Jax

I will add, the space and the arisings are one piece. The aware space is the arisings. There is no such thing as responsibility or free will. There is no "chooser" of action.

Jeff, I would describe it differently. A kind of harmonizing of minds occurs, but it is usually something that suddenly causes the student's mind to collapse completely...

It's all about seeing the empty nature of thoughts, and that there is no "grasper" of thoughts, and nothing "graspable"..

"Just as hallucination may arise from the potency of a heavy fever, so samsaric images arise as a matter of fact from the potency of a confused mind. Yet from their inception those images are just figments of imagination, immaculate and empty." "Due to unawareness of the nature of mind as the creator, seemingly discrete moments of consciousness appear as the mere perceiver of seemingly objective images." Rabjam, Longchen (2012-06-25). Natural Perfection: Longchenpa's Radical Dzogchen (Kindle Locations 4776-4777). Perseus Books Group. Kindle Edition. "Any thought is no thought, since in its essentially aware nature thought is transparently luminous." From the 8000 Line Prajnaparamita Sutra, Chapter 1.

Boy I sure disagree! Empowerments in group settings are pointless. They have nothing to do with Direct Introduction. Group "introductions" are like going to a lecture, Its not vaguely the same... But then if you haven't had the other (in private), then how would you know the difference?

Yea, but there is no alternative. Its rare to get a real "one on one" on-going relationship with daily access with a realized teacher. There may not be any meat in the soup, but just smelling the broth can be quite intoxicating to the point of engendering a true hunger to get some of the meat... But I agree with you completey...

Wisdom Clarity takes over... and qualities of omniscience begin to produce brilliiant flashes of insight that lie in a different order of magnitude from "thought".

Science and Dzogchen are one and the same...

Well I love quantum theory and how it is the outer verification of Dzogchen view. I have a whole chapter on quantum and Dzogchen in my book. I discuss the latest cutting edge tech regarding the holographic nature of the universe, which includes the mind and brain. Its all a field of "information", or we would say "a field of wisdom". Quantum Information physics is really getting us close to home... So, I think a scientist given a little tutoring on Quantum, could be totally enthralled with Dzogchen teachings. The Dalai Lama has been here in Vienna, Austria twice for two weekend seminars recenlty on Quantum Physics and Quantum Information Theory. He loves this stuff! It was great seeing him in person! The scientists were really excited by the insights provided regarding consciousness and insight as offered by the Dalai Lama.

Jack, I don't know anything about that... Could be any number of reasons. But what he has going has to be a huge source of "headaches". Don't get me wrong, what Norbu is doing is wonderful. Dzogchen is getting known. The downside is that many people get turned off by the whole circus, memberships, dues, gars, organizations, hierarchies, etc. etc. Also many are not seeing the essence clearly through all the side show, ritualistic stuff. That stuff is great for people attracted to a "religious' type, Tibetan approach, but hip Western highly educated people are more often turned-off by all that. That's my point...

Hi Teknix! Its not about releasing all thoughts and conceptualizations to emptiness, but rather the mind at its deepest levels SEES all thoughts and conceptualizations to be empty, like transparent messages floating in space like little holograms that have no substance beyond their own alluring message.

Nice question Jeff... sure. Transmission is really from oneself to oneself. (per Trungpa). However this "flash" is triggered from within oneself, is not the issue. But that it must happen. A good teacher can dance with the student in such an intimate fashion that the flash just occurs when the dance hits it orgasmic finale'. Its the same in Zen dialoguing between a teacher and a student. However this can also happen in life spontaneously as well. Its not easy to find such an adroit dancing partner. Most just stumble over their own feet. So the first step is to find the dancing partner. You have to actually dance with the teacher in a very personal way. There is no "magic wand" effect. Don't believe that a teacher conveys something powerful and truly transforming in a webcast. That is just "magical thinking", where one's imagination takes over, like the "placebo effect". Its short lived at best, not life transforming. (in my opinion).

Good question, but irrelevent. When "people" ACTUALLY receive transmission, the knowledge of "rigpa", they then know nirvana. That knowing transforms the negative energies to positive and the "great reversal" begins (rulog). The emanatiion is collapsing back into its Basis. It feels good... and makes one feel unconditional love for all and everything. Tremendous Clarity arises that guides one's path in life perfectly, as varioius aspects of "omniscience" arise as well as "synchronicity". If this isn't happening then the practice is lacking, most likely the Direct Introduction was too shallow.

No, its not. Direction Introduction is not "something you learned". These big "gang-bangs" are just lazy-ass waste of times and money, (but not for the Lamas...he, he)

Yes, it became a "blessing" ceremony. That's all.

Hi all! I have seen my name pop up quite often lately regarding Dzogchen teachings. I would enjoy the opportunity to correct many of the comments regarding my relationship to the Dzogchen teachings and to clarify several points that are incorrect regarding Dzogchen practice and realization. There seems to be a clique of "Hinayana style Dzogchennist Taliban" panditas here that confuse conceptualization for rigpa wisdom or yeshe. One can't intellectualize one's way to rigpa. In spite of what many from this clique consider my view to be, this recent text I wrote contains the view that has been recognized here: If perceptions are not "objectified" and the perceiving is not "subjectified", there is then only the "unestablished". When the "unestablished" arises one cannot frame it in any conceptual way or else it becomes the "established". The "established" is then something perceived and objectified. If something is perceived and objectified then for that to be possible the perceiving must have become subjectified. Knowing this we find Nirvana is the condition of the "unestablished". Further comment: In practice, this means we leave "appearances" as-is without creating a story that defines them in any conceptual way. Likewise we leave our "perceiving" undefined, not creating a story about a "me", the perceiver. Continuing in this completely open and undefined space of experience, how can each moment not be Nirvana? I think this formula shows the same point that Zen, Dzogchen, Mahamudra, Madhyamaka and the Buddha's earliest teachings point to... Jackson Peterson. My background: http://mumonkan.org/resources/jackson.aspx

That's right Tao Bum! I don't believe anyone shifted into actual rigpa from his group explanations (exceptions allowed!). He was never that clever in my experience. His transmissions to me were when I was with him alone. The topic was always a two-way meeting of minds during a personal discussions, one on one. Norbu and I were once having a beer or two together in a bar in Nevada City, California, and Norbu asked me what I thought of an idea he had. He asked what I thought about whether he should teach Dzogchen in the traditional style of small groups and more intimate settings or should he roll out a program he had just designed. He said he had a plan to establish an international network of centers and teaching called "Santi Maha Sangha". I told him I didn't like the big "international center" concept. Well we know which way he finally decided on! Transmission as in authentic "direct introduction" is extremely personal and intimate. You can't wholesale it. He needs to transmit to many students capable of transmission and set them loose to transmit to others. This is greatly lacking in his community. Yeshe ain't the guy either. More people need to be recognized and encouraged to teach and transmit directly. Its the only way to effectively transform or self-liberate society, in my opinion.

We can talk about what people can do before coming to Dzogchen. Some things may seem helpful, some not so helpful and some things increase confusion and suffering. There is no need to construct an intellectual view of Dzogchen first. There is no need for any pre-requisites in a general sense. Realizing two-fold emptiness is not a pre-requisite to Rigpa. Two-fold emptiness is an "unestablished" condition of Rigpa. Each situation is different. If the "direct introduction" does not bring this "wisdom" shift, then perhaps you could say the "direct introduction" wasn't so professionaly delivered. The teacher should have great insight into the needs of the student prior to the direct introduction. The error is with the teacher, not the student. In Dzogchen the actual tradition is: First we do "direct introduction". That's the way of Dzogchen Ati-yoga. Rigpa is not an intellectual break-through into realzing the nature of "emptiness" as an insightful understanding that results in "rigpa". That is still a revelation of intellectual clarity, not rigpa. Dzogchen is not and never was a gradual path. Why not? Because there is not an entity that gradually "gets it". There is no "getting it", because there is nothing to get nor anyone to "get it". This is all clear just from the Prajnaparamita Sutras alone as well as from many early teachings of the Buddha. There is experience, yet "no self, me or mine" that can be found either before, during or after investigation. In transmission or illumination this is known directly, not like having graduated from "No self" or Dzogchen 101. The whole notion of a step by step path is absurd. Why? Because it assumes there is a "traveller" to travel on a path and a goal to be reached. Its a sad state of affairs that for many teachers and students Dzogchen has been relegated to the lower yanas of "cause and effect" teachings and practices. No one attains "enlightenment" nor does anyone realize rigpa. The whole idea is anti-Buddhist in structure (anatta). Simple Jack, you asked: " Do you have a sense of an abiding "rigpa/awareness," when encountering sensations, sounds, thoughts, etc.?" How ridiculous! You mean you still have a sense of "encountering" sensations, sounds, and thoughts? Let's ask instead; when you Jack are busy "encountering" sensations, sounds and thoughts, are you, during this dualistic experience, recognising the true nature of sensations, sounds and thoughts to be "wisdom" as "effulgent rigpa" itself? There is no need to have a great deal to say about Dzogchen, the less the better. None of what you say or know is relevant. Its all conceptual sem, ALL of it. That's why the "direct introduction" is so necessary, and I don't mean some hooky transmission you receive over a webcast to hundreds of people. The "direct introduction" has to be personal and one on one. In this initial flash, a clarification and sorting out occurs where rigpa becomes differentiated from sem or afflicted mind. This is the essential "Khorde Rushen". When that happens all that intellectual gathering of insights and information regarding Dzogchen and Buddhism including "emptiness", collapses... completely gone, and is seen to be so many meaningless movements and manuevers in a "day dream". All of it was a waste of time. Nothing got "you" closer. If you don't know that with certainty than Rigpa has not arisen.

Hi All! I think it would be good to start fresh... Leave our old discussions behind. One of this issues today with Dzogchen, I believe, is that it has turned into a subject and topic of "study". When that happens many mistake the "wisdom experience" with an understanding of great clarity. People read more and more texts, translations, tantras, commentaries etc. in an effort of intellectual grasping. This actually can make the task more complicated for the practitioner and teacher. The state of wisdom we are attempting to get familiar with is not a conceptual understanding. Usually students have constructed a subtle framework of understanding that involves "names", "labels", "hierarchies", "stages", "paths", "attainments" and various structural supports, all conceptual constructions. Rigpa is a completely "unestablished" wisdom. No concepts get one closer. There is not "anyone" to get closer. And there is "nothing" to get closer too. And there is no "getting closer" along a progressive path. Studying Dzogchen often results in establishing an imaginary, "correct Dzogchen view". However, if there is any trace of a view, even a "correct Dzogchen view", then this most subtle wisdom won't appear, only conceptual clarity will. So what is one to do? Nothing. But then if we do "nothing", we are DOING a conceptual "nothing", which is also a "doing". Any effort in any direction we make in this matter is the action of "sem" or the afflicted consciousness of the Fifth Skandha. The Dzogchen solution is to abandon self-effort and instead receive a "direct introduction" to this primordial "wisdom". When this "introduction" has been successful, then one rests in what is called "non-meditation". This is resting as the "unestablished". Only this is correct practice. But there must not be any sense of a "practice" occuring. No deliberate mindfulness of any kind. Rigpa contains its own quality of natural mindfulness and requires no assistance. Now if anyone has a different view of Dzogchen basics, please share! But please cite no texts or quotes. I would like to discuss this from direct experience only... Let's keep it real.. :-)

Thanks for the welcome. Gapbum!

Hi! The book should be out in a few weeks... Thanks for asking!

Funny... Try this one, just tested it! http://mumonkan.org/resources/jackson.aspx Nice quote! Lets not dig into old DW. Start fresh... In my opening post I was referring to a rather small group or clique that love to dominate any Dzogchen discussion. They love to quote Malcolm, who is now a good friend of mine... and he too has abandoned the Dharma Wheel clique. He also has apologized to me on DW before leaving there as well. Malcolm is a good guy. However this clique likes to use as their defense that the "translation" was faulty or out-moded. It's funny because I have been personally with Norbu where he has spoken in clear English demonstrating a sophisticated understanding regarding such terms as "presence", "awareness", "pure noticing", "immediate presence" etc. Or the argument turns personal to avoid defeat. However, some here have demonstrated some excellent insight into the experiential nature of rigpa. It would be nice to communicate without the rancor that was so ridiculous in Dharma Wheel.

Great points! Most people create little fantasy worlds regarding the teachings and don't see ordinary life, all experience... is where the treasure is found... Its all equally precious, just as every thought, feeling or perception arises... What pleasure!

Wonderful to hear! I am at the last stage of publishing my first book on Amazon and Kindle called The Natural Bliss of Being. The whole point of the book is to present the teachings such as Dzogchen, Mahamudra And Zen in completely generic non-religious and and non-cultural style. The conservative traditions are dinasours in their final death throws. These teachings can be presented as generically as physics or piano lessons. The traditions in the West are so pervaded by corruption, power-playing and sexual abuses, that a fresh, new approach is evolving outside of the traditional lineages. For those of us that have received all the transmissions, practices and necessary results in order to teach successfully, we are moving forward in this effort to demystify and offer these amazing teachings to the largest audience possible. That means easy, cost-free access. There's lots of push-back from the culty conservative Taliban, but that's only to be expected. I hope I have allayed your important concerns...