The Travels of Vajrahriidaya

[Marblehead]

 

I looooove muuudddddd. YAY!! Ah yes, New Mexican spring time frolics through running rapids into muddy ponds.

 

Yeah! I've seen a few of those gully washers while passing through that part of the world. Walked through a few of them when they were dry collecting rocks for my collection.

 

Be well!

Edited August 12, 2009 by Marblehead

[contrivedname!]

Well, Buddhism does teach something that no other path on earth teaches in it's view. The Buddha said it's the only path to liberation. So, either he was lying, ignorant, or telling the truth. He didn't say that I am the light, the way. But, he said that a particular realization about the nature of reality is the only way. Buddhism seems to be the only path that truly articulates this realization with utter clarity.

No, they influence beings. Being in peace or meditating on the nature of things helps others. I went into debt buying books for people that I had just met online from around the world about 7 years ago for a number of years. I went on a buy books for everyone kick, charging it to my credit cards. I still haven't been able to pay that debt off, thousands of dollars worth in fact. I did years of selfless service, even worked for a deeply wise yogi who had muscular dystrophy for 2 years. I worked on a food line for a number of years that served thousands of people per day in the summer time in the mid 90's. Opportunities for self sacrifice to help others arise all the time. Trying to get the Dharma through to people is considered actually one of the highest services one can do for mankind because the vast majority of people follow erroneous paths.

 

Talking about this will probably just be considered egotistical.

 

not really egotistical, i did ask

 

sure it is recorded that he said that but just because it is written doesnt make it so, he may have or he may not have. plenty of people have put words in the mouth of lao tzu... (though it is obvious that this is held to be true w/in the tradition you associate with)

 

hmm i think your right about meditating though i will say that it is not the act of meditating that helps someone else it is the fruit of the meditation, also i will posit that not everyone would apply their meditative, contemplative or whatever practice to the aid of beings.

 

also to take your words literally: "He didn't say that I am the light, the way. But, he said that a particular realization about the nature of reality is the only way."

 

part of my point is that different folks with differing dispositions and mentalities may need different tools to open up such a realization; i dont think the realization is dependent on buddhism, though i believe buddhism is dependent on such a realization, if that makes any sense (i.e. buddhism was founded as a tool to help others to such a realization, not as a narrow dogmatic interpretation of existence).

[Vajrahridaya]

not really egotistical, i did ask

 

sure it is recorded that he said that but just because it is written doesnt make it so, he may have or he may not have. plenty of people have put words in the mouth of lao tzu... (though it is obvious that this is held to be true w/in the tradition you associate with)

 

It's held to be true in Theravada, Zen and Vajrayana. Nagarjuna said the same thing and many, many other Buddhas. I say the same thing because it's also my own direct realization, as merely someone on the Bodhisattva path. I've experienced directly Nirguna Brahman and Saguna Brahman while a practicing Shaivite. I've seen directly the Alaya Vijnana which is known as the Nila Bindu and Shaivism takes that as the Self, it's the 8th consciousness in Chittamatra and we are trained to not take it up as a Self in Buddhism, and to apply Vipassana (applied D.O.). Which is what the Buddha did and talked about in the first turning when he said that the Jhanas/Samadhis would not take one to final realization alone, if your familiar with the 8 jhanas and the 31 planes. It's quite clear that the Buddha did say that, as it's recorded as having been said by him in many different ways throughout different texts. It is true. The sense that it makes comes clear when one see's emptiness directly. LOL! My girlfriend is arguing with her mom in the background... excuse me. Yes, so... it's clear that Vedanta and most other traditions reify a state of conceptualess absorption as ultimate reality (Jnanas of infinite space, infinite consciousness, infinite nothingness, neither perception nor non-perception which are all reified as Brahman in Vedanta and it seem's Tao in Taoism) this is not seeing dependent origination as the Buddha explained it. Most traditions see all things as a modification of one supreme entity or mysterious nature. There's no tradition other than Buddhism that see's beginningless and infinite mind streams that have no essential nature other than impermanent flow. Most traditions see all beings as coming from one source to return to one source. The Buddha said that's a Samsaric view. I've seen directly how this is so, through meditation, contemplation and realization.

 

 

hmm i think your right about meditating though i will say that it is not the act of meditating that helps someone else it is the fruit of the meditation, also i will posit that not everyone would apply their meditative, contemplative or whatever practice to the aid of beings.

 

Yes, but that's exactly part and parcel with being a Mahayanist. It's kind of a rule of Mahayana and also part of the realization. As one cannot maintain a teaching body past the ending of the cosmic eon without recognizing "anatta" through "pratityasamutpada" and "shunyata" as they are explained in Mahayana, specifically Nagarjuna. As it's through this selfless offering of merit that one transcends the re-absorption that happens at the end of a cosmic eon.

 

also to take your words literally: "He didn't say that I am the light, the way. But, he said that a particular realization about the nature of reality is the only way."

 

part of my point is that different folks with differing dispositions and mentalities may need different tools to open up such a realization; i dont think the realization is dependent on buddhism, though i believe buddhism is dependent on such a realization, if that makes any sense (i.e. buddhism was founded as a tool to help others to such a realization, not as a narrow dogmatic interpretation of existence).

 

Yes, of course, which is why there are many different techniques or methods within Buddhism. There are also different way's of manifesting the fruit of enlightenment, the jalus, illusionary body, powa, etc., etc. But all recognize dependent origination/emptiness from the perspective of the Buddha, the 8 fold noble path and the 4 noble truths, seeing directly the 6 realms and the 31 planes of the 6 realms. It seems that yes there are some from other traditions that come to the same realization, but that means that they transcended the traditional teachings of their lineage and came to a specifically Buddha (awakened) realization due to the cause of their own merit which probably extends to having been a Buddhist in a previous life and then they take the existent teachings and make them sound more and more Buddhist. The closer to Buddhism any tradition is, the more clear it is.

 

The thing is, is that if you actually study Buddhist cosmology it's the widest most explanatory cosmology known to man. If you read this...

Myriad Worlds

 

From "A Treasury of Knowledge". Which in English is even highly abridged. It has cosmology that comes from many perspectives. But, they all see beginningless flow of causes and conditions without a primordial beginning. Though the term beginning is used in Dzogchen, it means that one's realization or source of realization begins with awareness recognizing beginningless purity, which originates dependent upon seeing dependent origination and relativity of all experiences.

 

It never takes up an experience as an ultimate truth, rather the ultimate realization originates the endless experiencing of liberation for a Buddha.

 

Buddhist logic is extremely subtle. Much subtler than anything found in the most highly appraised texts of Vedanta and Trika Shaivism.

 

Sure, a man with two legs in a town of men with one legs has the advantage, born of good merit of previous karmas and will be able to walk a balanced life amongst 1 legged hoppers. But, Buddhism is the path of the two legged men and is clearly that from beginning to end with utter clarity. Plus it has all the methods necessary throughout it 's many different branches that have in fact influenced many of the worlds more mystic versions of the religions.

 

Sometimes vice versa, but the first noble truth is always there..."right view" and it is very specific in what that means for a Buddhist. It is the rigid viewless view. Sounds paradoxal as it's the dogmaless dogma. It basically say's that all states and all experiences are dependently originated, thus there is no reified ultimate Truth, and that's the ultimate truth of Buddhism.

[nac]

dwai: Could be, but I doubt it.

[dwai]

dwai: Could be, but I doubt it.

 

Try describing it then...

[Vajrahridaya]

Try describing it then...

 

It's the experience of existing without conceptual definition. It's still merely a samadhi state.