Controlling sexual desire

[Maddie]

Well, if she was the most desirable woman for you. You'd feel different now.

 

Was her unattractiveness to be blamed for your loss of energy?

No she is attractive. My loss of energy is due to me allowing her to take my energy lol.

[Maddie]

I'm in a bit of a quandary where I don't know what to do. So I cultivate a lot last week and suddenly everyone wants to hang out with me. My roommate hangs out with me two days in a row where as lately shes always with her bf. The first day she tries to take my energy but I stop it. So day two she comes back from round two. At this point I decide just to make her happy so there won't be a day three I just give her the energy.

 

Well its day three and that part worked cause shes off with her bf again, but I've been so utterly exhausted today, and on top of that even feeling a little bummed out, which I had not been feeling for a while now. Last week when I was meditating so much I was in a really good mood.

 

So from where I'm at it seems like you either cultivate a lot and then everyone wants your energy and won't leave you alone until they get it, or you give it to them and then your all tired, bummed out, and then ignored by everyone lol.

 

Hmmm what on earth is the answer?

[voidisyinyang]

I'm in a bit of a quandary where I don't know what to do. So I cultivate a lot last week and suddenly everyone wants to hang out with me. My roommate hangs out with me two days in a row where as lately shes always with her bf. The first day she tries to take my energy but I stop it. So day two she comes back from round two. At this point I decide just to make her happy so there won't be a day three I just give her the energy.

 

Well its day three and that part worked cause shes off with her bf again, but I've been so utterly exhausted today, and on top of that even feeling a little bummed out, which I had not been feeling for a while now. Last week when I was meditating so much I was in a really good mood.

 

So from where I'm at it seems like you either cultivate a lot and then everyone wants your energy and won't leave you alone until they get it, or you give it to them and then your all tired, bummed out, and then ignored by everyone lol.

 

Hmmm what on earth is the answer?

 

Yeah I've been using mind concentration when the attack comes and it seems to be working pretty well.

 

But I've heard the qigong master say - well a lot of times after you a heal a person they just go back to the way they were - in other words even though they experienced a qigong healing it does not really make them appreciate qigong. haha.

 

Umm.. another thing is that doing qigong tricks won't necessarily change a person's heart and so they are still not really "convinced."

 

Also -- for tantra it's stated that giving the chi energy or shen energy -- it's not a good deal because you get jing energy in return but it takes a ton of jing energy to make chi energy and a ton of chi energy to make shen energy. haha.

 

So yeah I did that for five years for free and so my jing energy is real low now - I have to eat a ton of meat, oil, cholesterol, etc. and then I have to exercise a lot to keep from getting fat - I'm already behind from the winter. haha. But seriously -- ummm -- Chunyi Lin said how he's met a lot of psychics who are obese or either aged too fast because they used their pineal gland energy too much and so their body is trying to compensate.

 

Umm.... so until the third eye is fully open then it's difficult to rebuild the energy - but when the third eye is fully open then the shen energy can recharge fast.

 

So yeah I just use mind concentration, sit in full lotus as much as possible, etc. but I agree it is pretty discouraging. But if you can meditate more then by all means do so. qigong master Jim Nance was meditating 6 to 12 hours a day to fully open his third eye and he still does this! So he said in 2007 he could sit in full lotus for 6 hours with no pain with legs one way and 2 hours with no pain with his legs the other way. haha.

 

So I will go meditate now that your comment has inspired me - quick before I lose the inspiration. It is a spiritual battle but the real message is that you can't lose since the source of the energy is not "you" but rather impersonal consciousness - God or the Emptiness, etc. So the energy was never "yours" to begin with. haha. I know it's a FIERCE lesson to learn on your ego - and yep that is the REAL message of spiritual training. You are not in control. Submission to the higher power is the only way.

[yondaime109]

Every time you get horny, Visualize a giant cold ice cube enveloping your penis.

[oildrops]

I'm in a bit of a quandary where I don't know what to do. So I cultivate a lot last week and suddenly everyone wants to hang out with me. My roommate hangs out with me two days in a row where as lately shes always with her bf. The first day she tries to take my energy but I stop it. So day two she comes back from round two. At this point I decide just to make her happy so there won't be a day three I just give her the energy.

 

Well its day three and that part worked cause shes off with her bf again, but I've been so utterly exhausted today, and on top of that even feeling a little bummed out, which I had not been feeling for a while now. Last week when I was meditating so much I was in a really good mood.

 

So from where I'm at it seems like you either cultivate a lot and then everyone wants your energy and won't leave you alone until they get it, or you give it to them and then your all tired, bummed out, and then ignored by everyone lol.

 

Hmmm what on earth is the answer?

 

I have been in this loop for the last year, I cultivate and then get discouraged by the difficulties interactions bring and then I get into bad habits to become "invisible" again. I am starting to think of it as an ego test. The more energy you get the more you start to feel like the center of the universe. Energy does want to balance out, but assuming that you have more and others have less seems like a bad way to approach it. Rather, you have a different energy, and by giving you can receive the lesson of the person. Why assume they have nothing to give you in return?

[Jetsun]

I'm in a bit of a quandary where I don't know what to do. So I cultivate a lot last week and suddenly everyone wants to hang out with me. My roommate hangs out with me two days in a row where as lately shes always with her bf. The first day she tries to take my energy but I stop it. So day two she comes back from round two. At this point I decide just to make her happy so there won't be a day three I just give her the energy.

 

Well its day three and that part worked cause shes off with her bf again, but I've been so utterly exhausted today, and on top of that even feeling a little bummed out, which I had not been feeling for a while now. Last week when I was meditating so much I was in a really good mood.

 

So from where I'm at it seems like you either cultivate a lot and then everyone wants your energy and won't leave you alone until they get it, or you give it to them and then your all tired, bummed out, and then ignored by everyone lol.

 

Hmmm what on earth is the answer?

This may just be another story created by your mind to create a coherent story around what you are experiencing or to try to regain control, it might not be based in reality.

[C T]

Apparently the false side of the self loves to script dramas so as to assert credence over a person.

 

If energy can really be sucked so easily by 'vamps', i think a lot of the more engaging teachers (from all the different traditions) would have been dried out by now hahaha!

 

People somehow love to weave stories around their practice at the beginning. This takes away the boredom i guess. But they dont realize boredom is quite useful -- its like manure. So the greater the boredom, the better quality it is, the more fuel for practice. That means if thru patience and perseverance the breakthrough comes, it can shatter many many layers of conditioned mental states.

[Maddie]

Every time you get horny, Visualize a giant cold ice cube enveloping your penis.

Yea I was re-reading my narrative and saw how it could be mistaken as a sexual thing. I should therefore specify that there was nothing sexual about this. Nothing physical happened and I had no desire for her, but I can see how the wording might have been somewhat ambiguous.

 

Oildrops. Yea that is a good perspective to look at it through, and I had been considering later that even though I gave her my energy that perhaps I got merit in return? Part of what I was bummed out about was that feeling of loss and thinking that I had worked so hard to make my energy as such and then to loose it. But I remember Dawg on here a while back saying that as he was at the monastery in Thailand how he would be woken up at night as spirits would want to take some of his merit. His dharma teacher told him to let them take it because he would actually get more merit by giving it to them than he lost, so kind of win win.

 

Jetsun and CT. As far as the "reality" of this energy vampirism as opposed to it being a story or script my mind is creating I'll put it this way. The first thing I became aware of was the energetic aspect of this scenario. As I had stated what happened first was that on Monday I was sitting on the couch with my roommate. I was resting with my eyes closed and suddenly I saw/felt/perceived my energy as a field around me (it kind of looked like those pictures you see of the earths magnetic field) and my roommate was absorbing it. I then exerted my will to stop it. On Tuesday she decided to hang out with me again as opposed to her bf which she never does these days, except this time she decides to up the ante and wine and dine me lol. So once again I become aware of several attempts on her part (unconsciously I'm sure) to again absorb my energy. The first few times I once again stop it, but then I start thinking that shes probably not going to quit until she gets what she wants (I figured if I didn't give it to her, she probably want to hang out again for a third day and probably take me to the circus or something lol). Anyways so I finally decide to just let her have the energy so she'll leave me alone haha. Well no sooner had I let her have it then I get very sleepy and go to bed. Sure enough the next day she made plans with her bf and I was yesterdays news haha. The draw back being that I was very tired all yesterday and even a little bummed out. Also at school I was very invisible whereas prior to that I was getting a lot of attention (yes I know ego is involved here, but at least I have awareness of that :-).

 

Drew. So is my consolation prize from giving my rooommate my qi, getting jing from her? Though even if that is the case I use "consolation" tongue in cheek considering how much meditation I had to do last week to convert that qi from jing. Yea that part about Jim Nance sounded familiar to me as last week I was usually doing between 4-5 hours a day in half lotus. Granted even yesterday I did 3+ hours but it felt like I was back at square one, or at least square two, ugh.

[C T]

Thanks for sharing the experience, Dmattwads.

 

Its a blessing to have enough energy to share with other beings.

 

Tonglen, if you study what it is, will give you a transcendent perspective on what giving and taking can do for a person, and release a little of the self-grasping so that you will actually feel more energized when the idea forms in your mind that others are taking your jing.

[Jetsun]

Jetsun and CT. As far as the "reality" of this energy vampirism as opposed to it being a story or script my mind is creating

I'm not going to try deny your own experiences but I would be careful of buying into this stuff too much, the mind is incredibly powerful and is very creative, the power of autosuggestion is immense. Thousands of people practice Qigong and are very sensitive to energy and don't experience this problem. There are healers and carers and therapists in every town who haven't refined their energy to a high level and get sucked on every day who are not exhausted by it.

 

Maybe people want to spend time with you because you are more pleasant after meditation, maybe worrying about losing your energy and stressing about giving it away tires you out more than actually losing it.

[Jetsun]

I was recently reading about traditional Tibetan doctors, when Tibetan doctors train they make a pledge out of compassion to treat anybody who asks even if they have no money for treatment, but in India due to the levels of poor health and poverty they have to treat hundreds of patients a day, thousands a week at all times of the day every day no matter how tired they are as they have made the pledge that they can't turn anyone away. Because they will work for free many people take advantage of this and take advantage of their energy, but the doctors aren't completely stressed out or burned out by this even though they haven't spent tens of years refining their energy.

 

I believe the reason why is because of their Buddhist training by focusing on others out of compassion and serving others you take off the fixation you have on your own self, if the self really is imaginary then maintaining its illusion of central importance must take an enormous amount of energy because you are resisting the entire force of reality, so by adjusting that focus to be on the wellbeing of others you liberate that energy. Which is why many old Lamas in their 70s like the Dalai Lama can continue to work and travel harder than many men in their 20's as they have largely liberated the energy of fixating on their own self and moved it to focus on the wellbeing of others.

Edited May 9, 2013 by Jetsun

[joeblast]

 

The "stillness" is relative as well. If every cell of your body moving at the same speed in the same direction, you can still achieve "stillness". Actually since cell doesn't really move in linear fashion, it's more like every cell inside your body spins in the same direction at its "natrual" frequency. That's why spin/spiral is very important in QiGong/Tai Chi.

 

 

 

 

[Maddie]

I was recently reading about traditional Tibetan doctors, when Tibetan doctors train they make a pledge out of compassion to treat anybody who asks even if they have no money for treatment, but in India due to the levels of poor health and poverty they have to treat hundreds of patients a day, thousands a week at all times of the day every day no matter how tired they are as they have made the pledge that they can't turn anyone away. Because they will work for free many people take advantage of this and take advantage of their energy, but the doctors aren't completely stressed out or burned out by this even though they haven't spent tens of years refining their energy.

 

I believe the reason why is because of their Buddhist training by focusing on others out of compassion and serving others you take off the fixation you have on your own self, if the self really is imaginary then maintaining its illusion of central importance must take an enormous amount of energy because you are resisting the entire force of reality, so by adjusting that focus to be on the wellbeing of others you liberate that energy. Which is why many old Lamas in their 70s like the Dalai Lama can continue to work and travel harder than many men in their 20's as they have largely liberated the energy of fixating on their own self and moved it to focus on the wellbeing of others.

 

I definitely won't disagree that there isn't aspects of ego in all of this to be sorted out, but then again that should not come as a surprise considering the nature of ego and being in Samsara. The catch 22 is that one of the reasons I want to cultivate more is to convert more qi into shen and then with that raised shen to have deeper insight into the nature of ego lol.

 

Though as far as the issue of energy loss I agree that there does exist the possibility to become paranoid about this. In fact at my school I know this one girl who is into Shamanism and she seems to think everyone and their dog drains her energy thus avoiding any self responsibility.

 

On the other hand though we are taught at TCM school that energy loss is a real and common concern. We have one professor who comes from a long and respected lineage of TCM in Taiwan and he said that its very common for new TCM students and practitioners to be drained of qi and get very worn out. So apparently since this is in the TCM culture far and wide it must be more common than perhaps you realize? Granted I got into TCM because I want to help people and enjoy doing so. I'd just prefer to not be made into a zombie to do so lol.

 

In regards to this not being a problem for the many qigong practitioners I was pondering that. That may explain all the monasteries, cave hermits, and the common trend of people into qigong to be some what reclusive. Previously I didn't really understand why it was that the more I cultivated the less I wanted to be out in society as much, but now it makes more sense to me based up this experience. I'll try to explain using this experience as an example.

 

The first thing that happened in this scenario was that my roommate was absorbing my qi field. (In retrospect in the past I had felt this before but didn't understand what was going on, so that also might explain why some people don't complain of this specifically. In retrospect it makes more senses now, as many many hours of cultivation allowed me to perceive the details of what was occurring more clearly). So I'm sitting there with my eye's closed and I am aware of my qi field around me sort of like the earths electromagnetic field. I also perceive her drawing this qi field into herself.

 

I'll skip all the other in between drama that I've already mentioned and just go straight to the part where I just decide to give her the energy. Ok so I let her take this energy. BAM now my external qi field is much weaker and greatly reduced, THEN I get tired. (Its important to note that I allowed her to take the energy first and I felt good, afterwards I became very tired). So I go to bed.

 

Now the rest is what I think happened. This is put together from a combination of direct experience and theoretical knowledge of qigong and TCM. I believe that after she absorbed my qi field that in order to replace the lost qi my middle dan tien had to give up some of its qi as it is the house of qi (electromagnetic spectrum). Once my middle dan tien becomes depleted my lower dan tien has to convert more jing to qi thus depleting it of electrochemical energy (jing). I believe it was at this point that I felt tired. So everything goes through this chain reaction to establish rebalance but at a reduced state of energy all around.

 

This would explain very well what I experienced the next day. I noticed that I felt far more acutely what other people were thinking and feeling (especially if it was not of good will). This I believe can be explained by the weakened qi field that was not able to have the same buffering effect. I also felt more bummed out and as the middle dan tien is the center of emotions this would make sense as well. Even more specifically the heart and lungs both reside within the sphere of the middle dan tien and as their emotions are joy and grief, less qi to power these emotions would result in that bummed out feeling (less joy, more grief). Finally I was bone tired as with less jing/physical vitality in the lower dan tien that would make sense.

 

I actually observed this happening in school the other day. There is this one girl at my school who is very pretty but also aloof. I can't say for sure all the reasons she is aloof, but I can explain one of them. As she is very attractive she is able to meet a lot of her needs for male electromagnetic energy. See what happens is, naturally she gets a lot of attention from the guys. So guy X sees her and his heart desire/excitement becomes aroused/stimulated. As the heart lies with in the middle dan tien, and the middle dan tien being the house of qi this extra middle dan tien qi is released into the man's qi field. Since his attention and affection are upon this pretty girl his qi is her's for the taking. Once she feels this qi she may smile, flirt, wink ect.. to help her get that attention/affection/eye contact so that she can arouse his qi and thus absorb it. This is a lot of whats behind attraction and flirting though people don't realize it. Anyways so this girl holds a conversation with guy X until she has absorbed Y amount of his qi. Now his qi is depleted and he suddenly becomes less interesting to her, and she returns to her aloof state, leaving the guy to wonder why she suddenly shut him out and why he's more tired (if he notices).

This is one reason girls are attracted to the bad boy types. Since the bad boy is more self absorbed than the nice guy sap (who is so easy to get qi from) she must work harder to turn his attentions and affections toward her so that she can win his qi. All of this effort takes more intention (yi) and with her yi fixated upon the bad more longer he fills her mind more.

 

Anyway my intent is not to belabor a point, but to show how this event and my reactions to it can be explained in a semi-objective way, and to rule out this being completely a figment of my over active imagination. Which I can appreciate as I am quite skeptical of that girl at school I was mentioning who thinks everyone is draining her.

Edited May 9, 2013 by dmattwads

[三江源]

Making up theories about stuff depletes your energies like nobodies business.

 

Telling stories can be inspiring and uplifting.

 

Making up rationales, really quite the opposite. Feeding something that you dont want to feed ie your unproductive thought patterning.

[Maddie]

Making up theories about stuff depletes your energies like nobodies business.

 

Telling stories can be inspiring and uplifting.

 

Making up rationales, really quite the opposite. Feeding something that you dont want to feed ie your unproductive thought patterning.

 

If you think about it the scientific method is a combination of hypothesis (making up theories) experiment, observation, conclusions (deducing a rationale) and publishing (telling stories).

[hydrogen]

Any world view model is good so long you're having fun with it.

 

It'll be interesting to see how you're going to solve the puzzle you're setting up.

 

You're a TCM student. I assume you'll going to see at least five patients a day. Do you see them as potential energy suckers?

 

You might have got some ideas from another poster Drew. He's fortunate enough to be able to sit in full lotus for six hours to deal with his energy loss by a stranger at street corner. Can you afford the time/money?

Edited May 9, 2013 by hydrogen

[Maddie]

Any world view model is good so long you're having fun with it.

 

It'll be interesting to see how you're going to solve the puzzle you're setting up.

 

You're a TCM student. I assume you'll going to see at least five patients a day. Do you see them as potential energy suckers?

 

You might have got some ideas from another poster Drew. He's fortunate enough to be able to sit in full lotus for six hours to deal with his energy loss by a stranger at street corner. Can you afford the time/money?

 

Some patients suck energy, even our professors warned us about this, but basically its the same awareness to stop it. Fortunately patients don't follow you home, so its easier to exert that force of will to stop energy drain in the clinic. Yea I'll be interested to see how I solve this puzzle too haha.

 

Um yea Drew's observations and insights have actually proven to be very useful. In regards to sitting in full lotus for 6 hours I don't cause my legs won't let me get in full lotus. Though I do sit in half lotus between 3-4 hours on average a day, and if I have extra free time then longer. Here is the crux of the issue. The more I do sitting meditaion for long periods of time like Drew for example, the more I see exactely what he has been talking about from a first hand experience point of view. It's clear to me now that he did not simply dream up this stuff out of thin air, but rather from first hand experience as I can attest since I am experiencing similar things now.

[Creation]

Hi dmattwads,

 

I am also exploring the ways my energy interacts with the energies of others, both physical and non-physical. Here are a couple of remarks from my perspective:

 

1. The mental framework you use to interpret your experience can become limiting. If someone has similar experiences as you and you adopt their framework, it is natural that you will continue to confirm their framework. But then whatever limitations that framework has become your limitations.

2. If it happens that interacting with others is draining to you and you don't want to become a hermit, a more efficient solution than trying to play tug of war with your energy all the time is to work on your boundaries.

[Maddie]

Hi dmattwads,

 

I am also exploring the ways my energy interacts with the energies of others, both physical and non-physical. Here are a couple of remarks from my perspective:

 

1. The mental framework you use to interpret your experience can become limiting. If someone has similar experiences as you and you adopt their framework, it is natural that you will continue to confirm their framework. But then whatever limitations that framework has become your limitations.

2. If it happens that interacting with others is draining to you and you don't want to become a hermit, a more efficient solution than trying to play tug of war with your energy all the time is to work on your boundaries.

 

Wonderful choise of words, and interesting timing. So after my last post I thought "ok well now I have the problem identified (to the best of my knowledge), now what to do about it". So I thought how I would treat this if a patient was complaining of these symptoms. At about the same time (I was in class) the professor was discussing now the Lung is the most external organ and controls our wie (defesive qi). So I was like "oh if your having a problem from the exterior strengthen the lung". In contrast for the past couple days I had been doing a Spleen meditation as the Spleen makes your qi, but this was not helping. Then I realized that you can tonify your Spleen all you want, but if you Lung is weak its like pouring water in a barrle with holes.

 

So upon hearing this, and being tired of being tired, I began to do the Lung meditaion right there in class (healing sound and inner smile) and with in minuets I began to feel better. After several minuets I began to feel human again lol. So I figured I'd found the right organ to work on, as having worked on the Spleen for two days straight had not really gotten me anywhere.

 

So yea your comment about boundries is very timely and appropriate :-). Also it makes sense as I've noticed the only place I have any grey hairs is precicely along my metal element meridians... hmmm. But anyways, I could feel that after only a few mineuts of doing the Lung meditation that constant feeling of being drained constantly lessened significantly and I began to feel somewhat energetic again. :-)

[hydrogen]

Um yea Drew's observations and insights have actually proven to be very useful. In regards to sitting in full lotus for 6 hours I don't cause my legs won't let me get in full lotus. Though I do sit in half lotus between 3-4 hours on average a day, and if I have extra free time then longer. Here is the crux of the issue. The more I do sitting meditaion for long periods of time like Drew for example, the more I see exactely what he has been talking about from a first hand experience point of view. It's clear to me now that he did not simply dream up this stuff out of thin air, but rather from first hand experience as I can attest since I am experiencing similar things now.

 

I see that you think Drew's lifestyle is ideal: sitting in lotus all day typing up imressive forum message. Is that part of me?

 

As a TCM student, don't you want to gether more energy and time to cure your patients?

[Maddie]

I see that you think Drew's lifestyle is ideal: sitting in lotus all day typing up imressive forum message. Is that part of me?

 

To be honest I don't really know much about what Drew's life style consists of by and large as I have never met him. As far as his forum messages go, um yea I'd say they tend to be pretty impressive, He seems to have one of the sharpest intellects on this forum and his posts are usually very interesting and highly informative.

 

 

 

As a TCM student, don't you want to gether more energy and time to cure your patients?

 

Yes, whats that have to do with this topic?

[oildrops]

What comes to mind today is the framework of intention that a practice draws from.

 

Foundational energy vs superficial energy. A person can't come along and start taking your foundational energies- that takes a long time and involves more extreme forms of manipulation. If someone can easily absorb and benefit from your presence, you are probably expending more trying to grasp.

 

I see most of what we cultivate as superficial, skin to be shed. What condenses and becomes our nature is what has taught us something important that then becomes wisdom. Our external energies work to facilitate these lessons, and when we cultivate, the external attracts our intent. So if you are cultivating to become a healer than you will naturally attract those who need to be healed. If you are cultivating to become a warrior, then you will attract battles, and so on.

 

 

Most teachings I encounter (which are 90% healing focused) maintain that it's crucial to remain in emptiness, cultivating virtue and unconditional love.

Edited May 10, 2013 by oildrops

[oildrops]

That's a much more concise version of what I was trying to get at. Thanks.

[Maddie]

Why not just tap into The Source (of the healing energetics) and let that heal others? Much less drain.

That is why I meditate in the first place :-)

[Jetsun]

Why not just tap into The Source (of the healing energetics) and let that heal others? Much less drain.

I have been working with someone who does this, she heals patients every day but only heals herself about once a month, its no real drain on her as she channels energy to heal rather than use her own.