Spotless

It is not a matter of like or dis-like. My dialog refers to the mistaken nature of the quotes. Also - in the quotes you have chosen to reference - you quote the authority of a non-meditator hypnotist who has "analyzed" the subject and come to erroneous conclusions that one might expect regarding such a subtle subject. It is not dissimilar to reading what the Pope "thinks" about Buddhism - there are some that consider the Pope or Popes to have a good understanding of other religions and other spiritual practices, yet there are a great many of us who are aware that this assumption is far less factual than the presumption assumes.

Question to Silas: I am confused as to your belief regarding Meditation and Trance. You constructed a very good description of the non-trance nature of meditation on Dec 10th. It was excellent. You have now quoted a hypnotist that has fully misunderstood meditation and continued to project his beliefs upon his practical ignorance of the subject. When I wrote my last post I quoted a statement from your posting of two postings ago in which you state that "Meditation is trance" and I maintained that this is incorrect. Your posting from Dec 10th and your posting from March 1st appear to be a polar fluctuation in your ideas on the subject. Can you clarify - perhaps without quoting other authors - how you experience this?

Meditation is not a trance state. It is easy to move into a trance state when meditating, watching TV and a whole host of other activities but the above statement that "meditation is a trance state" is a testimonial to a wide swath of misunderstanding regarding meditation and the various types of closed eyes exercises. If you are doing "correct meditation" you are definitely not going into trance,in fact you are exercising for perhaps the first time in your life, the practicing of an awake and aware non-trance state within which you practice the cessation of mind activity and/or identification without going into a trance. Silas made an excellent post on this mis-conception just a few pages back in complete contradition to his quote posted at the head of this posting of mine. His prior posting was on the 18 December 2012 - 03:19 PM

I do not understand this negativity towards "New Agers" - we are smack dab in the middle of a new age. Lunes are everywhere - but the most sane are starting to appear to be the "new agers" by comparison.

Certain forms of seizure are spirit posession or what is known in some circles as a transmedium attack. I am absolutly certain that this is true. I have not studied this phenomenon at length so I cannot tell you in enourmous depth but I will tell you a story of an event that occurred in a cafe. I am clairvoyant - my 3rd eye opened when I was about 22. The following took place when I was about 38. I was watching a person sitting on a high stool and noticed a fairly large dark being hovering behind him. When the person went over to pick up his order - it turned out to be a bowl of ice cream. About half way through the bowl of ice cream the being had moved into the persons back upper head region considerably. (it had plugged into the transmedium channels there) The person finished the bowl and ordered another bowl. He was about 3/4 of the way through the bowl when the being went in and took over - the person fell to the ground and started to convulse. I immediately jumped into the scene - ripped the being out of the persons head - slammed the owner back into his head and immediately his eyes opened right into mine - he was very surprised and bewildered. The crowd was thick but the situation was under control. It was clear that the being was used to raising this persons vibration and taking posession. People with problems such as this should take care in what they eat - learning how to maintain a strong, steady energy without allowing diet induced highs or other types of highs such as trance states induced by certain TV shows, flashing lights, "preachers", music etc. The lower dan tien carries a strong and powerful energy but it is grounding and not spacy - (at least this is very true for me) - it would probably be a good practice. Running some earth energy and maintaining certain colors in your aura will also work but explaining what that means is probably something for another time. Where are you located - city - state?

Their is quite a bit of mis-information in this post and I wanted to address it. I want to address it because it is common. The first is "We must remember the mind is the most powerful thing we posess". This is simply so far off the mark - lets just say - the mind in not the observer of the mind. The second item is: "I think one needs to look at firstly the idea of what trance is. Is it self stimulated by dance, drugs or deep meditation? This sort of trance comes from within and the journey there is all about what the mind can unfold about the self through images and playback." Trance has nothing to do with what the "mind can unfold". Trance is a sort of stilling of the mind and a residence within the transmedium channels but without necessarily allowing a being into them. It can also be other things such as psychic awareness but it is specifically not "what the mind can unfold". During meditation we can find ourselves in a trance state - this can be a time where we watch as pictures from deep within are released as the cosmic energy begins unleashing knots within our channels and space. It can be the beginning of being aware while letting pictures float by unattached. It would be preferrable to not be in trance for the most part during meditation, but this trance state has its place is seeing. It can also be difficult to dissasociate from certain pictures without trance because the mind will identify and make still observation impossible. The third item is: "The other trance is the one of spirit posession. This requires the posesser to have taken no drugs, done no meditation or to have danced around with rythmic drums etc. This way is more difficult because it is the inviting of a spirit to posess the body and the medium needs to be up to the task. Once posessed, in this way the medium does not know anything about what is happening, they have so to speak gone into a deep sleep, while their body is overtaken. Most people have access to the first way, the second is much harder and more frightening. Which is best IMO? the second, it is very reliable, for the source is not ones own deluded and muddled mind!!!" Everything said in this is completely incorrect - almost perfectly the opposite. I will go from the bottom up: 1. "Which is best IMO? the second, it is very reliable, for the source is not ones own deluded and muddled mind!!!" Full on possession is not at all reliable - it can be reliable but very frequently it is a being that appears to be High and Lofty and it is actually just pugging into your akashic records and playing to the crowd. Frequently possesion is also the beginning of the end for the medium. 2. ""The other trance is the one of spirit posession. This requires the posesser to have taken no drugs, done no meditation or to have danced around with rythmic drums etc." Actually many famous mediums will drink coffee, eat chocolate, snort cocaine, eat sugar, take drugs, dance, meditate and drum prior to possession because it requires increasing ones vibration considerably (above 35,000 cycles). Most mediums have very little idea just exactly what they are doing but the beings that have begun to take over their space know exactly what they need the body to do and they need easy access - ie: sugar up! If the medium is truely in control of the process, they can be very aware of the exchange and meditation before and after is extremely important. 3. "Once posessed, in this way the medium does not know anything about what is happening, they have so to speak gone into a deep sleep, while their body is overtaken." A medium that is "up to the task" should be wide awake during the possession - outside of their body and fully conscious - perhaps somewhat super conscious by comparison to most states. I am speaking from experience and not reading books or studying others or dabbling in this. It is not difficult - but I would say very few are "up to the task". I have personally known at least 12 mediums and 70% of them went off the deep-end. Of the remaining 30% only one truly understood what was taking place. (Their books sell, and they sell tickets - and they go nuts or die or commit suicide often. Poor health is also common)

It is possible - not even particularly hard.

I you are willing to commit suicide then why not let the false you die - walk away from your story - your skin in the game - loyalty to your positions, your agony? Drop the thinking and just be - ? If you can't see the forest through the teaching - stop trying. Effort is one of the biggest reasons for never getting out of the gate. One of the great things about these teachings is just how incredibly fine they are. On the other hand, they give the mind the impression that it is grasping something. As your understanding grows you will come to understand that you know nothing. At some point you will begin to see no position and no "assessment" - no inertia - neutrality - this changes everything in an instant. When you reach this point - no one can teach you - no teaching can encompass the ittle thing you have done that so few have. It is a lie that it must take years. There are no secrets just walls made of nothing.

As silly as this Jedi thing sounds I think it does resonate with all of us a bit. Unfortunately I can see several things you will need to examine - (if you are able) in order to proceed. Like - telekinesis: this is a tricky one. It is not handed out to just anyone, and if you do start to have it, it becomes immediately obvious how strong emotional control is very desirable. At one time my telekinesis was working much more than I was aware of. By the time I figured it out, it had cost me a considerable amount of time and money. When I did finally figure out what was going on I was delighted to understand but wow - what a hassle. I was working at a job that I did not like. One day I broke the Bell Housing of my car on the way to work. I had it replaced. That same week my radio fried (actual smoke) on the way to work for no apparent reason - I had it replaced. The next week my Bellhousing broke again - I replaced it again and the guy fixing it said "these don't break - they don't do anything unless you are hitting things really hard" which I was not. That same week I borrowed a friends car to go to work and fried the engine - it is amazing to open the hood of a car and see the engine glowing orange.

It depends on ones abilities and how you view the situation. Often the topic is obviously of interest to many and so the response is to those that are actually tuned into the topic. Sometimes it is a topic which has lots of viewers hovering - watching a close exchange between the current responders. Most of the time the timidity of the person asking the question - or their vanity - prevents them from actually telling those responders available to engage with enough information to work with. So instead of really getting down to specifics - once again it is somewhat more teaching or helping or clarifing to the larger hover group with a hope of hitting the mark somewhat with the person one is engaging with. I do not "read" the people openly. If a person cannot ask a question with a proper preface then they will get a response far more tailored to the group. If a person omits necessary information to allow for real dialog - they do not wish to hear real answers or they are unable to have the answer. Either way - they will not hear an answer until they are able to ask the question with enough clarity being offered by them to allow an answer to be given. I am a capable reader and energy worker if I choose to be.

Breathing can help to make it past a wall - sometimes relatively intense breathing. If you do Qi Gong - Qi Gong breathing during meditation can help - I also do "holotropic" breathing sometimes. If I lose my awareness - I have hit a "picture" - my vibration and the energies of the meditation are at a clearing point - a break point - a popping point (and you may experience many popping sounds from the back of the neck area where it attaches to the head) A knot of life force is wrapped up and is about to be released. Some portion of it will be released even if you pull out and stop your meditation - but if you make it past this - you will clear it and regain the energy at the same time. Its like clearing out a pile of dirty dishes - suddenly you get your sink back, the faucet back and the drain back - its all flowing again in that area.

I am unfamiliar with the exercises you are doing - or I don't know them by name (which is very often the case). However - i am relatively certain you are opening your 3rd chakra - (solar plexis) and at the same time stimulating your adrenals. If you do not have a teacher - you might be able to ask one over the phone or find a forum somewhere that understands the particular methods that bring you to this experience. It is not uncommon that new students want to "open" everything as much as possible in order to feel/validate something - anything - (to get a taste of extra-ordinary progress). Unfortuantely leaving all the doors open to your home can allow for some unsettling breezes. If your teaching/exercise has a calming cooliing exercise - you might try ending with that. Also - take a look at what things you might be mixing without making a connection: Do you stop for coffee on the way to your exercise - put coffee and some solar plexus moves together and you can get a rocket ship effect. Take care not to start writing books on the subject - you would be surprised just how many "experts" are inspired by this over abundance of energy in the early years.

3Bob suggested looking into Hatha Yoga - not a bad idea - .he is correct - most towns should have this - YMCA etc What town are you in? I do not have any video suggestions at the present time unfortunately

I am glad to see this topic - I forgot about this! I took a long cold shot after showing for several years and it was fantastic for calming and "kicking everyone" out of my space. I never tried the bucket method - but I did not have much of a learning curve either - I just remained calm through it all until the resistance left and then i went a little while longer and left the shower as smooth as glass.

I would suggest Qi Gong. You will progress quickly and it will distribute your energy to areas where you have vacated. It will also provide much needed vitality. You may also wish to view your birth agreements with your parents as contracts that have ended. You may find it helpful to write up a note stating the contract, thanking them for the experience and the group creation of your vessel. Officially date the end of the contract - then burn it. As it burns let any remaining energy of the original agreement to be completed. Start calling your mother by her first name. When she moves out - limit future visits to places outside your home or hers. (if you choose to continue to exchange with her) If she has to stay at your home for awhile - create a schedule where she is expected to be gone from the house. She can go to a movie or take up walking. Make it for at least several hours - particularly on weekends. If she has some good friends - have her stay at one of them for at least one day a week, If she is selling her home - she can still go there and sit. This is not warm and fuzzy but if she is a sidewinder then you need to extricate her from your head.

DMattwads said: "Thus I feel it more, but at the same time feel more detached from it. Hope that makes some sense." Congratulations! At some point you can direct the sexual energy. See your teacher for some instruction or ask it here - it has probably been discussed at length. I have noticed this recently in myself at times and simply flip the switch and redirect it.

Drop your story - as you meditate, at some point whole chunks of you will fall away. You will not release them, it is not something you "do". Drop your story - see it as the last lifetime - do you pine after your previous lives? Do you still want to get paid for those goats Yoretog stole from you in the ancient forests of neverland? You lose nothing - you gain everything - you will not be missed - you will only be more. Where you have skin in the game - do not feed the habit - breath in the present moment - nothing needs to be fixed or healed - you are spotless - untouched - you have no stain upon you.

Could you expand on this explosion of energy?

Grand Master P states: "'To overcome language by means of language is obviously impossible. Turning within, we will only find words and images that are part of ourself.'" There are ways to overcome language by means of language though I understand the tenor of your statement - it was the words "obviously impossible" that caught me: If you have read Gurdjieff you will find his book "Beelzebub's Tales to His Grandson' almost intolerable for a good portion of the beginning of the book - nearly 1/3 of it. The level of constant egoism is beyond toleration - it is a constant aggression upon one reading it - grating and grating and holding the note - and it is truely a work of conscious writing that in holding that note - the glass breaks! You read the book, you are reading the harrassing level of ego and it breaks down the very thing harrassing you. If you make it past this "disgusting display of vanity" he then holds another note for the entirety of the next 2/3 of the book - slaughtering everything sacred on our earth including any shred of puffery we may have left. The words do not do what the tone does. The entire book may leave you with a crew-cut and a distaste in your mouth for his way - but it will have its effect and given the exceedingly thick skin of the ego - his way has been very effective in treating the malady. (the book is some 1200 pages) Please do not steer away from this book because of my observations - it is an excellent read.

Regarding animals: They have chakras - many can communicate telepathically. I have had real communication with one cat and one puppy in particular. I have not sought out communication with them but horses and cats are among the easiest to speak with. Telepathically it can be identical to normal speech - it was that way with the cat. We spoke twice - each time during the day - each time he had a question or a request and only wanted the simple answer that I gave him - but he spoke loudly and clearly in the center of my head in English while he looked at me waiting for my response and he responded to my response immediately and appropriately. The dog was a different story - he was soundly asleep and I decided to follow him up to where he was sleeping. From his play space up there I spoke to him and he listened intently and came down into his body as I requested him to do though I had to be quite adamant - he was playing and I was asking him to leave. But - he did come down and jump into his body and immediately he stood up, came over to me and looked at me anxiously in the eyes and wanted to know what i wanted - at which point i just smiled and said "nothing" and he immediately curled back up into a ball and left his body to go back and play. I once had a Raven come to my table at an outside resturant and sit with me through my sandwich. Given that the place was busy it was pretty remarkable - it was a small two seat table. Later that week I was in a Safeway parking lot and he landed on my truck - I put out my arm and he got on it. I sat him in the passenger seat and he stayed at my house for an extended stay. I always left the window open in case he wanted to leave - at least until the weather became colder. He would leave for days and stay for days. The presence of this striking bird was very intense - it was a wonderful experience. By the way - in all the time he stayed with me i never once had to clean up after him - he would take off and come back - I don't recall even one incident - not that it would have mattered. i bring this up because this Raven was so wholly independent and reponsible for himself. His energy extended well into 3 feet all around him. (i was in my early 20s)

This is a message about the nature of how we have continuously identified with getting somewhere - going somewhere and never being. The view that Evolution will go to those that "become self-aware"and however strange and outcast they may seem - while Humanity continues to race toward the next bend in an endless circle of sleep. Stepping outside of the circle is as out of vogue today as it has ever been - the idea that their is an "outside" is viewed as being only appreciated by lunatics and those that abandon humanity. Gurdieff was speaking from his time - and it is still fully true. But one thing has changed - our world has become much smaller than when he was alive. Conscious teachers are springing up and their teachings are available 24/7. However dreary the world may seem at this time, all is not as it seems.

Most of humanity is trying to die - you have seemingly been quite alive for most of your adult life - good for you!! I would advise that you do not view this as some phase you are going through - this is a fork in the road - (though all forks can lead back to the original fork so don't worry about "the perfect choice"). Now - getting back to dying. Most of us identify with just about everything. We take it as a personal affront when someone cuts us off in traffic. We find stupidity intolerable and politics give us heart attacks. We love or we hate and we want and want and want. In all the inertia of these habituations and these positions that we have hardened into - we are typically fully dead and gone by the age of 40. The period of final death is usually between the ages of 30 and 45. Taking a hot shower and fasting will not get you over this hump - the hump will become a bump and then a road block which you will bypass - it will not be long before you are living like most of us - we drive on bypasses because all the highways are long dead and overgrown. Fasting can help in re-calibrating yourself. Meditation will clear the highways so that once again you can flow more naturally. Listen to the positions you are taking - look at the food you eat: what media do you consume, what air do you breath, what sounds imping upon your ears, what comes into your eyes. These things have changed and your choices become habituations and things that distract your positions begin to irritate you. You can wall off your irritations with all sorts of retalitory justifications that also serve as fortifications of your identifications - your positions - you can grab your flag and wave it in their face and say "how dare you"! But - you are at this time bright enough to understand that going down the rat hole is not what you would like to do - and so those of us down in the hole might miss you - but secretly we hope you do not join us - because then we will all raise up our flags and scream HOW DARE YOU! Recoginse that your choices of food affect you. We spend 1/3 of our lives sleeping - you can choose to sleep just after watching a documentary supporting your positions and watching a movie that creates angst and worry about the next episode or you can read something that has to do with your practice, wisdom teaching, looking at beautiful art, listening to fine music. You can also go to sleep with an intention of doing and seeing wonderful things during your sleep - perhaps awakening in your sleep - perhaps becoming enlightened in your sleep. Who are your friends - what food do they offer - are you beginning to try out sarcasm - its a bitter habituation but your hat size will take a big jump. You have asked for help at a time when most of us are buyig a second home in the rat hole and picking out which of our positions we will vacation in.

As you watch your thoughts - see if they have a theme - are they like tapes playing over and over? The ego / people are for the most part "trying to die" - we are constantly putting our stake in the ground and taking a position. We can take a position on our diet, politics, cars, pollution, "the children", poor, rich, clean, dirty, art, proper spelling, immigrants - the list is endless. See if these are habituations for you - or rather - see which ones have become habituations - "your position". Drop them - do not feed them - when you read about them - leave the words on the page. Do not judge yourself as "lazy" - what a phenomenally simple assesment of your spotless and untouched being. Try to go to sleep only after you have prepared to sleep. Go to sleep on thoughts that you would like to carry with you to sleep. Take care not to go to sleep having freshly indulged in any of your positions. It was once my position that I would die if my parents did not give me a certain toy - I defended my position and I was absolutely correct in my assesment - with the exception that within a week I was not interested in the toy at all. Allow yourself to not be in a position - neutrality - see what arises in you regarding judgement - it does not reside in a state of no inertia. What inertia do you have that reacts? That reaction is based in a position you have taken. You may notice that it is possible to assess a situation and make an adjustment/decision without having to hear a justification discussion going on in your head. Discontinue justification discourse. Consider something like Qi Gong as a practice - it can be among many things - a mechanical means to clean and refresh your space from habituation of energy. We tend to dwell in certain areas of our energetic menu and habituate to those areas, those frequencies. Fasting is also a great mechanical way to re-calibrate to our natural state - and it is also a vacation for your body. It is not at all stressful - it is the opposite of stressfull - except perhaps for the ego and all of its habituations. If your media is on the radio or TV - switch to streaming. You can go to sleep listening to one of the relatively many conscious teachers now available world wide for free 24/7 on youtube. Tolle and Mooji to name two. Pandora allows for ad-free - banter free music choices. If you have the space to sleep and read and practice - do so - it will be time extremely well spent. All the world makes the judgement that you must take a position, you must hold up your flag, you must go out into the world and make something of yourself. It is like the patriot that needs a war. Taking "a position" is dying - truly sleeping - it is a very powerful drug. You are already on it and trying to wake up from it. At some point you will look up and find the flag you are holding has no meaning for you - like the child who will die if it does not get the toy. "You must go out into the world" - among the snoring masses - ? It is true you need to live - but in the big picture: Would it not be so bad if you emerged from your time with yourself having used it to know yourself? There is no future - their is now - choose to end the noise within and you will be the spotless being that you are. Like a ball held underwater - when the silence begins the you will emerge. When the noise ceases - you will splash to the top and attain what the whole world is waiting for. In your meditation - break past the 40 minute barrier - try to go an hour or more. Get some 4 and 5 hour sessions behind you. If the doorbell rings - answer it and then go back to your meditation. Get up to go to the bathroom. Have tea or water at your side. Meditation is not torture - set aside any thoughts of this - meditation does not require a perfect situation - if you are meditating it is already "perfect".