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Hopefully I'm completely wrong about Kunlun being 100% problematic but I feel very comfortable claiming that Kunlun is either "partially" or "highly" problematic. At the very least, the average practitioner should have ongoing contact with a qualified teacher. ~~~ Here are some misc notes: I had a few bedroom encounters where I've strongly sensed the presence, felt the touch of, or seen entities. At the time they happened, I can't tell you whether I was awake, dreaming, or somewhere in between. One time, they put their hands around my neck and squeezed rather hard. The event had an erotic goth tone to it and I had mixed reactions about the encounter. Same for the dreams that I had... definite sense of fascination but vaguely uncomfortable undertones. I had this one dream where Max kissed me on the lips... a bit erotic but non-sexual. Reminded me of the Hindu notion of the demon kiss (inauspicious btw ). I had another creepy undertone dream where Max was standing on the moon. As far as channeling goes, I could ask yes and no questions and my head would nod or shake and I bet I could have run an Ouija board successfully during this time but I wasn't ready for automatic writing or having them "speak" through me directly. I asked if they loved me and they said "yes." That sort of thing. My practice of Kunlun was sometimes just shaking or doing simple taichi like motions but it mostly was of praying and bowing to the four directions and simultaneously grinning and frowning hugely and also doing a frantic lower MCO orbit lead by my hands with the orbit going up the front and down the back with this crazy facial expression and a sense of urgency. And lots of sword finger mudras. The facial expression and the finger mudras were coming up more and more in my regular life. Sometimes very animalistic motions and sounds esp cat-like and snake-like. So the vibe was a bit creepy but there was still a strong sensation of love and mysticism in the air... so it was sort of a toss up as to whether to go on. My more advanced Kunlun pals said that things got weirder in the future and that was my sense for myself as well if I had stuck with it. Getting out is a whole different story... is that even possible? Will RP keep on trucking forever? Will it just lay dormant ready to pop up during inopportune moments? Did I mention that my 8 year old daughter once woke up in the middle of the night doing some serious kunlun? That's a whole different aspect to all of this! Jmo, Yoda

No, depersonalization disorder and enlightenment aren't the same. I've experienced depersonalization MANY times in my life - lack of sleep can induce it, and when I was a kid and even recently (i'm almost 22) I still get it. I always used to call it dream vision, since I felt like I was in a dream, and it would occur for no reason. In my opinion, dpersonalization disorder is a feeling of detachment, non-connection, confusion. Enlightenment is supreme understanding, no concept of self or separateness, and profound understanding.

A few thoughts if nobody minds... "Forced" vs. "spontaneous" is a false distinction for all practical purposes. Our "spontaneous" is abnormal due to the fact we weren't conceived, carried in the womb, born, raised in any natural spontaneous manner in any natural spontaneous environments. (Taoism has a vast chapter dealing with the proper way to prepare and handle a human being to be whole before he or she is conceived even, and certainly during the mother's pregnancy and labor, and in the early developmental, "imprinting" times -- and it is a far cry from what is done in modern times. A child conceived, carried and born in a mindful natural manner is conscious from the start and remains so. This kind of spontaneity we don't even dream of because we don't know what we're missing. Similar practices existed in all indigenous tribes, only 'civilized' people abandoned them and turned a young developing human being into an unconscious "object of handling," whose spontaneity, as a result, is limited to a fraction of a percent of what it really is for a member of our species -- from the start, and typically till the end.) As a result, what we mistake for "spontaneity" as adults is really a bunch of unconscious knee-jerk responses to all the abnormalities of our developmental history, responses as forced as can be -- but forced below the level of conscious awareness. E.g., the "spontaneous" inability of an adult to voluntarily move his or her intercostal (between the ribs) muscles and the bones of the skull is thought of as "normal" -- medical texts state so! -- but it ain't! So if a practice restores this one normal ability, out of many-many-many we're missing, via methods that "don't feel natural and spontaneous" in our current book, in our current (drastically curtailed) comfort zone -- is it a "forced practice?" or, rather, a "force to use so as to overcome the force that counteracts spontaneity?.." Duh... If we modern urbanites go with only what "feels natural and spontaneous" to us (sic!), we will degenerate into mere appendages of our machines in no time. What DOES "natural" feel like to a baby hooked up to machines and interacting with machines before, during, after birth and for most of the rest of her life?.. What DOES "spontaneous" feel like to a child immobilized for most of her waking life in a crib, in a classroom, in an office?.. What DOES "un-forced" mean to someone who has never forced herself to do the impossible to save a loved one from this mechanical predicament?.. What does "forced" mean to someone whose definition of "spontaneous" is "my current comfort zone?" One's current comfort zone is usually so far removed from what "spontaneous" really is that investing into maintaining that is an investment into being a simple machine appendage -- no extra buttons please, I'm happy as it is, spontaneous as can be! Is that all you can be spontaneously, modern urbanite?.. Sheesh!.. And... I don't mean harmful forced practices aren't out there and aren't out to get you -- what I mean is, few modern people are equipped to tell the difference between a harmful forced and a beneficial spontaneous... So I guess this is a call to humility... You don't know because you aren't equipped to know. So just don't assume you do out of your current comfort zone -- don't assume you do, I mean the generic "you," not anyone personally...

I didn't like it, thought it was too new agey. If you're playing it straight, play it straight. If you want to go dream world w/ fake special effects then do that, but don't confuse the two. Michael

I actually just prefer to be a hermit, but I need food and shelter for a few years! haha. We'll see. I don't know about the city. Too me is just more distraction. I live in anaheim, ca. I go to beach often, and see beautiful looking girls walking around. This can't be helpful in the cultivation. When you dream about wanting to have sex with them, thats not the right path. You will leak everywhere. I just lived in cambodia for 2 months last summer. I actually just prefer a place to cultivate here in the states if they have one. The problem is here, you'll most likely have to pay room and board. I don't want that burden. Is there any taoist temples in the USA that one can go to become a monk?

Yeah sure, ill give it a shot. I learned pakua when I was a teenager and then went 'off the path'. I came back to focus on Chikung around 2002 and did it religiously with the concept of ascension in mind till 2005. Around 2004 I learned the Daoist Dream meditations and such. I am not going to go into my credentials and certifications because I dont want to be seen as a teacher here. Im not going into the pakua or magic stuff prior to 2002. Leave it at that. 2002 Left to my own devices I began to reconstruct what I remember of chikung and begin practicing on my own this time. I got the same skin crawling sensations as the first times. Et cetera. 2004 It wasnt until this year that on my own my consciousness began to shift into the emotional state and a lot of emotions began to resurface. I began to see a white mist around myself and others for starters. 2005 I met my girlfriend and from her, I naturally began to piece together the stuff I misunderstood from friends and my previous teacher, about feeling. She helped me to learn to communicate with and sense spirits, sense objects. Raise my vibrations. 2006 Went to see a sorcerer in Brazil 2007 Learned a healing technique in a Dream session from a fire spirt on a devic world. That is not even including recent stuff. To me what is talked about, alchemy, enlightenment is just learning to feel yourself or things outside your body. The smoother your energy through emotions and actions the easier it is. Everything seems to be about a constant shift in greater awareness. Recently Im addicted to learning "Go" I believe this game symbolically teaches us to strike a balance between life(centralized protection) and death(attack and spreading influence). So rather than view it as something that can be confirmed, yes it can be. It does exist if thats what you mean. There is so many methods and ways even outside of daoism to do things. I think it is just hard for some to believe it enough to try. If I was to speak in terms of how I accomplish things in this field now. I was a thinker before, proving things by facts and such and using critical thinking. Now I feel. It is all about emotions and sensation. Turning off everything else but that for the most part is what it is all about. Critical thinking and worrying about not having enough information isnt going to help. Visiting people who have higher energy vibrations has been known to jumpstart progress. Also attempt visiting a vortex suggested by someone with credentials this has also know to spike ones awareness. There are other ways too. Just make sure they are truely certified.

Hello All I have had time today and read the whole thread on the golden flower. Wery interesting indeed. I also read walter Piccas tranlation from 1964 and schimed through the wang Lipings students version of it. Wery interesting reading on the thread and in the translations. My own sparse relations to the book in my life! For about 20 years ago I come across Riccard Wilhems translation of it during intensive studies of Jungian litterature of all kind. I didn't grasp much of it during that time. It took me awhile after starting with the universal tao system before I realised that the text and my new interest was about the same subject, taoist yoga. During my early practise in the universal tao system I had a vision telling me that I would come into contact with the ligth. That ligth would tell me the meaning of my life. It was a certanity that I would come into contact with it if I continued my practise dilligently. That vision have been the the inner most meaning of my practise. It means that my life have a meaning and that I am able to see what it is, amasing! The vision had more content to it and When I reread the introduction by Jung to Richard Wilhems version of the TSOTGF I was amased of hes descripion of the ligth. It was exactly the same that I had my vision about. During my practise in the white tigress system I was meditating daily on the original cavity or the ancestrall hall that it also is called. A point betwean the eyes a bit above and a bit behind the eyes. During that practise I saw flaschings of ligths in the ancestors hall. I did also dream about my ancestors and how they lived what problems they had and how they where related to the society as a whole. The experience with the ancestors hall was one of a few things that did motivate me to go and take courses with Hsi Lai. My feeling is that this practise the secret of the golden flower will be a part of my future investigations into the taoist yoga system. Without jet reading the books, I will just thank JJ Semple for hes sharing and concreatisising, from own experience, the methods in the text. I think such work is realy beneficial to us all that are intereted in this kind of spiritual path. Thanks. F D

Sorry for the belated reply. Covering martial arts and literature from a taoist standpoint, I worked on two levels. First, from what I'd call an operational point of view. I gave the students a quick overview of the basics of tai-chi (which I used to practice), qi gong (which one of my students practices) and kung fu (which we all experienced only through the movies). I tried to emphasize how, underneath the "character" of each martial art, there lies a set of basic principles which are basically the Taoist concepts of wu wei and qi. We discussed the point and got deeper into the wu wei question - action without action, but also training so that trained action becomes a second nature. The idea - there is a set of rules which you have to adapt to yourself, and then explore and practice to the point that you no longer *think* about using them. You do, and that's it. But the same is true for writing, which in the form of composition is regarded as a Taoist practice, and which requires a deep knowledge of the rules (metrics, themes, grammar) in order to apply them without thinking, or breaking them the right way. I gave a few examples of writing as meditation - referencing Nathalie Golberg's "Writing Down the Bones" , and quoting a few Chinese poets. At this point, we took a break (basically, more discussion) and then shifted to literature. This is what I'd call a thematic point of view. We went rapidly over the classics of Chinese literature, pointing out how Taoist elements enter such books as the Romance of Three Kingdoms or the Dream of the Red Chamber. Then we shifted to contemporary entertainment literature, and we gave a look at wuxia novels (one of my students is interested in cinema, and she asked for some input on wuxia), noticing how some elements are stolen and adapted from Taoist practice (the concept of wulin, the master-pupil transmission of knowledge, the often rampant use of magic, etc), with liberal addition of Confucian and Neoconfucian elements. And of course these are martial arts novels, focusing on the themes of skill and mastery. So, Taoism as a source of inspiration for fictioneers. As a final point, I asked the participants to sum up the evening, and (as I hoped) they gave me basically a picture of a physical taoist practice (martial arts) and an intellectual taoist practice (literature). Which was cool, because it allowed me to point out that martial arts have a strong, inescapable intellectual component (it's all in themind, as they say) and that writing is a physical practice - witness the fact that all my students were taking notes using their favorite pen, on a notebook of their choice, sitting in what they felt was the best possible position, and so on... Because you can't cheat the Tao, and hope it works only on one level. End of lesson, off to supper. I admit it was all pretty basic, but I hope to be able and collect more material and examples for my future courses.

To everyone with actual advice, Thank You. To everyone with criticism for my views on humanity, your thoughts have been noted. To goldisheavy, I don't think brutal honestly would seriously allow me to accomplish my goals and only stand hinder them. Losing a job isn't going to help matters. I need a place to shower and wash my cloths and cook my food, in order to maintain a job. Also being brutally honest about my world and religious views e.g. the world we live in is an illusion, or the idea of self is an illusion all identities and therefor people are illusory etc would most likely wind me up in a mental institution for some sort of dissociative disorder even those are valid Buddhist concepts. Even though institutionalization might have some perks, having my neurons fried out with neurotoxic chemicals and violent electroshock therapy would most likely end any chances of liberation this life-cycle. This whole existence is a giant game, those that don't play by the rules set forth by this society are violently punished, and swept under the rug to keep them out of the site of other people. People caught in this illusion have a vested interest in maintaining it. So I have a role to play here if I want to maintain some degree of freedom. I have to pretend to be a normal person, I have to look and act respectable to maintain employment, I have to chum it up with my roomates and help them with their daily drama. I don't really see an alternative, unless I were to inherit some large sum of money or win the lottery. Sure being myself, and being honest might feel good and be liberating in a psychological sense, it would (or so I believe) have the opposite effect in a spiritual and real world sense. wudang, Maybe you could watch the original planet of the apes and that movie idiocracy each about ten times, then go to sleep. Maybe you would dream a dream of being trapped in a society of ignorant shit flinging apes, and being dependent upon their society for survival. Every day pretending to be one of them, but in your heart knowing your not. I don't really know if china could offer me anything I don't already have. There society seems worse in terms of personal freedom than ours. I am sure they might have some great masters there, but I have no idea how to find and test them, if I did find one I deemed advanced enough, he would have no obligation to teach me. My biggest complaint about car living, was when I experienced a breakdown for more than a day I was homeless. The cost of car repair and maintenance, and rental fees still is very expensive. Also having to keep a gym membership to shower, and eating mostly canned foods, run ins with police asking why I am parked in some rural isolated dirt road, police harassment in general, all take their toll on a person. I decided in the end it was less of a hassle to live with other people and have a place to shower, wash clothes, refrigerate and cook food, than it was to live in my car.

This is just my take on it. It's not authoritative because while I like Taoist writings and sages, I do not claim to be a Taoist myself. Taoists believe in immortality. Even the so-called philosophical ones believe it, except the difference is in what is immortal. One of the primary Taoist sages, Chuang Tzu, acknowledges impermanence. Impermanence is embraced fully by Chuang Tzu. But there is a sense of something immortal in Chuang Tzu as well. Maybe call it something timeless or beyond-mortal. Something transcendent. The religious and alchemical Taoists believe that you can give birth to an immortal body right from your physical body, and then you can emerge in that new body. This new body grows in your physical body regardless of your gender, and the process of how to grow it is secret and there are many disagreeing bits of information about it. Some say it's a purely spiritual process. Others say you have to ingest mercury and other chemicals. And so on. There are also rumors that Taoists who have attained immortality disappear from their coffins. Like there is a story of one master's coffin being opened after burial, only to find his robe and staff and shoes but no body, or something like that. So there is all kinds of discordant information about immortality within Taoism. Taoism is kind of famous for its diversity of viewpoints. It's not as neatly organized as some other religions/philosophies. Yes. In philosophical Taoism it's not as important, but the answer I think is still yes, even in the philosophical Taoism. Hell and Heaven are living conditions that are created by your own mind and they manifest like actual places, like this Earth, but even so, just like this Earth, it's nothing but mind. Never heard the term "circular". I think people talk of linear and non-linear time though. Linear time is when events progress along a well ordered time line, and this time line is considered to be set in stone, so to speak. It doesn't change. It cannot be reinterpreted. It cannot be exited or entered. It just exists as is and time marches forward along such line. A concept of non-linear time was "invented" to address the short-comings of the time as we know it. In non-linear time, the time flow is not absolute. In other words, there is an experience of time, but is time going quickly or slowly? It's hard to say. Is even B definitely and always after event A? That's flexible. Using non-linear time, you can go back and forward in time. An experience of timelessness is meaningful within non-linear time, but if you think in terms of linear time, a concept such as "timelessness" doesn't refer to anything and makes no sense at all. So "non-linear time" is a way to enrich our language to talk about more diverse and stranger experiences than normal conception of time would allow. For example there is a story of one guy wanting to become a Taoist immortal, but he wasn't sure. He thought maybe earthly life was good. Maybe not. As luck or fate would have it, he met a Taoist immortal. This immortal gave the guy a pillow and told him to sleep on it. So the guy falls asleep and in his dream he is born, raised and lives an entire earthly life, with all kind of troubles in it. So he lives something like 60 years or more worth of time in his dream which lasts only say 8 hours of time. So non-linear time is a concept you can use to refer to an experience like that. As the guy wakes up, his mind is made up. He decides that he's had more than enough of earthly life and it's time for him to become an immortal. To enjoy life! The entire purpose of Taoism is to maximize enjoyment. Things like spiritual practice, kindness, contemplation, they improve the quality of life. And that's what it's all about. When people try to enjoy life in a naive manner, they often face obstacles and disappointment. So enjoyment of life actually requires wisdom, because if a person tries to enjoy life in a foolish manner, then a period of enjoyment is quickly followed by intense suffering. Philosophical Taoists don't worship. They contemplate and meditate. Alchemical Taoists may not worship either. They practice alchemy and meditation, but they usually are weak in contemplation. Religious Taoists worship Taoist gods by lighting incense, and making offerings. The way I understand, Taoist gods are kind of distant and don't really care about humans. Taoist gods used to be humans at one point. As they evolved spiritually, they helped other humans to evolve also. But once they reached a high level of evolution, they enter into realms of being that are imperceptible by ordinary humans and thus they don't really care about the old human realm, cause they have a new life to live in a new world, so they have their hands full. So in this sense, Taoist gods are more like examples of what is possible and not necessarily something to worship, but still religious Taoists light incense and make offerings. It's a way of life, so it's a philosophy first and foremost. But people can't help themselves and often form religions around certain cool concepts. I don't think Lao Tzu or Chuang Tzu were religious at all. But after they died, religious Taoism appeared and people started to worship those guys, along with other deities. The 3 primary ones, as I understand it, are: Tao Te Ching, Chuang Tzu, and Lieh Tzu. There are many many Taoist texts, but unfortunately most of the are untranslated. I've seen some Taoist texts of surprisingly low quality when compared to the three primary ones though. So I don't think it's surprising that people don't hurry to translate all of them, because not all of them are of even quality. But there are also many untranslated gems.

Years ago I read a description about what I considered the true Zen bum. He lived in California, in a small shack. It was unheated and without electricity, but immaculately clean and filled with precious but simple things. He meditated, hung out w/ friends, worked part time jobs when he needed money. Most of all he kept his life very simple and lived it on his own terms. I vacationed once on the island of St. Lucia. The weather is beautiful, all the beaches public, the people are friendly. Walking along the beach I saw a small ramshackle hut, tin roof, misc. boards for walls. But it was beautifully decorated and painted. There were lines of conk shells defining its drive way . Again I thought this person knows the secret. So, I think your dream is possible. But, in my mind those 'bums' were competent in our world and made the conscious decision to drop out of it. I think if you can't get along in 'this' world, and think of bumming as an escape, you may find your problems follow you. maybe. Michael

Hi all! Let's see... where do I start?? I'm a quirky, off-the-wall 19-year-old from Scotland... and pretty disillusioned with most things in Western culture... I was brought up as a Christian and ended up in a Baptist church for 6 years... let's just say that there is NO WAY ON EARTH that that pastor was a Christian, all he taught was hatred and intolerance, it was totally imbalanced and wrong... so I have kinda lost faith in religious leaders, which also led me to question what I'd been brought up to believe. I've looked into various different faith systems without much success - this includes Ras Tafari, Catholicism, Wicca... everything you can think of. But everything, I have noticed, lacks harmony, and lacks control over one's own path. I had heard a little about Taoism and liked the concept of Yin and Yang... I felt I could relate to it somehow, as if it was something I was remembering from a dream... but somehow more real. If that makes any sense whatsoever. I've long had an interest in Eastern culture and religion because it's so different to what I have known. I'm hoping to find some answer/direction in joining this forum... I'm afraid I'm going to be asking a lot of stupid questions, but "He who dares ask is a fool for five minutes; he who does not ask is a fool forever". Oh and a bit about my personal background, as well as spiritual: Parents divorced when I was 8, got bullied in school until I was 16, have had a couple of bad breakups, one of which I am still trying to get over. Had severe jealousy issues between myself and my siblings (step-siblings included). Basic result is... no harmony whatsoever, and this is really what I am searching for... wish me luck. Hoping to make some new friends on this forum too, so say hi and tell me a bit about yourselves... Sorry if this was long... Pixie

Regarding clear signs I can only tell what my yoga teacher said and that confirms the above. If you have a kundalini awakening practice and if it's your calling to have the kundalini then very clearly one day you will feel the energy going first through the ida and pingali nadis and then the rising of the kundalini through sushumna. And apparently that it is very clearly the same for everybody - of course after many years of hourly breathing exercises and pranayama. Then he also talked about self realization- one's you're self realized you're free and you will know this very clearly. There will be know doubt about that. Regarding the dream of cutting peoples' heads that reminds me of Kali. You know the goddess with all these freshly cut heads that look very blissful on a string. They are very happy because Kali has killed their ego, so that they are free.

Stig, that would be great, wouldn't it? I envision my teacher as a fountain of wisdom. As a friendly, and warm person. Maybe a young person. In a vision I once had my teacher was like a 20 year old guy and he was a Buddha. Which is to say, I am not agist. I don't demand that my teacher be 105 years old in order to be authentic. My teacher doesn't mind talking. My teacher invites me for tea after class, and after practicing and being Taijuquan for 1 - 2 hours, we are being Taijiquan at a tea house. I bring a gift for my teacher's birthday. When my teacher needs to move some stuff, I come over and help load the truck. We joke around and laugh. One day my teacher tells me he's had enough. He builds a funeral pyre and asks me to light it. He hops on top. And I light it without hesitation, regardless of the laws or implications. Nice dream ah? Why would you settle for less? If I never meet some teacher like that, I have vowed that I myself will become this teacher. I will not rest until it is done.

Confirmations are tricky things. They range between being meaningless to being meaningful only to a particular practitioner. Just to throw one random example at you, one time some Buddhist practitioner had a dream of cutting many many people's heads off. Wow! What a terrible dream. Surely a sign of bad karma, right? The teary-eyed practitioner goes to see his master and master tells him it's an excellent sign. It means he will enlighten many many people. See? Does this mean master is right and student is wrong? Not at all. It means experience is empty of its own essence. It's malleable. It changes based on interpretation and many other factors. It's possible to get some inner certainty from some experience, and in that sense it can be like a confirmation. But what it is and how it works is a mystery. Certainly it's not something that is universal and can be described in objective terms. To give you an even more extreme example, take day to day experience. To an enlightened person, normal day to day experience is a confirmation of enlightenment. The exact same experience is a confirmation of being stuck in the cyclical mundane world to the non-enlightened. How can the same experience confirm two different things? It's because it is empty (which is to say, it lacks own-essence, which is to say, it has no inherent meaning -- it has any number of meanings, but none of those meanings is inherently THE meaning).

Thank you... reciprocated! Well, the only thing I could do is say what it is that I, personally, am doing -- I don't have a universal recipe. Here's how I go about it: 1. Try to stay informed, and take the time and patience to contemplate and analyze the information -- don't buy everything, don't reject everything, just let it accumulate into a hypersaturated solution and crystallize into some clear understanding eventually. Things you hear, things you notice, indirect evidence, direct experience, the 'feel' of things... how does it feel to be lined up and shot... no wait, not shot, I mean, searched... at the airport, e.g.? how does it feel to be handled impersonally, like an object, by an impersonal, objectified machine -- by people who are paid to not behave as people, by systems that don't behave any other way than automatically -- how does if feel to be reduced to an object of handling which the machine is set up to crush the second this object tries to exhibit human feelings, human behavior?.. 2. Invest in metaphysical solutions, but don't place all your eggs in this particular basket. Learn to be strong inside, try to be strong externally to the extent possible. Work on that because the machine crushes weakness first, doesn't mean it can't crush strength if it's a big enough mean enough machine... but still... Don't set yourself up to go quietly into the night. This is spiritual death with or without physical one, far as I'm concerned. 3. Play it by ear, be alert, try to visualize what it is that you, personally, would be able to do for yourself and your loved ones in the worst case scenario. E.g., I had a dream. I call it The Dream of the Red Suitcase. In that dream, the worst case scenario started unfolding and I wasn't ready, which was symbolized by a Red Suitcase that I should have packed long ago for just such a possibility, and when I rushed to grab it, with the last-escape route about to close within minutes, turned out my Red Suitcase was lying there in the middle of my bedroom, open, only half packed, with stuff that was supposed to go in it strewn about, with no chance I could possibly have enough time to pack it now. So... if you get a lesson like that from whatever source -- say your higher self -- pay attention and do something about it... What exactly, I don't know. I don't even know yet what it is exactly that goes into my own Red Suitcase... Try to figure out what it is that must go into yours, and take it from there?..

If that's true, I don't see how informing me or others on this forum helps anyone. Great, so we do have some common ground then. I don't like how you describe life as "biological". You can see bodies moving around. If you look under a microscope, you can see other smaller bodies moving around. But calling all that "biological" brings some unnecessary physicalist connotations. It's entirely possible for life to look biological and yet not be biological at the ultimate level. In fact, one time I had a dream I was working as a virologist in a lab. I was using electron microscope and collaborating with a team of scientists, etc. So it's entirely possible to have an appearance of any kind. You can have a scientific/physicalist flavor of appearance without needing physicalism to be the ultimate reality behind it. Well, it does, kind of. It does. You have to distinguish appearances from essence. If you say that for us to be who we are right now requires AN APPEARANCE of matter, that's fine, and then you're not a physicalist! But if you say it requires matter and not just an appearance of one, then you're saying that matter is the key essence of this experience, and that would make you a physicalist. Then you're a physicalist. Had you said that your body dependent on appearance or experience of matter rather than actual matter, I would not label you as a physicalist. If you're a dualist, that still means that Aurobindo is wrong. To a dualist the matter does not evolve mind. Rather, mind has its own essence separate and independent from matter. The only way Aurobindo's statement can make sense, is if you agree that the ultimate essence is matter, that matter is the primordial building block of life -- and that's a physicalist stance which I disagree with. You asked for an opinion. You got it. I disagree with Aurobindo. No biggie. I don't buy into Aurobindo's particular vision of evolution. Yes. We only need an experience or an appearance of atoms, but we don't need actual atoms or actual molecules. It simply has to look convincing to the mind but no more than that. First, it's not off-topic. Second, I am not bickering, but kindly offering you my opinion. I don't ask that you agree with me. I think it's cool if you disagree. I've looked up Aurobindo in the past and I wasn't impressed. I didn't like him as a thinker/mystic/whatever. I don't hate him. I am just indifferent or not moved by him at all. Now don't be stubborn and please accept all opinions in all their diversity. I think you should have asked "Does anyone has a positive opinion about Aurobindo, and if yes, can you then and only then post it here?" Then I would have remained silent.

I believe there are some elites that dream of something like world domination. Will they succeed? I don't think so. The first person that tries to implant me with a chip will die a horrible and painful death. I'd rather die without medical coverage and I'd rather be blown up by terrorists 10 times in a row than to be implanted with a chip like some dog. Hell, I wouldn't even do that to my dog. If my dog runs away, it's the right decision for him.

I am 23 and can not grow a beard. this realization has been haunting me for years, knowing the truth that to be a sage a beard is required. My life dream of living on a mountain like Pai Mei in Kill Bill 2 is shattered. any student that climbs the mountain and sees a beardless sage, will only see a false prophet.

hi my name is Brandon Pearson im 18 years old i live in the USA. i first got interested in Taoism when i was turning 17 .. i new that what i wanted more than anything was wisdom strange i no for a kid my age living the the US but what i seek in live is far more valuable than the false American dream.. i seek enlightenment and to maby who knows become a taoist immortal one day . i have so much to say but i must be getting to bed soon the US empire is falling and will collaps perhaps in my life time so living a material life is not for me and is boring anyway. i wish to tavel to china to be taught taoism from masters and learn martial arts and nei kung and Mo-pai. i am also going to travel to indonesia to seek out potential taoist immortal john chang... nothing really makes sence in life except for the taoist way of life... it just (makes sense) i cant explain it.. its like how we were meant to live not living in from of our tv's and computers night after night. i seek enlightenment and hopefully u guys can help me along my way what i know of taoism i have only read in books that books i have read are The Magus of Java Seven Taoist Masters Nei Kung Tales of Taoist Immortals Teachings of the Tao Cultivating stillness clear light of bliss Wen-tzu yes i have read ALL of those books no joke a couple of them twice i am starting to read... the complete I ching - its not easy tho i no from reading the books that the true tao cannot be learned from reading a book i need to seek a master if i found a master to teach me taoism i would devote my LIFE to him and his teachings

But if we do that, we'll soon see the entire topic has no meaning. It's best to avoid asking such question so we can continue our dream of alternating self-preservation and annihilation. (tongue in cheek).

about 10 years ago, I had a dream where I was trudging through the rain, and came upon a flyer lying on the ground. I picked it up and it said "Daoist Crystal Meditation" and gave me the directions. I thought, 'wow, right up my alley!', and the scene cut to me climbing up a steep, muddy slope on my hands and knees in the pouring rain. There was a temple at the top of the hill, and inside were two beautiful people in robes and top knots. The woman beckoned me into a back room, sat me down and looked deep into my eyes. She said that the 'crystal meditation' flyer was just to get my attention and to get me to come to the temple. She placed a string of jade beads around my neck and proceeded to show me some powerful truth about my life (and specifically, the unhealthy relationship I was in at the time) which within a few weeks led to me 'waking up' from this six year relationship, and spreading my wings back into my life . . . I'm not sure how this fits into this thread, but I felt guided to share anyway. I have been a friend to the crystal beings for quite some time, and am caretaking a 10lb Hunan golden healer quartz. It seems to be paired with the shining silver Tibetan black spot of the same size, as a sun and moon energy. It seems to me that the stones have an innate intelligence within them . . . I hear a quiet 'voice' from them at times, asking to be taken here or there (i.e. stone circles of Ireland, top of Huashan, my local waterfall), or given to this person or that. It is a gentle transmission, a gridding of spiritual energy. I don't ask them too many questions, just help them along on their mission. As for the crystals being water element, I can see that in some way, as they are formed from water. My teacher says they are Metal. . . as the 'white' or 'clear' color of quartz corresponds with metal element, and they are mineral, yes I see this too.

Enlightenment is simply Ourself waking up in this dream. Of course, simple =/= easy...

I've heard it said that we are the sum total of all our previous lives so there's no point in exploring them. Having said that I did a Denise Linn tape once; there was a flood of vivid dream like images and impressions with some relating to present relationships and past connections. In one of the images a spear was thrust into my lower abdomen on a road and I was killed when incapacitated. I never really gave it much thought until I remembered later that I was born with a hernia in the place where the spear entered. Some of impressions did kind of help me make sense of some present issues. Whether it was all wishful thinking and fantasy I don't know.

Things worked well last night. I might be over-interpreting, but funny how the principle that Kunlun is different and adapted for every person worked with my nature. I think I was able to combine the energy flow with the 'option' to think, to talk to myself in my mind and give myself direction or motivate me. Because that's what I did. What really helped was healthy breathing ... and smiling, which came natural due to a mnemonic hook I use and also due to occasional positive insights that came from my active philosophizing during the practice. You know how it feels in your arm when you touch 100 Volts (minus the pain)? This strong tingling buzz? That (in a lower magnitude) was how it felt along my center channel and/or spine, combined with a kind of pingpong effect in a normal heartbeat frequency. This started when the legs stopped jumping, and I kind of shifted gears twice after I got used to the strength. When that happened, the legs again started jumping, it felt more powerful, and after a while again, I got used to it. Closing down was mostly unspectacular. Felt a little heat at the lower dan tien. I did this session from 3 to 4 am, was wide awake, went to bed, fell asleep roughly at 5 am, woke up without alarm clock at 9 am refreshed. Had a pretty long dream that didn't have a clear message and was kinda weird ... like dreams often are. This was the first time that it was restorative and invigorating... and during the practice it actually felt entertaining/nice.