chenping
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Everything posted by chenping
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I appreciate your thoughtful response. This means your head is not cooked like a Taoist bun offered to hungry ghosts in a Wudang temple. Money, generally, does bind you to a material reality. But just because one has no money doesn't mean one is free. In fact, the attachment is more intense because the need is real. The poor guy who claims he is free is either a spiritual conman on the make, or cracked. The reason why rich people won't give up money and even want ever more is because they are poor people who never got over the trauma of being poor. In that sense, Forbes list of billionaires are actually a line up of world-class scavengers showing off their stash. My point is, there is nothing wrong with being wealthy, and coming into money, in itself, is not a damning thing. The problem is the person, and I am the person. Then, there is the other problem which is the way the money comes into my life. If you were the scriptwriter, in what way (Tao) can that $20 billion come into my life not through the misery of others?
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Who cares about purpose? Being alive is like being in a Theme park. I'm not much into that stuff about Tao makes one and one makes two and two makes three and three makes the Theme park. All I care about is getting my rides before it's time to get to the exit. And you think being a straw dog among the other 99% will get you closer? I just don't get why the rich can't get through the needle's eye or closer to the true Self. Sure, money isn't the rocket propellant that will get you into orbit but it sure can dispel gravity and move obstacles out of the way. 99% are straw dogs. The players, the movers and the shakers, are something else. Imagine this: you stick your bank card in the ATM Machine, touch "Check Balance", and see "$20,000,000,000". This is it. This is the eternal Tao. Does it matter if you are going to die one day? You are a player. You can literally move mountains. Straw dogs get closer to the true Self. Which do you pick? Wise up, man. I am not the Devil and you are not Jesus in the desert. I am not talking about writing the script about what you're going to do for the day. I'm talking about writing the script that takes you out of the role of a straw dog on a slave ship into a role of a player who parts the Red Sea. I'm talking about real Tao power. There is the wu-wei of the loser and the wu-wei of the winner. If you don't take life seriously, you might as well be dead. Even the ant takes life seriously. And the lilies of the field too, they do sew and spin. Only the biblical ones don't. But in real life - if you really observe the truth about nature - it's all serious; otherwise, you won't have that beauty, you'd have the garbage-strewn streets of cities where no one really gives a damn.
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That was one heck of a confession. You made me feel like your parish priest. How am I doing? I wish I knew. I don't even know where I am and what I am. All I know is that I am cast in the role of Chenping in this mother of all TV series called life. In this present episode, I am messing around in a Taoists forum and talking to you. You sure you are exactly where you are supposed to be? I really wish I can get in touch with the scriptwriter and get him to write me into a better situation. Right now, I am just one of the 7 billion non-players on the planet who live and die, come and go, like straw dogs - human fodder. Only a handful of people get to make a difference in life. I am not asking to be a player because I don't need fame or want power to change anything. In that sense, I am kind of like a wu-wei guy. Like you, I just want enough to be contented and 10 to 20 billion US Dollars would do it for me. This gets me into the players club so I can get up close to see what these human elites are doing as masters of the universe. How's my confession? We are like Catholic priests confessing to one another.
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Pity. It's my loss if you bow out without even trying. Anything and everything? You must be a really wild cat. You think (1) the Christian God is a joke but you worship strange ones like the Dao. You'd (2) swear "Jesus f-cking Christ!" and (6) mess around with women even on (3) Sundays. (5) You want the right to kill anyone, including (4) your old man, trampling on your turf in any way. (7) You steal (ideas count too) and (8) tell lies with conviction that they are truths. And (9-10) you covet and God only know how you do this. You probably don't care if Taoism never gets you to Heaven but what about that other place? And I don't mean Hell.
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Cite me one worldly "rule" that is not in alignment with your nature.
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I would rather read your mind in order to come to my senses. I cannot read the TTC directly. I can read people. If they make sense, then the world make sense. If they don't make sense, then the world doesn't make much sense.
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Does (1) Taoism give a sensible perspective of the non-sensical world, or (2) is Taoism a sensible refuge in a nonsensical world? (1) provides a (Taoist) rationale that enables you to function as an integral part of the world; while (2) validates and facilitates a sensible (Taoist) way of life in a world that doesn't make much sense. Why do you see this as Taoism? You have describe a mind-set that speaks to individualism. Can you point out one distinguishing characteristic between individualism and what you consider Taoism?
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Why Taoism? The only reason, for me, is the people who are drawn to Taoism. They are different from people drawn to other belief systems. I am not a Taoist. I just like Taoists.
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Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Feels like we both have the answer. Why do people get their knickers in a knot when confronted with the truth? -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
And why is that? If the Chinese were so hospitable, why didn't more Jews spread to China? Why did Jews head west to embed in hostile cultures instead of moving east? -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Not agitated at all. Getting provoked over a conversation is mental sickness. I appreciate your willingness to engage me in discussion. We are still on topic as these points we are looking at are connected to the examination of Nazi Dao. America sees herself as the standard bearer for freedom. It is difficult not to act when dictators in foreign lands kill and oppress their own people especially when you are holding the big stick in your hands. I wonder why you would say that it is hegemony and a fake goal to stop injustice. -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
As long as each mind his own business, different mindsets won't be a problem. The USA wants to export democracy and human rights regardless of cultural differences. People of a different mindset would see this as villifying. Where do you stand on this? China is practising state capitalism: competing in the free world markets as a nation against individuals in the west. It's like a swarm of ants against solitary insects. Is this a form of Nazi Dao? Ok, I know you would defend the western bell even against acoustic facts and the force of gravity. Such is the way of individuality that is driving up public debts in the west. -
You know what? I think Daoism is a western concept that does not exist in the Chinese mind. Sure, there are temples of the Dao Religion in China as well as in other parts of the world where the Chinese have settled but I am not sure that they have anything to do with the Dao De Jing. The Christian Bible, unlike the Dao De Jing, was deliberately put together for the specific purpose of providing a basis for a theology. On the contrary, I think Philosophical Daoism and the NW direction of Pakau practice are fundamentally the same. Ok, I will provide you an example. The Dao De Jing is one of many ancient texts of the Chinese elites, really smart guys whose interest in these classical works had nothing to do with everyday life in China other than to shape and govern it in accord with Heaven. It is literature for masters of the universe: Emperors and their advisors. I don't think Sun Tzu or Mencius would find Philosophical Daoism appealing. "Philosophical Daoism", like the philosophical component of the NW direction of the Pakua, provides comfort for all under Heaven when the idiots with its Mandate screw up.
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There are only manifestations including our imagination that anything can predate us.
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Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
What you call synthetic would be wholistic in my view. The western mind sees the whole in terms of its parts while the eastern mind sees only the whole without which the parts have no meaning in themselves. Thirty spokes form the wheel, says the Tao Te Ching. It's the wheel that gives meaning to the individual spoke. By itself, the spoke has no purpose for existence. But in the west, the individual gives meaning to the world, to all existence. I am the way, the truth and the life, said Jesus Christ. You may be over-rating Eastern medicine. It's true that western medicine treats the symptoms rather than dealing with the cause of the disease. I don't think the Eastern medicine man know the root cause either. He may talk a good game pointing to yin and yang balance and whatnot. In the end, he prescribes a nasty brew to, hopefully, put you back in order. Symptom or not, the itchy rash goes away every time I rub on some Cortaid. So far, that hasn't caused any other problems. What do you mean by " geograhically defined flow from one extreme to the other"? What do you mean by Eastern science? The human mind works only one way in figuring out how to invent tools and do things. It can go about it in a clumsy fashion or with amazing intelligence. Let me show you what I mean. The western bell is hung high up in the bell tower. The eastern bell is suspended just above the ground. Lifting the heavy cast iron bell up high makes no sense because when the bell is struck by its clapper, the sound waves travels just as far whether the bell is 100 feet or one foot above the ground. Also, to ring the western bell, it has to be swung from side to side causing the clapper to strike its sides on the inside. The eastern bell is stationary and only the relatively smaller and lighter clapper is swung to strike its side on the outside. The bigger the bell the louder the sound and the farther it can be heard when rung. So which is smarter? Make a 10 ton western bell, build a 100 foot tower to hang it and use ten men to swing that damn thing or make an eastern bell? -
I am not sure Philosophical Daoism (that Drifting Cloud referred to as coming from Barnes & Noble Daoists) is the same as the philosophical aspect (in the NW direction of the Pakua) of traditional Daoism as pointed out by Mo Tzu. Each culture has its own way of seeing things. My grandmother finds bedroom scenes in western movies disturbing and unclothed women engaging in sex absolutely shocking. I am not talking about pornography but wholesome PG-13 stuff like "Thomas Crown Affair" or "Skyfall". So, I don't think western philosophical aspect of Daoism would feel comfortable on the family ancestral altar where she lights joss sticks for my grandfather every morning.
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Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Seriously, I am Chinese. So, if you say my thinking is synthetic, I'm going to say "huh? Come again?" I think analytically - taking things apart to check how they fit together - just like anybody would to track out the logic. Synthesis is the other part? I don't get it. You must not assume that everyone here is super smart. -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
What do you mean by synthetic? You mean synthesis, the "third stage of an argument in Hegelian dialectic"? Can you explain with examples? -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
What I find interesting is that practically all western thought is Jewish in origin. For religion and spirituality, there is Jesus Christ. For self-identity, there is Sigmund Freud. For politics - the place of self in society - there is Karl Marx. For a material reality, there is Einstein. Eastern thought is non-Jewish in origin. -
China has nuclear weapons, a technology invented by the West 60-70 years ago? Once upon a time, China was ahead of the West in warfare technology. They invented the crossbow and gunpowder. It took the West a thousand years before they caught up with the Chinese. And that was only the hardware. The two thousand year-old Chinese Art of War was used to defeat the USA in Vietnam. Desert Storm followed classic Sun Tzu's strategies, which are now required reading at West Point. Philosophical Daoism espouses western values which seem at odds with Chinese thought that had produced the Dao De Jing and traditional Daoism. I would rather separate the two and study each based on its own respective merit rather than compare one against the other. Traditional Daoism: What are your views on Mo Tzu's pakua that covers the eight directions of practice? Philosophical Daoism: Is this the same as the philosophy in the NW direction of practice in the Pakua?
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Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Do you really think that anti-semitism in the west is only of the "Christian blaming Jews" variety? Frankly, I feel this is a perception coming from the Jews themselves. Jesus was a Jew and the Christians are grateful to and worship this Jew who redeemed them from eternal suffering. Anti-semetism is not what you believe it is. Strangely, anti-semitism doesn't seem to exist in the East. If we are going to do it? Is there a choice? If there is, then why do it at all? Why not practise wu-wei and leave things be? People are willing die for what they believe in because they have no choice. Hitler died for what he believed in. Are you willing to die for Daoism? -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Do you think it is contradictory for the faithful to say that God is undefinable, unknowable and formless but can be related to, worshipped and obeyed? I am not saying that God has internal contradictions. Don't you think that the faithful who makes such assertions about God is "literally speaking against" his own assertions? There is more to the story of Hitler than what we have been fed. Anti-semitism existed long before Hitler and is widespread all over Europe even today. Everyone is struggling for a better life and looking for a final solution to social problems. Isn't your final solution a natural government for all to live in accordance with the Tao? -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Are you suggesting that the Tao itself will develop this "natural government" and "would produce a variety of structures" without any human agency? -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
You are defining the Tao as an un-nameable, extra-conceptual and eternally applicable thing. This is a self-contradictory assertion. You are insinuating that only the Nazi Party was guilty of being human. Is that fair? People have been at each others' throats since the beginning of time. -
Can there be such a thing as a Nazi Dao?
chenping replied to Mark Saltveit's topic in Daoist Discussion
Even Lao Tzu's form of natural government pointed out by Aaron?
