Internal Energy Generation (QiGong, Taoist Yoga) vs. External Energy Generation

[DaoChild]

Good evening ladies and gents,

 

So as I was browsing through "Your Hands Can Heal You" (Book on Pranic Healing), the method used to energize an energy that is depleted of Qi is called "the Water pump".

 

Their reasoning is that internal generation methods (taoist yoga, taiji, qigong) only cause you to accumulate Qi, which can be used, wasted, and which also takes time, and is finite.

 

External energy generation (where you leave one palm up to be receiving Qi from the cosmos, and one faced forward to project and energize an area) on the other hand is limitless.

 

So my question naturally is: has anyone else heard of this? This has been on my mind for quite some time. If Qi comes to us through the cosmos, why would we bother cultivating it inside us? Why not just "siphon" it from heaven and earth, rather than use lengthy cultivation practices for it to develop inside us?

 

Thanks for the responses

 

By the way, although a relative novice to energy healing, I have yet to use the water pump yet. So I cannot verify the efficacy in healing. But, I have had very very strong "Qi sensations" doing the other exercises they recommend. Most of them have been working a lot stronger than Qigong, because supposedly The Master who invented Pranic Healing traveled through India & Asia, taking the best & strongest practices from Tibet, Yoga, Taoism, etc.

 

Any thoughts?

[Spiritual_Aspirant]

I am a practitioner of Pranic Healing myself. The advantage of external energy generation is you don't have to wait for years for your internal energy to build up to be able to heal. Also, simultaneously external energy generation also energizes you so it's a win-win situation. When it comes to healing, both internal and external energy generation are effective, but using your internal energy to heal might deplete your energy supply. Cultiivating your internal energy is still necessary for spiritual development. In Arhatic Yoga, which is the spiritual practice complementary to Pranic Healing (all arhatic yogis are pranic healers), practitioners are also taught to cultivate internal energy.

[Thunder_Gooch]

Listen to those who have already accomplished the goals you have set for your life, ignore those who haven't.

 

 

Good evening ladies and gents,

 

So as I was browsing through "Your Hands Can Heal You" (Book on Pranic Healing), the method used to energize an energy that is depleted of Qi is called "the Water pump".

 

Their reasoning is that internal generation methods (taoist yoga, taiji, qigong) only cause you to accumulate Qi, which can be used, wasted, and which also takes time, and is finite.

 

External energy generation (where you leave one palm up to be receiving Qi from the cosmos, and one faced forward to project and energize an area) on the other hand is limitless.

 

So my question naturally is: has anyone else heard of this? This has been on my mind for quite some time. If Qi comes to us through the cosmos, why would we bother cultivating it inside us? Why not just "siphon" it from heaven and earth, rather than use lengthy cultivation practices for it to develop inside us?

 

Thanks for the responses

 

By the way, although a relative novice to energy healing, I have yet to use the water pump yet. So I cannot verify the efficacy in healing. But, I have had very very strong "Qi sensations" doing the other exercises they recommend. Most of them have been working a lot stronger than Qigong, because supposedly The Master who invented Pranic Healing traveled through India & Asia, taking the best & strongest practices from Tibet, Yoga, Taoism, etc.

 

Any thoughts?

[Ya Mu]

Good evening ladies and gents,

 

So as I was browsing through "Your Hands Can Heal You" (Book on Pranic Healing), the method used to energize an energy that is depleted of Qi is called "the Water pump".

 

Their reasoning is that internal generation methods (taoist yoga, taiji, qigong) only cause you to accumulate Qi, which can be used, wasted, and which also takes time, and is finite.

 

External energy generation (where you leave one palm up to be receiving Qi from the cosmos, and one faced forward to project and energize an area) on the other hand is limitless.

 

So my question naturally is: has anyone else heard of this? This has been on my mind for quite some time. If Qi comes to us through the cosmos, why would we bother cultivating it inside us? Why not just "siphon" it from heaven and earth, rather than use lengthy cultivation practices for it to develop inside us?

 

Thanks for the responses

 

By the way, although a relative novice to energy healing, I have yet to use the water pump yet. So I cannot verify the efficacy in healing. But, I have had very very strong "Qi sensations" doing the other exercises they recommend. Most of them have been working a lot stronger than Qigong, because supposedly The Master who invented Pranic Healing traveled through India & Asia, taking the best & strongest practices from Tibet, Yoga, Taoism, etc.

 

Any thoughts?

 

You can pull in energy from all the pores of your body. You may find you can read about all this for a very long time and get nowhere and stand a very good chance of getting in trouble. AS far as healing goes, one single workshop with your teacher of choice would go a long ways toward helping you understand these things.

 

This thread is very applicable to what you ask about.

[WhiteTiger]

You can pull in energy from all the pores of your body. You may find you can read about all this for a very long time and get nowhere and stand a very good chance of getting in trouble. AS far as healing goes, one single workshop with your teacher of choice would go a long ways toward helping you understand these things.

 

This is very true

 

I state this NOT specifically for the profit of Ya Mu (although he seems to knows a bunch more than me) Rather for the true wisdom it offers.

 

Notice: I only validate the wisdom not the person whom said it. Wisdom for the sakes of wisdom.

 

Peace, Love

wt

[Ya Mu]

This is very true

 

I state this NOT specifically for the profit of Ya Mu (although he seems to knows a bunch more than me) Rather for the true wisdom it offers.

 

Notice: I only validate the wisdom not the person whom said it. Wisdom for the sakes of wisdom.

 

Peace, Love

wt

 

Is this a personal cut on me? Hey, I'm a nice guy

What I teach stands on it's own with students throughout the USA who use this to help others with amazing result rates.

[WhiteTiger]

Humm...

 

I wasn't trying to take a cut at you.

 

From what I've heard you definitely sound like a good energy healer. But I haven't worked with you so I can't really know. It has a little to do with me seeing or feeling what you can do on an earthly level.

 

Actually I thought I was giving you an extremely high compliment. Saying how your wisdom on the subject is sound. I can't speak on anything else is all I'm saying because I haven't taken a seminar with you. I haven't seen you do anything on an earthly level. I also said I didn't state any of this specifically for your benefit in profit. Although don't get me wrong if people wanna go to your seminars that's great. I might wanna try some day because of your good wisdom and what you know on the subject.

 

It wasn't a cut at you at all.

 

The difference between me able to be nice and being nice are two different things. Wisdom for the love of wisdom.

 

Peace,

wt

 

Good evening ladies and gents,

 

So as I was browsing through "Your Hands Can Heal You" (Book on Pranic Healing), the method used to energize an energy that is depleted of Qi is called "the Water pump".

 

Their reasoning is that internal generation methods (taoist yoga, taiji, qigong) only cause you to accumulate Qi, which can be used, wasted, and which also takes time, and is finite.

 

External energy generation (where you leave one palm up to be receiving Qi from the cosmos, and one faced forward to project and energize an area) on the other hand is limitless.

 

This is just not fully correct. They are missing many details about Taoist Yoga, Taiji, and qigong. Although qigong is all dependent on what your learn.

 

Prana and Taiji, and Taoist Yoga, qigong and other things that could be classified as Taoist practices all use the same energy.

 

Peace,

wt

[DaoChild]

If it's all the same, why bother with internal Qi generation / accumulation? If you can generate more, faster, with external, then why internal?

 

Humm...

 

I wasn't trying to take a cut at you.

 

From what I've heard you definitely sound like a good energy healer. But I haven't worked with you so I can't really know. It has a little to do with me seeing or feeling what you can do on an earthly level.

 

Actually I thought I was giving you an extremely high compliment. Saying how your wisdom on the subject is sound. I can't speak on anything else is all I'm saying because I haven't taken a seminar with you. I haven't seen you do anything on an earthly level. I also said I didn't state any of this specifically for your benefit in profit. Although don't get me wrong if people wanna go to your seminars that's great. I might wanna try some day because of your good wisdom and what you know on the subject.

 

It wasn't a cut at you at all.

 

The difference between me able to be nice and being nice are two different things. Wisdom for the love of wisdom.

 

Peace,

wt

This is just not fully correct. They are missing many details about Taoist Yoga, Taiji, and qigong. Although qigong is all dependent on what your learn.

 

Prana and Taiji, and Taoist Yoga, qigong and other things that could be classified as Taoist practices all use the same energy.

 

Peace,

wt

[Ya Mu]

Humm...

 

I wasn't trying to take a cut at you.

 

From what I've heard you definitely sound like a good energy healer. But I haven't worked with you so I can't really know. It has a little to do with me seeing or feeling what you can do on an earthly level.

 

Actually I thought I was giving you an extremely high compliment. Saying how your wisdom on the subject is sound. I can't speak on anything else is all I'm saying because I haven't taken a seminar with you. I haven't seen you do anything on an earthly level. I also said I didn't state any of this specifically for your benefit in profit. Although don't get me wrong if people wanna go to your seminars that's great. I might wanna try some day because of your good wisdom and what you know on the subject.

 

It wasn't a cut at you at all.

 

The difference between me able to be nice and being nice are two different things. Wisdom for the love of wisdom.

 

Peace,

wt

This is just not fully correct. They are missing many details about Taoist Yoga, Taiji, and qigong. Although qigong is all dependent on what your learn.

 

Prana and Taiji, and Taoist Yoga, qigong and other things that could be classified as Taoist practices all use the same energy.

 

Peace,

wt

 

OK, thanks for the specifics. Don't blame you for being skeptical until you have interacted. WE ALL need to do this. Far too many read a book or two and think that it is the real thing, or hear someone else say what a good teacher someone is, or what a great Taoist scholar someone is, until we actually meet the teacher and find out they obviously haven't cultivated; the person only thought they were a good teacher based upon the personality and/or scholastic achievements. AND there sure is a lot of nonsense going around that is called qigong/taiji/yoga/taoism.

 

 

If it's all the same, why bother with internal Qi generation / accumulation? If you can generate more, faster, with external, then why internal?

 

It is not all the same. Here is one extremely simplified way to look at it. You know how the power line comes into your house and the electricity lights up the lightbulbs? First it comes into a transformer before the line extends to your house. If it was all the same, then why not just take the direct line into the lightbulbs? The reason is, it wouldn't work, it would not be conditioned to be the output desired to accomplish the task. Substitute the electricity for qi, the transformer for dan tian and the incoming powerline as the universe.

 

The other thing is that with internal cultivation we actually raise our energy body vibration frequency. When we do that we are much better at manipulating the energy and can call on different frequencies as needed. In this case we would be using our own energy and dan tian more for transmutation so as to help change the energy into something that has a specific manifestation. But we pull the energy from everywhere and through all pores of our body, from inside, from outside, and from other dimensions.

 

Goodness. You keep asking all these questions but will not seek a teacher. I feel for you, but see you are willing to spend dollars for books/video. I'll offer this: Come to one of my next 2 workshops. Pay some small amount that you decide on (need energy exchange). After that practice the techniques for 90 days; then decide if you think it was worth something and pay that something that you think it was worth or not. If you don't like me then there are several others that post here that could help you FAR FAR more than you will ever get out of the books.

[Iskote]

Edited June 13, 2009 by Iskote

[Ya Mu]

...

From my perspective, 'Dao Child' is taking a good practical approach. With better understanding

of the basic concepts one should be able to make a more informed decision on how better to

proceed, no?

Not from my perspective. See how all the confusion was gained from reading a book which led to false conclusions? Anyone can gain a perspective from reading 10,000 books but what does that perspective mean? Without the experience of the thing it actually doesn't have a whole lot of meaning. I can read everything you wrote in the above post and agree with it from a Chinese medicine perspective but it tells me absolutely nothing about the experience of qi cultivation or how to manipulate qi.

[Iskote]

Not from my perspective. See how all the confusion was gained from reading a book which led to false conclusions? Anyone can gain a perspective from reading 10,000 books but what does that perspective mean? Without the experience of the thing it actually doesn't have a whole lot of meaning. I can read everything you wrote in the above post and agree with it from a Chinese medicine perspective but it tells me absolutely nothing about the experience of qi cultivation or how to manipulate qi.

 

The problem as I see it is there are so many practices out there. There is medical qigong, martial qigong,

spiritual or mystical qigong, etc., and no clear dividing line between them all. Also, many teachers teach various combinations of these different types of practices. If someone has a better understanding of what the

approaches of the various practices are, and what exactly they are trying to achieve, it seems reasonable

that one can then make a more informed decision on what route they want to go.

 

Whether theory is written, or transmitted in person through conversation, or through demonstration,

it is still theory. Some teachers prefer to emphasize theory at first and some prefer to emphasize practice

at first. Some teachers prefer to teach both right from the get go. But I don't think that's the point here.

I think it is more to do with getting a better understanding what the various approaches do and why.

With such information one can then make a more informed choice on what they want to practice.

Once they have made their choice, they can learn what the teacher is teaching, and practice the

way the teacher instructs them to practice, but at least they will be practicing something that is

likely taking them in the direction they want to go.

 

Again, I hope others will contribute to this thread, as I am interested in learning about the various

approaches and exactly why they are done as well.

 

 

Best wishes from Iskote...

Edited June 13, 2009 by Iskote

[Ya Mu]

...

I think it is more to do with getting a better understanding what the various approaches do and why.

With such information one can then make a more informed choice on what they want to practice.

...

 

Here is where we differ in opinion. I think there is no possible way (reading it from a book? Someone telling you something?) to actually gain that understanding without experiencing the thing. Chinese medicine is a good example. Read several books on TCM. Does anyone understand what qi actually is from reading them? No way! One has to experience the qi. Does anyone actually understand how to manipulate the qi from reading those books? No way! How can they manipulate something that they have never experienced?

 

I do agree someone should research something before jumping into it. But that doesn't actually mean they know what they really are getting into.

[Iskote]

Here is where we differ in opinion. I think there is no possible way (reading it from a book? Someone telling you something?) to actually gain that understanding without experiencing the thing. Chinese medicine is a good example. Read several books on TCM. Does anyone understand what qi actually is from reading them? No way! One has to experience the qi. Does anyone actually understand how to manipulate the qi from reading those books? No way! How can they manipulate something that they have never experienced?

Even so, a TCM practitioner can still effect change in the health of a patient,

so their knowledge at least helps. BTW, don't you have a book out on qigong?

Maybe I am confusing you with someone else?

 

 

I do agree someone should research something before jumping into it. But that doesn't actually mean they know what they really are getting into.

At least they will have some idea of what they are undertaking, and maybe some

idea on how effective the practice is as well. There are teachers teaching stuff out there

that other teachers say is ineffective or even harmful. I know it is common for teachers

of one type of practice to criticize other practices though, so one should probably take all

such assessments with a grain of salt.

 

Anyway, my intention was not to hijack Dao Child's thread.

 

Getting back to Dao Child's question on whether the method of drawing qi from the 'cosmos'

in one hand and redirecting it out the other hand for healing purposes really is an effective

method for healing, and whether it drains or at least impacts one's internal energy or not,

I don't have any experience with that. It sounds similar to Reiki healing where the energy

is supposed to come from outside the self, and the Reiki healer just channels and directs it.

Not sure though. It would seem that if you are drawing energy from one hand and emitting it

from the other hand that you would still be impacting your internal energy in some way, since

the energy is passing through you, but I don't know. Also how would you be able to tell if

you are not also emitting some of your own energy as well? Would you feel immediate effects

if that were the case? I tried to clarify a bit in my other post on what is meant by the term internal

energy, so maybe someone else can comment more on the effectiveness of such methods ('water pump'),

and if or how it impacts one's internal energy.

 

 

Best wishes from iskote...

Edited June 13, 2009 by Iskote

[DaoChild]

Hi Ya Mu,

I have experienced Qi, even in my limited experience of practicing multiple hours of Qigong for the past 2-3 months. Although I would say I'm not experienced, I definitely know the sensations, the full body buzz, the extreme heat in the palms of my hands.

 

And I completely agree with you about a teacher. I disagree when you say I'm so unwilling to find one -- on the contrary, that's been one of my main desires for over 10 years, yet I've never been able to have a teacher except in martial arts.

 

Once again I agree that the practice (experience) is the most important part of many things in life-- energy healing included. Unfortunately, a biproduct of the modern age is that traditional wisdom, oral wisdom, is fading very quickly. Parents no longer need to give their kids the "birds and the bees" talk, and grandparents are viewed as boring, and uninteresting. It's not easy to find a teacher anymore.

 

Where are you located for seminars?

 

Edit: Iskote, I can confirm the immediate effects of the practice, but like Ya Mu mentions, I can't notice if it comes from myself, and/or how to localise sick Qi. But from what I've experienced, the exercises are much, much stronger than most Qigong I've experienced.

Edited June 14, 2009 by DaoChild

[Ya Mu]

It would seem that if you are drawing energy from one hand and emitting it

from the other hand that you would still be impacting your internal energy in some way, since

the energy is passing through you...

Bingo - I think you know more than you are letting on...

 

It's not easy to find a teacher anymore.

 

Where are you located for seminars?

 

http://www.stillnessmovement.com

http://www.qigongamerica.com

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?showto...llness-movement

This thread

[Iskote]

...

Iskote, I can confirm the immediate effects of the practice, but like Ya Mu mentions, I can't notice if it comes from myself, and/or how to localise sick Qi. But from what I've experienced, the exercises are much, much stronger than most Qigong I've experienced.

 

Yes, I have tried such practices as well. I know the sensations you are speaking of. There

can be all kinds of sensations. In my experience the effectiveness of one's practice is not really

measured by sensations though. Different types of practices may produce various sensations or other experiences at various stages, and sometimes you may not feel much in the way of sensations at all.

Such things can vary quite a bit as your practice progresses. Also, some people seem to be less sensitive to

such things, but still get all the benefits, so sensations and the like are really not a reliable way to

judge effectiveness of practice or progress IMO.

 

My main practice is stillness meditaton so I don't really focus on such things, although sensations

of all types come and go. I am more interested in the results. I am starting to become more interested

in qigong healing methods as well.

 

Best wishes from Iskote...

Edited June 14, 2009 by Iskote