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Found some cool quotes today on this subject: Via BuddhaNet "Most psychotherapy tends to work with the contents of consciousness, with the aim of reducing pain and conflict and enhancing the capacity for love and work. This can be characterised as working on the content of the dream, exchanging nightmares for happier, more peaceful dreams. Ideally, spiritual practice is aimed at waking up and becoming aware of the nature of the dream and who the dreamer is. At its best, transpersonal psychotherapy aims at doing both. Both psychotherapy and spiritual practice contribute to psychological health and spiritual growth. Unresolved psychological issues can impede healthy developments at any stage, and sometimes such issues surface only after much spiritual practice. The seeker must beware of the limitations of both therapists and spiritual teachers. Expertise in one domain does not make one an authority in the other, and few individuals are well trained in both. Psychological and spiritual development are inextricably intertwined, and both continue throughout life. In practice both psychotherapist and spiritual teachers do what they can to relieve suffering and help people grow in consciousness." Via Ken Wilber "The true part of the recaptured-goodness model is that at any of the stages of growth--purple to red to blue to orange to green to integral--the potentials of those stages can be repressed, oppressed, alienated, fragmented. 'Therapia' then involves a recontacting, a releasing, a liberating of the repressed potentials--a regression in service of further growth. The main 'problem' with the Enlightenment was not the emergence of rationality (orange)--that, in fact, was one of its extraordinary accomplishments--but a rationality that was captured by empiricism and positivism and thus reduced to instrumental rationality (monological, not dialogical): what we at IC call 'flatland.' The other potentials of reason (dialogical, communicative, moral, practical) were thus buried, became atrophied and withered. The 'therapia' for this is not regression to red or purple--recommended by Romantics and eco-primitivists--but recontacting the lost potentials of reason and carrying them forward into second-tier integral embrace. See The Marriage of Sense and Soul and Sex, Ecology, Spirituality."

Yes, I noticed it... unfortunately I do not have internet in my house, and probably miss some precious posts since I do not access everyday. But I was lucky this time due to your actions! ----------------------- About stopping some aspects of the practice... It is important to note that I do not feel cold during the practice... I feel fine.. it is just my skin that become cold. I used to have alot of night emissions, but lacked sexual vigour. Afetr practicing the Kidney strengthening, I noticed that the emission ceased... I still dream with women and having intercourse with them, but I do not ejaculate, and I noiced that, even though I am not having emissions, I wake up with an erection more often, so I guess that the Kidney Stregnghthening is really helping me to preserve My Yin and Yang in Kidney, since I was having up to 3 ejacs or more a weak, with no control.. I was in dispair!... During the Kidney Strengthening exercices I felt alot of Heat and even sweating. The feeling of cold happens more often ater I go to sleep. please Friend... I am not discarting you precious post, I am just extending the discussion further more. Cheers.

thanks for the reminder SJ. i appreciate it, and agree. Further, the words and logic that madhyamakas use to define "existant" "nonexistant" and all the other designations inherent in that logic are all imputed terms. At the ultimate level, once a person breaks through the shell of delusion and sees that reality is not unlike a dream, everything you could say or think is imputation. So all that buddhist logic is nice and helpful to many, but to some, it is like pages and pages of fingers pointing, but no moon. The moon only appears when one can put all the discursive activity down... in other words i have never heard of anyone thinking themselves to liberation. Its not something you can share directly through books. And while i agree that science is inherently materialist, i would say that there is nothing wrong with understanding the material world and how it works. Its just not the end-all-be-all... not the full equation.. as fringe science happily acknowledges. Quantum physics confirms the observations of the buddhas, and if it didn't i would have as hard a time "being buddhist" as i would with being a fundamentalist christian who thinks that dinosaur fossils are tests of faith and that the world is 5000 years old, was created in 7 days, etc. I can't do that tho, i can't be that. You can take this or leave it, but my root lama has taught me that there is a reality, and that we need to pay attention to it, to connect with it, to understand it as best we can. It might be a fleeting mirage, but dismissing it without recognizing it at our true self, the sacred vajra mandala, and treating is as such (somewhat sacred) is a cop-out. He's a prasangika, and dismisses view that stops at svatantrika emptiness, but i see the sense in what he is trying to impart, and i have been influenced by him to respect, revere, and observe reality as a student, not to dismiss it outright as unreal and thereby unimportant. lastly, i don't take you as saying that reality is unimportant, that is not in direct response to you. Its just a commonly held "buddhist" viewpoint that reality is unreal, illusory, and thats the end of the logical process. According to madhyamaka, that is an extreme point of view, and no different than saying reality is real. So the truth of the vajra world is neither of those extremes, and shouldn't be seen as important or unimportant, sacred or profane... that is what madhyamaka teaches, a way beyond words and concepts, but it doesn't mean that gravity isn't relevant, or that you should step out in front of a bus because the bus lacks inherent existence. Those sorts of things are for the fully realized, or at least who have awakened the power of flying about or teleportation... until i get there, i feel like understanding the laws of the world has relevance.

I agree Do you think that what one person calls a fantasy or dream can be considered realistic by another person, I find often I am creating/creative thoughts, a so called realistic minded person would say I live in the clouds or am delusional, but from my perspective they are stuck in their own limitations. What is your own opinion of this, or did you mean something else by fantasies and delusions such as conspiracy theories (which might be right?)...

so is it a coincidence that the three of you who seem to love leftist political points of view are pretty much the only three around here saying it is preposterous to question the official story on this...oh, but wait, you can ask questions,...but hey, cant follow any of those crazy conspiracy theories... like I said, we've been presented with an "official" story that clearly contains fabricated elements, it prompts one to question when one sees "a glitch in the matrix," as it were.........."did my eyes deceive me, or was I just bullshitted?" my bullshit meter has throughout my life woken me from any dream that didnt add up. it is the nature of it to question an inconsistent story.

Long ago someone told me this in a dream -- "Sarvaiva hridayam, sadaiva hridayam" (Everything is Heart, Forever is Heart). For some reason it popped into my conscious mind just now. Wonder what it means...

Yes we all feel this sometimes more than other times. The mind/brain is ALWAYS attempting to tell us it is who we are. This is what you are terming your small self. We can consciously know our true eternal selves but that doesn't mean we are not being attempted hijack at any time. The key is to make the "small self" the slave of the true self; this gets into our own personal concepts of things such as wu wei (link to my definition) and is much easier said than done. So many things, when we discuss them with words, start losing their meaning. I think there are many reasons we need to go through the process of humanity and having a body. It was only in the last 15 years or so that I have proven to myself one of my earlier theories, one very important reason; there is one particular thing that cannot be done while in Spirit. It has to do with our previous lives. We lose, through various interactions and deeds, parts of our energy. This energy can only be recouped while in body. Yes, I know this sounds weird. At first I did not wish to believe it. The proof comes from doing the specific neigong exercise I developed for this: The Sequential Energy Center Activation, Balancing, & Dimensional Expansion exercise. One aspect of this exercise is that when we jump through the astral layers into clear pure high vibration Light, we then have the opportunity to call back to us these energetics. We can because we have, for a brief period, transcended the "time" thing, and because we are in a vibrational level where our intent and energetics are pure and uncontaminated. Folks here asking me to expand on this need to remember I am speaking from the point of view of the system and tradition I practice. I do know that quite a lot of folks that post here like to jump around and add whatever to their practice. I am referring to the Stillness-Movement system which has different conclusions, abilities, benefits than other systems. So, if one is not in this system, I CAN"T speak too much more of this. I posted on this thread because I saw a practitioner had reached a specific level within this system and I consider it an awesome and needed thing he has done. The Stillness-Movement Dream Neigong is a part of the Stillness-Movement sleeping Neigong which is a part of the Stillness-Movement Sitting Neigong. It takes students of this system anywhere from 3 months to 15 years to begin this dreamtime interaction; those who embrace the system sooner rather than later. This interaction is not anywhere close to what is referred in the books as lucid dreaming and is a total different thing. Most interaction of these type of things are on the astral level which is not at all what I am referring to.

in waking state... always ask... am I dreaming (take note of surroundings) another is to look at hands asking the same question Theory is when you are dreaming you will ^ do the same... and hopefully realize that you are in a dream = lucid another is to let your body fall asleep but keep your mind awake... many experience imagery just before sleep or just before waking. they say, if you can master sleep you can master death. once lucid one basically has to maintain a meditative / sharp awareness of ones awareness and ones surroundings or so they say... Happy travels

Many would call that the lower astral, rather than saying that it is the entire astral. But yes there is an Initial layer that seems to house a lot of the nastier or confused or dodgy entities... The many people having an OBE who suddenly feel hostile or sticky forces around them are stepping straight into here. I totally agree about Vibration raising practices being important. I personally found the rising on the planes exersises quite useful, as well as having some kind of banishing process down pat... S.M. Dream yoga sounds Interesting... can you tell us anything about it?

I was not referring to the wandering dream souls but to the disembodied liars that reside on the astral levels. Two totally different things. These liars are spirits one encounters when he/she doesn't raise his/her energy body vibration past the point where one can jump through the astral level layer. Sonhoffman has, through the practice of Stillness-Movement, done this raising of energy body vibration where he can jump past that non-sense layer to true multi-dimensional awareness.

' Wandering dream souls' is a far nicer description than 'disembodied liars' IMHO

Yes. Also somebody can sell some good MLM product that pays good. The thing is that there is no overnight success. Everything is time consuming. Lots of my friends are in MLM business, they had dream that they will work MLM next to their primary job but there is no time for that. MLM sounds great but still you have to advertise, to find connections, to pull the strings, go to conferences, etc. That is why I said it's better to get some diploma in some filed that is closely related to your primary interest, you will be more satisfied. And I would highly recommend work of Stephen Kraus. Brilliant man guy who wrote exceptional books. Helped me a lot.

Good luck with your mom, Barb. Sorry to hear what's going on - that's got to be painful. I've been listening lately to Sogyal Rinpoche's audio presentation of Tibetan Wisdom for Living and Dying. Beautiful stuff. Very much related to our discussion of Dzogchen. I really like how he emphasizes the value and importance of our simple presence when dealing with the dying (and living). I recently visited acquaintances in mourning for the death of their young daughter... I was quite apprehensive and emotional about visiting. I used the advice offered by Sogyal. I simply made myself available, rested to the best of my ability in basic conscious awareness. It was quite an experience and I'm very glad I went. As far as the book goes, "Reaching the definitive conclusion that all phenomena are inexpressible emptiness." It's very important to investigate what Tibetans mean when they use the word "emptiness." Emptiness is NOT empty. Rather, they tend to mean something more along the lines of formlessness, without border or distinction, undifferentiated, boundless, spacious and open, lacking boundary, and so forth. To call it empty would violate the inexpressible condition. I personally enjoy the American approach - Great Mystery. I had an insight a few years back out about it. It occurred to me that what we perceive as "real" and "solid" is nothing more than a consequence of our unique sensory apparatus which is specifically "tuned" to evoke our dream. What actually exists is a formless, boundless, space full of infinite potential - Great Mystery. Our sensory apparatus evokes from that our particular experience. And if that sensory equipment were to change, so would that experience. A rock is hard specifically because our skin is soft. Similarly, our sensory organs create the illusion of separation of us from other. The "space" which "separates" us from others and our surroundings is most certainly not "empty" - it's full of water vapor, gases, microorganisms, and who knows what else. And yet our senses of sight and touch, in particular, lend the perception of being surrounded by empty space as they are tuned to ignore what fills that space. But this whole perception of separateness is illusory. There is no self and other. Separate "me" from my atmosphere, my food source, solid ground, ... what happens? It doesn't work. The boundaries are imaginary. So what is, is not stuff and matter but rather an interaction between boundless spaciousness full of infinite potential and the clarity of presence or awareness (not perception) and vividness. Very hard to use words, hence "inexpressible emptiness." Talk to you soon.

You aren't getting it done, you are living with your parents, asking on an internet forum how to make enough money to pursue your dreams, if it were that easy we'd all be doing it. It isn't. You might get lucky and win the lottery, you might meet someone who is rich, you might get a dream job and enjoy the work, but if you wait till your parents die to figure it out you'll be thrown to the wolves in the real world and it's going to suck. Learn to live with being dirt poor or dedicate your life to a career, pick one and stick with it. As much as I wish this was a have your cake and eat it to situation it isn't.

The Sun Of Wisdom: Teachings on the Noble Nagarjuna's Fundamental Wisdom of the Middle Way by Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso haven't cracked it yet, just checked it out of a library yesterday The Way of the Bodhisattva (bodhicharyavatara) by Shantideva transl. by Padmakara Translation Group been reading this for a while.. a beautiful poem about the activities of a person on the bodhisattva's path. Not my favorite translation of it but i was just struck by this and wanted to quote: "likewise since it is a group of fingers a hand itself is not a single entity and so it is with fingers, made of joints and joints themselves consist of many parts these parts themselves will break down into atoms and atoms will divide according to direction these fragments too will also fall to nothing thus atoms are like empty space - they have no real existance all form therefore is like a dream and who will be attached to it, who thus investigates? the body, in this way, has no existence what is male, therefore, and what is female" i am always struck by how close the observations of the buddha and meditative mystics of that order are to the declarations of modern particle and quantum physics. Clarifying the Natural State: A Principle Guidance Manual for the Practice of Mahamudra by Dakpo Tashi Namgyal transl. by Erik Pema Kunsang (I guess its out of print now because i got my copy before they were $250.. yikes! only getting around to reading it now tho) dakpo tashi namgyal wrote the definitive book on mahamudra, called "Mahamudra: The Moonlight", an epic tome about how to sit and do nothing lol. This is a manual for practice geared less towards the philosophy and view of mahamudra and more towards how to actually sit and realize the natural state.

How so? Is it the kind of denigration when that British teacher named a Teddy bear Muhamad? Or is it at the level where a Buddha head is used as a doorstop? You seem to be suggesting some kind of a desecration of a holy artifact here. I am not aware that the Tao Te Ching has been appropriated by foreign cultures to become - like the Holy Bible - an object of worship outside China. Please be kind enough to explain how I have denigrated the Tao Te Ching in your eyes. Ok, then do it. By all means read it in any form you wish. All do allow me the same freedom, if you don't mind. Talk with us? Who is us? This is an open forum, isn't it? People from all over the planet come and go in the World Wide Web. I am not aware that I have intruded a private party of Taoist initiates. And what do you mean by talk with us? Is this some gangland code of conduct? The only rules I know when I came in is 1. No foul language and 2. No fighting. You had better clue me in on any additional restrictions. . I read some Chinese but not as good as Dawei or Mr Chi who helps me out. That's good to know. I don't understand why you keep saying I talk down other cultures, etc.. You may want to practise this western liberal value of equality and that is fine. But to impose that value on those like me who don't buy it just isn't fair unless it is a pre-condition for participating in your group. Like I said, if there are rules in this regard, spit it out and be transparent. I would never dream of walking into a muslim prayer hall without taking off my shoes or act like a bull in a china shop in this forum with no regard for sensitivities.

I would never dream of discriminating anyone. Of course you can discuss it. Anybody can and in anyway they see it. That was my point. But declaring this is off topic or that is off topic, as you had done, is designed to stifle any discussion that is not going your way. I was referring to anyone who doesn't have the mind of an ass. Is that too exclusive?

Hi Aaron There you go again. Imposing your views on others. You just have no idea do you? Radical lessez faire. Just let go of everything and that will take you there. To emptiness. Well, you are wrong. You did not ever perceive emptiness, nor do you even know how to get there. Your practice, what you've described will lead you straight into the substrate consciousness where you will stagnate, fall into laxity and dullness, mistake it for emptiness and think you've accomplished something. You've accomplished nothing. The acid test is like Alan Wallace says. The experience is authentic if it liberates. No liberation? No awakening. If you took a moment to read the many buddhist books that are out there, you know the ones I'm talking about.. the ones with maps. But then, you wouldn't know that. You think maps are bad. Well radical rationalism will get you nowhere. Entropy is your elixir. It all falls apart. There is a reason why people follow teachings and maps. It is because some people have learned certain methods and ways based on their experiences, and they have the capacity and intention to convey that knowledge to others. We should be grateful that other people have written maps. Knowledge is a benefit, not a detriment as you so foolishly have been supporting in your radical posts. A silent mind state is not emptiness, it is not awakening, nor is it anything useful. As a matter of fact, it is regarded by most Buddhists as intellectually damaging. It makes you stupid. You are a prisoner of your radical belief system. Why don't you try letting go of that for a change and follow somebody else's map? You know, the Buddhists who become rainbow bodies. The ones that draw pictures of cows on the wall and then milk them, producing real milk. The ones who have realized true emptiness. I have seen other posts of yours where you declare that you have realized emptiness. I do not believe you. I'm sure others here don't either. From a few of your posts I would say that you don't even believe yourself. But, if you believe that sitting in silence is emptiness, then perhaps you have realized silence. But that is not emptiness. Had you realized emptiness, you could walk though walls, you could turn into a rainbow body at will. You could manifest forms at will. You could tell me what I look like. You would know your previous lives. After all, life is only a dream. It's all space and light, smoke and mirrors. Instead of trying to spread your brand of enlightment, your erroneous methodology, your bad advice, why don't you learn about the proper progression of events that occur during breath meditation? If you had proper breath meditation techniques, you would have learned that by calming the mind, the breathing slows, the mind calms even more and then the breath seems almost nonexistant. It lets go all by itself without any conscious effort of letting go. At that point, you switch from the 'learning sign' -nimitta to the counterpoint sign (which may look like a star, a sun, a ball of light). After you gain stability in that, the counterpoint sign engulfs you and your coarse mind dissolves into the substrate consciousness. The substrate consciousness is that which continues from life to life. The substrate consciousness is the alaya. That is the silent state that you are trying to teach everyone to remain in. But it is not so silent. It's not even not the final goal. If you stay in the alaya too long, your awareness will degrade and morph into dullness and laxity. Beyond the substrate is Primordial Awareness. The realization of that is the realization of emptiness.. The proper procedure is not to "let the conscious thought of breathing go" as you suggest. The proper procedure is to cultivate attention on the breath, and sustain it. Vitakka and Vicara. It is not a letting go. The letting go, the dissolution will occur if you follow the proper steps. And when you say "eventually you can begin your meditation without having to focus on anything, but simply entering a silent-mind state." this is not a goal, it is not a good thing. You've trained yourself to sit in dullness and laxity, probably stilted your intelligence and cut short your spiritual development. Now, I'm not going to educate you as to the proper Buddhist breathing meditaiton techinques. But I will say this. Silence is not a goal as it pertains to "no thoughts". Part of what you will discover as your progress in proper techinique is clarity, vividness of thoughts. Absence of thoughts is not a goal as there are always thoughts, or forms. But when the center of your awareness becomes very clear and you can see each thought, clear and separate, dissolve into the luminous space, you are getting closer. You know, nobody ever got entlightened by your method, just letting go. Letting go is a form of aversion. Sustained mindfulness is the key. Sustained awareness. Neither averting nor grasping. It requires relaxation and sustained attention. 24/7. That is the goal. That is what most all teachings teach. I suggest you look into it. Your "Silent Mind Meditation" is bad advice and you should seriously consider the effects of what you write on others. Or if you insist on pushing your brand of spiritualism, then maybe instead of copping out and avoiding revealing your wisdom from realizing emptiness as you continually do, you could tell the rest of us about the fruits of your brand of practice so that we may assess the validity of your claims, especially the realization of what you call "emptiness". (Actually, I'm not all that interested in hearing about it anyway because I've seen the fruits of your practice in most of your posts.). Good luck in your journey. I think you'll need it. TI For anyone else who is interested in learning proper breath meditation I would suggest reading Shaila Catherine, Ajahn Brahm, Alan Wallace, Dudjom Lingpa, anything on Dzogchen preliminary practices or any other of the serious Buddhists with maps to follow.

I completely agree that it depends on how you define happiness. I, as has already been stated, couldn't be happy causing others pain. Happiness for me...is a moving target, I'll admit, I'm still getting my shit figured out, but I'm on the right track. It involves getting what I want out of life without harming the planet and life on it any more than necessary, helping others to some extent, and feeling content with what I'm doing with myself. This involves something other than sitting in an office, only interacting with real people, nature and life in a second hand way. It involves a good social life with good friends, even if I don't see them more than once or twice a week (or maybe less...). And I don't mean fun drinking friends who will go out and be assholes with me and chase girls. I mean good people; good friends. That along with a practice in which I feel I'm getting somewhere, accomplishing something. I could probably sit here and think of more, but that's the gist of it. It does not involve the American Dream, aka three-car garage, boat, camper, wife and 2.5 kids (though those first few are not inherently bad), high powered high paying yet soulless job, expensive clothes, fancy restaurants, people I pay to do the stuff for me which I think I'm above, etc. etc. All the ego-centric bullshit that I'm assuming (dangerous, I know!) is what you had in mind with this thread.

　 Many here on TTB hold to various contrive fantasies regarding what is a Bodhisattva. I've constantly pointed to authoritative definitions, yet many who read them insist that they themselves are enlightened, and thus have no use for C&P quotes of idiot charlatans. One of these self ordained New Agers implies that real compassion is turning the other cheek for your tormentors. Others have even more fanciful delusions,...like Thich Naht Hahn proselytizing that Jesus was like Buddha. The reality is that Believers believe whatever makes their delusions more palatable. For them, it is doubtful that they will ever accept the real definition of Bodhisattva, or compassion beyond their relative, sentient perceptions. For those seriously interested in what a Bodhisattva is, is not so succinct, and quite arduous to explain, because humanity as a whole are not prepared to receive such an appreciation of reality. What reality? The reality that a Bodhisattva sees,...which according to the Eight foremost Bodhsattvas, arises through the perception of profound Emptiness. Thus, teachers such as Robert Thurman, an esteemed student of HH Dalai Lama, stated, "Buddhist teachings on compassion are grounded in the direct realization of Emptiness; without which, compassion is impossible." And what does HH Dalai Lama say about compassion? "If I have any understanding of compassion..., it all comes from studying the Bodhicharyavatara" HH Dalai Lama What does the Bodhicharyavatara (Way of the Bodhisattva) say? "The whole of the Bodhicharyvatara is geared toward prajna, the direct realization of emptiness, absolute bodhichitta, without which the true practice of compassion is impossible." Of course, to many TTBers, too many to name here, but you will come upon their "spoiler" posts, those above authorities are wrong. Lao-zu said, "If you want to awaken all of humanity, then awaken all of your self." But these "spoilers" have no desire to awaken,...they insist that others follow their beliefs. Those seriously interested in the term Bodhisattva agree that bodhi is a feminine noun expressing a non-cerebral mindful understanding of the nature of things, and sattva, indicating the beingness through which that is experience, and is motivated by pure compassion. Through this pure compassion, a Bodhisattva makes a committment to suspend full enlightenment until all sentient beings have been liberated from the suffering brought about by their attachment to sentience, which the Eight foremost Bodhisattvas defines as the 6 senses. People generally believe they understand what that above paragraph means; yet they do not. First, bodhi is a feminine noun, not a masculine one. It is Yin, not Yang; expansive, not contractive. Few people on this planet have a clue to Who's Who in Duality, let alone its significance. Without understanding Who's Who in duality, the realization of Emptiness is impossible,...and without the realization of Emptiness, real compassion is impossible. A Bodhisattva sees the world through compassion, however the compassion of a Bodhisattva is much different than most can comprehend. Again,..."Buddhist teachings on compassion are grounded in the direct realization of Emptiness; without which, compassion is impossible." The compassion of a Bodhisattva is not some sentient feeling of sympathy, pity, despair, or Abrahamic religious definition. A Bodhisattva has an understanding Dependent Origination,...that is, not only why and how Form is Empty and Empty is Form,...but that feelings, etc., are also empty. It explicitly says so in the Prajnaparamita,...and the prajnaparamita is the process all Bodhisattvas used to realize emptiness, so they could uncover real compassion, without which, they are not Bodhisattvas. We can define a Bodhisattva as a being who, upon realizing Dependent Origination (which can only be understood through emptiness), forgoes enlightenment for the sake of those who consider themselves separate from Others. Seeing the illusion as illusion, Bodhisattva's committ themselves to the liberation of humanity's sentience; which is something that human beings hold dear. In response, most Sentient Beings will attempt to harm, injure, and even kill, such liberators. A true Bodhisattvas would not be perceived as wonderful people leading very moral and exemplary lives. A Bodhisattva is an assassin, who challenges or shines light upon every aspect of beliefs and faith-based delusions. A Bodhisattva can be recognized as one who is intolerant of all conditions that step between sentient beings and their direct experience. A Bodhisattva understands that an experience born of belief can only be experienced through the condition of that belief. Anyone claiming to be a Bodhisattva, without a full understanding Emptiness,...that is to say, the understanding how things really are (beyond the perception of sentience), is not a Bodhisattva. The Heart Sutra, which is the heart essence of the Prajnaparamita, is quite implicit about that. The Heart Sutra is how a Bodhisattva sees. One is not a Bodhisattva until one sees as a Bodhisattva. One does not see as a Bodhisattva, until emptiness (Perception of the Profound) is realized. Although many have recited the Bodhisattva vow,...of the thousands of posts I've read on this forum, there is only one Bodhisattva that posts on TTB. The Bodhisattva Path is one of cultivating bodhicitta,...whereas a Bodhisattva is one who participates with bodhicitta. Bodhicitta is the awareness that everything a sentient being perceives is a dream. Chögyam Trungpa, who said that real compassion is not having any hesitation to reflect your light on things,... it does not discriminate whether to reflect on a pile of shit or on a pile of rock or on a pile of diamonds,...also said, "May all beings be free from suffering and the root of suffering, May the dark ignorance of sentient beings be dispelled, May all beings enjoy profound brilliant glory."

haha I guess so Well I guess to some degree it does depend on ones own taste/emotional reaction to certain music but I will tell you what I have/am also planning to put on my mp3 player. Lion King- Circle of life, he lives in you, Can you feel the love tonight Pocahontas- Colours of the wind Tarzan- Youll be in my heart Xavier Rudd- Come let go, Let me be, Didgeridoo Jamming (plan to put others on) Ash Dargan- Shiva Aphex twin- didgeridoo, pulsewidth, heliospan Shpongle- DMT (plan to put others on) Midnite- Foolish and the Wise, Bushman (plan to put others on) Lee scratch perry- I am a madman, Rain night dub (maybe put others on) Tibetan/Buddhist Mantra Chanting (maybe put others on) Sufi music- Tree of patience, Dream of the dreams (maybe put others on) Native American- Sundance (maybe put others on) Dennis Brown and Gregory Isaacs- Raggamuffin Tenor Saw- Ring the Alarm Barrington Levi (under mi sensei) Plan to put some more reggae on Djembe music- Le tambours de burundi black, zimbabwe/botswana music,senegal day, djembe Feng Shui Music, Bamboo chinese flute. Plan to put mozart etc, maybe some santana-transcendence, europa, moonflower. My own rule is how it makes me feel even so called music that should be good eg native american music sometimes makes me feel sad, I dont know the logical reason, maybe past life or something lol or maybe they are crying about something, also I try to put music that is based on joy, love, peace, appreciation, playfulness, harmony, not really into stuff about changing the world TOO MUCH... Live music is best, second best speakers, then good headphones, then cheap headphones, also if you live somewhere hot good to do barefoot..maybe natural clothes.

I definitely think you're heading in the right direction with that interpretation. I think that there is a point at which some people have a moment of complete lucidity. I also think that it can manifest differently, based on that person's conditioning. The truth itself is always that same but the way we then interpret that, narrate it to ourselves, and others, and so on, colors it. I also think there are varying degrees of depth and breadth of insight, application, and the degree to which we honor it in our daily lives. And different traditions refer to it in different ways but the truth is beyond any specific expression of it. But at some point there does appear to be a before and after... before I was dreaming, now I am awake. And so there does seem to be an instantaneous shift. There certainly was for me, and it certainly has lingered, informed, and affected my life profoundly. An interesting question is - to what degree is that influenced by what we do? Whether that is meditation or any other activity or conceptualization. Then we can get into the discussion of whether meditation is an activity, what is the motivation associated with it, and all of that. As Krishnamurti says - truth is a pathless land... And as Fenner says - if I didn't do what I didn't need to do, I wouldn't know that I didn't need to do it in the first place. And yes, I agree with you about looking at this as a short path. I don't consider myself an authority in the Buddhist traditions, so everything I say, to some degree, should be suspect. I think most people using the terms "short path" are referring to a 'method' by which we get somewhere or do something or change something in time. But that can never work because what is there to change and who is there to change it? But certainly there is change in our relative experience and it is spontaneous. Nang jang (refinement of perception) is the other name given to the book and it is often referred to as a tool used to cut through (trek-cho). I think that this cutting through refers to making that incremental but profound shift of awareness, cutting through the dream, the mitote, and aiming at the space between thoughts - between what was and what will be; but nang jang equally destroys the concept of having to do anything or become something, or change anything to achieve that. It always already is. Great idea for a project, Barb.

Here's a post from the RJ's final flame out thread: POOR ME BE GONNA RETTIRE IN A WINE BARREL LIKE DIOGENES DA PHILLOSIPHER EXCEPT MINE BARREL WILL STIL BE FULL WHEN I MOVE IN. I JUST WANTED TO ADD 5 THANGS, VIZ., 1) DO DA BIG DRAW. YA NEED TO PHYSICALLY DE-CUM-GEST DA HUEVOS N PROSTITE N DA BIG DRAW DO THAT BY ACTUALY SQUEEZIN OUT DA FLUIDS BESSIDES MOVIN DA CHING. 2) ARROUND 3 MONTHS TO 100 DAYS FROM START O RETTENTION, YALL HIT A WALL, BE PREPPARED FOR THAT. 3) EVVENTUALY, IF A KEEP SHAGIN N RETTAININ, YALL HAVE A WET DREAM N LOSE IT UNLESS YA LEARN DREAM YOGA. WHAT HAPEN BE, SUCCUBUS ENTITTIES LURE YER CHING N SUK IT UP UNLESS YA BE LUCID IN YER DREAMS. 4) KEEP OPENIN DA CHANNELS, NOT JUST DA MC BUT ALSO DA SUSHUMNA , DA MACROCOSMIC, DA BELT CHANEL N YA CAN JUST GET AN ACCUPUNTURE BOOK N OPEN AS MANY AS YA LIKE. THEN REMMEMBER TO STORE DA CHING IN YER BONE MAROW AS WELL. UNLESS YA DO ALL THIS EVVENTUALY YA OVERFLOW OR CUM-GEST YER HUEVOS N PROSTITE. 5) KEEP IN MIND THATIF YA KEEP AT IT, ONE WOMMAN WONT BE ENUFF NO MORE FOR SEXUAL SATTISFACTION, SO YA EITHER END UP SEXUALLY UNSATTISFIED OR YALL HAVE TO BANG MORE THAN ONE PEACH, OR YALL HAVE TO GIVE UP SEXUAL CHI KUNG. DA TRHANG BE, YA CAN VIRTUALY SHAG FOR DAYS AT A TIME, BUT A SINGLE WOMMAN WILL PAS OUT BEFORE THAT OR JUST GET DRAINNED N BORIN. THAT BE DA SECRET FOR DA REASON O DA ANCIENT INSTITTUTION O DA HAREM, THOSE KINGS O OD NEEDDED A BUNCHA PEACHES TO GET SUM KINDA SATTISFACTION N THEY COULD FUCK FOR DAYS AT A TIME. OF COURSE BECCAUSE THEY WERE PAST MASTER O RETTENTION. BYE NOW QUOTE(Yoda @ Aug 12 2005, 07:08 AM) Here's Ron's instructions: 1. For a kinder, gentler America, alternate between using your weiner and your tongue--stay away from max stimulation. 2. use the three finger/million dollar technique as an emergency backup. You find the indentation between the balls and the poopy place, but closer to the poopy place. Just experiment with it. 3. practice circulating the energy or you'll blow up "in a geyser of cum." Ron's refering to microcosmic orbit. Yoda's commentary: Ron and many others say that the million dollar point shouldn't be used as a regular practice, just as a backup. Others say that it is fine to use as often as you like with no long term problems. Once you figure out the exact location and the exact kind of pressure I feel that it is safe, but some have had bad experiences with it.

I guess someone needs to write on this subject. Perhaps I will. Folks need to learn how to clean up after themselves., I must confess... It is very hard, especially at this time of the year, for me right now. In the middle of reprogramming my mind which has been programmed by years of what I called "realist" thinking. Realist, HAH! The assumption that something will be some way simply because it has been before is perhaps the biggest assumption we humans collectively make! No realism is simply "justified" pessimism, and the so-called justifications used for it are based on past events, which no longer exist. Something Wayne Dyer said I keep coming back to... Your body, right now, is not the body you had when you were a child. Not one cell of that original body remains. So even our bodies are not real. The past is gone, and everything that happened then has no bearing on what happens now unless we create that reality. Anyway to stop beating around the bush... I was tempted today to play that video I made. Listen to the music I listened to then. Essentially risk re-connecting with my tulpa. It is almost unbearably hard to resist. I'm clinging to the reality I have created for myself, my ultimate reality, my dream, where I have a wife, children, house and a way to support us all. I try to hold on to that picture in my mind. I try to feel what it is like in this reality I have created. But it is incredibly difficult. After too brief moments visiting this reality I come back here, where it has not manifested yet. I am alone again. I have to admit I am tired of being alone. Even though I am not alone (reprogramming.) I have a family, they just haven't manifested yet. ARG! - DreamBliss

As I don't know how to initiate this, would you be kind enough to launch a new thread entitled "The Way (道 i.e.Tao) of Living"? To start off the discussion, you can cut and paste on the new thread site the following: Let's discuss our way of life, according to our values and our attitudes, to find out how far off the mark we are in relation to the eternal Way (道 i.e.Tao). John Lennon's Way (道) of Living, as told in his song "Imagine" would be as follows: No Heaven, no Hell, and above us only sky. (Meaning no religion, shamanism, spiritualism.) All the people (百姓) living together for today. (No dwelling on the past, no planning for the future.) No countries. (No nationalism, no territorial divisions.) Nothing to live or die for. (No conflicts, no dreams and no wants.) No possessions. (Public or private.) Lennon said that his Way (道 i.e.Tao) will lead to: No need for greed and hunger. All the people, sharing all the world, living life in peace. Is John Lennon's dream practicable and consistent with the teaching of the Tao Te Ching?