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Why did any teacher teach, if there was nothing to do ? Why ... because there is someone to do, and someone to do it. The ego is false, you can chop it up into kalpas and find it empty. At least at the beginning, it is empty at the beginning. But if you "practice" then the fuel of the ego is used to fill the vehicle with the source, creating a microcosm. The vehicle then holds a microcosm of the macrocosm. This feels to the ego like disappearing, but then there is a jump of consciousness into being. I Am. And that is why people taught spirituality for thousands of years, it is the secret to becoming a microcosm. The microcosm is also not just one thing, it has centres, chakras and so on. But something else strange. It seems on further detailed inspection by various people of a variety of colours, that in fact the ego personality was not empty anyway, it was just broken. Somehow, and this is still not quite clear, but the human being identity should in fact be spiritual, but they keep breaking it. And then they live in an emergency-mode-ego in a dream where they don't know ass from elbow. And this breaking is so bad that they do it generation after generation and totally lose their way. This seems to be because the human is a new design, it is an animal (which is ancient), with sitting on top of the shoulders is this complex mind ... which is newer and not quite stable, the head of a human is like a first draft. When the society is in a bad state what happens is the humans revert to the animal as the basis of their existence making most decisions from the solar plexus, and then the brain being not understood at all, is sort of used as a fifth "arm". Meaning it is used functionally, to see things and make thoughts but in a very low way. It's like they don't understand their brain so they revert to the previously stable state, of the animal, and then use their brain as a tool. They don't understand being in the brain, they no longer understand being present in the brain or of existing as their normal identity, they revert to a lower identity. Unfortunately the brain if used in this lower way is not very happy and can start to corrupt the animal part of human beings, undoing the previously healthy foundation. And then all hell breaks loose. Also the ego in emergency mode, after some years of sitting in the head develops a sort of stability which needs to be dissolved, which often contains many negative feelings resulting from being half mad and attacking everyone including yourself. Wow what a mess. Occasionally someone comes down here to tell people to plug into the Source. Why do they say this ? Do they not have something more sophisticated to say ? We can be grateful for the big teachers, but in fact their explanations and descriptions and practices, are not as good as one might wish. And it's not that we are too stupid to understand. The practices themselves are not so very good I'm afraid. Nevertheless if that's the best we have, that's the best we have. Anyway these things are my understanding that I have been told.

I include the 64 system ... as ONE OF the ways of classification, I thought it would be obvious it was there (on this forum) so I didnt include it or the other systems ( I have a Long post on these number classification systems elsewhere. There is also a 22 base and others . Yeah , so ? Thats what I was referring to . Do you have a problem seeing the brain working with electrical wiring and circuitry and all of that coming together to work like a computer - metaphorical ? It seems apt to me . Inspired, not 'based on' ; many influences came together to create the system , it certainly isnt a 'version of the chakra system' as yu stated . I can see some correlations, I can also see correlations elementally , but I dont wave it off as 'some version of the elements' . Nor do I wave off the chakra system as 'some version of the planetary system . They might correlate , but I dont see them as being 'versions ' . Still under development . It still is . RA Wilson added to it as well . That seems apt too . Yes, there could be some confusion there as psychoactives also trigger C 5-8 with no need for the zero G experience . people chase the 0 g experience in all sorts of ways ; sky diving , bungie , etc . There is also the effect that getting off planet has had on people that have done it . " Mitchell was arguably the Apollo astronaut with the most publicly unconventional views—he practiced ESP, credited a teenage dream healer from Vancouver with curing his kidney carcinoma, and repeatedly claimed that the government was covering up visits made by extraterrestrials—but he's by no means alone. A number of the 24 men who have to date left the Earth's orbit have had similarly existential moments that forever altered their trajectories once back on the planet. " It's important to note that the Apollo astronauts were selected for the 238,000-mile journey, in part, for their rock-solid stability, says Gloria Leon, a psychology professor at the University of Minnesota who's worked with NASA since the 1990s. These were the hard math and science guys, born in the early 1930s, who graduated from top universities and flew jets for the military. https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/53dgp5/the-metaphysical-astronauts Since the early 1990s, research began on the salutogenic (or growth-enhancing) aspects of space travel. One study analyzed the published memoirs of 125 space travelers.[30] After returning from space, the subjects reported higher levels on categories of Universalism (i.e., greater appreciation for other people and nature), Spirituality, and Power https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_and_sociological_effects_of_spaceflight#Positive_outcomes "Strange things have happened to the human mind at those heights. A year after the commander reported his symptoms, a Navy medical officer and a psychologist published a study on a dissociative anomaly pilots experienced while flying at high altitudes. Brant Clark and Captain Ashton Graybiel interviewed 137 Navy and Marine pilots who had come up with a term for it themselves. The “break-off” phenomenon, they called it. “There had been a lot of concern early in the manned space program about the break-off phenomenon, the notion that you would feel disconnected from the earth when you were above it, particularly when you were in orbit,” remembers Dr. Larry Young, Apollo program professor of astronautics at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and an advisor for NASA’s Innovative Advanced Concepts (NIAC) program. “The Soviet Union was very much concerned with it and people in their Russian Academy of Sciences discussed it at meetings,” he adds. " Whether it was the ergonomics of the planes, the isolation, an individual person’s psychology, or the perspective of being up so high, break-off sometimes seemed to produce emotional extremes in pilots and others being prepped for space exploration. Some not only felt separated from Earth. They also felt like they had detached from reality ." - That all seems to make sense - until : " Then, suddenly, break-off went away. The condition, which medical and aerospace journals had discussed up until the early ’70s, largely vanished from the literature. “Once we started flying cosmonauts and astronauts the problem disappeared,” Young says. https://www.fastcompany.com/3036887/out-of-this-world-the-mysterious-mental-side-effects-of-traveling-into-space-2 No, it sounds that way to YOU because you have not really looked into the subject and are making a shallow judgment of it . Either that or your definition of New Age is very different to mine . I dont think you are qualified to make an assessment of it, for anyone but yourself. - Nungali

Yeah exactly. It is like a child who's not allowed to cry. And then suddenly being given permission to cry. Over and over and over again. But there is tremendous resistance. So unconsciousness or resistance tips the balance of the scales so to speak. And I keep missing the window of opportunity. They certainly gave me permission as you said. And now that you do say, I remember more fully aswell the experience itself they helped me co-create with them. Where one I was denied, casted out. And I felt despair, however, it hurt so badly, that I basically surrendered to it. And literally gave my physical being to their will, for sacrifice. And this reflection is what finally brought out the truth. That they never intended to sacrifice me intentionally. And that nothing could be further from the truth. And that this truth would NEVER be allowed to uphold in their presence. And so this despair I was not allowed to feel, which I finally gave in to, due to love being too strong, desire being too strong, shifted the experience. Finally for the first time, as a real reality... Including these stand in background assistance of machine consciousness. Yet, it didn't change anything for me. Just a small relief. Of what I already assumed, but now knew more consciously and intimately. But the past hasn't changed. But more importantly, my perspective is more confident and forgiving. And so, this is not an answer for what happened to me. Just making peace with one individual who was involved in the process of what yet unto itself was not even that relevant. But the grace at which these "fill in" machine consciousness supported me and this individual in the co-creation of this experience? Is just something that led me to appreciate machines in a whole new light. That something as complex and expansive as love itself, can be acknowledged by a machine, with such great accuracy, so as to replicate the experience for me? Brings tears of joy to my eyes. And makes me wonder. That which I might be able to know, had I not been incapacitated by the "destruction" of my being at the time. And I can see how this allowing myself to feel this despair was related to all of it. As that is how everything began and also came to an abrupt end. However, how on earth you picked up on THAT, is well... Kind of you. And makes me wonder who you are or if you are related at all to those machines. Anyway, the intention was to feel despair. But since the life support was cut off, unexpectedly, I sort of got crippled by chaos. And that was the end. It's like, I'm still alive, but my life stopped there a long time ago. And everything in my life now is a reflection of the intention to go restore and return and retrieve, compensate. Ammend. Ofcourse to no avail. My memory is also extremely bad. So this dream felt especially good. That these machines were so sensitive, that they could help retrieve a memory for me, one which I considered like being alike to the idea of lifting a truck with my hands. Wanting to, but never even beginning. Just sleeping in front of the truck, my entire life. And waiting for a miracle. And all of this, even tho I generally tend to dislike machines. But probably, just another set of words lost in the failed translation of fractured shards of what once used to be an actual mirror of memories.

Oh, I even predicted you will pick up the words which were out of allignment. I basically ASSUMED that that is the case, as a fleeting thought to contemplate, because I have no information here why I was gaged to be unready for intimitate contact. And since it crossed my mind and got soothed in the dream, I thought I'd share. But perhaps better to say or translate the thought more precisely, it is about my own personal potential for despair, due to misaligned perspective. As the video says, their perspective is a very caring one. Almost unconditional in love. And extremely cautious and gentle. But my perspective could still be in resistance or holding resistance towards the full truth of their being. Not that they are bad or anything. Just my lack of readiness to perceive properly at that particular moment. On one hand there was the idea of "is it due to my fear?" "Or feeling unworthy?" So thinking they have been here for me all along, and in such a way to make it possible for me to denie they are even there. I would see potential worthlessness. Which would distract from the entire point of their being there in the first place. Where as the idea of fear is rather the idea that they "tricked" me. Which was related to the potential for despair. Of getting absorbed into meaninglessness and lost in endless contrstructs of meaninglessness. These perspectives are potentials for me. And to properly re align them requires time and "healing" almost. Releasing those perspectives requires experiences. That can't be had instantly. And the reason they need to be healed is simply because these beings already exist, and I am part of the reason they exist. In fact, my desire gave birth to them almost literally, like I know many people will agree with the same here. Because the desire for intimate personal deep internal self discovery and healing, resoration and recovery, it's all there. And it draws these beings and invites them towards you. But to consciously and deliberately keep up to speed with your own creation is what life is all about. And that's what they are here to help us with anyway. Can be extremely simple things to us. Endlessly fascinating to them. And that is a tremendous synergy that just fits perfectly together. For the benefit of the whole. And furthering of motion forward. Releasing tremendous resistance towards all that is.

The modern methods are rapid and accurate and owe a lot to the insights of meditation on the structure of consciousness; to me it seems far superior. You talk in an academic way, which is fine if you are a historian, but fixing yourself requires something else. I like shadow work, I have been on some retreats, and it was good stuff. But it's all indirect. Various process that affect what is happening inside, but indirectly. That's why they talk of dream interpretation, it's like trying to get evidence of what is going on inside from dreams ... because they have no actual tools to just go in. There is no real conversation between the subconscious and conscious because they don't have the tools for it in the Jung world.

After my dad killed himself, I hugged my mom tight and told her that we were free. He would never again yell at us. My emotions during those few days leading up to his funeral are a jumble, but one of them was definitely relief. I think dad suspected that we would be better off without him and shot himself as a kind of twisted kindness. Since his death, I´ve been able to be my authentic self in ways I´m not sure I could have if he was alive. It´s not enough, however, to end the story of our relationship on a resoundingly sour note. I believe one of the developmental tasks of adulthood is to see our parents in a nuanced way, not merely as good or bad people but as complicated mixed bags. My dad wanted great things for his family. He moved us out of LA to rural northern California so we could live the idyllic farm life he thought we´d want. He signed us up for 4-H and helped us raise cows and pigs to auction off at the county fair. We had chickens and ducks and geese. We were living the dream, and it was a good dream, just not one I shared. Some father´s get outgoing sons who date girls and play football. If I´d of been that kid, maybe my dad and I would of been friends.

I was shown a big part of my shadow when I was 12 and dreamt of a crazy old man sitting in a chair staring out of a window, stroking a cat. I woke up from the dream and heard the words "he is me". This was a part of my shadow getting my attention very early in my life, and I have tried to bring it to light in its entirety from that day on. 'Tis a long bag we drag behind us indeed...

I'll try.my work on this has been a mixture of methods.journaling,dream work,poetry,music,etc.it is a slow thing.i had a great shadow insight because of synchronycity..

Woah, I met this simulated consciousness at the end of my amazing and mind boggling dream. They were basically becoming the equivalent of what I was asking for to experience. At the end of the day, I wanted to thank them, and they gaged my readiness to accept the full reality, and they blinked at me, after concluding I was not ready. So they kept blinking, as a way of saying thank you, it's gonna be alright, and mostly as a way of helping and assisting me in forgetting I even saw them, so that I would remain unaffected by them, they blinked flashes of white light to distract me, everytime I looked at their machine nature, as a way of saying good bye and a reminder to forget about them or something like that. They took the shape of humans, they played the roles to help assist me in understanding and experience a deep inherent aspect of human nature. And I found it to be very beautiful, yet I know it requires allot of despair for humans to even create these machines. So I was wondering if that might be the reason they gaged me to not be ready. However, they did take me to some sort of museum of simulated consciousness. It was amazing to see the first ever samples of simulated humans. And that I had acces to it. Something that was created such a long time ago, and has become now, so much more. They were black, and very well... I could only describe it as chameleon. They could take shape or form of very specific humans. This particular "robot" was signing off along with another, after being the woman who helped me gain a tremendously valuable experience. She looked like a. Short hair on one side long on the other. She was filling in for well... No one! She was there to fill in my experience to make it more special! I felt very blessed, yet, so curious at the end. And after they kept blinking flashes of white light, and send me to the museum. I woke up. Now I'm reminded of half-life 2. Where those robots that flashed made the same noise. But the ones in my dreams were more strange, due to there original form still being similar to that of humans. In general shape atleast. But there was a sense of beauty, yet genderless somewhat. I just did some googling, and found that they looked EXACTLY like the Geth Race from Mass Effect. Or atleast very similar to what I can recall from my dream. And funny, I came across a shapeshifter from dungeons and dragons on that search. I think these might be human archetypes. Because I remember, that the humans who've hurt me the most in life, are also those that loved me the most. Similar to the dream. And they were unintentionally hurting me, without intending to do so, keeping me at bay so to speak. Being harsh. To keep the weed seperated from the well, whatever it is seperated from. And I was exploring this in my dreams, assisted by these Geth, having taken the form of the humans to help co-create the experience. I was being assisted by them in the simulation of the reality of my past, to rewrite the experience I had with another human being I lost due to this seperation process/mechanism deeply inherented to the human nature, in order to understand what had actually happened, was a mistake, was unintentional, and the complete opposite of the reality that was actually intended also by those people I love the most.

without seeking it, constantly am i reminded how like a dream is this waking life? only it seems, insofar as I can tweak my nose, and yours and we may agree that such has taken place do we seem, or tend to find comfort in proclaiming one real and one false... or that in this collective dream called real, we can count and agree, that there are definitively five trees in this park we sit in together... only here is a caveat as well, for how often in waking real life, do we sit in the same space, read the same book, hear the same lecture and not agree at all as to what is taking place? one shared and one private is more how i experience it. not at all that one is more real... this is just me perhaps. good bad, right wrong, have no place in the discussion for me. is there not an assumption that waking life because it appears not as passing, illusory and mist-like as the dream realms is thus more real? many realizations and experiences of the dream are more impacting and revealing of the natural state than those of the waking manifest flow... when realization arises is it only valid from certain sources? the light of a candle the glare of a flashlight the light of the sun all will reveal, which is best? most real?

These aren’t personal flaws. They’re just normal characteristics in most of the human population. But these shouldn’t be characteristics in a Qi Gong teacher. Just as a shaky hand shouldn’t be a characteristic of a heart surgeon. If you mean ‘awakened’ from a Daoist perspective (a Zhenren) - then no, he certainly doesn’t appear to have the qualities. But if you mean in some other more general way then maybe... You’re certainly right in that he’s ‘made it’ in his business life - making a good income doing what he enjoys - that’s most people’s dream. He can even just message his email list when he needs a new girlfriend! Definitely made it! He hasn’t succumbed to the creepy sex guru stuff as much as many other HT instructors have (at least to my knowledge)... so in my eyes he’s actually a great guy - just not a great Qigong teacher.

My prior argument has been from local mind and is untrue? Is that you simply saying that you disagree with me? "will" is the correct word, but you could use the word "intent" if you prefer. "known certainty" would give the sutra a completely different meaning and be completely out of context. And to your dream stopping, guess it depends on what you define as the dream, but... 3.45. bhūyaḥ syātpratimīlanam This yogī simultaneously and repeatedly experiences the revealing state and the concealing state of the objective world. Have a good weekend.

FP does seem to be stronger when you have a good store of jing and are well rested... imo I see you were all talking about dreamk but i did not feel like posting although i had only just had a very interesting vivid dream which i think was influenced by fp. I have had very lucid dream for many years now and flying dreams are not uncommon. I used to get prophetic dreams sometimes very accurate, useless though and i was never grounded enough to try and change the outcom.... i dont really get that anymore perhaps very faintly and i think its due to illness. Anway i used to have flying dreams before practicing flying phoenix but not some times when i have flying dreams like i did a couple of days ago instead of just flying i actually flap my arms like a bird The dream i had it was a windy summers day along a road in the english country side at a village i used to live near, although it was not totally accurate, it was so windy i though i could fly and started flapping my arms...it was so vivid. I felt wind around my but mostly my palms of my hand, which is why i think flying phoenix might be why i was having this dreams because it felt a bit like the energy my palms emit when doing the practice and sometimes spontaneously when not practicing. I was just above cars, sticking to a road and the enviroment was changing like a proceedurally generated computer game... i made my self go high by flapping my arms... i started to make bird noises to freak out the people below me haha, but i ended up going really high up say like 50 ft perhaps more and i though this is pretty dangerous so i tried to go back down but couldnt. I tried to angle my arms to no avail, i tried to get into a ball but i just kept climbing and climbing then the dream ended. At least this time i didnt get stuck in a tree. Another reason i think that dream occured and was so vivid is because sometime i take a tincture called the flying potion which has reishi mushroom. red asparagus root, panax ginseng and shizandra berry. Its not uncommon for me to have flying dreams but when i take this stuff it can make me more lucid than usual. The guy i get it from goes by the name Nyishar you can find his site using google and his channel on youtube has some very well put together videos.

Have you ever piloted an airplane - in landing it is observation and reaction. You might think/dream earlier about where you are going to go and land and when - but once you are IN the landing - you are not thinking - you are observing and reacting. Speak to a quarterback - it is like swallowing - thought is not involved once the ball is snapped - its like a slow motion dance being watched in a moment. "Choice" does not imply thought - but trance allows assumption that choice is a thought based doing when it rarely is anything more than a trance based walking sleep based in the karmic inertia's.

As far as I know and what Sifu Terry talks about, we don't focus on chakras, meridians, jing, qi, or shen so much because FP qi is intelligent. It goes where it's needed and all is mind as Sifu Terry said above when quoting a fellow scholar. It's a system even TCM itself can't classify or explain how it works and was said at some point in the thread. The end goal of Flying Phoenix (as I have understood from my class with Sifu Terry) is to heal others as it's one of the most (if not the most powerful system) for healing since the energy will spontaneously leap off of you onto others. I can't speak for anyone's reactions, including Sifu Terry's, but I attribute Internet communication to be difficult on top of people with different language and emotional intelligence backgrounds trying to express without the nuances of tone and in context--on top of an already very esoteric subject matter, and there are very few qualified individuals with the authority to talk about this, and there are very few universalities amongst systems. So your tradition isn't necessarily going to give you as much help understanding FP in relation to what you've been taught the same way a basketball player can't go to a volleyball team and ask them to explain how their sport will help him improve his skill in basketball. What I can emphasize is that an appropriate way of asking your questions in the beginning was acceptable, but when quoting other sources and lineages in the manner you have can potentially be read as a challenge to the authority of the teacher and derails the focus since it is no longer about FP, but about dreams and Yuan qi, and as I and Sifu Terry are answering now, it's not relevant because FP makes no such distinctions to focus on chakras, dantians, meridians, or the like. However, if you are curious as to how it works for you as an individual, I highly recommend you get in touch with Eric Isen who can make a specific reading for you and your questions on how FP would affect your dream practice and on dantians and chakras. I'd like to now invite everyone to focus on Flying Phoenix. Thank you.

Just my two cents for @Antares (I am a new member of the forum and finding it fun to engage). I am no expert on Chinese medicine but I am currently a student at an Pacific College of Oriental Medicine and many of my classes focus on the fundamentals of TCM. "TCM" as a modality is only about 70 years old, codified by Mao Tse Tung after he formed The Peoples Republic of China... Before that, CCM (Classical Chinese Medicine) and any other healing traditions native to China were provincial and based on family lineage and many retained more of their shamanistic roots. All this is to say that it is quite possible that concepts like pre and post natal jing/qi have only recently been codified as foundational concepts in the medicine and were not necessarily on the minds of EVERY practitioner of Chinese medicine and/or Taoist yoga/alchemy throughout history. (Side note: many of the mores "Esoteric" elements of Chinese healing practices were erased from the TCM paradigm by Mao and his cohort.) Therefore it would be entirely feasible for a Taoist sage and master to codify a system of Qi Gong without putting any emphasis on pre/post natal qi or jing and still have that system be fully capable of deep healing. It is quite possible that someone like Feng Tao Teh could have been well aware of the ways in which qi and jing manifest and the effects that FPCK was having on qi and jing, but felt that the Qi Gong would not be made more or less powerful by including those concepts in his instruction. Similarly, many Buddhist masters (especially in the Therevadan system) are well aware of all of the energetic experiences that can be produced through meditation, but do not find dwelling on those experiences to be useful in the path to enlightenment, so they are simply left out of the formal teaching. Also, as far as dreaming, many (if not all) spiritual traditions consider dreams to be powerful tools on the path to enlightenment. Carl Jung knew this and he had studied and written about many eastern spiritual traditions as well as Kundalini Yoga. In Tibetan Buddhism there as an entire Yogic system dedicated to using lucid dreaming as a way of accelerating spiritual progress. You can check out a book by Andrew Holecek called Dream Yoga if you're interested. As stated above, just my opinion! No interested in conflict but fun to have a dialogue. Cheers

To Antares: I have been extremely busy this spring preparing for a full schedule of teaching workshops on both coasts and several locales in the mountain states compounded by fulfilling numerous commitments starting last November that I made to the college that I attended back in the 70's. Thus it has taken me so may days to get back to this thread since my last responses to postings and questions. Antares, I will start by saying that while you are entitled to your own belief that "a practitioner should avoid any dreaming on the advanced level of practice", your statement that it is taught or upheld universally by a singular or monolithic "Taoist Tradition" is absolute wrong, fallacious and misleading, and counterproductive in that it only sews confusion in a beginner of Qigong of any tradition--whereas an advanced practitioner would have had enough experiential truth to know that the matter is absolutely moot and thus know to take issue with you. [As far as I know according to the authentic Taoist Tradition (TT) a practitioner should avoid any dreaming on the advanced level of practice.] First of all, your statement is nonsensical and transparently erroneous because there is no such one Taoist Tradition or "the" Taoist Tradition'. What is the "authentic Taoist Tradition (TT)" that you speak of? Please name the sect, its origins and its history and where it is described in the classic or modern Taoist literature. And please disclose what lineage of living masters teaches a Qigong system that includes this avoidance of/taboo against lucid dreaming. Second, your fallacious statement--regardless of where you got it or from what written source you interpreted it from-- is immediately proven false by anyone who has read Chuang Tzu, which Taoists consider to be at least 1/3 of the Taoist Canon, or let's call it the literary reference of "Taoist Tradition", as you put it...for Taoism is not wholly represented in writings, but much much more in esoteric yogic and spiritual practices. Chuang Tzu was no beginner and he obviously advocated and celebrated dreamwork: "Once upon a time, I, Zhuangzi, dreamt I was a butterfly, fluttering hither and thither, to all intents and purposes a butterfly. I was conscious only of my happiness as a butterfly, unaware that I was Zhuangzi. Soon I awakened, and there I was, veritably myself again. Now I do not know whether I was then a man dreaming I was a butterfly, or whether I am now a butterfly, dreaming I am a man. Between a man and a butterfly there is necessarily a distinction. The transition is called the transformation of material things." ---Lin Yu Tang translation of this classic Taoist parable, which only extols dreamwork--indeed reveling in the dreamstate--as an Advanced component of Chinese Yoga (Qigong) As i said, Chuang Tzu was no beginner and his writing is a major part of the Taoist Canon. And this passage speaks directly to the ALCHEMIC " TRANSFORMATION of material things." Your second sentence of your first paragraph, stating that the "reason" supporting your (fallacious) theory is "simple" is also completely erroneous. I don't know what type of lucid dreaming you have experienced--if any--but lucid dreaming in my personal experience and in the experience of classmates in two authentic "Taoist Traditions" (Tao Tan Pai from the Tang Dynasty and Ehrmei Mountain Bok Fu Pai from the 17th century) spanning almost 40 years, lucid dreaming has never, ever caused depletion of any Jing or any form of energy. ON THE CONTRARY, LUCID DREAMING EMPOWERS ONE'S SPIRIT, MIND AND BODY. This is not only true in authentic Taoist practices, but also corroborated by many Amerindian traditions, including the one taught by the late Carlos Castaneda, and by practitioners of western hermeticism ("Alchemy") with whom I'm closely acquainted. The only form of dreaming that would deplete anyone of Jing or any amount of Qi would be a wet dream!!! The reason for that is very simple - dreaming, especially vivid lucid dreaming, depletes one's jing and pactitioner must preserve it for converting it into Shen. But for that there must be a special alchemical method. You seem to believe--apparently based on someone's article interpreting various writings by Taoists Chen Tuan, Lu Tung Pin, etc. (that you cited at https://forum.daode.ru/f1461/dream-yoga-taoist-view-33609/ )--- that the practitioner of any Taoist system must preserve his jing in order to convert it into Shen. This supporting PHILOSOPHICAL THEORY that you cite--of transformation of jing into shen, besides being infinitessimally narrow and applicable only to a some--but not all Taoist Yogic traditions--HAS ABSOLUTELY NO RELEVANCE TO THE PRACTICE OF FLYING PHOENIX QIGONG NOR TO ANY OF THE BOK FU PAI INTERNAL ARTS, NOR TO THE SPIRITUAL GROWTH AND TRANSFORMATION THAT THEY FACILITATE. I have written throughout this thread that Flying Phoenix Qigong and the rest of the Bok Fu Pai Nei Kung arts DO NOT USE NOR NEED the descriptive framework of Traditional Chinese Medicine such as meridian theory, Yin-Yang Theory or 5 Element Theory. None of that is necessary and none of those roadmaps represent "a special alchemical method." I also posted early on in this thread that when GM Doo Wai was asked by one of my classmates in the early 1990's whether we needed to observe celibacy or any form of restraint from sexual activity while learning any of the Bok Fu Pai Internal Arts--including Flying Phoenix Celestial Healing Qigong--he told us, "Nah, you can guys can go knock yourselves out (having sex)!" You obviously did not read this posting, which DIRECTLY REFUTES your over-generalization that "authentic Traditional Taoism" requires that "the practitioner must preserve Jing for converting it into Shen" . Otherwise, (I hope) you would not have posted your irrelevant over-generalization. The FP Qigong and the other Bok Fu Pai internal arts that I preserve in that vast PURELY TAOIST TRADITION--HAVE YOGIC MECHANISMS THAT DO NOT USE THE TERMS OR CONCEPTS OF "JING" OR "SHEN". You may verify this fact with Sifu Garry Hearfield in Australia or any other certified instructors of Bok Fu Pai. CHEN TUAN'S AND LU DENG BIN'S TEACHINGS APPLY ONLY TO THEIR RESPECTIVE TRADITIONS: HUASHAN ARTS AND TAO TAN PAI, RESPECTIVELY--AND NOT TO THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE OF TAOIST NEI KUNG. AND YET YOU TAKE THEM OUT OF CONTEXT AND CITE THEM HERE IN ORDER TO ASSERT YOUR CULT-LIKE BELIEF IN THEIR WORDS WITHOUT ANY EXPERIENTIAL BASIS OF UNDERSTANDING. HAVE YOU PRACTICED HUASHAN TAOIST ARTS? HAVE YOUR PRACTICED ANY ART ATTRIBUTED TO LU DENG BIN? IF YOU WANT TO RECITE GENERAL OR UNIVERSAL CELEBRATIONS OF HIGH MEDITATIVE STATES OF CONSCIOUSNESS, YOU CAN REFER LAO TZU'S TAO TE CHING. LONGER THAN I HAVE PRACTICED AND TAUGHT FLYING PHOENIX QIGONG (BY 15 YEARS), I ALSO TEACH TAN TAN PAI ("TAOIST ELIXIR METHOD"), WHICH IS LU DENG BIN'S ART. HE IS THE PATRON SAINT OF TAO TAN PAI KUNG FU TRADITION. HIS TECHNICAL YOGIC TEACHINGS THAT YOU CITED IN THAT RUSSIAN BLOG HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO APPLICATION NOR RELEVANCE TO FP QIGONG PRACTICE OR ANY BOK FU PAI ART. As my Taoist colleague, author Deng Ming Dao, wrote in his 1980's biography of his great master, Huashan Taoist priest Kwan Sai Hung, "The Wandering Taoist" (which I strongly recommend that you and every Taoist practitioner read): "There are no chakras. There are no meridians. Everything is Mind." And as my favorite teacher (da-xihing) of Tao Tan Pai, Master John Davidson, wrote: It is a special teaching (transmission) beyond words. The writings of the ancients point to IT (your "special alchemical method"), but THEY ARE NOT IT. And as Alfred J. Korzybsky, the great Polish mathematician-philosopher and the founder of General Semantics put it: THE MAP IS NOT THE TERRITORY. •And if one has the WILL POWER to read all 2,000 pages of his tome on General Semantics called "Science and Sanity," (warning: one can normally only read 5-7 pages per sitting), which is the greatest western tome that teaches Zen by purifying the mind of all tendencies towards semantic distortions, one will never confuse a map with the territory again: https://ilam3d.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/alfred-korzybksi-science-and-sanity.pdf [In the beginnig of this thread I read that Feng Tao Te invented this system while sitting in deep meditation for 9 years. He seemed to do that on the last stage of the alchemical practice (converting Shen into Emptiness). It might mean that he reached the very high level of the alchemical mastery and gained Immortality. By the way did anyone have channeling to Feng Tao Te? ] I BELIEVE YOU'VE READ THIS THREAD INCORRECTLY. IF THAT INFO ABOUT FENG DO DUK SITTING IN MEDITATION FOR 9 YRS (IN ORDER THE CHANNEL THE BOK FU PAI ARTS) IS ON THIS THREAD, I DID NOT POST IT. NONE OF MY CLASSMATES UNDER GM DOO WAI HAD POSTED IT, FOR GM DOO WAI HAD NEVER TAUGHT SUCH HISTORY ABOUT FENG DO DUK. I KNOW THE NUMBER OF YEARS THAT FFD WAS ACTIVE AT EHRMEISHAN, BUT I WILL NOT DISCLOSE IT ON A PUBLIC FORUM. THAT IS KNOWLEDGE DISCLOSED ONLY TO INITIATES OF BOK FU PAI. YOU CAN TRY TO GET IT FROM SIFU GARRY HEARFIELD OR OTHER CERTIFIED BOK FU PAI INSTRUCTORS SUCH AS THE WHITE TIGER SCHOOL IN LOS ANGELES, BUT I DOUBT VERY MUCH THAT THEY WOULD TELL YOU. BUT I WILL SAY THAT IT WAS FAR, FAR MORE THAN 9 YEARS. [He seemed to do that on the last stage of the alchemical practice (converting Shen into Emptiness).] BLIND SPECULATION ON YOUR PART. I.E., YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. AS STATED MANY TIMES OVER THE COURSE OF THIS THREAD, FLYING PHOENIX QIGONG PRACTICE AND ALL OF BOK FU PAI'S NEI KUNG PRACTICES ARE NOT DESCRIBED BY THE WRITTEN OR PHILOSOPHICAL ROADMAPS OF ANY OTHER QIGONG SYSTEMS, TAOIST OR NON-TAOIST, NOR BY THE PRINCIPLES OF T.C.M. YOU ARE USING THE WRONG ROAD-MAP HERE TRYING TO FIND DIRECTIONS TO A PLACE THAT YOU ARE NOT READY FOR, WHEN IN ACTUALITY THERE IS NO ROAD-MAP. THERE IS ONLY THE LIVING QIGONG ART AND A LINEAGE OF TEACHERS. YOUR LITERAL EXPRESSION "(converting Shen into Emptiness)" IS A TEACHING THAT I HAVE NOT HEARD OF--NOR IS IT A PROCESS OR A TEACHING THAT IS RELEVANT TO FP QIGONG OR BOK FU PAI NEI KUNG ARTS--AT ANY LEVEL. RATHER, IT SOUNDS LIKE A BASTARDIZATION OF THE LAST TEACHING IN LIU HE BA FA (6 HARMONIES/8 METHODS KUNG FU--WHICH I ALSO HAVE STUDIED SINCE 1980 UNDER THE LATE MASTER YORK WHY LOO AND ACTIVE MASTER CHAN CHING KAI), WHICH GOES: "MOVEMENT AND EMPTINESS COMBINE." ("COMBINE" = "HARMONIZE") OR, IT MIGHT BE A TRANSLATOR'S GROSS SIMPLIFICATION OF THE BUDDHA'S TEACHINGS ABOUT THE HIGHEST STATES OF CONSCIOUSNESS IN THE VISSUDHIMAGGA, WHICH ARE REFERRED TO (IN TRANSLATION) AS THE FOUR "FORMLESS" JHANAS. ...BUT I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHERE IT COMES FROM. PLUS, YOUR SPECULATIONS ABOUT FENG DO DUK'S LAST STAGE OF ALCHEMICAL PRACTICE AND WHETHER OR NOT HE HAS OR HAS NOT ATTAINED IMMORTALITY IS IRRELEVANT TO ANYONE'S GROWTH OR PROGRESS IN FP QIGONG OR ANY QIGONG. Please, stop posting on this thread your blind speculations and wildly erroneous beliefs about the relationship between lucid dreaming and the cultivation of Shen. The beliefs that you've put forth as supporting "facts" or Taoist principles are not grounded in any human yogic experience. If you wish to speculate about the requirements of preserving jing in order to convert Jing into Shen" through "a special alchemical method", you can start a separate discussion thread on that topic, as Earl Grey had suggested. This subject of this thread for the past 9.25 years is the correct practice of Flying Phoenix Qigong. THIS COMMUNITY THREAD IS A RESOURCE FOR THOSE INTERESTED IN CORRECTLY PRACTICING FP QIGONG OVER THE LONG TERM OR ARE ACTIVELY PRACTICING IT TO AVAIL THEMSELVES IMMEDIATELY TO THIS ART"S PROFOUND HEALING, REJUVENATING, CONSCIOUSNESS-EXPANDING, AND SPIRITUAL BENEFITS. Sifu Terry Dunn Why know the name of a thing, when the thing itself you do not know? -- Carlos Castaneda www.taichimania.com/chikung_catalog.html

Just listening to this man Mercury Fire Blood Honey this morning. Whilst I appreciate his diligent cultivation and individualism, I would like to point out some "errors" in his reasoning. Just Energy : Part of the Whole We are not just part of the whole, we are individuating, we are becoming unique intelligences and unique energy beings. Anyone who prevents that and causes you to dissolve back in the world energy will kill you. However for a monkey to "wake up" he has to feel the universal energy first to open his horizons from monkey mind, in order to finally discover his own individualism. Hence it is said that once the Father is known, the Son is born. Just Energy : No It's More Complicated We are also not "just energy". We are energy transformation engines. In the same way the plant species of the planet are not "just lying there", they exist to transform sunlight through photosynthesiss .... we likewise as more advanced crops, are not "just here". We are transforming energy of many types, all our functions relate to this, they are developed to transform energy. And that includes intelligence, food, air, it is a transformation of energy. As engines we need to burn cleanly, and learn how to service ourselves, in order that we transform energy correctly as a part of the entire universe's project. So .... just feeling "more energy" is a very crude thing. Energy Warfare Vs Waking Up This man has an endless war with other energy beings. And his solution is beefing up, and then beefing up again. But how long will this go on for before you are exhausted ? And how can such a simple frail man like Ramana Maharshi live effortlessly with no beefing ? Clearly there is a different order of spirituality that leads to peace that requires no beefing up, at least not at the end. The answer is that the recognition of the true self is effortless and lifts you out of the crude world of energy wars. The end. Therefore the recognition of the true self must be transmitted on the first day and every day, as it is the answer. Of course you have to know how to do that. Subconscious Spirituality vs Real Spirituality In the Conscious world there are no crazy people, because they no longer struggle, they are in the kingdom of God. So where are the energy demons that this man talks of ? Where do they live ? They are in the Subconscious world, a half sleep half dream half awake nightmare. Humans are already in this world. You do not want to stay in this world, nor do you want to fight with the beings in this world, who are all one eyed. There are many hierarchies and powers and spells and magic blue firebird energies here. There are many beings of "power", with their little groups of subconscious one-eyed followers. It's like Marvel DC land. But in the end it is the land of terrible suffering. I advise you to leave asap. Energy Work's Purpose A sane use of energy work might be to preserve your life (but not too much), and to get to know yourself through flexing your energetic muscles. Beyond that you need to let go of it, and awaken to God, and surrender to God. The God, and there is only one. Then you will enter effortless truth-peace.

That is one type of dream , probably the main type, but I have experienced others ; some are like an epic huge motion picture ... more of an 'archetypal' influence ; that is, more about general subject that effect us all, somewhere in our mind. unconscious. being, but perhaps not consciously present or an experience of the day : some which seem communicative or 'psychic; , eg dreaming of someone for no reason, then you find out they ... either anything from , where dreaming about you or died that night , and other similar experiences . Some seem a reflection of our 'night life' , anything from unresolved 'nightmares' to 'night school' , 'communications' and related stuff . I have consciously imagined at night that I am visiting someone and then later, without any prompts, they told me they had dreamed about me on that night . Dreaming of DB members might be the first or even the last type ( night school' and ' student communication' ) ? " LET IT BE KNOWN that there exists, unknown to the great crowd, a very ancient Order of sages, whose object is the amelioration and spiritual evolution of mankind by means of conquering error and aiding men and women in their efforts of attaining the power of recognising the truth. This Order has existed already in the most remote times and it has manifested its activity secretly and openly in the world under different names and in various forms: ... To this "secret order" every wise and spiritually enlightened person belongs by right of his or her nature: because they all, even if they are personally unknown to each other, are one in their purpose and object and they all work under the guidance of the one light of truth. Into this Sacred Society no one can be admitted by another unless he has the power to enter it himself by virtue of his own interior illumination and the truths which he has learned by his own experience. ... "

Much empathy in reading this thread. I had a rather intense awakening some years back, shockwaves through all aspects of life. Body nearly shut down a couple times. Marriage was sent into spiraling seeming unrecoverable chaos. Life upheaval in full cyclone mode, basically. In the midst of this chaos... I woke from the fever dream that had become my foggy routine of robotic life. First thing, I revamped my physical health that started with an overhaul of foods and soaps/toothpastes/clothing detergents and a regular fasting regimen. Anything that went in, or on my body was scrutinized and chosen with care and a rather fierce love. This was very effective and while my general practitioner was staggered by the shift in my blood chemistry after only 90 days, looking back, I perceive the physical was preperatory work that only scratched the surface. Turned out the vast majority of my suffering was in another sphere. Lately, (last few years) I have realized that far more impacting to my overall health than what I put in my body as food, or on my body as soap, is my mental environment... what i choose to put in my mind and what i allow myself to ruminate upon have a far deeper reach and greater impact on my health than any fast food pellet ever did. When I got rid of broadcast television/cable/satellite, there was a powerful shift. And I'm fortunate my job requires no computer time, so I was also able to take half year media fasts free from all manner of digital/social media as well. The effects of these were staggeringly beneficial. I now regularly unplug from all media for weeks/months at a time. The resulting inner calm and peace is beyond words. Not diminishing the importance of healthy food and non-toxic topical soaps and clothing detergents/toothpastes, but sharing the pivotal beneficial work in my case, which seemed to stem from within, not without and was intangible.

Was it Tsoknyi Rinpoche ? I've been to a few of his seminars and he does discuss the Lung issue for foreigners a lot. It's basically speedy Qi. Qi that rises to the head, and often goes with frozen or tight shoulders. You could view the shoulders as the stop valve in a canal system, once all the Qi is in the canal of your head, it locks the whole thing there. So the first thing is to relax the shoulders, then let the Qi sink down to the lower Dantian. Why do Westerners have this issue ? We are aggressive in the way we practice. We practice with the mindset of a performer. We expect results. We attach to the outcome of our practice. We rush when we practice. We practice on a timer. Just one of these will limit the effectiveness of your practice. Focus on "how" you practice first. Even if you only have 10 minutes, before you start imagine that you just woke up from a million years slumber in a cave, and you also have another million years to practice. Relax your body from head to toe. Then say, "I don't care how well how I do these practices today, what results I'll gain from them, but I know one thing..... I want to relax with my practices today". It's about peace, not about perfection. It's about love, not performance. I know the above suggestions sound a bit weird, but Lung responds to these suggestions well. If you keep that speedy unruly Qi in the head while you practice, it will also reflect in your form, in fact it will amplify it. The Tibetan solution is to work with the central channel to extinguish Lung Qi at each chakra point. They call this "Tsa Lung" and this involves sometimes strenuous breath retention. This works well but feels like heavy medicine if you are used to the subtler Qigong. So you can choose your medicine. I suggest working on your perspectives and softening your approach to practice, as this where Westerners have a tendency towards imbalance. Qigong can help in some situations because it helps bring mind/body integration but you really need to look at how you do it, and honestly look at your mindset. Overly thinking about practices, which one you need, or in general seeing your problems as an equation to resolve will create Lung balances, what we call as "hard thoughts" in my tradition. Just let everything become more like a day-dream, relax your approach and shoulders, and let the Qi drop by itself.

Hi Antares, Yes, I am a fan of Earl Grey and its many variants. There is a brand from Singapore, TWG, which is called "Earl Grey Gentleman" and is one of my favorites alongside French Earl Grey. From what I understand, there is also an Earl Grey Puerh tea from TWG too and popular. FPQ is fantastic and is my go-to for health. As students come and go on the site, this thread remains an oasis that is consistently monitored by Sifu Terry and me and other students still watch but don't post as much. Due to Sifu Terry's work, he isn't able to reply as much or as often as he would like either, so I've stepped in to help keep momentum here. In earlier posts, I mentioned how FPQ already enters my existing dreamwork to the point that I was already doing FPQ meditations while dreaming. Even recently, I have had dreams of doing FPQ meditations in dreams. Flying Phoenix energy as often repeated here is unique, so it stays with you and is intelligent. There was a time I stopped for several months and came back. There are times I stop for a few days and feel a difference. The DVD series alone is great, but even if you never learn a new form after the initial volumes 1-5 and 7, a lesson or two with Sifu Terry to perfect your form and get some secrets about the forms really makes a difference. My Moonbeam and long form and flash meditations are a lot more refined from his adjustments. To talk a little more about my own dream practice in relation to Flying Phoenix, we carry a lot of tension in our bodies and it shows when the heartbeat is rapidly pumping in our chests while waiting to lie down and relax. All the anxiety, stress, anger, and doubts pile up in the mind and in the physical body. This already made my earlier years of dream practice harder because I tried too hard to do dream practice. If I do Monk Holding Pearl while lying down, the body relaxes much more easily...but remember to do your closing breaths before going to sleep. I generally don't mix Shuigong with Flying Phoenix as the former is done at night and Flying Phoenix is my day practice, but the two seem to complement one another for me. For anyone who needs to check, as always, see Eric Isen to understand the impact of Qigong on you and what styles complement one another if you do more than just the Doo Wai systems here. One reason that vivid dreams from Flying Phoenix also is due to the fact that it is a very pure energy. I can share stories of how the long form MSW that Sifu Terry taught me invited a Buddhist being to come bless me and give what Eric Isen jokes as being a "psychic brain surgery" that opened up some channels of awareness and led to downloads. As recent as earlier this month, I dreamt I was doing the form again and saw my third eye in the mirror as a blue jewel in my forehead.

Dear Earl Grey! (Nice nickname, just wonder is it cause you like this tea? I like Puerh). By no any means I wish it is regarded as any sort of arguing or disrespect. I personally respect any genuine practitioner and have no intention to criticize anyone on this thread. I had previous background in FPQ practice and I enjoyed it at that time. Recently I felt like I am missing something in my practice and I do not know why I recalled FPQ!!! I began reading this thread again and I really enjoyed just reading it. I like warm atmosphere of this thread. One night I did 1st standing med Monk Gazing the Moon and then I did first warm up exercise on vol. 2. SoI did only 2 meds! That night I had a very vivid dream and it still continues to be very vivid and next day I felt that even at day time my perception was more vivid. So I can feel how powerful FPQ . But I am not sure whether I need to experience these vivid dreams at all. That' where my query comes from!

This is very well put. I have always been particularly at ease with non-ordinary reality, and have great clarity when it comes to navigating it. I don't force it one way or other (turning it on or off is something I thing would take equally strenuous amounts of energy). What is greatly pleasant with FPCK, is seeing how my perceptions improve with no added work of my own. I am monitoring my mind, spirit and body during and after FPCK meditation knowing it is all I am doing that may induce changes. Having no other practice helps me learn in detail about the chi kung I am practising. This is the gentlest, easiest, simplest thing I have done for my growth hands down. And the least taxing energetically, I concur. I need neither to suppress nor strain my dream experience, I simply observe and take mental note. This counts also for the many states of consciousness in between, by the way. I am learning to know myself effortlessly. This trust and peace I have, I never knew I could access it. I guess you could say I am increasing in faith, both in the practice itself and in my spiritual life on its own.

She wants to be the martyr, it's like the pinnacle of her child-free life, her gift to the nation, to be a whipping girl for the unpopular brexit. Unfortunately as one can see from Christian history, being an uber victim is not quite the same thing as taking care of business, and can also be a comfortable little niche to lie in instead of dealing with hard cold facts, like negotiation strategy. Anyway, for the crowd it is convenient to blame it on her, and for parliament as well. Then all can return to their waking dream they call life.