between realities, would have Carlos use the device of feeling something familiar, like the ring on his hand. Something to bring you into the Here and Now and reassemble the personality. I've found that the ring thing works. I love your shine on the apple metaphor. Very nice.

When I say terminus of a path, I'm referring to the path we take to the sublime or high indifference. Those paths do need to be transcended to find the state. Agreed, I don't think there's a destination at all. I think the consciousness just keeps growing in us, if we tend our garden. It becomes more 24/7, and easier to stay in. Or so I'm told.....

Go glad to hear it's lightening up!

Actually, I think I'll start a thread in General Discussion relating to the High Indifference, as explained by Merrell-Wolff. It seems to fit any discipline...

Silent Thunder said: "As I move in this field of awareness, high indifference is a good descriptor for it. There is no lack of care or love, quite the opposite. One of the benefits to this has been my ability to see the child in just about anyone I come in contact with now and that has allowed me to step beyond my overly harsh judgmental tendencies and live in more compassion, (from time to time). In the end humans are not male or female, they are male and female. All opposites are their antipodal extreme and would not exist without each other. From the point of high indifference this is accepted as original nature and it is my judgment within the context of a situation from alligning myself with one side or the other that creates the conflict I experience internally." I recently read a book (Experience and Philosophy, by Franklin Merrell-Wolff) where he referred to the transcendent state of mind as High Indifference - the phrase sort of kicked me in the gut because it so closely describes the state that we're talking about. I've used the expression several times in my recent posts, as it is so very descriptive of what happens to us as we increase our understanding. And it surely does involve love or compassion. The state is with me all the time - rarely do I find myself falling out of it any more. I can't remember the last time I was angry at something. High Indifference. And it resides in my psyche all the time - during the mundane as well. Silent Thunder, your coming full circle with your parents is exactly what I've had to do. As I mentioned on a recent thread, I can finally have a picture of my father hanging in my room, despite the early years and all the pain. I am delighted about this, because it shows me that I too have come full circle, in both the forgiveness aspect, but also the love aspect - where I have found the love I had for him before the leather belt went into action. Your story is beautiful, and a wonderful story of healing. Congratulations to you for doing all the work necessary to get to that place.

Masters do reach a High Indifference, but without the judgment. This is most likely part of your progress. Be One with the task, as CT said in his magnificent post earlier. It's like it says in the TTC - we can integrate fully with the action by choice; or we can transcend the situation and see it in its entirety. Sounds like you may need to engage the task (like being with your girlfriend) in a more Be Here Now way.

I'm guessing, after reading the previous thread (that I didn't know how to provide her a link to!) that Gurdjieff wasn't actually kundalini active.

Hi again - you might want to check out the thread of 3/15/14, titled Kundalini, Kundabuffer, and Black Tantra. It was started in General Discussion and if you pick the thread up again you'll get some activity. Just go up to the Search box on the upper right hand of the page and type Kundabuffer in there - it will point you not only to this thread, but the other one in General Discussion. Sounds like a really interesting topic. I can see where it would fit in with Buddhism as to losing the 'body of desires' (Satan's tail) and shushumna, but it seems that it would fall into General Discussion because it covers such a broad spectrum. I look forward to participating.

Haven't a clue what the Kundabuffer organ is - do you think it falls under Occult or Esoteric? Is it tied in with Buddhism or Vedanta somehow? If so, we should move this thread to one of those sections. I'm going to google Kundabuffer. I'll be back

Anoesjka - that was beautiful. I have the identical situation with my mother (minus the limited intelligence) - but the rest is all there. It's like we turn into our parent's parent at some point in time. I put together a bunch of photo albums for my 89 year old mother - the only thing she seems to get a kick out of anymore is to see pictures of her and her family as a child. So we go through the albums every time I go out to see her, about 4 times a year (she doesn't remember that we just did it 3 months ago). The repetitive conversations are just mind-numbing - so I guess it's up to us to figure out a little stimulus. And your changing your perspective to actually listen to her stories (and go along with them!) is such an act of love. I guess it's just quid pro quo for all the times they changed our diapers.

Isn't it strange that reality to one is different than reality to another? So what is reality? It's a mindset, apparently. I'm not sure that speaking of the interconnectedness of everything, the One, isn't reality. Mundane life and living in the Tao are one and the same; all we can do is change our perspective of what Reality is. If we put out negative stuff, we get negative stuff back. What goes around comes around. If life is a training-ground for further evolution, how can they be separate? As I see it, they're one and the same. We have a choice as to how we choose to see it and react to it. The only thing we can really change is ourselves. (Okay, be nice, Marbles.....after all, I didn't mention the touchy-feely stuff )

Goldisheavy said: You can remember things you thought you've never experienced. What is the difference between a lack of experience and a forgotten experience? In my experience, goldi, I have a terrible problem with short term memory, possibly following my mother into dementia. I think there is a difference - a forgotten experience is still somehow lodged within our unconscious, whereas something never experienced just isn't in there. There are many times in my life (maybe within the last 10 years) that that unconscious previous experience will come to the fore and give me access to the forgotten knowledge. It's almost like a channel of forgotten stuff that gives you what you need when you need it. I think it's accessed by our intuitive self. Okay - I know that someone will say "If you can access it, it's not forgotten". Maybe that's the case - but on the other hand I know what it was to have a 'normal' memory, as opposed to what I have now. It really is a different kind of access - an intentional one vs. an unintentional surprise of something coming out of the fog suddenly.

Nice post, VMarco! But I do actually think there are some mystic Christians out there that have transcended the 'face' of the Only Through Jesus thing. When you said: "When the Greeks spoke of the Higher Mind, they pointed to the chest and said thymos,...the thymos was the seat of gnowledge. Of course, as shown by Paul of Tarsus and Mohammed, gnowledge (Heart Mind) is a direct threat to the faith-based agendas of knowledge, or Head Mind. Over the portico of theTemple of Delphi it is written "Gnothi Seauton"....Gnow Thyself. But religion has altered this to say Know Thyself,...which is not the same. Knowledge comes from psyche, the Head Mind. Those who know, do not gnow." What I think is that when Jesus said 'Know Thyself', he was speaking of 'Gnow Thyself'. The I Am dwells at the bottom of our acquired personality, and it is this that he intended people to discover. Western Religion has got it all screwed up now - it's much easier for them to just wear the Jesus badge and just know they're "Saved" from some fiery pit - a fear-based proposition, to be sure. This wasn't his intent at all. One bag must be emptied, the other must be filled.

Darling, may I invite you to Vegas this weekend?? Jadespear - what happened was that the truck didn't see us and was coming over into our lane. The "pick up" happened (or felt like it was happening) and resulted in both rigs being aligned perfectly and both moving to the left (luckily for us, there was nobody in the lane next to us). But we were both suddenly positioned diagonally when we all moved to the left. The thing that made it so odd was the perfection of the sudden alignment after the feeling that we were being picked up. Maybe it was just a 'drafting' thing with both big rigs. But whatever it was, it was astounding and a real slo-mo event.

Missed this statement the first time around. I think this is profound. In metaphysics what you are striving for is the High Indifference - not a state of 'not caring' as much as 'not judging', and compassion is infused in there because it becomes our original nature. At the bottom of everything is Love (or for you, Marbles....Compassion!) Edit: Maybe I should rephrase my last sentence. I don't mean to say that Marbles needs compassion - I only meant that he's not crazy about the L-word.

And don't forget that other classic that Shirley would do: I've Got Tears in my Ears from Lying on my Back Cryin' Over You.