Taoist Physical Exercise?

[11:33]

I am wondering about what Taoists think about physical exercise. I know they have tons of qigong, and some of it is physical in nature, especially the martial qigong stances, etc. I also know that they don't think you should over-exert yourself as this will deplete the chi in your organs, which actually weakens your longevity. But I am pretty sure they think exercise is good up until you start sweating? Correct me if I'm wrong please.

 

So what are some traditional kinds of Taoist exercise? Qigong walking? Qigong Hiking? Anything? I'm curious to know

 

All the Best,

Alex

[evZENy]

I guess it depends who are the "Taoists" :-)

Some techniques discussed in "Opening the dragon gate"

Then you have the more physical aspect of T'ai Chi, Pa Kua, Hsing I and Wu Tang, for example.

I believe one can not neglect the body and focus on mind and spirit alone.

The Chinese philosophy sees them all as one, hence all have to be equally cared about and cultivated.

 

That said, I know many who believe that if you cultivate, purify, store etc. enough Chi, it will take care of the body problems.

I personally doubt it and take care of my body as well.

Edited June 3, 2009 by evZENy

[Ramon25]

Scott sonnons system of intuflow, clubbells is great. opens up all the channels, heals the joints, provides exercise. The original daoist martial arts are quite physical. Chen the (original) tai chi, bagua, xing yi. well hua to was against exausting the body but was up for a good sweat. from what I understand if you focus only on subtle energies you weaken the bodys dense nature (not good). Yin/yang my friend. Certain types of exercised aimed at the body can carry over to the channels and mind/emotions like scoott sonnons stuff, yoga, pilates and martial arts certain qi gungs.Vice versa many meditations and subtle energie practices aimed at the emotions/mind and channels carry over to physical body. You cannot have one without the other, body and mind are one, just some practices focus more on one aspect but to much of either will disbalance the system. the meditations address what cannot be done through exercise channels, emotions, quality of internal organs ect and exercises dense nature maintains the bodys structure. Remember though that the original intent of longevity was to live long enough to grow a powerful spiritual life. Good luck

[Siliconvalley1]

Taoist stretches - as some call them, seem to be good physical exercises. Jeff Primack has a bunch on his program. My earlier Tai chi teacher taught us a bunch too and insisted on them pretty severely. There seem to be a bunch of different such sets used for warm up. When I was doing these religiously, I stopped working out altogether.

[Iskote]

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Edited June 7, 2009 by Iskote

[DaoChild]

Lots of Bagua and Xingyi training is by nature very exhausting, and you will certainly sweat and be tired.

 

The reason why these exist? Taoists were always after health and longevity.

 

You can't cultivate just the spiritual/energetic and expect to live a long life. The physical body has different practices that require it to be maintained, and I'm sure you've heard of tons of famous energy healers (especially recently) that die young -- Before 70. You can't cultivate the spirit and expect the physical body (subject to the laws of nature) to live long as well.

 

You need exercise to keep the physical body strong, remember the Buddhist monks when Bodidharma showed up at the shaolin temple.

[11:33]

All monastic monks don't practice martial arts though, I don't think, do they?

 

Curious: who are the energy healers who died in their 60's?

[Ramon25]

Yes, exactly, the more you focus on spirit alone the weaker the physical body becomes. Also sending out alot of energy to people (healing) will suck you dry one way or another. I have been realzing latley aswell that really advanced energy practices, are not conductive to good health, not in todays world. That simpler methods like , inner smile, bone breathing, deep breathing, basic three dantien work, basic 5 element stuff that trunks has laid out, spinal breathing, accupressure, self massage, zhan zuanhg, chi gung, 6 sounds ect is much better for health and easier to balance properly and also if trully mastered each of these probably has alot to offer in terms of spiritual growth from what i hear. I was talking to a dim mak practioner and he told me that the Micro orbit weakens the physical body. he said that in dim mak to weaaken an opponent you swipe the energy up the back or down the front then you strike. You can actually kill someone that way from what I understood. Thats dim mak though. Anyway I also think creation was right when he said that really advanced chi manipulation should be done in a teachers presence. All the best to everyone.

[WhiteTiger]

Yes, exactly, the more you focus on spirit alone the weaker the physical body becomes. Also sending out alot of energy to people (healing) will suck you dry one way or another. I have been realzing latley aswell that really advanced energy practices, are not conductive to good health, not in todays world. That simpler methods like , inner smile, bone breathing, deep breathing, basic three dantien work, basic 5 element stuff that trunks has laid out, spinal breathing, accupressure, self massage, zhan zuanhg, chi gung, 6 sounds ect is much better for health and easier to balance properly and also if trully mastered each of these probably has alot to offer in terms of spiritual growth from what i hear. I was talking to a dim mak practioner and he told me that the Micro orbit weakens the physical body. he said that in dim mak to weaaken an opponent you swipe the energy up the back or down the front then you strike. You can actually kill someone that way from what I understood. Thats dim mak though. Anyway I also think creation was right when he said that really advanced chi manipulation should be done in a teachers presence. All the best to everyone.

 

I think you should understand that there is a big difference between people marketing whats called "Advanced practices" on top of making sure people have the ability/body/energy to do actual advanced practices healthy.

 

That being said... stuff like bone breathing, are beginner, intermediate and advanced practices. It all depends on how far you've gone with the practice.

 

Same thing goes for classic Zhan Zhuang

 

All monastic monks don't practice martial arts though, I don't think, do they?

 

Many or most don't practice martial arts. But a greater amount know them. (meaning practitioners that don't practice them may still know some martial arts at a very deep level)

 

Not that I'm an authority on the matter. Just my humble observation.

 

Peace,

sincerely wt

[Ramon25]

You mean that these practices are advanced when you master them? In that case that is a good thing.

[DaoChild]

All monastic monks don't practice martial arts though, I don't think, do they?

 

Curious: who are the energy healers who died in their 60's?

 

A recent one is Grandmaster Choa Kok Sui, who founded "Pranic Healing" and was considered a miracle worker by some. He died at age 53, yet (anecdotally) was curing people of serious chronic and other fatal illnesses. I actually use lots of his training methods since they produce stronger sensations of Qi than I've felt in most Qigong.

 

Also, no most monks do not practice martial arts. It depends on the region where you go. I guess it's rather Ironic that even many of the martial artists and taoist cultivators don't live all that long. Most of the famous ones die between 65 and 80. So I'm not quite sure where their longevity goes, considering that that's right around our average life expectancy eating hot dogs and drinking soda.

Edited June 4, 2009 by DaoChild

[Ramon25]

They usually go in good healthy though, not completly blown to shit. Maybe its that their spirit is ready to go?

[JEN_A_KINS]

try reading the book, "The Tao of Heath, Sex and Longevity" by Daniel Reid....there are several different examples of exercises

[Ramon25]

OI have been thinking about this and think I got and answer. Alchemy at least alot of internal forms is not really about life, its about death. Inernal energy practices go and transform jing into qi then into shen. How would that not weaken the physical body? It will give streghth tp spirit but..... Then we have the whole transforming sexual energy and lower energys into higher ones, again how is that good for the body? Sealing senses, kan and li, the orbit, the three treasures, birthing an immortal fetus, healing, emmiting Ect ect. these are not really practices aimed at longevity of the "physical body". How many daoist do make to old age in great health? Alot, with some amazing cases. What the difference? That there practices were usually not as transforming to the lower energy's as others were. Now "healing" the lower energy's is one thing, healing the emotions in the organs, giving power to the their elements, cleansing and opening channles, breathing exercises, "some" Higher work. Those are all still going to enhance the body i think, but transorming energy's is another story. I f you are bringing lots of energy from above into the lower I think you asking for early death or preparing your spirit to leave the body by speeding up its evolution. In a book I got it talks about how in an unelightened person the flow of energy in the orbit is up the front down the back and in a master/immortal its up the back down the front, so basically you are speeding up the spirit and giving it power with the orbit which in turns speeds up the prorcess of leaving the body i mean thats what the practice is there for in the first place.Any thoughts?

[Creation]

OI have been thinking about this and think I got and answer. Alchemy at least alot of internal forms is not really about life, its about death.

Wow...I think you are profoundly mistaken...

 

When your kundalini raised to your head, did it suck the energy out of your lower centers? Do you feel like you don't have any energy left in your lower chakras? If so I think something is wrong.

 

Consider this:

 

Jing-Qi-Shen-Wu-Tao is the way of return, sailing against life's current, reconnecting with your Original Nature.

 

Just because you have completed jing to chi doesn't mean you no longer have jing. Just because you have completed chi to shen does not mean you don't have chi. Etc.

 

One must gather the ingredients before making the transmutation.

 

No, indeed, alchemy is the Way of Life.

[Ramon25]

Wow...I think you are profoundly mistaken...

 

When your kundalini raised to your head, did it suck the energy out of your lower centers? Do you feel like you don't have any energy left in your lower chakras? If so I think something is wrong.

 

Consider this:

 

Jing-Qi-Shen-Wu-Tao is the way of return, sailing against life's current, reconnecting with your Original Nature.

 

Just because you have completed jing to chi doesn't mean you no longer have jing. Just because you have completed chi to shen does not mean you don't have chi. Etc.

 

One must gather the ingredients before making the transmutation.

 

No, indeed, alchemy is the Way of Life.

 

Then why do so many Alchemist/energy practioners die young? After kundalini i definatley dont have the energy i used to physically. I have energy left in my lower chackras for sure but kundalni is not qi. Internal alchemy is not about about longevity, it is about an immortal soul, it prepares you to leave the body hence why some of thge practices ask you to exit the body so you know what that like for the time of death. certain tools of alchemy can be used to extend life. But many of the longevity practices aside from alchemy are there to preserve the body long enough to complete that task. If all you do is internal alchemy your body will become weaker and weaker while your energy body gets stronger thats why you need to balance it out with more physical things like martial arts, qi gung, self massage, zhan zuang, nutrition ect

Edited June 4, 2009 by Ramon25

[Siliconvalley1]

Then why do so many Alchemist/energy practioners die young? After kundalini i definatley dont have the energy i used to physically. I have energy left in my lower chackras for sure but kundalni is not qi.

 

 

Are you sure the awakening was really of Kundalini and not an outburst of Prana. 99% of the times, people confuse pranic phenomena as Kundalini. Some schools of yoga hold that Kundalini is sukshma prana or the subtle-most form of Prana and some disagree with that - but most seem to agree they are connected. Also, the awakening is not always unpleasant or leaving one in a state of darkness, depression and lack of energy. That would only mean that the "awakening" was forced. Most yogic techniques, which employ "hatha" or force, thus run into the risk of such an awakening. Focus on directly awakening Kundalini or that awakening being an explicit goal was popularized by yogis such as Matsyendranatha and Gorakshanatha. But the ancient practice was to let Kundalini blossom by herself, and that was mostly a side-effect of the main practice. The ways to directly awaken Kundalini and focus on her aspect as a force seemed to have gained popularity in the medieval period.

 

But a student of tantra however identifies Kundalini with his own chosen deity and all her assumed characters - such as grace, beauty, love, warmth etc. are seen in the ascent of Kundalini as well. The kundalini is no longer a physical force who needs to be guided, carefully prepared for or watched - she is divine, all-knowing and concerned about the aspirant like a caring mother. This approach can be slower, but is safer. It is the traditional practice of many yogis to employ deity yoga as the primary method and use hatha techniques only to compliment. And the transformation of Kundalini from being a physical energy to the Universal Consciousness that she really is (i.e. from jiva kundalini to vishva kundalini) is what really grants one Enlightenment (just to clarify, I am a hardcore Eternalist ) and when one is really centered around this higher goal, and not merely centered around a physical or energetic phenomenon, there seldom are many troubles.

 

From a personal experience, a true awakening fills you with power, vigor and an all expanding awareness - which may not be steady but flashes now and then - and there is a true feeling of being connected with HER. And gradually, the intense vibrations or spanda are replaced by a total silence where you just ARE. She is frequently referred to as the greatest doctor - for as she blossoms, all diseases, of the body and mind, are cleansed as also the vasanas or impressions which are the causes behind such manifestations - and finally also the cure for Samsara when she reveals herself as the true and unified consciousness. She fills every pore with energy, for she is shakti afterall until one is vibrating so fast that there is absolutely no vibration. Not sure how much sense it makes, but with my very limited understanding, this is how I see it.

Edited June 5, 2009 by Siliconvalley1

[Iskote]

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Edited June 7, 2009 by Iskote