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Thanks PythagoreanFL! Interesting. I have other questions about how 'heart energy' can be dangerous to others. And what about directing it to its source (which is complicated, I think because where is the actual source?) The green light, yes 'seen' it (internally during pre-sleep or as part of a dream). It's definitely a visual experience. I have some subjective experiences of 'telepathy' that could be confused with just knowing what a given person tends to do. A 'hunch'. Not so clear cut.

Hehehe. Well, as Vmarco has stated, you are never living in the present because by the time you recognize what happened in the present it is already the past. And you can't live in the future cause it ain't here yet. The past is written in stone so you can't go back. Yeah, maybe we all are just someone's dream? If that be so, I think the dreamer has a psychological problem.

If I could meditate more than 1hour a day I would be doing this, if not now, then after my studies. It is my dream to go on a long lenght solitude and do nothing but meditate. I believe it would be a very powerful tool, like someone mentioned here. On the other hand I have had ages in my life, when I was really depressed and was all alone, in those kind of cases it destroys your psyche whether you like it or not. So I guess if it is planned and the person is ready, then it can be a bliss, but if not, then not

I think if I could be out in a beautiful natural setting and have a few things to putter around and maybe create art with, some extended simple time in solitude would be living a dream.

Hey everyone! I have been having a lot of fun opening up my microcosmic orbit, which has helped immensely with dealing with some kundalini stuff that flared up recently. I've been having a particularly bothersome area that I am finding it difficult to deal with, as there don't seem to be any "points" located here. I am talking about the area directly above your top palate, where the tongue touches, reaching up to the brain. Also, the tongue itself, the tendon beneth the tongue, the salivary glands, as well as the entire area extending from the tongue to the throat point (if you put your index underneath your tongue, and your thumb under your chin and squeeze, this is the worst area for me). The blockages I have here are so intense, that I have been having vivid dreams about them being removed. One involving myself somehow breaking my teeth and pulling my brain out through my mouth, and being unable to place it back in, and another dream involving me making out with this super cute girl, and her "sucking out" the stuck energy. Yeah, it's that bad! I noticed that this particular area, especially the tongue and below, is shock full of lymph nodes, so I've been just generally massaging the heck out of it as much as I can. I've also been seeing an acupuncturist to help out, but it's still not improving much. But I post here to know if you guys have any other suggestions! Any ideas are most welcome. Thank you.

I haven't done astral travel. I'd like to experience it. Isn't that part of reason why we're here: to experience? I did some lucid dream before. I wonder if atral travel is similar. In lucid dreams, you can change stuff at will. I wonder if astral travel is similar.

edit>i do sincerely wish you luck and i hope that fate and destiny are kind to you. i respect your choice , whichever way you decide to go. i am only suggesting you dont have to give up your dream

I just read The Attention Revolution, by Alan Wallace. It's a great book on the stages and practice of shamatha; how it ties into the path; the relation between shamatha and vipassanna; the basics of lucid dreaming or dream yoga, and also touches on things like the 4 immeasurables. It's mainly focused on 3 techniques: anapana, resting the mind in the natural state, and awareness of awareness. Wallace suggests moving through these increasingly subtle practices as you advance, and goes into detail on adjustments you can make along the way. But the information can be easily applied to any shamatha method, and in particular Wallace explains how to use anapana through all the stages by focusing on nimittas then counterpart signs as they appear. Highly recommended!

Yup--- textual glitch. "On" position is with the pinky "down".... think british tea-hands. Maintaining some tension in the pinkies is ideal --- not necessarily trying to fall asleep (unless your aim is a dream practice). Light awareness / transitional-state. Placing yourself in that slightly-upright position is supposed to encourage some wakefulness (but, in spite of my best intentions, I generally find myself just nodding off...... ). I prefer seated. best. balance.

You think you're going, great. It is an anarchists dream. No money (cept for drinks in the main tent), no corporate logos, extreme self sufficiency in an extreme climate balanced by a gift economy and the ideal every one participates and everyone should find there art or passion. <mine was hanging out in bars and a defunct body outline project that failed early> Burning Man burn out. It hits a lot of people. For the Big Burn I came a day or two late and left a day early, still caught the big burn of course. But 2 of the 3 trailers that made up my impromptu group left earlier. You want to see it all, do it all, there so much energy in the place its very easy to melt down. People stay up 40 or 50 hours then collapse. Its the freakin desert 100 degrees w/ the wind blowing burning alkaline dust and all you want to do is see more and more. What saves you is slowing down, finding a bar or class, planting your feet and shooting the shit. Its okay not to see everything, try to get some rest, stay hydrated, always have a cup w/ you <I use a drinking horn>. Bring quality ear plugs, eye shades and very importantly a cheap bike; Black Rock City is just too big, hot and dusty to walk everywhere. It could be a 4 or 5 mile hike to get to The Man, The Temple, the Art sections, your favorite watering holes; you'll need wheels- a cheap expendable no speed. Sadly a tiny combo chain, its not that it'll be stolen, but it may be borrowed for a long periods. Burn out happens at the smaller regionals too. Camping isn't easy, I generally don't like it. Loud and exciting people cut both ways too. If you <or any bum> are going, let me know. We can set up some way to meet. M.

Dream Yoga is one of the six Yogas of Naropa, a complete system of Tibetan cultivation. One of the early Kagyu lineage holders, Dusum Khyenpa, achieved enlightenment through dream yoga. It's a very powerful metaphor for waking up. Of course any practice, including emptiness meditation, can be an addiction in the service of entertainment. Sean PS - KoHsuan, I think registration is over. I've been too busy to follow through on the course so far so maybe next session we should sign up earlier and many of us can do it together.

if a bum goes to pp section and the topics are all locked, then where else would bum respond if saw fit? extreme poverty in the cities apparently really sucks but in the countryside of life , it aint so bad, really. it is a bit of a challenge some days but everyone else is also extremely poverty stricken and so the country folk have found ways to be resourceful and clever and mostly take great joy in helping others out. this sorta thing happens in my neck of the woods daily, nightly, in the morning too. and we never ever ever ever never ever never would ever ever dream of letting go of our dreams. never.

Hey D Yup I'd agree with that. Mind doesn't know how to process the nonlinear stuff. Yeah, in my post I wasn't specifically referring to you or anyone in particular. Just some general reflections. It seems to me that you have had or have genuine realisation of the Self. I just wanted to clarify some points on vedanta as there were a few misconceptions about vedanta. and I felt I could do this here as it is a vedanta forum. If it had been another I may not have said That's not really the point I wanted to make. On an absolute level that statement is correct but it's a neo advaita copout if that's basically all Sailor Bob tells us (I don't really know him, I think he's a neo though?). Obviously there are things you can do to purify the mind and enable yourself to 'gain' Self realisation...which isn't really a gain, but more of a change of our default settings I guess. True vedanta has an entire arsenal of tools to enable us to make this shift. Yes! Again the neos don't tell us this, because their satsangs might get a lot quieter, but in order to GET this, we need to be 'qualified'. Obviously the mind needs to be relatively stable and pure to be able to assimilate the teaching and make the shift. Shankara outlined the four main qualifications necessary for really assimilating Self knowledge: discrimination, dispassion, discipline and desire for Realisation. These are the qualities necessary for ripeness. i guess they are the difference between someone who seeks enlightenment for decades but can't seem to get it (must lack one or more of the four D's!) and those who can listen to a single talk and just 'click'! All true vedanta teachers emphasise the necessary for be fully prepared in order to assimilate the teaching. Yeah there are definitely things you need to do to 'ripen' yourself. Koans are good - zen is an amazing tradition and works amazingly for many people. Vedanta offers sadhana, spiritual practise to prepare the mind - karma yoga/letting go of the fruits of our actions, bkhati yoga/devotion, meditation, etc. These are not direct means to realisation, but indirect. They whip the mind into shape, into a suitably pure and receptive mode in which we can practise jnana/knowledge yoga/self inquiry and process our inquiry. Neo advaita generally ignores this necessary prerequisite and tells us no practises are necessary, trying to offer 'enlightenment for lazy people'. I've never met anyone that's worked for! The Neos are lazy. They don't have a complete teaching. They just cherry pick elements of jnana yoga and pass that off as all we need. Clearly it isn't, unless the person is already highly qualified and has a very pure, still, dispassionate and discriminating mind. That's very rare in our crazy culture. You say 'that's it' like it's nothing special at all. It's pretty fcking amazing! I haven't got to the state where Self knowledge is completely abiding, I dip in and out (still some vaasnas to work out!!), but when I'm grounded in t completely transforms everything...in that you are no longer bound by anything in this world. It's a sense of freedom and fearlessness. It's just the start of the journey. Of that I am certain... I guess it really depends what perspective we take, This whole topic is extremely subtle, expansive, multi-dimensional. It's hard to discuss also, because a statement that is true from one perspective may be untrue from another, but that doesn't negate the truth of it. I feel it's a contradiction saying there's the Absolute and 'not the Absolute' because that would mean the Absolute isn't absolute. Maybe it's wording and semantics. I think of it as the Absolute and the apparent reality/apparent separation/apparent world/maya/etc. It's not *not* the Absolute, but it appears to be lol Excellent. I've had periods of depression and whatnot...sensitive, emotional guy...through it all awareness shines. It outlasts everything. The mundaka upanishad astounds me with it's simple but mind-shattering realisation. The person we think we are with its problems and emotions and desires and fears doesn't even last a full 24 hours. It recedes into a dream self with entirely diff problems and emotions and circumstances. And then that self recedes into pure unconscious consciousness. Awareness (what I think you mean as the observer) ties together these ephemeral selves like the string connecting pearls. Only in this case the pearls are made out of the string, all one substance. It's crazy...beautiful...

just finished reading this for the first time http://www.archives.gov/press/exhibits/dream-speech.pdf, and was reflecting on what we take for granted today.

I said, "Those who point to the highest levels of compassion have already exceeded the limits of relative compassion." How you interpreted that as "Claiming that people who talk about the idea of "true compassion" are above common compassion" is incredible. If you read the context of why that reply was being giving, it may have afforded a better comprehension,...although unlikely. If there is no absolute truth (a common response by those who cling to their personal truth for their identity), then the absolute truth would be absolutely nothing, and thus an absolute truth. Factually speaking, truth is a frightening thing for most. After the realization of a single truth, a Canadian said: "Waking up is not necessarily pleasant; you get to see why all this time, you chose to sleep. When you wake up the first thing you will see is Reality does not exist for you, you exist for it. Shocking as it is when you let it in, there is rest. You do not have to labor anymore to hold together a reality that does not exist; forcing something to be real that is not real. You and this life you have been living are not real .. In letting it in, even through the shock... pain... shattering, there is rest. Reality is when all you want to know is what is true ...just so that you can let it in and be true. Reality is not a safe place for you - the you that you have created. It is the only place where you would die; where there is no room for your hopes, your dreams. Once you have let it in, once you begin to re-awaken; to let Reality wake you up, nothing can get it out. That is the beginning of your end. Waking up can be much more painful than the agony of your dream, but waking up is real." If you ever get to that level of uncovering, let me know. I'm not a teacher or guru,...I have no desire to help you along your path. As for compassion,...you can invent all the feelings you wish to make it more palatable for your beliefs,...however, if you ever wish to understand compassion as a Bodhisattva, I'd recommend the 'Heart Attack Sutra' by Karl Brunnholzl.

Never easy to let go of fear and simply observe; nightmare, dream, bliss or terror.... Never easy.

All philosophical and religious positions revolve around only 2 views: Existence and Nonexistence. However its all illusion, like a dream. Phenomena don't arise in the first place. Nagarjuna in ''Mūlamadhyamakakārikā'' 21.12. states: "An existent does not arise from an existent; neither does an existent arise from a non-existent. A non-existent does not arise from a non-existent; neither does a non-existent arise from an existent." http://books.google.com/books?id=38WJRwP3nLgC&pg=PA297&dq=Mulamadhyamakakarika+of+Nagarjuna+An+existent+does+not+arise+from+an+existent;+neither+does+an+existent+arise+from+a+non-existent.&hl=en&sa=X&ei=fnGiUtuWMPPMsQSzkIDwCA&ved=0CDgQuwUwAQ#v=onepage&q=Mulamadhyamakakarika%20of%20Nagarjuna%20An%20existent%20does%20not%20arise%20from%20an%20existent%3B%20neither%20does%20an%20existent%20arise%20from%20a%20non-existent.&f=false Here are some quotations from 2 top books, Nagarjuna's Reason Sixty and Center of the Sunlit Sky: "Nagarjuna taught , "bereft of beginning, middle, and end," meaning that the world is free from creation, duration, and destruction." -Candrakirti "Once one asserts things, one will succumb to the view of seeing such by imagining their beginning, middle and end; hence that grasping at things is the cause of all views." -Candrakirti "the perfectly enlightened buddhas-proclaimed, "What is dependently created is uncreated." -Candrakirti "Likewise, here as well, the Lord Buddha’s pronouncement that "What is dependently created is objectively uncreated," is to counteract insistence on the objectivity of things." -Candrakirti "Since relativity is not objectively created, those who, through this reasoning, accept dependent things as resembling the moon in water and reflections in a mirror, understand them as neither objectively true nor false. Therefore, those who think thus regarding dependent things realize that what is dependently arisen cannot be substantially existent, since what is like a reflection is not real. If it were real, that would entail the absurdity that its transformation would be impossible. Yet neither is it unreal, since it manifests as real within the world." -Candrakirti Nagarjuna said "If I had any position, I thereby would be at fault. Since I have no position, I am not at fault at all." Aryadeva said "Against someone who has no thesis of “existence, nonexistence, or [both] existence and nonexistence,” it is not possible to level a charge, even if [this is tried] for a long time." "I do not say that entities do not exist, because I say that they originate in dependence. “So are you a realist then?” I am not, because I am just a proponent of dependent origination. “What sort of nature is it then that you [propound]?” I propound dependent origination. “What is the meaning of dependent origination?” It has the meaning of the lack of a nature and the meaning of nonarising through a nature [of its own]. It has the meaning of the origination of results with a nature similar to that of illusions, mirages, reflections, cities of scent-eaters, magical creations, and dreams. It has the meaning of emptiness and identitylessness." -Candrakirti Nagarjuna in Mūlamadhyamakakārikā 1.1. states: "Not from themselves, not from something other, Not from both, and not without a cause- At any place and any time, All entities lack arising." Buddhapālita comments (using consequentalist arguments which ultimately snowballs into Tibetan prasangika vs. svatantrika): "Entities do not arise from their own intrinsic nature, because their arising would be pointless and because they would arise endlessly. For entities that [already] exist as their own intrinsic nature, there is no need to arise again. If they were to arise despite existing [already], there would be no time when they do not arise; [but] that is also not asserted [by the Enumerators]. Candrakīrti, in ''Madhyamakāvatāra'' VI.14., comments: "If something were to originate in dependence on something other than it, Well, then utter darkness could spring from flames And everything could arise from everything, Because everything that does not produce [a specific result] is the same in being other [than it]." Candrakīrti, in the ''Prasannapadā'', comments: "Entities also do not arise from something other, because there is nothing other." Nagarjuna in ''Mūlamadhyamakakārikā'' 1.3cd. states: "If an entity in itself does not exist, An entity other [than it] does not exist either." Candrakīrti, in the ''Prasannapadā'', comments: "Nor do entities arise from both [themselves and others], because this would entail [all] the flaws that were stated for both of these theses and because none of these [disproved possibilities] have the capacity to produce [entities]." Nagarjuna, in ''Mūlamadhyamakakārikā'' VII.17., states: "If some nonarisen entity Existed somewhere, It might arise. However, since such does not exist, what would arise?" Nagarjuna, in ''Mūlamadhyamakakārikā'' VII.19cd., states: "If something that lacks arising could arise, Just about anything could arise in this way." Candrakīrti, in ''Madhyamakāvatāra'' VI.151., comments: "It is not asserted that a chariot is something other than its parts. It is not something that is not other, nor does it possess them. It does not exist in the parts, nor do the parts exist in it. It is neither their mere collection nor the shape—thus is the analogy." Candrakirti, in "Madhyamakavatara" VI.23., defines ultimate and relative truth "The object of perfect seeing is true reality And false seeing is seeming reality."

Times are different, it isn't easy to just go off and dedicate your life to cultivation like it once was. I was just reading about a guy who was just about to go into a traditional Buddhist three year retreat and had a freak out about his life how he was giving up a good career and some of the best years of his life to sit and do nothing, but the reality is on the Buddhist path at least there has to be a giving up of mundane life and renunciation of trying to attain happiness or fulfilment through it, so if you want to attain meditative realisations to match the conceptual understandings you have gained you will most probably have to do a number of long retreats in your life,or at least one three year retreat to get to the depth in your meditation. Those who say otherwise haven't studied the lives of previous masters, there are exceptions but the majority of masters go on long retreats sometimes 10-15 years or more. But that is the Buddhist path, there are other paths, the Fourth Way for example is meant to be conducted in mundane life and around people as your fuel, which is what attracted it to me because I have always known it will be very difficult for me to take many years out of my life to go into retreat so I was looking for another way and it is meant to be possible to walk it while satisfying your duties as a householder. And according to Liu I Ming there are Taoist paths which can be walked within cities and within normal mundane life. But another method someone else mentioned is to develop your dreaming ability and become highly developed in dream Yoga, then including waking meditation time you could be practising over ten hours a day while still going to work, which is probably more than many people in retreat practice.

That won't work for me, I am not interested in arguing or debating why this is the case. My dream will remain a hobby, and career will have front seat. This is currently the case anyway, so there will be no net change. My other option is taking a part time job, and being homeless living out of a vehicle. However I don't think this is such a smart move.

This morning I woke up and my first thought was "Man, I've been far away". I recall some dreams of being in a foreign country but it was unclear what this country was. Then I went online and saw a message from a Facebook friend I've never met. He said I visited him in Costa Rica last night, asked if I could smoke weed at his place and then gave him a hug telling him "It will be alright". This guy is sick with cancer. Right now as I write this I'm watching Twin Peaks and the Blackfoot Indian guy is talking about wandering dream souls.... Look at that. It's as if the Higher Levels were 36 000 bit information and we only receive 36... Or something. Happy 2013 everyone!

Excellent move away from what you repeatedly express that you neither enjoy nor find useful! Perfect use of ignore function, to avoid repetetive fruitless activation! Self moderation is not just a utopian dream!!

If an enlightened person were asked if they were awake to the dream of the 6 senses, and said no, they are awake. For such a Truth Realized being would not spew such a dishonesty. Most today would not recognize an enlightened person if they saw one,...the faith and belief-based seek faith and belief, and would thus desire to kill an enlightened being. "Anyone who gives you a belief system is your enemy"...and certainly not enlightened. You can recognize a truth realized being by the fact that they are intolerant of anything that steps between a sentient being and their direct experience.

one of my dreams is/was to own a large property and build up a self sufficient organization using only what is available on/off the land, and inviting people out to live with me and form a nice community of hippies and free thinkers... of course it'll all be pretty labor intensive, so i dunno how the elderly will be handling this dream of mine, though i do hope taijiquan and qi gong will benefit them as much as i do hope

Hi ॐDominicusॐ Thank you so much for taking the time to write all of that. I appreciate it. Yes, I found that one too. I've watched myself sleep, watch the mind churn and dreams occur from a third person point of view for a total of about three weeks. It's hard to get used to that. I'd prefer to have a normal sleep. But, most mornings now, I'm aware of my self before I wake up. Is that what you call those? I've seen visions of these rectangles of colored light, like geometric patterns. They are very pretty and remind me of archetypes. I've never thought that they were mandalas. No, I don't think so. I was capable of thinking so I suspect my coarse consciousness dissolved into the substrate and then the subtle consciousness in the substrate consciousness (alaya) took over and that is what experienced the experience. No, it wasn't the Aerial Toll House. I didn't meet any angels or see any demons at that time.. There was no other presence there. However, I have had multiple dreams when I was a kid about flying over a sea of naked 'reddish dirty' people in a place of rock, fire and semi-darkness, all standing up. The few times that I flew over them too closely, they'd grab me and try to hold me down. Really freaked me out. I don't know what released me, but I'm glad that it did.. I think the astral/mental/causal bodies qualify as a bodies. Otherwise, why would angels and other beings appear, helping people on earth? Have you found the place at the base of the skull, somewhere near the medulla where, if you focus on it, your breathing stops dead? I have found such a place but I'm afraid. I've heard in Taoist writings that there are certain points you have to stay away from, otherwise it may kill you.. Didn't want to get rid of the body just yet. I have experienced the 'point of view' totally separate from the body, mind, dreams etc.. Most mornings, before I wake, I am like that. Just this tiny little point of view, everything is dark and not much is happening.. I can see the little cloud of thoughts in the mind churning, the dream world appearing separately, I can hear myself snore and watch the body. The point of view is from about 2 feet above the body.. I've always thought that it was the point of view from the astral body, floating above.. but now I'm not sure.. Yes, I know what you mean.. I know that I once lived in India, when they had steam locomotives (ha, maybe they still do? -no offense to anyone). I spent allot of time in this wooden square building that was three stories high and the middle of the room was wide open. People would sit around the balconies and have debates of some kind. But I don't remember much about it. Gee, I was just listening to James Swartz's youtube and he has described the same thing that I've experienced several times now.. I call them 'satori moments'. Funny, I don't think that that is any basis to declare 'enlightenment'. Do you? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uvp6qRQwSE He also has had an experience of coming out of the third eye and becoming everything (while taking a shower). This is not so hard to do. If you train your awareness to move around and expand into the surroundings, occaisionally you notice that you really do seem to be the car, or the tree or become the person whom you focus on. I don't think that qualifies as enlightenment. I think it is just a taste of the localized third eye action, some kind of astral projection, especially because he maintained a singular entity-like point of view, not one that is simultaneous and all-encompassing (includes all the infinite planes). I do recall that Yogananda Paramhansa Yogi had a similar experience to the one Swartz describes.. But who am I to say. Here is James Swartz's list of gurus: http://www.shiningwo.../About Me 1.htm Hmm. I'm thinking Swartz's understanding is not so great.. In this video, he claims that everything, all actions in the universe, is controlled by vasanas and samskaras, even in the high gurus like Sai Baba and others.. I thought enlightenment was being free from vasanas and samskaras. They should have all been burnt away. If they aren't then that is not the real thing. Is it? Well, he is entertaining anyway.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcFwgPzQ_rY TI

Sorry you're going through some trying times. I don't know if there's a 'proper' way to do any of it (and I certainly wouldn't caution the Kubler-Ross 'stages') I dealt with it just at the end of last year and it's been very mixed. The person was very ill, very loved by me. I felt I had to 'support' a lot of the other people and didn't really get a chance without them there to do it 'my way'. Practice was helpful in dealing with the other people but not with myself. I can understand the 'indulgence' of sadness but there's IMO/IME a clear difference between that and the actual grief. At the time he passed, I had some very strange experiences of being in communication with him in a dream. I might get around to sharing that in the PPF at some point.