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as to the question about the tibetans vanishing into light, thats called rainbow body and is different than immortality practices. rainbow body dissolution into light (leaving hair and nails) only happens upon death. In fact its considered the most elevated way to die. Then depending on ones mastery of dream states and the bardo, one can go where they wish to be reborn, so in a sense, there is that aspect of immortality of the soul, but the general tendancy of tibetan buddhists is to look at extreme longevity and immortality practices as a sort of self-clinging, or ego exercise. if you look into it you should find info. Read Chogyal Namkhai Norbu's "The Crystal and the Way of Light" for more info but thats the only firsthand account i can think of. He writes about a guy under house arrest whose progress in the rainbow body death was disturbed by authorities who said that they went into his room but he was tiny like a child, they were kinda freaked out so they went back in a couple days with some more men, but all that was left was hair and nails. CNN writes about several cases of rainbow body he witnessed firsthand, some were people related to him, very good book, highly recommended

.................. Astral projection and remote viewing happen more often than folk know I reckon. More people having done one or t'other and brushed it off as a dream or a wobble. Neither practice is recommended nor taught in development circles in the biggest spiritualist organisation here in the UK. What is taught is how to 'deal with' if and when those happen. One of our working mediums Fiona Roberts has a book out on Kindle called Ghost of a Smile, well worth a look for anyone seriously interested in these areas.

Fū Yue, on 21 November 2012 - 02:25 PM, said: No, I havent read the book so I don't remember john changs account in the spirit world. I have my own accounts to go on. YOU: You're not correct. - ME: proove it! - YOU: 100% of the knowledge is in front of you right now, the only question is whether you can recognize it for what it is. - ME: if you have truly astroprojected you wouldnt make that statement! thats like saying all the knowledge about space can be gathered by not going there! that space is like earth if you had been there you would know that they are totally diferent places. this one and that one. different laws different effects ect.. YOU: Following nature's example is the way, and all biological and 'spiritual' knowledge is a natural permutation of what the universe is doing right now, the transmutation of the various phases of the elements, the cycle of the seasons and the harmony between polarity. - ME: its not following natures example its altering natures example , thats the way, and knowing fanciful words wont teach you how to use natures example to become immortal. YOU: There's no use projecting to fantastical lands if you cannot even understand how enmeshed your being is in the natural elements around you, because if you can understand that then you already know the path to immortality, which is one of return, not leaving. - ME: its all the use you need. by projecting you understand what happens when you leave. and thats how you learn and understand how to get back. otherwise you'll leave and never know how to get back. and by exploring the other side you learn more about this one not the latter. thing is it takes more than indulging in philosophy of spirit and being. it takes knowledge and understanding. knowledge one can only get by doing, by going, by experiencing. Merceless One, do not be presumptuous. I am not speaking of philosophical musings, I am speaking from experience. I have died to this world while alive, and come back. I have ascended and descended through the various realms of existence. My awareness survived re-entry into the womb. I don't have anything to prove to you, the truth speaks for itself. I'm only here to help. And the truth is that nature is already perfect, and by making our selves identical to the celestial design we are able to enter the Tao even in normal existence, where nothing is gained or lost, and there are no ends or beginnings. By making our awareness in the likeness of the universe, we are able to recognize and follow the truth even through endless transformations and death itself. Reversing the outflow of light to return to the unfathomable nature is the whole path. You don't become immortal, because your nature is already deathless. Manifestation is deviation from the source. Self realization is far more important than learning to astral project. If you have self realization, power will result naturally, it will all come together. You will naturally assimilate the knowledge from those who have gone before you, in dream and wakefulness. You don't need to 'go out there' to see the ascended masters. They are right here, in the space between these words. They live inside of you. But if you pursue power ignorant of the truth of being, you will only encounter obstacles and blank spots in your cultivation, because you will unconsciously create barriers between yourself and the beings you are trying to learn from.

Searcher on the way Living lifes dream Loving the illusion

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I find that you're a pretty good thinker, as you have great focus. I think you can do even better. I suggest you explore your preferences more often and you're well on your way. When you find yourself imagining/thinking about what you don't like, stop and say "I will give myself 15 seconds to think about what I don't want and then let go of thinking that." timer goes on... 15... 14.. "I don't like rules, people who give me rules suck! I hate them all and I hate that I hate them, I don't like it all!" 2.. 1.. DONE You don't have to focus on those things. Who told you that you have to think about what you don't want to think about? Do people call you selfish when you choose to focus on your preferences instead of dispreferences? Ask them if they feel selfish when they remove their hand from a hot pan or stove. The "dispreference" is nothing but an emotional response to a focus of thought you are having that is deviating from the truth of your preference.. Now think about what you do want and focus on that instead. It is very easy to focus on preferences in life and think about that. Now as you have been trying to ignore your preferences for years and years, you will find that you have some crazy preferences. Don't throw these crazy preferences away and don't judge them. Embrace all of your preferences as fully as you can. They're not crazy, they're symbolic. Like a dream. It will take some time to translate them into physical action/inspiration/preferences. Keep exploring your preferences to greater and greater depths. Eventually you will begin to see your preferences in your daily life and it will STAND OUT to you. Where there was no way, a way shall be made for you to walk upon. This is how you carve out the way without any effort on your part. It's another perspective on the 3th LAW of Creation: Law of Attraction.

OK! Sorry it took until Wednesday… First, a brief word about the whole Marxist angle -- I mentioned it because you had already mentioned it! And, of course, the fact that it is the defining characteristic of the site you linked... I think it is of value to be cognizant of the lens through which a religious devotee (of any creed) is looking in order to construct the appropriate filter through which to attempt to interpret the interaction. Marxist theory is so logically bankrupt and so manipulative in formulation that it should, in my evaluation, be viewed as the canon of a religious cult, and fair warning should be heeded when attempting to interact with or take meaning from a follower (whether professed or otherwise). But that’s a topic for a completely different thread! Popper's chapter was interesting and I agreed with much of it, but not all of it -- and my Marxist comb caught a few nits. No need for any nit-picking though, I think. I like the suggestion that knowledge has a cumulative aspect but would place a stronger caveat on the idea because change is often disruptive and because loops often seem superfluous in the rear-view (sort of like ox-bows along the periphery of a dry river bed). This generally diminishes the future value of current work and lessens the significance of the "value to the hive" analogy. As a specific case in point, Edison joked about having discovered 999 ways to not make a light bulb. Some of those failures may have contributed in some other fashion to science (or more likely, engineering) -- probably more in the short-term than the long-term -- but most collapse into a single final problem/resolution pair. Had the project taken ten times as long and taken 10,000 tries, it would likely not have been 10 times as rewarding to society. I also question the premise that man's "knowledge edifice" (my words, I think) will have the sort of impact in isolation of plant life or plate tectonics -- history suggests that the collapse of a civilization can happen in a generation or two. Imagine, for instance that all the TaoBums entered cryogenic suspension for a thousand years (heck! even a hundred) and then, on Day One, everyone else on Earth was abducted by aliens. When we awoke, what traces would remain? We'd have the knowledge in our heads but our glorious machines and libraries of "stuff" would largely be like smoke in the breeze. Would we, for instance, be able to make cloth or find food or find a suitable replacement for toilet paper? How long would it take before knowledge of gene-splicing became relevant again? Anyhow, about "science..." First, I think there is a fundamental misunderstanding (including within "the scientific community") about the nature of science itself. In part, this is an anticipated result of the institutionalization of “science” -- including bureaucratization, formalizing by rote, syndicalism, an odd form of irredentism, and an emphasis on accessibility rather than usability, among other influences. Science is not unique in being so impacted. The core of this particular effect on science is a shift in focus from philosophy to “fact.” Anyone with a set of water colors is an artist but some artists are better than others. Part of the difference stems from innate ability and part is the result of hard work. The mix is irrelevant for the purpose of this discussion and it should be noted that this concept doesn’t just apply to painting. For any quality I can think of, an individual has a potential range and kung fu is a prime determinant of the extent to which that potential is realized. In this same vein, let’s say a “good scientist” brings to the table a strong analytical capacity, a love of discovery, and a desire to understand. These characteristics (just to use them as examples) help to define the “envelope” of that scientist’s potential. Of them, the first is far easier to formalize and dogmatize so it is understandably the one the establishment (education establishment, regulatory establishment, funding establishment, policy-making establishment, etc.) focuses on despite the fact that the creativity and intuition of our historical “scientific giants” are crucial among the unifying characteristics for that group of individuals. That and lots of kung fu to learn the tools of the trade. But how do you “make” strong minds? Well, you force them into narrow chutes and feed them fully baked concepts and protein-rich facts. How do you assess their success? With standardized tests, of course!  As a consequence of the convergence of several of these influencing factors, however, we are transforming science into a technical field in support of society rather than a philosophical field in pursuit of “learning what there is to learn and then learning how to learn some more.” In the short-term, this sort of focusing may bring an intensification but it is my suspicion that the long-term result would be a burning-out – IF that approach were to continue in isolation. One approach says “we have to focus on the details because we only have a limited amount of time/energy/options and the urgency is mounting” while the other says “dream and you may dream new dreams.” There is a continuing drunkard’s walk between these two approaches, and both always exist (just as yin & yang coexist). Aside -- I am reminded suddenly of the transformation of the old saying “God is in the details” into “the devil is in the details” – I think this is philosophical in nature and I think perhaps it is reflective of the transformation we see in society’s view of science. So, we’ve got a culture in which “everyone knows about science” (a shallow understanding which is largely façade and that diminishes the accomplished scientist much like “I know Taoism because we covered it in a ‘religions of the world’ class in high school” no doubt causes sighs or groans among some TaoBums) and in which governmental-type agencies lead the charting-out of goals, objectives, metrics, motivations, cultivation, methodologies, documentation and economics of “science” (and of much of academia, for that matter). In my mind, this is a recipe for stagnation, but it isn’t the only negative happening. For most of mankind’s recorded history, intellectual exploration and spiritual development have been inexorably linked – two sides of the same coin. Often, this has had unfortunate religious flavoring (by which I suggest that “religion” is a man-made corruption of spirituality) but by & large the thinkers have not been too tightly constrained by dogma (and numerous examples to the contrary (think Galileo, for instance) highlight the constant struggle). Now, however, society as a whole tends to view spirituality in a negative light while simultaneously embracing superficial aspects of spiritual practices. Ask, for instance, a random member of a neighborhood yoga class and a random member of a Presbyterian congregation on some of the philosophical concepts surrounding their practice and they are likely to just look at you funny. Same goes for the scientist. This has been happening (again, more of a drunkard’s walk than a pendulum-swing) at an increasing rate during my lifetime. When I was in school, a scientist (both those I interacted with and those I learned about) seemed more likely than not to have an attitude open to “there seems to still be more out there” agnosticism and most seemed to have gently loosened the edges of the religious framework their culture had formed around them. Now, however, it seems that the prevailing attitude is decidedly “anti-“: antitheist, antideist, anticreationist, anti-“more things in heaven & earth.” The disturbing part is that this attitude is often unrecognized. In my experience, most people tend to over-emphasize their commitment to what they say they believe to be “correct” (“proper,”, “good,” something along those lines). So the “Christian” overstates his fidelity in trying to follow in those sandal-tracks, thereby diluting the “value” of his religion, and the “rationalist” overstates his impartiality, thereby masking what is often a well-developed belief system of his own. When science and religion mix, bad things tend to happen. This is still true when one of the religion’s tenets is a firm antireligious belief – doubly-bad, I think, because “I believe that I don’t believe” is a tough nut to crack (see also: Gregory Bateman’s framework for learning levels…) Add to all this an environment that increasingly punishes creative risk-taking and rewards letting someone else fence the yard, give it a shot of Tobasco, mix well, and you have an unappetizing recipe. All this may sound rather dire and gloomy but I don’t really think that it is – too much, anyhow. There is the possibility of complete societal collapse around the next bend, of course. And there is the much more realistic possibility of an Orwellian nightmare looming on the horizon. Thing about an Orwellian nightmare, as opposed to a Wellsian one, is that –while it may be unpleasant or devastating for those who suffer through it – the balance shifts back towards the middle in the fullness of time, perhaps over years, decades or centuries. (The Wellsian type, on the other hand, devolves into Eloi & Morlocks…) The result in its present state, though, is a situation in which many are left with a bad taste in their mouths. So, just two cents' worth of idle rambling... Ask me tomorrow and I’ll probably tell you something completely different!  As to the questions of the observer’s effect on reality or of quantum theory making it possible to walk through walls or whatever, most humans will live their entire lives without encountering a situation in which the infinitesimal possibility overwhelms statistical reality. As a sophomore, I realized that while it may be deep to pontificate over a beer on whether one’s barstool exists when one leaves to go to the restroom, it is wise to have sufficient faith in its reality to sit on it and have one more…

Chocolat and that other Johnny Depp movie Don Juan De Marco, emotional without making you feel like you've been traumatized after. Another film by requiem for a Dream director called Pi is more intellectually interesting although not quite as emotionally intense. And I like A River Runs Through it. Cool Hand Luke and Breakfast at Tiffany's for old movies.

That sounds like a very useful excercise. What I like to do is see every single little dust mote in my visual field as a miniature-me who diligently keeps record of everything i've ever done said thought smelled whatever. If I want to recall something I pull it out, fractal style, and it unfolds like a flower in space. It's lead to some very interesting dreams where I'd be disembodied floating through crazy holographic mind internet and some pretty novel lucid dream techniques. That feeling when you realize you're dreaming because your awareness is stuck halfway between a television, the show on it, and your shoes in some sort of unspeakable spacial geometry: priceless.

sinansencer said: I feel your own exploration in your own style is determining what is most effective for you~ I'll mention a bit of the technique of the shamans of Mexico as an aside …but I wouldn't dream of making comparisons with the living awareness you are activating❤ In recollecting physical details and the environment, the one(s) with whom there was interaction, and the feelings present, the breath is used to eject residual foreign energy from the event being recapitulated and also to pull back energy that was left behind during the original event. Shamans used recapitulation as a ploy to induce a minute but steady displacement of the assemblage point (something it seems you are accomplishing). Under the impact of reviewing past actions and feelings, the assemblage point goes back and forth between its present site and the site it occupied when the event being recapitulated took place. Sorcerers believe the source of emanations (referred to as the Eagle) can be satisfied with facsimiles of our own life experience: hence the recapitulation. The dissolving force of the source of all awareness gets what it wants: our life's experience, and wizards get what they want: freedom to expand their capacity to perceive and reach and fly on the wings of intent. What you are doing may serve this purpose well~ it doesn't need to be for any reason other than perhaps it is time to effect the recollecting. It seems I accomplish similar effects during certain kinds of spontaneous meditative states where everyone I conjure in detail, in turns, dissolves or melts or opens into empty activated potential … in order to clarify presence and open it to incipient movements of potential. It can be some sort of preliminary lead-up to other states or sometimes not. I don't know if what you or I do in these recollecting states produces identical effects as the recapitulation practice of the shamans of ancient Mexico, as there doesn't seem to be a strategic motive in conjuring these freeing experiences, but the similarities are worth mentioning. 仙 ed note: fix typo and add the ending to the last sentence

....................... Broccoli smells five in London? You posh sods! We dream about broccoli that smells five up here in poor old Broccoli smells two Leicestershire. You guys must live like Ottoman potentates you and your five smelling broccoli.

Guess, we had the same dream

looks good jetsun two nights ago i realized i was dreaming but in attempting to stabilize my lucidity the dream faded to black. I have worked with Stephen Laberge's techniques and writings and successfully attained regular lucidity, but that was about 20 years ago. I should get back into it! I think i will look into Robert Moss. Does anyone have other suggestions for lucidity authors?

I read 'Waking the Tiger' a few years back, I thought it was pretty good, I would be interested if there is anything new in his new book though. I am currently reading Which is good so far, is a bit long but has a lot of good practical shamanic techniques in it, including thing like egg cleansing and dream re-entry and techniques for soul retrieval.

The world is but a wooly dream....

Hi chi, it's great to hear other people stating the efficiency of Clyman's system too! Well, as I already stated in this thread, of cause of everything I learned so far and of cause of my own experiences I came to the conclusion that Kundalini = Yuan Chi = Jing (Internal Power)! And with Gary's training you don't only activate your already existent supply of Yuan Chi in your Tantien so it flows up and down the spine, you in fact are re-creating Yuan Chi in your body alchemically and fuel your already existent supply with it to make it more and more powerful! Because in fact the Taoists believe that this primal energy can and eventually will be depleted, an issue that I never found addressed in the material about kundalini systems I read so far! So simply "activating" kundalini might very well deplete it faster in the long run, as it seems to happen to many Chi-healers who heal people with their own internal energy. But with Clymans system, you don't fall into that trap! And "all the time flowing around" kundalini might therefore be a bad idea. But with Gary's system you learn to control this energy and let it flow around only when you want it to. I think so too! Keeping your body alive and healthy, growing up and regenerating body cells is what burns up your Yuan Chi! And regenerating sperm cells seem to burn up enormous amounts of Yuan Chi! So not the ejaculataion per se is the problem, it's the re-grow of sperm cells afterwards that depletes your internal power! Also, when I have a "wet dream " now and then what I can't prevent I make sure to keep the "72-hours-Mo-Pai-rule", just to make sure to not "tear" my Tantien! Gary does not address that danger, he just tells you to stop ejaculating altogether!

Hehehe. I know that when I go to sleep I am no longer conscious. (I rarely dream.) No, there is no way, without scientific instruments, of measuring consciousness. It just is. (A result of the brain's processes, of course.

As you mentioned, I said "In my opinion". My opinion binds me, you can decide yourself. Fortunately, no. I know much more powerful masters with real Yin-Yang Gong not this cheap trick You are quite right. I think you are also in the same category desiring the quick fix. Could you just show me a person with this "Empty Force - Kong Jing" with long hours of practice? I mentioned in some other threads, but let me repeat here: Without a real master from a real lineage, these kind of things are nothing but a dream. There are some "masters" like Kiai "master" Yanagikuryen (www.youtube.com/watch?v=edKZAFUfO38).These men have a special bond with their disciples. So their disciples really feel that "force". However, an outsider can go and beat the "master" This is not Yin-Yang Gong.

I just had a nap for 1 and a half hours whilst in stilness movement..I know I was sleeping because the chemicals of sleep seemed to be in, and I was aware, sometimes visions/dream like things came. Have done this a few times Wow I am excited at the prospect of being able to do it everyday, would skyrocket my progress and feels so supremely peaceful.

Haha! Sensei! Far from it...veeerrryy far from it...but I know the difference between what is direct and what is indirect. For a long time I was a indirect practitioner. I am very familiar with the words and concepts people use especially from Buddhist lingo in the most cunning ways...because haha! I've been the most guilty of them all! This is my experience of anatta, or emptiness of self. When I was doing intense practice, I realized first that despite all the knowledge I had gathered about "myself" I really did not know who I was at all. I then realized I didn't even know what the hell "knowing" was. Digging deeper and deeper I clearly saw that there was no one there at all that there was merely a boundary around nothing making it seem like there was. At that moment something within my energy body clicked open as if a knot that had been there to hold onto a boundary between itself and the rest of the world just let go instantaneously. I lost all sense of self will, and a tremendous sadness and pain started rushing from all parts of my body. I cried as if it were my own funeral! Then the sudden absolute clarity of hilarity overcame everything, like my entire life of suffering was a very stupid joke! I don't know for how long but I danced in this stupendous feeling of ecstasy and freedom! One could do absolutely no wrong! My personality was seen to be a clear concoction of the mind, and no independent "thing" was found anywhere at all, even in other people. There's a great Zen poem on this about this Korean monk who rushed immediately out of his meditation hall and sang "who will I tell it to? there's no one here, there's no one here..." Like my signature says, it was a moment of a thousand petals entering an empty house, the entire world seemed blissful naturally, every step felt like a liberation of life, the sound of the herder's flute, and not of a human being. But my deeper understandings came later when I saw that my old habits based on notions around the ego were still very much there or began re emerging after the peak experience, like the branches of a tree still there after the roots had been cut. If you read Hakuin's Kensho: Four Ways of Knowing, he puts in perfectly when he says that just because the sun has begun to rise, don't expect the snow to instantly melt. The snow was still there, and more than that, I saw that there are deeper inter-connected levels of blockages affected by years of living under the idea of a self entity within my energies, mind, and body. My energy practices after this took on a whole another dimension. I finally understood just a little bit (finally! like I was learning to baby step after witnessing people run marathons ) about what my Kunlun practice was there to do. Energy practices aren't to build energy, but rather to melt into that potential, that sea of energy always around us and within us but we feel separated from. Everything that I had been doing just took on a whole another direction. You may not see it from these posts, but I felt very humbled by all this. I felt like a miniature insect in a endless jungle that is the vast universe. P.S. Around 2 years ago, I also had days of tremendous awareness experiences where my consciousness began experiencing another level of being awake, like I was shown that our normal everyday consciousness was actually half sleeping compared to this. I was awake during sleep, and couldn't really eat anything. Just a lot of water and laughter. It was another dimension of awakefulness than beyond mere bodily senses. The comedown from that was not pleasant due to my lack of understanding and immaturity. Then it was 2 years of struggling in my own filth. Hence when I'm questioning Nikolai's statement on realizing that the outer world is a complete illusion, which is a realization one should ultimately arrive at (likely in degrees...to the point where it becomes certain that it is like a magical dream and never existent) according to Buddhism and even modern science, certain signs of your realization should manifest in shifts in consciousness and energy. It shouldn't be a mundane thing at all (too many people, having had no such break through fall into the ever popular zen saying, carry water, chop wood. Those are grounding practices that you do in these states to keep rooted on earth). The mundane should be shattered. I suspect it will be much more vibrant and incisive than seeing the emptiness of self since the physical world has a much stronger anchor than the personality. You can change personalities easily and observe the shifting of the ego. But to take the roots of the physical dimension out, it would require a level of energy the body is normally unaccustomed to.

I bought and read this book yesterday, thanks for the recommendation I thought it was really good and spoke to me deeply, I'm suprised there isn't more spirituality talking on this level of healing trauma as it is such a key issue. It reminded me a bit of Castaneda but I don't think she is a fraud because she is treating clients in clinical ractice, but I was disappointed that she didn't make clear any practical ways we can do the work for ourselves, there was something about bringing memories to the level of your eyes but not much. But I am looking into shamanism methods for this again and dream healing so if anyone has any other good books for this I will be most grateful. I am currently reading "gift of the dreamtime - awakening to the divinity of trauma" by Kelly Harrel , which is similar to the other book, ill report back if its any good.

Law of attraction is based on the foundation Idea that the Universe is Mental. in other words, it is a big consciousness or divine mind, and it 'Imagines' everything into being, including us. But in the case of us, we {and other sentient beings} are a microcosm of the Divine mind, and we have the same spark of Divine mind within us. So what we dream of, desire, fear, imagine, think about, believe and so on, is all constantly 'creating' the reality around it. Some points to consider about this ancient worldview: 1.) Life will never be 'perfect' { as in no problems ever } forever despite our manifesting skill} as the Big Minds dream is primarily one of Duality. The play of consciousness is one of forgetting and remembering... 2.) One will not win the Lotto, just becase one 'wants' to, because everyone else who buys lotto tickets are also 'wanting' to win. But if your signal to the universe is far stronger than anyone elses, then that may be a different story... Cynthia Stanford won 112 million by spending 4 months constanty visualising untill she was absolutely certain she would win. which she did. 3.) The Divine mind may have its own plans for you at times, regardles of what you want or try to manifest... 4.) You may actively work against yourself. Like trying to will for money, yet hating rich people or having some personal belief that you will never 'make it' in the world...

Wow...sounds like this sure was an amazing workshop! Truly wish I could have been there with everyone . I actually tuned into the energetics of the workshop during the weekend and WOW was it powerful. My regular SM qigong practice felt many times more vibrant and all weekend I felt a strong sense of timelessness. In fact during the weekend one night I actually attended a dream SM workshop where Ya Mu actually projected to me and I awoke feeling extra energized...do wonder if the dream attendees I met corresponded to the actual attendees last weekend . Kinda goes to show even if you can't physical make it to a workshop, there no reason you still can show up in spirit

I'm sure every teacher knows that they cannot teach the whole truth. If they want to be logical and consistent they must focus on one half of the story at any one time. We all believe (or used to believe) that we exist as independent selves, and in a sense we are. But Spiritual teachers tend not to bother teaching us about this because we are convinced already. What we don't tend to realise is that we are also completely empty of independent existence, as is everything that appears to us. Because we don't understand this too well the spiritual teachers emphasise it because it's the biggest gap in our education. Tony Parsons emphasises emptiness of the self alone. He is quite insistent that he and you and I are not really here. If people base an argument on independent selfhood he contradicts them. This consistent and disciplined contradiction of questions is his teaching. He teaches emptiness and impermanence like the Buddha did, but he seems not to remind us to reject the teachings. He does not teach the middle way between the extremes of existence of the self and non-existence. We do not now what Tony Parsons' understanding is. If we we judge him by his words alone he seems to be very much 'trapped in emptiness'. But it is possible that his focus on emptiness of the self is strategic. We will not become enlightened unless we first 'see' the emptiness that he teaches so consistently. It is only later that emptiness must be reconciled with the former 'dream of individuality' rather then remain in contradistinction to it. It is when this merging of form of emptiness occurs that the miraculous fruits of the spiritual like start to appear. Parsons has an acknowledged ability to communicate emptiness - sometimes miraculously. He also seems to be lovable, loving and charismatic. If we should 'beware of false prophets and judge a tree by its fruit' then I think we can trust him. The Zen Buddhists talk about the three states of awareness: First is the nornal state of independently existing objects and selves. Trees are trees. Second is the realisation that things and selves can also be seen as empty. Trees are not trees. Third is when these two views are harmonised into two sides of a coin. Trees are trees again. If Tony Parsons is still at only the second stage he is still doing better than 99.99% of people. His message is definitely worth listening to.

Sounds like you are mixing up shamanic practices with meditation, if you get some spirit or voice talk to you in meditation you are meant to give it as much attention and valuation as the voice which starts thinking about what you are going to cook for dinner ie not very much at all, you recognise it is there and let it go or come back to your meditation focus. Typically in meditation spirits etc are just a distraction. The only method I know of contacting your spirit animal is drumming or maybe some dream practices. But a lot of what you describe will sound quite out there strange to the average reader, I hope you are aware of this, if not I would think about going to talk to someone more regular like a councillor.

This is a very hard thing to put into words clearly. Briefly I will start by giving you some background. Some months ago I had an experience, in my mind, after an experience I had, a feeling, after reading a book, that, essentially, messed me up. I won't go into details. Basically I thought I was in love with someone and it turned out to (most likely) not be what I thought. More study and some time since I ended this has provided a few possibilities: 1. The magician's perspective - I was dealing with power which had manifested in this form. 2. The Yogic/Buddha/Tao perspective - I was dealing with Kundalini energy manifested in female form. 3. The alternate Buddha perspective - I was dealing with a Tulpa I had created. 4. My original perspective - I was really in love and energetically connected to an alien being on another world. This thread is not to talk about that, only to give you background. You know the saying, "Once burned twice shy." Before this experience I was exploring the inner landscapes of my chakras with a spirit animal named Ayhunna, who came to me during a dream re-entry session to shamanic drumming. He left as suddendly as he came, aging before my eyes and disintigrating for lack of a better word. Now he's back. This brings me to what I need help with. Before with Ayhunna I would meditate on my chakras, enter its landscape, and then Ayhunna would lead me to something I had to deal with there. Usually this was done playing his favorite game, "Chase the fox." I have since ceased to meditate on my chakras. Now I do ZaZen when I get up and try to do Deep Meditation using the mantas, "Release, Flow" or "(my real name) a Center of Consiousness." With this last mantra I was trying to see myself as a center of consiousness per the first lesson in Raja yoga. Recently with Ayhunna's return he usually sort of tells me during ZaZen through a sort of glimpse of him in my mind's eye or a sense of his presence that he wants me to follow him. Generally he comes during my last meditation of the evening. But I am having an issue here. I need to figure out how to seperate that which my mind is manufacturing to distract me from meditating and that which is truly Ayhunna wanting me to follow him. I feel it is an honor to have his guidance and help once again, and I want to honor this by following his guidance. But I also need to make sure I'm not getting disracted by thoughts. You could argue that it's all thoughts. But for now let's try to keep it simple. There are thoughts generated by my mind, and there are thoughts my mind either locks onto or is given, like a message. I want to seperate what is message and what is just mind drivel. Understand? So how do I do this? How do I make sure that I am not getting lost in thoughts durring meditation? How to I tell when Ayhunna is genuinely calling to me? How can I distinguish a mental distraction from a summons? I need to be sure so if it is a mind distraction, I can simply ignore it and focus on my mantra. But if it is Ayhunna, then I must follow him. My inner landscape/inner world/chakra landscape - whatever the heck it is - is seriously f-d up right now. Hope nobody gets mad at the swear word. But it is very apt. With the loss of Ayhunna and the confusion around this, this relationship and its recent and raw end, as well as the fact that I was, not even a year ago, a simple church-going Christian with a few questions so this is all brand new to me, well I'm a mess. Ayhunna is trying to help. I had one other indivdual who was trying to help me, but we have unfortunately sort of come up at odds to each other. My problem is I never really understood a lot of what he said. I tried and for the most part I followed his instructions. But so many things he instructed me to do just didn't feel right, or I didn't want to do them or something. But he did direct me here, so perhaps someone can help me out. One last thing... As I read, "Magical Knowledge I" by Josephine McCarthy I am seeing much that could coorelate to my experiences. Later in the book she discusses meditation and inner worlds. I think I might have to drop my Raja yoga studies for now and adopt some sort of Inner Stillness Meditation based on her training as my last meditation of the day, and the time at which I work with Ayhunna. So this is what I tenatively plan to do. However I wouldn't mind getting some other viewpoints and advice here. I mean what is the best way to go inside and work with your spirit animal? Maybe the answer is to somehow have a session devoted simply to Ayhunna and inner working, seperate from meditation. That may even be the answer to my problem. Simple enough, just train him, as much as that seems like the wrong way to think about it or say it, that meditation time is seperate from our time and ignore any glimpses or senses of him I recieve. If there is a practicing shaman somewhere in here I would dearly love to hear from you. Above anyone else you would be able to shed light on a lot of this stuff. So please post if you can help me! OK, off to meditate then sleep. Thanks everyone, and Namaste! - DreamBliss