Rara

I guess this applies if you're acquiring a skill and are getting comfortable with it over time...just like any other art we choose to adopt. That, or like you, spend enough time for it to become like a second language. But for those that aren't, I'd say go with the option that requires less effort - otherwise one would either be doing it for a) The novelty or b ) Too feel more "authentic"

I love this. I don't have kids...but know plenty that do. And I have the audacity to complain about insomnia!

Sitting, smiling, drinking tea. Breathing, tai chi and other martial arts. That outside what is a pretty ordinary life - but always bringing myself back round when I realise I'm being pulled away in day to day life. Feeling and absorbing the moment is the main daily practice. I mess up a lot but I come out better for it.

Well, you never know...we'll see, won't we? I think I've said all I needed to say. Thanks for leading this discussion!

Hi Lost In Translation. I thought back to what you said here just now when something sparked in my mind. Have you also considered that the Taoist view points being expressed here aren't actually Taoist? I mean, they are, by definition I guess. But Chuang Tzu would point out that it is only subject to one's own experience and teachings. Just like any other opinion, neither would really have much substance if it's only based on a point of view from a certain tradition. What is the truth? What is immortality? That's up to you, and we can cherry pick ideas from this thread to make up our own ideas that suit us best. Being honest with myself, I am clueless, and that is the beauty in it. I could say, that makes me immortal. Depending on what you want out of it, I'd always say to remember that it's all just banter, ideas and it's neither here nor there

If I might ask, how is this different to an afterlife? That realm before you cease to exist...

That was half of my point, just without being bold enough to say it as absolute as this. Some opinions in this thread differ and suggest otherwise. But I was saying that I wouldn't translate immortality as your own sprit and flying off somewhere wonderful just because of your level of cultivation.

As above, I say the manifest self and spirit self are the same. I can't see another way. You can remove self by meditating, but that self is an "idea" or an "ego". It helps calm us down and to remember in the grand scheme of things, we are "one". I suppose, in other words, "it's all in your head, maaaan"

Two are quite far-fetched ideas and are just as dogmatic as any other "afterlife" belief. I take the term with a pinch of salt. A hyperbole for a healthy mind, body and spirit. I don't know what happens to the latter, but I'll find out (or not) in due course.

I do like Gladwell. Did a good book called "Blink"

It's not unreachable. Can you wake every morning and be content with your existence and abilities? I can't, but hopefully one day. I know what needs to be done, but it's hard to apply because my mind gets in the way. But I don't give up. I have to hush that mind! As much as I can remember to do so...when it goes wandering. Others' opinions, no. How can they know what lies inside you? Remember - those who speak, do not know. Those that know, do not speak. I practice martial arts, but if I master them, how does anyone know? Is it because I make an academy and show off my skills on Youtube? I'd feel better going to my grave knowing that I learnt and expanded daily until death. I don't believe summits are eternal. What goes up, always comes down, but you'll always be a master of yourself, if you stay true to the path. Hope this helps!

Imagine if the sun got bored of rising every morning. Tired of providing light and heat for people it didn't want to. One day, decided to quit. I constantly remind myself about this every morning and every night before I work, or before I clean the house that I only cleaned a week ago. Thanks for the post!

I think most true Taoists would say the same. There's no difference between any of us, we're all living and have our own experiences, that's about it. Feeling this...that's the enlightenment. Other than that, just try and be good

I only started watching The Last Airbender a couple of months ago! I got up to this episode (S2E3) the other day and thought WOW. Lots of characters in this reflect a different culture of spiritual and philosophical practices. King Bumi seems to be the prankster Taoist and I also enjoy Iroh's character - the hedonist with a sly ability to kick anyone's arse. I just had to search for Bumi on this forum having seen this episode recently. I recommend it to all (but start with season one and enjoy the journey)

Yes, I see your point. Perhaps the methods are really down to interest and what is useful to one's own circumstances? For example, I don't believe that I will become any closer to the Tao from practicing Tai Chi or Yoga, but I do know that it will iron me out from all the sitting at a desk. Lao-weng's lifestyle is far different, being a recluse. I remember seeing a video on the Bee-Taoist who simply just eats, looks at his favourite mountain views, and not much else. So I think the environment that you put yourself may determine what needs to be done, but believing that they will take you to a higher place is the misunderstanding.

By definition, is what I am asking, not to be muddled with how it enhances your life...

Hi Mig. I currently have D.C Lau's Tao Te Ching translation and Burton Watson's Zhuangzi. I also have "The Way" which is a collection of extracts from TTC, ZZ and Leih Tzu, translated by Lionel and Herbert Giles. These days they don't leave the house, and they don't need to

Short and sweet question - is anyone familiar with these two? I'm currently reading some translations from TTC and Zhuangzi which have been translated by them and wonder if you have any opinions. I only ask because they seem more "westernised", different again from others that I've read. However, they're quite accessible and a joy to read because of that!

My favourite part of the whole book. In a nutshell, Vast Obscurity schooling Cloud General in the Way. V.O seems quite put out by being interrupted which is nice and comedic. Any other thoughts on this?

I could swear I saw this thread weeks ago and a dozen people answered, including myself. Perhaps it was aaallll a dreeeeam??

Yes, absolutely. Good that you see that and are looking to balance yourself I think I'm the opposite actually, hence my initial advice. Good luck, whatever you choose.

I've been self-employed ever since leaving university. I've bounced around from gigging music and working for promotional agencies on the side to present day where I've managed to hustle myself into a recruitment role where I can work from home (that took me 6 years to get to) Being paid well for doing less hours is what you're after, but it will take time to build. But above suggestions such as temping usually pays well enough (because the agency will appreciate they can't offer work all the time) Beware of cabin fever if you do work from home. I get very lonely these days so have to find new things to do! Thankfully I have a Tai Chi class and some old martial arts buddies who I see every week. Sometimes though, I have to go to the local shop and make small talk just to get me out of the house lol

When I began reading and practicing around 2009, I liked it because "yeah man, free spirit stuff, be yourself, do what you want, find your own path man, your own waaaaaay". This is all fine, but too much of this attitude led to a complete lack of discipline and arrogance. It was around two years ago when I realised "oh, I've gone virtually nowhere", when I shut up and seeked people that could teach me another way of life. Maybe I would like all the trimmings after all. If only there was a Taoist community or temple around where I live.

Maybe you should be a teacher Very nice response. Yes, I said to my fiancée that the tea she was drinking would make her immortal if she drank it every day. Of course, I was just dressing it up with flowers and mysticism. She is a Wiccan after all, and she will take that probably more seriously than I do. You are right though. I belonged to a mindfulness forum as well and around 6 or so years ago, I went in with a particular problem of getting constant anxiety outside of meditation and when meditating, I was constantly worrying about the things I needed to get done. A Tai Chi teacher said two things to me. 1) Why am I sitting down and worrying if I have other things to do. Why not do them and meditate when I'm able and 2) The meditation is almost useless if I then get up afterwards and continue to run around mindlessly. 6 years later, and I am still training myself to change my habits and mindset. A huge improvement has been made, don't get me wrong, but it's amazing how that in itself is a daily task. One thing I am grateful for though, in relation to the OP, is having some form of teacher that I can learn from passively. I kept getting into martial art classes where I was surrounded by other "broken" youngsters and a "broken" teacher. Now I have a teacher that is a chilled, happy middle-aged lady - the environment reminds me that there's an entire different world out there, should I choose to enter it. But you are also saying that either way, the teacher or guide will give you the discipline to learn something without you being able to do things "your own way"...which people often misunderstand with Daoism. I will elaborate in my next post....

@Stosh Thank you for your always-two-sides-of-the-coin response haha. One question. How do we know that Daoist teachers haven't interpreted things wrong too? And with Tai Chi...this was developed fairly recently, considering how old Daoism is. To me, it's merely a physical interpretation in itself, but surely can only be a component of Daoist practice as a result, right? From what I've read in The Chuang Tzu, we know very little about the actual practice of the ancients...