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Hello, I would like to introduce myself properly by giving my related background in regards to internal alchemy, which is what i am about... I started out with the religion of my parents until early teenage years, became agnostic as it didnt matter to me and later on picked up interest in Christendom. Not having any preconceived notions about anything Christian by external teachings... and reading the book on my own, I came to other conclusions than those that are mainstream. My understanding or interpretation has evolved multiple times, after which I took a step back and realized that relying on interpretation, understanding, knowledge or reasoning is not enough and can be misleading. That was the main point that made me stop trying to reach God with the intellect, but start walking the path of the mystic (experiencing God > knowing God). One day, I had a very interesting experience, which changed everything. I sat on my bed or I was lying, I dont know and had a moment where I totally surrendered to "God", giving up my life, basically, saying its all yours and meaning it and fully giving up... As I was lying there, my body started to burn hot. Internal waves of goosebumps emerged that came in waves, stronger and stronger, and overtook my entire body. If I was to describe it, I would say my body was in blazing, overwhelming, invisible fire, which did not burn me, but which I could sense! At that moment, I had no clue what was happening, but nowadays, I think I know... anyway, as it was happening, I was thinking of God's embrace, of verses like "God is a burning fire" which does not burn, things of that nature, which intensified the whole experience... IIRC, it kept going for 2-3 minutes, give or take and then i went to sleep. I never paid more attention or taught to it, but nowadays, I think it was a key event in my energetic unfolding - i think it started it all. Anyway, I evolved from Christianity by becoming a perennialist, due to my mystical/esoteric approach to the bible. I discovered non-duality, first in the bible, then noticed how other traditions, mainly buddhism (secretly) and advaita vedanta (openly) are teaching the same thing. I realized that "God" is not personal, but rather impersonal and more than that, that God's identity, which I knew was "ineffable" - somethign that did not make much sense to me, was beyond concepts, language or reason, making me understand the ineffible-ness of God's identity. It transcends the intellect or speech, the Tao that can be talked or written about, is not the real Tao... The buddhists call it the void or emptiness.. The evolution of my understanding has been happening in multiple strands, in parallel. The main strand or framework I was working with, was alchemical Christianity (occultism), but I was open minded so I was pursuing other maps or frameworks like budhism and yoga (of patanjali) to better understand what they were all pointing at. As a perennialist, I view God as a mountain-top, with different starting points having different paths (potentially-) all leading to the same top, or trying to, at least. From Christendom, I understood that the way to God is by "Christ" alone - which is an occultish way to say that celibacy is sine-quo-non. This knowledge has been esoterically distilled from a few things...: - the allegory of the fall of Adam & Eve, who "ate" from the forbidden "tree" placed in the "midst of the garden". ther is a verse that says one should come to a conclusion on a matter by taking multiple witnesses in court cases, but esoterically speaking, this is referring to textual interpretation - so, there is another place (Proverbs 30:20) which says "the whore eats and wipes her mouth and says she has done nothing wrong", showing and indicating that "eating" = sex, making the allegory of Adam & Eve all about sex, as they also "ate".. making the forbidden tree the genitelia, the garden the center of the human body etc. - allegory of Christ's crcufixition - being crucified at the age of "33" in "golgotha" is code for the spine, which has 33 vertebrates and the human skull: "golgotha" literally means "place of skull" - the word "Christ" means anointing or oil, in the original, its "cristos" - this is the same "oil" of the parable of the 10 virgins, all of whom seek to enter the "kindgom of God" (deciphered: samadhi/jhana), 5 wise having "oil" in their lantern, 5 foolish who dont have "oil" and cant enter during the dark night (meditation) - the Christ (anointing, oil, essence, "jing"), which came from above ("Most High" / "God" - aka the brain, pituary/pineal) must also go up the same way it came down - by being accepted (celibacy) and not rejected (sexual indulgence) - "to know" meaning to have sex and the saying "know thyself" occultishly referring to self-frucitication (internal alchemy).. Equipped with this knowledge, I practiced mainly 2 things: - meditation - celibacy (both of which are simply non-doings, now that I think about it - I did not "do" those things, I rather stopped "doing" in both instances xD the yoke of Christ is easy after all...) The form of meditation I practiced was what Buddha described in the anapana-sati sutta. Awareness of the breath. By "breath", I mean the false breath - the mechanism by which we suck in air. These days, my main interpretation for "breath" in occult or spiritual ancient texts is Chi automatically, because you can breath chi as well. Sooner or later, I discovered that I can voluntarily cause piloerection, in short - create goosebumps voluntarily with my breath. I now understand this as chi-control. Initially I did not understand the significance of it and ignored it, but thanks to articles I found here and elsewhere, correlating it with the other knowledge I have, I think its the key to all of it.. The comment I am referring to is this one: Having spent some time here and having read about xing and ming (a 60+ page pdf called "Destiny, Vital Force, or Existence? On the Meanings of Ming in Daoist Internal Alchemy and Its Relation to Xing or Human Nature by Fabrizio Pregadio"), I think I now have somewhat of a better understanding of what the process is really all about. (I am still not hipp to the taoist lingo, but i am trying xD) And I find myself more leaning towards Taoism or rather, internal alchemy (neidan) than any other framework, as its the most straight forward and the one that makes most sense to me personally, assuming you know what the cryptic elements mean. All spiritual texts are cryptic, but if you have a little bit of progress or related knowledge to compare it to, you can usually make sense of it... or delude yourself you are undersanding them, lol xD Here is my current understanding ,which is ever-evolving: - Meditation (false xing exercise, post-heaven xing?) creates true ming (chi movement, awareness of chi, voluntary piloerection), when the body and mind are completely and 100% relaxed (no movement: physical stillness and 0 muscle tension + no thoughts) - True Ming & its exercise (chi-gong, taichi, external movements but paying 80% attention to the movement of the chi internally, not the physical form or movement) is what charges the battery at the core of the human system and allows for true xing (jhanic absoprtion, samadhi, emptiness) to occur The anapanasati sutta is ingenious in the way, that it contains both elements. You progress from the breath of air to the breath of chi all naturally. Once you do celibacy or become a monk and then completely relax the body and mind for a while, you feel start feeling the pulsations of chi in your body (mainly abdomen), which are exponentially intensified through celibacy.. and sooner or later, acquire control over them. You start feeling light-orgasmic sensations in your abdomen when you fully relax and meditate! This is the bliss of the secluded monks, Buddha talked about, who were entering Jhana! When the breath is traced down, which naturally occurs, as you can not focus your attention to the nose-tip as mainstream buddhist teachers teach, because you have let go of all control (even awareness) to achieve stillness, bodily and mentally, awareness itself will natural latch on to the breath and follow it down to the belly. in the belly, when the breath is slow (long), heat sensations will start to form near the belly button and it will heat up. this natural xing-approach can be simulated by a ming approach of doing reverse breathing and intentionally moving chi (voluntary piloerection) to the belly region. visualizing energy moving in from your limbs like electricity down into your belly helps a lot. 2 different approaches, but the same effect. i think once this center is charged sufficiently, it spills over to higher regions which is when supernatural phenomena are gonna start occurring around you, usually unintentionally and without control... perhaps you can gain control, but I am not that far yet and I am not really interested, tbh... i could not make sense of it either, it seems that certain physical phenomena occur, when there is a "delta" in awareness, say you are at 50% of stillness or emptiness (random number) and then you drop to 49% or jump to 51% abruptly for whatever reason, this has a ripple effect on physical reality. this is the best way I can describe it and I could not induce it by will, it happens on its own or is out of control... i could not attribute it to anything else, because its hard to "think" while not thinking or being completely still.. so when the phenomena occur, it rips me out of emptiness completely when i try to make sense of it, completely stopping the whole process! i think thinking (mental movements) are too coarse for supernatural phenomena - you have to have a super subtle mind with super subtle movements during stillness, to (probably) intentionally induce these things. and even then, how would you do that, when you have to let go of all things to reach such levels of stilness (non-doing)? how to do while not doing? i have no idea... its super complex and I have no one to really talk to about these things, except perhaps you guys! I believe that dual-cultivation is necessary and complementary to each other, cultivating both energy (chi movement) + stillness (100% body/mind relaxation, no wavering at all, no movement of any sort). Christ may have been a taoist, btw., having said what he said in the gospel of Thomas verse 50, in regards to where we come from: > (50) Jesus says: > (1) “If they say to you: ‘Where do you come from?’ (then) say to them: ‘We have come from the light, the place where the light has come into being > by itself, has established [itself] and has appeared in their image.’ > (2) If they say to you: ‘Is it you?’ (then) say: ‘We are his children, and we are the elect of the living Father.’ > (3) If they ask you: ‘What is the sign of your Father among you?’ (then) say to them: ‘It is movement and repose.’” Movement (ming) and repose (stillness) or yang and yin, etc.. The Tao (stillness, void, emptiness, nothingness) spontaneously created unity (golden elixier, the unification of yin and yang) which split into duality (yin and yang), which procreated the 3rd (mother+father=child) and from this process came all the things (10.000 things)... so its about uniting duality, merging movement with stillness, action in non-action, doing in non-doing or non-doing in doing - i think this is what wuwei refers to, ultimately. effortless action is born, when both yin and yang merged into one. no one can do this, except the exalted ones, the taoist immortals, the boddhisattvas, the saints, etc. etc. intentionally. in regards to internal alchemy, I think this refers to controlling energy while being in stillness. its kinda paradoxical, how is there a "doing" (yang, chi-control) in "non-doing" (meditation, yin). i think the answer is: spontaneity - its a natural phenomenon, its not you, who does anything, it is something which follows a certain law and happens on its own on the path of cultivation. i think this is what has been depicted in the yin and yang symbol, where there is a dot of the opposite in each one of them. yang has a dot of yin and yin has a dot of yang, as they both complement each other and one induces the other. they are tightly knit together, one could argue they are the two sides of the same coin... And Jesus also talked about how to create the golden elixier, allthough cryptically, in verse 106, for example: > (106) Jesus says: > (1) “When you make the two into one, you will become sons of man. > (2) And when you say ‘Mountain, move away,’ it will move away.” (sons of man is a title for offspring of the perfect one, the first "man" aka Adam, who was 100% perfect before the fall) Anyway, there are many traditions and many esoteric sayings, which I have not referenced outright, which point at this general direction. The muslims "pray" (repetition of words; mantra meditation) by placing their hands on their belly buttons and doing a few stretching movements.. i think its a veiled form of internal alchemy! In general, the abrahamic flavors seem to use the formula: celibacy + xing practice (or non-practice, lol, letting go, non-doing). I think this is called xing before ming in taoism. Xing before ming, in true christendom, evolves into xing with ming at the same time, once ming becomes doable due to xing cultivation - as one other daobummer once pointed out in a completely different context but still related: "how can a pianist play the piano, if he has no hands? he first needs to cultivate and have hands.. hence the higher teachings are secret or only given to those who qualify.." something along those lines - which makes sens in this context as well - how can you do ming work, if you are not aware of your chi and can not move it. So I am of the "xing before ming" school, allthough nowadays I practice both at the same time, beceause I "grew hands", so to speak.. ---- I am grateful for this community, there are many nuggets of wisdom and lots of interesting discussions. I am happy to be able to be part of it, allthough I am one who prefers personal, direct experience over theories, its still nice to have a few ideas or different POVs... and more importantly, likeminded people!

Hello. New here. Looking for info to help with stuff I'm doing. For the record, I'm not interested in squabbling or one upsmanship I see. If the info works for me, thanks if not then I appreciate the effort an move forward. I cultivate. For me that's a personal definition meaning I bring in external qi to enhance my natural qi, an do exercises related to that. Adbominal breathing to store qi. Reverse breathing to cycle qi an for specific reasons. I don't help ppl or try to heal ppl,not my thing. I use Sun qi for the body an part of the other stuff I do. I use Moon qi for the nonphysiological stuff an to assist in nurturing personal qi. I blend both by compressing in Lower TanTian, then sending to Perenium where it usually shoots it's way up the spine or thru one of those life gates in the back. Not sure the name but sometimes it goes back up between shoulder blades an to the heart area. To avoid sex energy loss, I pull in the qi as I'm ejaculating or before I finish an that works pretty well, I send it to the Lower TanTian an continue my sex session. Then later I cycle it. I'm interested in getting some clarity on some of my experiences. Which are: When absorbing qi an letting it flow thru my system, I've noticed that it tends to settle with a vibrating feeling recently. I'm not sure bout what to do with this, though it tends to do it in the joint areas. What might this be? An what are some possible solutions to this if it's an issue? Lately been projecting outside myself, but though the images are semi murky. Got a fix for that? Also on projections it doesn't ever seem to be In the Present. The other day, did a session an saw a truck an a friend there. So I came back an went out to verify it. About an hour later walking home, I saw what I had during the projection. This is interesting in itself, however the goal is off. Advice? Technique used is to just close eyes an see elsewhere, nothing special. An seeing interesting things lately, wondering if they are apart of the cultivation or some mental gunk clearing out. Saw a blue almost neon streak of light that became a marble, then disappeared when a red glowing marble like thing appeared. Both where over my bed while I was about to sleep. The third thing we an amorphous shadow that seem to move by my open apartment door fast, then came back an stopped for a minute while I looked at it,then it shot off. An there's this little smoke thing that randomly shows up, when there's no fire, no incense, no cigarettes lit. It's just like a cohesive bit of smoke that moved around an then disappears on its own. Not sure what these weird things are, don't even know enough to guess so any info that'd be great. Anyhow, hi. Feel free to message if you young men have any answers.

Hello, I am a middle-age fart with 3 Kids and a Wife and I am doing my best to bring myself back into a state of balance and good health. I am somewhat new to Qigong (I started practicing through Ken Cohens CD/DVD's some 7 or 8 years ago, but didn't stick with it long, and renewed my interest a few months ago after stumbling upon Sifu Anthony Korahais online instructional for Lifting the Sky (thanks Anthony!)), though I have been practicing various types of meditation and shadow-work throughout the last few decades. I also found interest in Dao through the Tao Te Ching as a youngster, and I am always working to apply its wisdom to my life. I've been on this site a few times over the years while searching for various things, and I'm happy to finally join the site and get to know some of you better!

Hey there, just writing my intro post as I'm new to the forum. I am interested in reading the discussion here. I Googled this forum again after hearing about it a while ago after reading an interesting chapter on the feminine in Taoism in a book of lectures by Andrew Harvey. Looking forward to reading more!

Hey everyone, So, I don't really know what to say other than this seems like a great place and I like how Dao is spelled with a D rather than a T. I'm a writer, psychology undergrad, and lay/secular Buddhist. I love how Daojia and Chinese Buddhism riffed off each other and I incorporate both in my practice. I just turned 30 and live between two cornfields (well, now they're cornless) in rural Illinois. I'm constantly trying to walk the tightrope between pragmatism and mysticism without falling into either of the extremes. Nice to meet you, John

Totally new to Qigong (which is my interes). Read some articles of Sifu Anthony Korahais and found this forum.

Hello. I've been fascinated with the Asian Culture since a I was a little kid. The writing system, martial arts, music, imagery, ... everything was misterious and intriguiing. It was many, many years ago; information about those topics were scarce and books in my native language (Italian) were extremely rare. Above everything, one thing has remained constant in my life for all this time: I Ching. I discovered them when I was 14 and since then I had a mentor and counseler that would help me looking through the situation (and myself) more clearly. That's my main reason to be hear. I hope to learn more and, possibily, share the little I know. Remo

Hello My name i go by is Asharana but if you would like to know my formal name its actually Kenneth. Ive practiced Microcosmic orbit from the mantak chia awakening healing light series as well as learning about the 3 dan tiens. Ive only recently been able to connect the spiritual body (macro) to the Micro(physical) so i am looking on where to go now i noticed each time ive connected to the northstar general other wise known as the northern star i feel either a strong spinning sensation or a pull from what feels like a strong vacuum effect of it. getting back to the intro i wanted to learn not only advance healing techniques but also how to have a strong or more fluid connection to the "Wuji" or emptiness I am unsure why but this seems to be one of the things on my bucket list before i move unto my next life. i can say ive experienced the silence of meditation and felt awakenings of the spiritual nature that hit me more then once like a mach truck of the universal energy . I was first developing or cultivating the energy that i have now when i was about 20-23 years old by first being attuned to reiki. then i realize there are methods that are more simple then reiki within in the first year of finding that attunement i decided that i would learn to be a healer to assist in developing my energetic body which i did not know could grow or i should say raise to higher levels until i started reading about "light/rainbow/diamond bodies" that is when i realize i had all the time i need to start working on my self to become better with my abilities and uncover new ones over time. So i am happy and hoping that within these few years ahead i'll be lead further down my path into the understanding of what my other spiritual bodies are like or even if my soul it self it manly multi-existantial

Hope to be very active in this forum!

Hello TaoBums and other users, I am 36 year old epileptic man. Still unemployed and dependent on my parents. The few times I held a job I started becoming unconscious at work. Got to the point where even my father refused to hire me. My doctors claim stress is the trigger to my seizures. I have also had a few psychotic episodes. In a few months, they are going to assign me to an assisted living facility somewhere in India. Not sure about the details. I will become a trust fund baby when they pass away but they don't believe I can survive on my own. I never thought of myself as disabled, I am not sure if I should fight against this path or accept it until it is no longer an option. I am currently reading The Empty Boat and The Pathless Path by Osho. Only a little way in but makes for interesting reading. Hope I can ask question about my doubts and get clarifications through this forum, Regards, Anoop Alex

Or, in English "Peace be with you." I'm new to these forums, and I'm also very new to this "Tao" thing as well. I'm so new to it that beyond still trying to understand what some of the poems mean in the Tao Te Ching I have no idea what to do or where to go. I have a feeling that is almost a good thing though, as long as I'm mindful of it and the possibilities that could arise. A little background on me: I'm an American woman in her mid 20's. Engaged, marrying next year to a Muslim husband. Big time gamer, geek, nerd (w/e you want to call it these days). Lifelong seeker. Since I could form the word "God" I've probably been seeking some kind of higher calling or purpose. Attended a Christian elementary school that pretty much killed every possible chance of me ever being a Christian. Studied(ing) Islam beginning in my late teens. Began wearing the hijab, dressing modestly, praying, sometimes fasting, etc. I've also worked in nightlife and been a model. I left those lifestyles behind after a few short years because I felt they offered me nothing in the way of progress as a soul, just a lot of materialistic and carnal noise. I studied philosophy in college. (Surprise!) In my very, very, very brief studies of this path I have seen the phrase on a few blogs, "You don't become a Taoist, you just realize you are one.", or something to that effect. I guess that's where I stand on the precipice of. I've come to admit some very harsh truths to myself about what I believe about the nature of God and the nature of, well, nature, and our relationship to it. I guess mainstream society and my Islamic disposition made it easy to push these things down, but I've had enough. I'm tired of tossing and turning in bed and living with mental discomfort about my beliefs. It's stifling. I'm not going to go into explicit detail about every single thing, but I'd be happy to talk more about it if someone wants to know more. Overall, I'm just hear to learn and hear people's opinions. I learned a lot about Islam that way and I felt it worked pretty well for me. Just listening and asking questions and talking with others. After all, this site if "conversations on the way" right? hehe I like it! Anyways, I'm open to any and all recommended reading and other suggestions about supplementing my study of this path. On the surface it resonates with me a lot, on a very basic level just as someone or something that exists. Really, I'd love any basic guidance for a neophyte seeker. I'll close with a verse from the Qur'an that stirred the first inkling of the Tao in me: "And to Allah belongs the east and the west. So wherever you [might] turn, there is the Face of Allah. Indeed, Allah is all-Encompassing and Knowing." - Qur'an 2:115

Hello Tao Bums, I am a Taoist martial artist and I enjoy reading your topics so I figured I'd drop in and join the forum! I am relatively new to internal but have practiced martial arts for almost 14 years and internal specifically for almost 4. At my school we practice Chen Tai Chi & Silk Reeling, Xingyi, Bagua Zhang, some Praying Mantis and Shandong weaponry, and a creative martial art called Tao style created by our Sifu. Tao has always resonated deeply with me ever since I first came across a Tao Te Ching in high school. In life I am an artist, astrologer (currently using western tropical, hoping to explore the akashic records soon), and teach some qigong and martial arts on a basic level OK, I hope this is a good introduction! I get nervous about these things. Look forward to being a part of the community.

Hi folks. I usually just tend to read forums but this one seems to pretty popular so I decided to join. I enjoy philosophy, metaphysics, exercise, and a good laugh! :-)

Hello, I am a student in East Asian Studies. My current focus is on Chinese philosophy both pre-modern and contemporary. I look forward to discussing your views on any aspects of Chinese thought and its impact on your outlook in life. I am a Malaysian on a short tour to the College de France (Paris) and the University of Chicago. Thank you in advance for your participation in our conversations. Regards, hamida

Hello everyone, I am very happy to find a community like this. I just began my journey into Taoism in September and I am interested in see everyone's views and beliefs. Sorry, I am a little awkward...

Hello Taoist Bums participants, it is nice to be among you to discuss topics of interest I wanted to say thanks to Vic for the nice words he mentioned. The DVD he is using to train will soon be unavailable, I am in the process of shooting a new series, which I believe will be even more effective and help additional people to learn Floating Monk Qigong I enjoyed making that DVD, but I think there was room for improvement Sifu Jeff