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Happy new year! Can you help me with some examples/signposting to Daoist funeral music traditions - sonic, written, video, transcription, any depiction really - for new bit of academic research [and probably a bit personal too]. Reaching out to see what knowledge is here. Any advice appreciated!

I went ahead and did a google search to see if others have already recognized this simple truth and written far more eloquent words about it than I might ever be able to come up with... here is a sample: https://www.oriannesociety.org/faces-of-the-forest/rattlesnakes-reputation-vs-reality/?v=400b9db48e62

"The rising of thought (the rising of the first thought, ‘I am so-and-so’) itself is birth, and the forgetfulness of Self itself is death. The mind’s phenomena of such thinking and forgetting is called samsara. When the mind, freed from its impure state of thinking and forgetting, stands ever holding on to Self, that is called the destruction of the mind [manonasa], which itself is liberation." ~Sri Muruganar

108. When the Taoist sage Lai was on the verge of death, another sage asked him, "Great is the Maker of Things! What will become of you now? Where will he send you?" Lai replied, "A child who obeys his father and mother will go wherever they tell him to go -- east, west, south, north. Yin and yang, the elements of nature, are they not to a man like a father and mother? If I were not to obey them now that they have brought me to the point of death, how wayward I should be. They are not to be blamed. The great earth burdens me with a body, forces upon me the toil of life, eases me in old age, and calms me in death. If life is good, death is good also. If an ironsmith were casting metal and the metal were to jump up and say, 'Make me into the best of all swords!' the ironsmith would regard it as a bad omen. Now that my human form is decomposing, were I to say, 'I want to be a man! Nothing but a man!' the Maker of Things would think me most unworthy. Heaven and earth are a great forge and the Maker of Things is a master ironsmith. Can the place he is sending me to be the wrong place?" pp. 141-142 Graceful Exits How Great Beings Die 1997 Sushila Blackman

What is a real fight? Is it for defense? Is it to kill? Is it against a MMA practitioner? Someone knowledgeable and experienced or someone not? Who wants to kill? Do I know if he or she wants to kill? What is the situation? Are they many or is it just me? Is it being healthy a real fight? Is it being happy a real fight? What is a real fight? Do I fight biting the neck? Or scratching the eyes? Do I fight with rules? Why would I fight with rules? Am I conditioned to use rules? Where does a real fight start? Does it start with the psyche and words? With the behavioral language and my own emotions? What is a real fight? Must it be a physical confrontation? Do I need physical confrontation? Does a real winner ever let that happen? If it does happen have I lost? If it does happen how do I act? Not fight, but act. What is a real fight, if not everything I do in my life? But I prefer not to say what is a real fight. Instead, I ask the questions and act upon the mystery. A real fight is a real act.

Here's an interesting and touching story; I've heard that the consciousness can remain with the body for three days or more after death: Man who slept next to his dead wife's body for six days recommends the experience

So in chapter 16 of the TTC, it ends with: "Immersed in the wonder of the Tao, you can deal with whatever life brings you. When death comes, you are ready". Ready for what? Is this gone into detail in any Taoist texts? At all?

Why are we afraid to die if it's inevitable? Why do we want to survive, even though no one really survives? Why do we want to leave a legacy, when all stories fade into oblivion? Why do we want the impermanent to become permanent? Why do we want for things to be other than they are? The same question in 5 variants. The answer shall destroy the world.

I have been talking to someone for a little while. It seems as if she is somewhat sensitive, I guess is the best word for it. She told me, in her final email to me (long story, not going into it) that if I go to California I should do so by bus. One that has a bike rack on it. Go to Ouija, CA, Bike around there. If I do not do this, if I bike all the way down, I will, "...not live past this year..." OK, before you tell me to take the predictions of mediums with a grain of salt, and go into the infinite and unknown nature of the future, let's play a game. Just for informative purposes. Let's just say that her prediction is correct. In so far as my current circumstances and responses will lead down this most likely path, and unless something life changing happens, this is the most likely outcome for me. still with me? This is telling me two things: 1. I am currently vibrating at a frequency that is drawing this event to me. 2. If I think, "OH MY F-ING GOD I AM GOING TO DIE!!!" I will bring it even quicker, because I will be vibrating even more at that frequency. Here is the problem... For a variety of reasons I don't care about my life. I have no reason to live that is stronger than that. I should be scared. I should be running around like a chicken with my head cut off. But if I were to do any running, how I currently feel, it would be on bike, as quickly as possible, to this outcome. I have dealt with feelings of loneliness, shame, unworthiness, etc. for the last two decades. I feel I have little value, little to offer. I know, intellectually, differently. But my feelings do not match my thoughts. At least not consciously. Somewhere in the record player of my mind there is a scratched section that keeps repeating. I have hinted and downright mentioned all this before. I won't go into it more now. As I have said before, I don't believe in destiny, fate, karma, imperfection or sin. I think there are an unknown and unknowable variety of paths that stem from this moment. The idea of some path that is set in stone for me is ludicrous to my mind. I also feel that both death and life are illusions. Death is just a transition. So there is nothing to fear here. Yet despite how I feel about my life, at this moment I am not exactly in a rush to end it. Also, while I can take a lot of physical discomfort, I don't like it. So slicing my wrists or walking in front of traffic doesn't appeal to me. Same for jumping off of high places or hanging myself. Same for drowning, although that would probably be the least painful. Ideally I will go out in some really cool way, like during an Ayahuasca trip in the South American jungle somehwere... Here is some really trippy music for you: No, I kinda want to continue on. Even though I have no justification or reason for it. It is not that I am attached to this physical life or resisting pain. It's just that there are some things I would like to experience and see. So what is my best course of action here, presuming this prediction is 100% accurate and will happen, barring some life-changing/course changing event? How do I find a reason to live that is stronger than all the things I am feeling that leave me not caring about my life? What would you do if you were in my shoes? Would you face this head on? Change course around it in some way? Run away from it? Please detail why you would take your chosen course of action or inaction. How can I find what essentially, for me amounts to, a super-strong reason to live? Especially considering I don't have one now, and obviously I have to deal with that, or I will draw the termination of my physical life through me, if not from others than from myself.

This subject was edging into another topic and I thought it deserved its own thread. What do you think about the afterlife? Heaven, hell, reincarnation.. combination.. or nothing. Do we have control? Do we have any proof? Do we have.. hope? Personally, I don't think we can ever be truly sure of what the truth is. Proofwise, its pretty murky, heaven has its proofs, though I find proofs in literature of reincarnation more persuasive. Especially cases of young children remembering past events. I think such interviews are beyond being called away will finish later.

As tongue in cheek as this may appear... I honestly think this is a great layout of a valid modern perspective of the straw dog aspect of the Tao.

Is there a significance we cannot measure? Is there a meaning that does not fall victim to the thoughts that compose us? Can we identify without clinging? Can we identify without anything? Do not all currents of the mind eventually subjectify? Do not all currents of the mind eventually die? Do not all streams of belief, meaning, and significance through the passage of time become unbelievable, meaningless, and insignificant? What then remains? What then.

You people have got me thinking about 'Salvation' lately. What does it mean to be 'saved' ?. I hear alot of 'Christian' people tell me Jesus saves but they give no explanation other than needing 'faith'. I know of (Chrisitan) masters that can assist people towards salvation after they have passed on. I know of the buddhist deal with repect to ending the cyle of death/rebirth - i.e. I believe its getting to at least the 4th plane in waking life and making your way from there. So, to me, is seems that merely becoming aware of where to go after death enables you to get there after death. But, if you cant become aware of those realms that exisit in the after life, Jesus/Christ is a good fallback plan for helping you to get there. Now, I notice from experience, that its almost impossible to move from lower planes to higher planes on your own. Just by 'willing' ascension through your own effort on the other side seems impossible (but maybe not improbable). The question then arises, can you ever know for sure that you are guaranteed to reach heaven or break the cycle of death/rebirth while in waking life ? Is it just a matter becoming aware of where to go or does one require assistance of some sort ie., help from the other side or help from a conscious master on this side ? Incidentally, I recall a youtube video of one guy who was taken to a plane of existance 'a hell' as he describes it and could not, by any effort of his own, get himself out of it. He was fully conscious and the experience was very real. This one was a Christian based story by the way.

Was recently going back and reading an old book that got me into Shamanism and was a very powerful text for me. Personally I have been having a lot of inner conflict with the underworld and ancestral work...and have been looking for more clarity on this topic and trying to rewrite all of the internalized bad programs I picked up that have become part of our culture. I found this excerpt quite useful for me and perhaps may be illuminating for others whom face the same internal blockages. Was going to originally put it in my Ancestral Work thread but I thought it deserved its own separate focus. Enjoy. ------------------------------------------------------------ "The Underworld is the powerhouse of the three worlds. Here we draw upon our draw upon our deeper resources, our traditional inheritance, our memory. Look at the diagram on pg.49, which shows the three worlds connected by the great centre tree (picture attached). This Illustrates the way that the Underworld can be envisaged as the rich loam into which the trees roots go down. In addition, all trees have a tap root which searches out the nearest source of water, whose nurture it then channels to the rest of the tree. When we enter the Underworld, we put down our tap root and draw upon nourishment. The Underworld has a bad press in the West, since in both Classical and Christian cosmology it has been dualist ally understood as Hell. In shamanism the tree worlds are primal worlds of possibility without such dualist in connotations. The Underworld is a place of foundations and beginnings, of joy and creativity, not a place of fear and terror. For many religions, the Underworld has become a kind of toxic-waste dumping ground where the spiritual evils of the world are thought to lie ready to recrudesce. Scenarios of unending hell-fire and fantastic terror have been set up in our imagination to guard the gates of the underworld from unauthorized intrusion. Our communion with the underworld has been lost or severed by fearful religious dogmas which would prefer us to imagine a region of demons and searing flame, rather than a place of restoration and reconnective joy. The Underworld is a place of mirror images, reversal and complementarities where we perceive the physical reality of our daily lives thrown into startling subtle relief. Imagine the separation of realities as a gauze veil hanging from floor to ceiling: if you push your hand into the gauze, you cause it to push inwards away from your side: anyone standing on the other side of the gauze veil will see your hand push the gauze outwards towards them. If we bear this in mind, we will begin to understand why the Underworld journey has been discouraged by non-shamanic cultures: for here the threshold guardians assume tiny or gigantic size, here we meet the spirits that compliment realities we have neglected or ignored. Without strong and willing allies, such encounters can confuse and terrify - many genuine mystics have gone thither without preparation or ally, returning to report strange sights. Without the correct cosmological information and without a non dual framework to trace from, religions have barred the doors that lead between the worlds. The wise traditions of the primal earth drew continually upon the Underworld and are fed by it and many people now deeply regret that we have lost communion with these rich indigenous traditions. Although we may feel that such treasures can never be ours, our hearts are still gripped by the many myths and stories of the Underworld journeys of those whose seek the treasures and wisdom: the descent of Inanna to take the initiation of mortality and gain wisdom, the descent of Aeneas to meet and consult his dead father, Orpheus's descent to retrieve Eurydice, the initiatory descent of Christian Rosenkreutz into the vault, the descent of Persephone which triggers the coming agricultural wisdoms of the earth, the descent of King Arthur to bring home the Cauldron, the prototype of the Grail. All these myths speak of initiation into wisdom and the winning of empowering treasures, gained through endurance, perseverance and courage. Such heroic descents can be ours through the shamanic Underworld journey. Reconnection with the Underworld restores communication with the voices of our wise ancestors, with traditions which hallow earth, with the deep empowering teachings and treasures which remain eternally available. The beings encountered in the Underworld include ancestral teachers, clan totems, deities who initiate and empower, dwarfs, dragons and other subterranean or watery guardians of power. You may encounter ancestral councils or assemblies here. The genius of the Underworld often appears as a Lord or King of the Underworld and is sometimes horned or antlered, like the Celtic Cernunnos or the Hindu Pasupati, surrounded by many beasts. Many primal Underworld deities have the horns of power: such beings have been demonized by Christians, but they simply preserve their original non dual functions as gatekeepers and initiators. Each land has its own native Underworld guardians. Awakening and communicating with these native powers is important work. During the early 1980s with other walkers between the world, I visited many parts of Britain, specifically to effect such awakenings. As a result of our work, certain powers have become more widely available and contactable. The work of awakening the sleep is important, not to evoke atavistic and inappropriate energies, but to 'clear the ways' between our own world and the deep power of the Underworld after so many centuries of neglect and misunderstanding, so that primal wisdom of the ancestral traditions may once more flow as a corrective to our over-urban and increasingly fragmented lives." Singing the Soul Back Home, by Caitlin Mathews A Note: i have edited out some portions of the section do to length. The book itself is pretty awesome and well worth purchasing. http://www.amazon.com/Singing-Soul-Back-Home-Shamanic/dp/1859061036/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1382754073&sr=1-1&keywords=singing+the+soul+back+home

If you had only one day to live, what advice or life lesson would you give your daughter/son or loved one? Assuming that you know you are going to die. Mine would be in no particular order; 1) The golden rule. Treat others as you would like to be treated. 2) Masleows hierarchy of needs 3) If you live in the past, you wil be depressed. If you live in the future, you will be anxious. If you live in the present, you will be at peace. Any constructive thoughts on the above?

So right now I am dealing with a terminal illness within my family. It has been a long battle but it looks like it will be ending fairly soon. A DNR has been signed, and there is so much emotion and stress going on around me. There has also been some heartbreak as I learned that a family member attempted to forge documents in order to put themselves down as beneficiary to life insurance. There's just so much going on. I am doing everything I can to help, and am able to keep a cool head and sort things out and tackle things one at a time. There is a deep sadness within me that doesn't feel ready to come out yet, though. I am trying to get through this the healthiest way possible. Are there any specific meditations or Qigong that might help with this? Anything I could do to look after myself?

Here is a BBC documentary interviewing many scientists and experts who have conducted scientific research on Near Death Experiences and Out of Body Experiences- YouTube - The Day I Died. NDE + Consciousness Documentary Pt1 of 6 YouTube - The Day I Died. NDE + Consciousness Documentary Pt2 of 6 YouTube - The Day I Died. NDE + Consciousness Documentary Pt3 of 6 YouTube - The Day I Died. NDE + Consciousness Documentary Pt4 of 6 YouTube - The Day I Died. NDE + Consciousness Documentary Pt5 of 6 YouTube - The Day I Died. NDE + Consciousness Documentary Pt6 of 6 In modern times 2 factors have allowed NDE's to be proven, modern resuscitation techniques and the fact that heart attacks are now very common. Many cardiologists are investigating this subject rigorously. With modern medicine this phenomenon has become more common as people are brought back after being pronounced clinically dead with no heartbeat and no brain function more and more through surgery, emergency medical treatments, etc. My understanding is that people before they die will often have out of body experiences leading up to their death, and when they die they float above their bodies and up to the outer atmosphere of the earth, from there they enter a tunnel with a light at the end of the tunnel, when they reach the light they begin to have a complete flashback and review of their entire lives, and then they enter into the pure light, but some are then told they can go back and that they're body has been brought back by the surgeons. People have been able to float above their bodies and see things on the floors above them that they couldn't have known, or seen things on high shelves that could only be seen if they were floating above it Here's a scientific article i found on the subject although i am sure there are even more rigorous ones with harder proof, i just don't have all that much time to read and find them at this moment Article: Near Death Experiences Oh what's that? Real data? oh too bad so sad The existence of mind and conciousness is not dependent on matter, and to view mind as being created by brain chemicals is a simplistic and ridiculous notion Although sicence is often pure nonsense, sometimes scientific studies can be very rigourous when it comes to observing a specific phenomena, the exact times when people are clinically dead are monitered closely in each case. People see things happen that they could not have seen or things that happened definitely while they were dead. The whole point of the study is to find objective evidence of and corroboration of the accounts connecting to real events. NDE have been studied for over 25 years all over the world by prestigous scientific institutions The Lancet: Near-death experience in survivors of cardiac arrest more-

It wasn't but a few days ago, her and I talked about her relationship. Now, I find out she is gone. Car accident took her life. She was an amazing person! Met her in my Psychology class, was in her group and had deep conversations that I will remember for ever. I'm just speechless, I am beyond words. A person such as her gone...Wow....WOW....WOWWW.... May you Rest in Peace Crystal! Keep smiling bright!!!

Most historians believe Jesus Christ was an actual man who really existed, and we know the things he did and taught have stood the test of time. The commandment to love thy neighbor as thyself, is so perfect of a law, it is practically impossible to improve upon. The most famous thing he did was come back from death and conquer death. In history prophets have used the energy of the universe to perform many incredible feats including bringing people back to life. In modern times cardiologists sometimes bring people who had heart attacks back to life by shocking them with electricity, but this uses machines and has to be very soon after the person died. It may be hard to accept for some people that a master could bring someone back to life with life energy. So there is a theory that in fact Jesus did not die on the cross. Remember that he was taken down much earlier than a person was normally supposed to be on the cross, and they decided to not break his legs like they usually do when they take someone down. Then, when he was put in his tomb, the herbs his people brought with them were not funerary herbs, but medicinal ones. We know the order Jesus originally came from, the Essenes, were experts in the use of the medicinal properties of plants. Here is the 1 hour BBC Documentary "Did Jesus Die on the Cross?"- http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8617432570680905331# Here is a shorter, half hour version with some scenes cut- http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1669658378154953060# Youtube version- or-