The Prince and the Magician

[nac]

Sweet!

 

At one point in the past I just used to be a Philosophical Taoist. Now I'm also a Zen Buddhist. The only thing I've actually shed is the monistic idealism part. I have to warn you about extreme conventionalism though, it leads to some really scary stuff. (

)

[Marblehead]

Hi Old Man,

 

Physical reality is real. It is not an illusion. The only illusion is that some believe that some things are eternal.

 

Yes, there are illusionists who can cause one to believe something is real when it is not. I don't discuss magic, superstition or any of that other stuff.

 

I will suggest that I am a body that has an ego. I remember back when I was an infant I thought that I was a part of everything. But then that illusion was broken when I realized that I could not manifest my mother every time I wanted her. But then I had this illusion that everything around me was "mine". That lasted for a while until my older brother took my toy away from me and wouldn't give it back. Illusion number two shot in the back!

 

Shortly thereafter, (Oh, about fifty years) I realized that I am a special creation. I am unique in the universe! Yes, I am made up of so many things, too numerous to count, but the entire collection is what makes me "me". I am not an illusion. I am a manifest form of Tao. Is the a purpose for me? I have no idea. I guess I am nothing more than an expression of Tao.

 

Really though, there is no end to the story because what I am now will become something else when my Life Force leaves my body. No more ego, no more functioning brain. But all is not lost. In fact, nothing is lost; it just changes.

 

The tree outside is a living organism. It too is an expression of Tao. The cat turd too is an expression of Tao. No, the turd is not a living organism although it may contain living organisms. Each manifest thing is complete in itself - each being an expression of Tao.

 

Yes, the tree, the turd, me, we all are of the same source. But we each are different, unique, and very real.

 

Be well!

 

 

 

Sweet!

 

At one point in the past I just used to be a Philosophical Taoist. Now I'm also a Zen Buddhist. The only thing I've actually shed is the monistic idealism part. I have to warn you about extreme conventionalism though, it leads to some really scary stuff. (

)

 

Hehehe. Those young men are repeating what they have been told by others. They simply, IMO, have no idea. I can speak to this because I was once there.

 

All I can say is that if that helps them through the day then they should hold to their beliefs. (But I would discuss with them if they confronted me with their beliefs and tried to force their beliefs on me.)

 

Once upon a time I was working in my flower garden and two gentlemen stopped and decided that I needed to be saved. One stated that I would go to hell if I didn't believe the way he did. I told him that he could go to hell right now. They left totally disgusted with me.

 

Yes Dear, I am an Atheistic Taoist.

 

Be well!

 

Oh! BTW I realize that many who begin in Taoism extend themselfs into Buddhism. I see no problem with that at all. Many also extend into the religious aspects of Taoism. There too I see no problem. It's all about trying to make our life as full as possible and feeling a part of the creation (don't misunderstand how I use that word). Creation and destruction are the same thing.

 

Later!

Edited August 10, 2009 by Marblehead

[Old Man Contradiction]

Hi Old Man,

 

Physical reality is real. It is not an illusion. The only illusion is that some believe that some things are eternal.

 

Yes, there are illusionists who can cause one to believe something is real when it is not. I don't discuss magic, superstition or any of that other stuff.

 

My topic wasn't magic and stage performance. Your true self is the assistant's legs, your ego is the prosthetics. One illusion is mistaking the false for the real.

 

I will suggest that I am a body that has an ego. I remember back when I was an infant I thought that I was a part of everything. But then that illusion was broken when I realized that I could not manifest my mother every time I wanted her. But then I had this illusion that everything around me was "mine". That lasted for a while until my older brother took my toy away from me and wouldn't give it back. Illusion number two shot in the back!

 

All these illusions are found in the ego, your collection of illusions.

 

Shortly thereafter, (Oh, about fifty years) I realized that I am a special creation. I am unique in the universe! Yes, I am made up of so many things, too numerous to count, but the entire collection is what makes me "me". I am not an illusion. I am a manifest form of Tao. Is the a purpose for me? I have no idea. I guess I am nothing more than an expression of Tao.

 

Really though, there is no end to the story because what I am now will become something else when my Life Force leaves my body. No more ego, no more functioning brain. But all is not lost. In fact, nothing is lost; it just changes.

 

There is no end, but there is eternity. When your consciousness IS the feeling of life force. Completely thoughtless, mindful, aware of your environment, and always within your inner body. You are almost out of "the story". But once you are within this, which is always within you dormant or not, you can begin feeling the unmanifested, which is the next place your awareness will be from. The unmanifest is eternal and the end of your investment in your atomic body and life story.

 

The tree outside is a living organism. It too is an expression of Tao. The cat turd too is an expression of Tao. No, the turd is not a living organism although it may contain living organisms. Each manifest thing is complete in itself - each being an expression of Tao.

 

Yes, the tree, the turd, me, we all are of the same source. But we each are different, unique, and very real.

 

Be well!

 

That is the key. Our trick is staying with the source, or else the ego can run amock causing havoc wherever it may roam.

 

edit: My glimpse of truth that occurs now and again is what brings me to my beliefs. A change in beliefs is like putting a pig on a stake and calling it something else. When I am done thinking about this topic. I'll take the pig off the stake and look at it is it is. This is where I've slipped so far today, even now.

Edited August 10, 2009 by Old Man Contradiction

[Marblehead]

Hi Old Man,

 

Hehehe. I knew your point was not to magicians but rather to illusion but I thought it was a good opportunity for me to say that I do not hold to the concept of superstition (or supernatural, magic, ghosts, etc).

 

So it seems that we need speak of illusion and ego collectively here. If I am understanding you correctly you are suggesting that my ego is causing the illusion that I exist. If I have not misunderstood you I would need to ask you where this ego came from if it is not a reflection of everything that I am. It is my understanding that ego exists because I exist. Without me there is no ego.

 

I agree, there is no end; only cycles. Creation and destruction. I have a saying that I like to use: Everything that is, is, always has been, and always will be. It (things) just takes different form over time.

 

The rest of that paragraph beginning with When your consciousness ... I was unable to grasp. Could you rephrase it for me?

 

That is the key. Our trick is staying with the source, or else the ego can run amock causing havoc wherever it may roam.

 

Agree again. I will only suggest that we really do need our ego. It is what provides our instinct to survive. We do need to lessen our ego wherever that is possible though.

 

Yes, the pig was no longer a complete pig the moment the rifle round went through its brain.

 

But change is good. It lets us know that we are still alive. Once we stop changing we are, for all practicle purposes, dead.

 

Oh! Let me say something about illusion. Yes, the illusion is that "I" am any more important than anything else. (We won't talk about value. Hehehe.)

 

Be well!

[Old Man Contradiction]

Don't worry, I don't worship David Blaine and his telekinetic abilities either.

 

If I am understanding you correctly you are suggesting that my ego is causing the illusion that I exist ......

 

Most people uncontrollably go through the day going from one thought to the next, rarely ever choosing what their mind does, and almost never being in an inner silent peace. This uncontrollable thinking is based on their personality. This thinking, the thoughts, and that personality put together is what I call the ego.

 

Consider this. If you do not have the ability to drop your entire life history, life situation, and your entire personality. If you can not stop your mind from thinking. If you can not even choose what enters your mind, and keep your mind empty for more than 10 seconds. Your essentially possessed by what is basically an entity of it's own, the ego. Your thoughts and personality live in you and you have no choice on whether you keep them around or not.

 

I propose that we all try to regain our selves by letting go of the ego. Than we are free to express ourselves unconditionally. The first step is to empty your mind, after that, everything at this level falls into place.

 

PS. Changing beliefs is like taking a dead pig, putting it on a stake and calling it something else. If you don't believe anything you have no choice but to see things as they really are.

Edited August 10, 2009 by Old Man Contradiction

[Marblehead]

Hi Old Man,

 

We are not very far apart in our understanding. We use different words; I am sure we have had different personal experiences.

 

Yes, I would agree if all this thinking you speak of is centered on "Me, Me, Me".

 

It's really not an easy task to not think or to prevent our brain from throwing stuff into our consciousness.

 

I do need to restate that I believe that the ego is important in our life. Taming the ego is the key, I think.

 

Envision a mind empty of thought ... If you had stopped right there I would have jumped up and down (actually, we don't jump down - gravity takes care of that) and clapped my hands in recognition.

 

Okay:

 

If you don't believe anything you have no choice but to see things as they really are.

 

One wisdom point for you.

 

... and almost never being in an inner silent peace.

 

You are playing with a bit of one of my favorite phrases. I oftentimes speak of inner peace and contentment.

 

Be well!

[Old Man Contradiction]

You are playing with a bit of one of my favorite phrases. I oftentimes speak of inner peace and contentment.

 

Be well!

 

You too Marblehead, i'm sure I'll see you in the forum in the future.

[Marblehead]

You too Marblehead, i'm sure I'll see you in the forum in the future.

 

Yep.

[Vajrahridaya]

Change of Heart

 

My life's joy used to depend upon such a complex assortment of tricks.

And what I received from many hours and days of hard work,

never gave me satisfaction, only a shadow of joy, a glimpse of contentment.

 

Since my dependency was so engraved in tangible evidence

it was fickle and I needed continual support from that dust.

How foolish was I, to build my castle out of sand,

for those magnificent structures of petty desires are doomed for destruction

at the wash of the first wave from the ocean of life's change upon the surface of this existence.

 

But now a glorious wonder has taken life inside of me.

A change greatly welcomed,

through the power of precious teachers glance,

loves flame has been lit on an eternal wick in the cup of my heart,

and its bliss is all pervading, continuous and embraces all,

my vision is now deeper than surface.

 

Now its the simple things in life which reflect my unhidden inner treasure.

Unbidden are loves spontaneous surges that well up from inside

when I glance at the luminous moon high above in the twinkling night sky.

Or the sweet playfull laugh of a child in his mothers' arms,

this laugh that's without reason but with rhyme,

on time with the pulse and rhythm of life's eternal throb.

Or when watching the suns light falling through a collage of colorful leaves in autumn

during a walk in mentally stilled silence, the boundless joy can be staggering.

 

Yet the most astounding experiences of my own great joy

occur when I am sitting alone in my room

contemplating this wellspring of nectar that has taken up residence in my very own being.

This joy that is independent and based on the source of existence

and not this coming and going merry go round of life's myriad shapes and sizes.

Its this inner divinity that I take flight in when unasked for beauty touches my senses,

and since there is no grasping for or task towards,

all that I experience is pure love in essence on display in glorious manifestation.

And this is the pulse that I dance to as I skip to each moments passing.

Praise be to you, oh sweet Guru, the lord of this amazing creation.

 

Love,

Hari

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

Change of Heart

 

My life's joy used to depend upon such a complex assortment of tricks.

And what I received from many hours and days of hard work,

never gave me satisfaction, only a shadow of joy, a glimpse of contentment.

 

Since my dependency was so engraved in tangible evidence

it was fickle and I needed continual support from that dust.

How foolish was I, to build my castle out of sand,

for those magnificent structures of petty desires are doomed for destruction

at the wash of the first wave from the ocean of life's change upon the surface of this existence.

 

But now a glorious wonder has taken life inside of me.

A change greatly welcomed,

through the power of precious teachers glance,

loves flame has been lit on an eternal wick in the cup of my heart,

and its bliss is all pervading, continuous and embraces all,

my vision is now deeper than surface.

 

Now its the simple things in life which reflect my unhidden inner treasure.

Unbidden are loves spontaneous surges that well up from inside

when I glance at the luminous moon high above in the twinkling night sky.

Or the sweet playfull laugh of a child in his mothers' arms,

this laugh that's without reason but with rhyme,

on time with the pulse and rhythm of life's eternal throb.

Or when watching the suns light falling through a collage of colorful leaves in autumn

during a walk in mentally stilled silence, the boundless joy can be staggering.

 

Yet the most astounding experiences of my own great joy

occur when I am sitting alone in my room

contemplating this wellspring of nectar that has taken up residence in my very own being.

This joy that is independent and based on the source of existence

and not this coming and going merry go round of life's myriad shapes and sizes.

Its this inner divinity that I take flight in when unasked for beauty touches my senses,

and since there is no grasping for or task towards,

all that I experience is pure love in essence on display in glorious manifestation.

And this is the pulse that I dance to as I skip to each moments passing.

Praise be to you, oh sweet Guru, the lord of this amazing creation.

 

Love,

Hari

 

 

Really nice! Best thing I've read that you've wrote, Hari. Fine words indeed.

 

And I just can't figure out why you are so keen on debating those obscure "philosophical" points

endlessly, convincing few and confounding many (even me, and one of my degrees is in philosophy,

from a top program). One of the few books I spend a lot of time with is The Ashtavakra Gita,

Thomas Byrom translation. Do you know it? I find it contains all you are trying to argue with your many

clunky words that are well, boring to read. No sarcasm or offense intended here. What you stated above

captures what you are trying to get across much more effectively in my humble opinion.

 

http://bhagavan-ramana.org/ashtavakragita2.html

Edited August 11, 2009 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[Vajrahridaya]

Really nice! Best thing I've read that you've wrote, Hari. Fine words indeed.

 

And I just can't figure out why you are so keen on debating those obscure "philosophical" points

endlessly, convincing few and confounding many (even me, and one of my degrees is in philosophy,

from a top program). One of the few books I spend a lot of time with is The Ashtavakra Gita,

Thomas Byrom translation. Do you know it? I find it contains all you are trying to argue with your many

clunky words that are well, boring to read. No sarcasm or offense intended here. What you stated above

captures what you are trying to get across much more effectively in my humble opinion.

 

http://bhagavan-ramana.org/ashtavakragita2.html

 

I have the Ashtavakara Gita or the Bent in 8 places song. No, it does not talk about the same realization. Your opinion of my clunky words are subjective as many have found them valuable and "beautiful". You have no idea what I mean by "source", "creation", or "Guru" in my poem. You have not even understood the first turning of the Buddhas wheel yet, so how could you comprehend the subtle Dzogchen? Your Ashtavakara Gita is substantial non-dual eternalism, basically reifying formless states of consciousness, it's still Monist Theism at heart. The subtle difference is true and it's not my fault that you don't understand because the Buddha explained it, many other's have, including Nagarjuna, and I have explained it in so many way's here that if you haven't gotten it yet... that's just the way it is for you right now. Plenty here have had a realization of what is meant in Buddhism by ultimate truth, and it's not the same as what is taught in the Vedantic Ashtavakara Gita. Most who have not seen emptiness directly will have no clue about the difference because you think D.O. is a lower truth than Godhead and one reifies the experience of emptiness as the experiencer, thus missing out on what emptiness actually means beyond experiencing. The difference is oh so subtle. Most who do not understand the explanation of the 31 planes of existence as well as the real meaning of vipassana (applied D.O.) transcending Jhana will just be clueless. I don't care about your college courses. I know P.H.D.'s who are clueless about the real meaning of the Buddha's teachings, including my own dear P.H.D. of a mother who's Hindu self I truly love and adore, who's been meditating for 40 years and experiencing the 8th consciousness or Alaya Vijnana interpreted as Self (Nirguna Brahman, Parashiva) for well over 15 years now.

 

You have not yet realized how subtle Samsara is.

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

I have the Ashtavakara Gita or the Bent in 8 places song. No, it does not talk about the same realization. Your opinion of my clunky words are subjective as many have found them valuable and "beautiful". You have no idea what I mean by "source", "creation", or "Guru" in my poem. You have not even understood the first turning of the Buddhas wheel yet, so how could you comprehend the subtle Dzogchen? Your Ashtavakara Gita is substantial non-dual eternalism, basically reifying formless states of consciousness, it's still Monist Theism at heart. The subtle difference is true and it's not my fault that you don't understand because the Buddha explained it, many other's have, including Nagarjuna, and I have explained it in so many way's here that if you haven't gotten it yet... that's just the way it is for you right now. Plenty here have had a realization of what is meant in Buddhism by ultimate truth, and it's not the same as what is taught in the Vedantic Ashtavakara Gita. Most who have not seen emptiness directly will have no clue about the difference because you think D.O. is a lower truth than Godhead and one reifies the experience of emptiness as the experiencer, thus missing out on what emptiness actually means beyond experiencing. The difference is oh so subtle. Most who do not understand the explanation of the 31 planes of existence as well as the real meaning of vipassana (applied D.O.) transcending Jhana will just be clueless. I don't care about your college courses. I know P.H.D.'s who are clueless about the real meaning of the Buddha's teachings, including my own dear P.H.D. of a mother who's Hindu self I truly love and adore, who's been meditating for 40 years and experiencing the 8th consciousness or Alaya Vijnana interpreted as Self (Nirguna Brahman, Parashiva) for well over 15 years now.

 

You have not yet realized how subtle Samsara is.

 

 

Narcissus? Is that you? I bow to your superior superiority in everything! Then why are you a lowly internet entrepeneur, instead of ascending your throne as Realized World Teacher? Why are you addicted to your own posts on the internet? You are the Most Special!

 

Anyway, don't tell me what I do or don't know, Va-jay-jay. 660+ posts in less than three months? Yes, you is addicted. Try a vacay from the Taobums and maybe every thread doesn't have to turn into a platform for your

opinions, O Realized One. Give us all a break, except your fanboys who PM you, please.

 

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_...nality_disorder

 

 

Just kidding....you rock!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

hehehe

[Vajrahridaya]

Narcissus? Is that you? I bow to your superior superiority in everything! Then why are you a lowly internet entrepeneur, instead of ascending your throne as Realized World Teacher? Why are you addicted to your own posts on the internet? You are the Most Special!

 

Anyway, don't tell me what I do or don't know, Va-jay-jay. 660+ posts in less than three months? Yes, you is addicted. Try a vacay from the Taobums and maybe every thread doesn't have to turn into a platform for your

opinions, O Realized One. Give us all a break, except your fanboys who PM you, please.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_...nality_disorder

Just kidding....you rock!

hehehe

I love you brother.

 

The largest Narcissism is the reification of the experience of emptiness as the ultimate subsuming nature of all beings. This interpreting the experience into a formless substratum as the Self of all is the most subtle narcissism that merely leads to future recycling. It has been YOUR very habit since beginningless time. It's taking the lock for the key.

 

 

"Enlightening the House of Brahma in the fontanelle

Stroking the uvala in wanton delight,

Confused, believing binding pleasure to be spiritual release,

The vain fools calls himself a yogin......

 

......His mind takes brass for gold,

Momentary peak experience for reality accomplished;

Clinging to the joy of ephemeral dreams

He calls his short-thrift life Eternal Bliss.....

 

.....With a discursive understanding of the symbol EVAM,

Creating four seals through an analysis of the moment,

He labels his peak experience sahaja: (spontaneous)

He is clinging to a reflection mistaken for the mirror."

-Excerpt from Saraha's Royal Song by Saraha

 

.......................................................................................................

 

Nagarjuna's Mahamudra Vision

 

 

Homage to Manjusrikumarabhuta!

 

"1. I bow down to the all-powerful Buddha

Whose mind is free of attachment,

Who in his compassion and wisdom

Has taught the inexpressible.

 

2. In truth there is no birth -

Then surely no cessation or liberation;

The Buddha is like the sky

And all beings have that nature.

 

3. Neither Samsara nor Nirvana exist,

But all is a complex continuum

With an intrinsic face of void,

The object of ultimate awareness.

 

4. The nature of all things

Appears like a reflection,

Pure and naturally quiescent,

With a non-dual identity of suchness.

 

5. The common mind imagines a self

Where there is nothing at all,

And it conceives of emotional states -

Happiness, suffering, and equanimity.

 

6. The six states of being in Samsara,

The happiness of heaven,

The suffering of hell,

Are all false creations, figments of mind.

 

7. Likewise the ideas of bad action causing suffering,

Old age, disease and death,

And the idea that virtue leads to happiness,

Are mere ideas, unreal notions.

 

8. Like an artist frightened

By the devil he paints,

The sufferer in Samsara

Is terrified by his own imagination.

 

9. Like a man caught in quicksands

Thrashing and struggling about,

So beings drown

In the mess of their own thoughts.

 

10. Mistaking fantasy for reality

Causes an experience of suffering;

Mind is poisoned by interpretation

Of consciousness of form.

 

11. Dissolving figment and fantasy

With a mind of compassionate insight,

Remain in perfect awareness

In order to help all beings.

 

12. So acquiring conventional virtue

Freed from the web of interpretive thought,

Insurpassable understanding is gained

As Buddha, friend to the world.

 

13. Knowing the relativity of all,

The ultimate truth is always seen;

Dismissing the idea of beginning, middle and end

The flow is seen as Emptiness.

 

14. So all samsara and nirvana is seen as it is -

Empty and insubstantial,

Naked and changeless,

Eternally quiescent and illumined.

 

15. As the figments of a dream

Dissolve upon waking,

So the confusion of Samsara

Fades away in enlightenment.

 

16. Idealising things of no substance

As eternal, substantial and satisfying,

Shrouding them in a fog of desire

The round of existence arises.

 

17. The nature of beings is unborn

Yet commonly beings are conceived to exist;

Both beings and their ideas

Are false beliefs.

 

18. It is nothing but an artifice of mind

This birth into an illusory becoming,

Into a world of good and evil action

With good or bad rebirth to follow.

 

19. When the wheel of mind ceases to turn

All things come to an end.

So there is nothing inherently substantial

And all things are utterly pure.

 

20. This great ocean of samsara,

Full of delusive thought,

Can be crossed in the boat Universal Approach.

Who can reach the other side without it?"

 

Colophon

The Twenty Mahayana Verses, (in Sanskrit,

Mahayanavimsaka; in Tibetan: Theg pa chen po nyi

shu pa) were composed by the master Nagarjuna.

They were translated into Tibetan by the Kashmiri

Pandit Ananda and the Bhikshu translator Drakjor

Sherab (Grags 'byor shes rab). They have been

translated into English by the Anagarika

Kunzang Tenzin on the last day of the year 1973

in the hope that the karma of the year may be mitigated.

 

May all beings be happy!

 

 

The Buddhas teachings and his interpretation of Vedic terminology is different. His interpretation of Nirvana is different. His realization of the depth of Samsara is subtler.

Edited August 11, 2009 by Vajrahridaya

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

I love you brother.

 

 

 

I love you too, my son.

 

(I do think I nailed the narcissistic thing, though. Of course a narcissist never

has insight into their pathology. No matter.)

 

But seriously-- Get away from your computer, dude. I mean nobody believes you really spend time

doing anything else, let alone meditating or abiding in the Self. A lot of your posts are at 3:00 and

4:00 a.m...and your "job" obviously takes very little of your time. Don't you have anything better to do?

 

 

"Those who know do not tell,

Those who tell do not know."

 

The Tao Te Ching

 

But I suppose you'll have a better quote to prove Lao Tse wrong. You never admit a point or back down.You're never wrong.

Just the bloviation of a true narcissist.

 

Plus, your previous lifetime must have been karmically unfortunate for you to have taken rebirth and rewarded with life in Florida.

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

 

 

The largest Narcissism is the reification of the experience of emptiness as the ultimate subsuming nature of all beings. This interpreting the experience into a formless substratum as the Self of all is the most subtle narcissism that merely leads to future recycling. It has been YOUR very habit since beginningless time. It's taking the lock for the key.

 

 

Say what?? What the hell does that mean? More of your fancy uber-pedantic utterly meaningless buddhaspeak, O Mighty Mighty?

 

 

But hey. Good times!

Edited August 11, 2009 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[Vajrahridaya]

I love you too, my son.

 

I'm older than you.

 

(I do think I nailed the narcissistic thing, though. Of course a narcissist never

has insight into their pathology. No matter.)

 

Thought is not the same as insight.

But seriously-- Get away from your computer, dude. I mean nobody believes you really spend time

doing anything else, let alone meditating or abiding in the Self. A lot of your posts are at 3:00 and

4:00 a.m...and your "job" obviously takes very little of your time. Don't you have anything better to do?

"Those who know do not tell,

Those who tell do not know."

 

The Tao Te Ching

 

This is fun!

 

Your interpretation of spirituality is very Vedantic. In Buddhism, those who know, talk. Because the truth of existence is not an un-knowable mystery, like it is in other traditions. Buddhism is different. Also, it's just something I enjoy doing, as I learn more and more every day I post here. I'm also interested in learning and always am. I spend plenty of time reading things online for free. But, I am selling many books right now in fact that I've read. I'm selling all the time. My Ebay is a1annah

 

Just a couple weeks ago I sold tons and tons of Hindu things.

 

I follow the path of the Buddha's who don't follow the path of the Self. They all speak volumes because the path of the Self seems quite natural and logical to Samsarins from gods to humans, so it takes the right concepts in order to get the "right view" which is the first part of the 8 fold noble path. Also your level of subjectivity is quite strong. I work online pretty much all the time and everyday. I didn't tell you what I do, but obviously you don't read many of my posts with clarity. I've mentioned that I have an Ebay business and that's all that I do for money, until the pedicabbing season starts up a bit later then I'll do that as well here in St. Pete. I go to auctions, and I search for Curb Alerts and pick up things for free to re-sell. I also talk to my girlfriend online through Skype pretty much all day while I work. Like right now in fact. I also play my practice DVD through my computer and my puja is right next to my computer as well. I also don't watch TV because I like to avoid commercials. I download my T.V. shows and watch them on my computer in between doing work or at the same time. I also skateboard and ride my bike, been skating for 21 years. You are subjective in your understanding because you are attached to an essential Self of all, the deepest narcissism that one can have so you think that your projections are intuition. Tonight I have a Transmission from Rinpoche that will take place at 4 a.m. our time for free, and again I use my computer as it's a live webcast. I'm also a writer which I use my computer for. My girlfriend is getting ready to move from Toronto to Florida and spends her time packing all night lately. I don't sleep much by the way. I'm also up all night because I worked a night audit shift at a hotel from 2000 to 2004, then I worked nights in NYC for 5 years and I just moved here about 3 weeks ago and it's just my schedule pretty much. Though I do try to get up before noon everyday to work out and do my practice. Sometimes I'm up only a few hours after sleep and am just too excited. I hope my excitement doesn't stress you out.

 

Just like your interpretation of the Buddha, you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to both me and Buddhism. Your pride of ignorance is your only leverage. Which you cannot express very well so instead you spend your time attacking someone who you can only assume about. Don't you have anything better to do? No, it's actually kind of fun and humorous actually. You are getting genuine Dharma teachings at the same time, though you don't understand them yet. You just make an ass of yourself, to yourself, because your interpretation of me is a false reality, any assumption of me is a hallucination. So it's like your making someone up in your mind to throw darts at, but really it's like throwing darts at yourself because that's the only reality of the image.

 

I share this information so that finally you can see yourself more clearly. When you know your wrong, you can finally start learning how to be right. Ya know?

 

 

 

But I suppose you'll have a better quote to prove Lao Tse wrong. You never admit a point or back down.You're never wrong.

Just the bloviation of a true narcissist.

 

I have in fact, I have admitted that I could be wrong about Taoist interpretation of cosmos on the thread put up by Sillicon... sound familiar? Then I re-read the Tao De Ching and see reification of a mysterious non-conceptual ground of all being, that everything is supposed to be a modification of? Buddhas teaching cuts through that mysterious unknowableness, thus there is true omniscience through Buddhism. Yes, I can indeed quote many Buddhas to prove Lau Tzu wrong. Then again, maybe it's just the English translations of his words that give the wrong assumptions? This happens with Dzogchen texts a whole lot. So many Westerners mistaken Dzogchen teachings as a reification of some Divine source of all reality due to reading translations. Which is a mis-interpretation of the teaching.

 

Oh... also it took a lot to realize that the Buddhas teachings were subtler than Vedanta, because I grew up reifying a source of all existence, both intellectually, and experientially, so my intuition was all based upon this fundamental lie that keeps endless beings recycling. I admitted my conversion to the very people I argued against for years on E-Sangha.

 

If you can really prove me wrong with scriptural support and logic. Which you think I have none of, then I'll humbly concede only after I apply the information to my meditation and experience the truth of your assertions first hand. As experience is what it took to convert me to Buddhism. I grew up with a view such as yours, not understanding Buddhism, thinking much like Dwai that all these Buddhists mis-interpret the Buddha and Vedanta has the real understanding of what the Buddha taught. It was quite hard to convert for me, and it took a lot of letting go, it was very painful and took a number of years of contemplation and inner debate. But, my quest is for Truth, not dogma. The Vedas pose a deep dogma that all being comes from one source and that there is an intelligent personal/impersonal creator of all things. That all paths lead to the same truth because they come from the same truth. This is based upon a mistaken cognition and mistaken interpretation of spiritual experience.

 

Plus, your previous lifetime must have been karmically unfortunate for you to have taken rebirth and rewarded with life in Florida.

 

Oh, I loooove Florida. I don't get neck injuries trying to look at the sky. Summer is pretty much year round. The waters are so warm. The air so much clearer. People are so much nicer and I feel again that I'm where I'm supposed to be. My Mom lives here and it's just very nice for me. Thanks for proving more of your subjectivity to yourself again.

 

If you took a second to look at yourself with even a little bit of objectivity you would see how full of crap you are. You take your time to read my posts, mistinterpret them, call them boring, then follow me around and attack me personally starting whole new threads just to do so. I must threaten you? When you don't know the first thing about me, or my life, or my history. Your entire interpretation of me is based upon ill informed assumptions. Or pre-conceptions based upon the fact that I'm making you insecure by subverting your interpretation of cosmos. So, you have to kill the enemy. Screw the words, just kill the enemy, go for the throat.

 

 

I hope I didn't bore you to death this time.

Edited August 11, 2009 by Vajrahridaya

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

I'm older than you.

Thought is not the same as insight.

This is fun!

 

Your interpretation of spirituality is very Vedantic. In Buddhism, those who know, talk. Because the truth of existence is not an un-knowable mystery, like it is in other traditions. Buddhism is different. Also, it's just something I enjoy doing, as I learn more and more every day I post here. I'm also interested in learning and always am. I spend plenty of time reading things online for free. But, I am selling many books right now in fact that I've read. I'm selling all the time. My Ebay is a1annah

 

Just a couple weeks ago I sold tons and tons of Hindu things.

 

I follow the path of the Buddha's who don't follow the path of the Self. They all speak volumes because the path of the Self seems quite natural and logical to Samsarins from gods to humans, so it takes the right concepts in order to get the "right view" which is the first part of the 8 fold noble path. Also your level of subjectivity is quite strong. I work online pretty much all the time and everyday. I didn't tell you what I do, but obviously you don't read many of my posts with clarity. I've mentioned that I have an Ebay business and that's all that I do for money, until the pedicabbing season starts up a bit later then I'll do that as well here in St. Pete. I go to auctions, and I search for Curb Alerts and pick up things for free to re-sell. I also talk to my girlfriend online through Skype pretty much all day while I work. Like right now in fact. I also play my practice DVD through my computer and my puja is right next to my computer as well. I also don't watch TV because I like to avoid commercials. I download my T.V. shows and watch them on my computer in between doing work or at the same time. I also skateboard and ride my bike, been skating for 21 years. You are subjective in your understanding because you are attached to an essential Self of all, the deepest narcissism that one can have so you think that your projections are intuition. Tonight I have a Transmission from Rinpoche that will take place at 4 a.m. our time for free, and again I use my computer as it's a live webcast. I'm also a writer which I use my computer for. My girlfriend is getting ready to move from Toronto to Florida and spends her time packing all night lately. I don't sleep much by the way. I'm also up all night because I worked a night audit shift at a hotel from 2000 to 2004, then I worked nights in NYC for 5 years and I just moved here about 3 weeks ago and it's just my schedule pretty much. Though I do try to get up before noon everyday to work out and do my practice. Sometimes I'm up only a few hours after sleep and am just too excited. I hope my excitement doesn't stress you out.

 

Just like your interpretation of the Buddha, you have no idea what your talking about when it comes to both me and Buddhism. Your pride of ignorance is your only leverage. Which you cannot express very well so instead you spend your time attacking someone who you can only assume about. Don't you have anything better to do? No, it's actually kind of fun and humorous actually. You are getting genuine Dharma teachings at the same time, though you don't understand them yet. You just make an ass of yourself, to yourself, because your interpretation of me is a false reality, any assumption of me is a hallucination. So it's like your making someone up in your mind to throw darts at, but really it's like throwing darts at yourself because that's the only reality of the image.

 

I share this information so that finally you can see yourself more clearly. When you know your wrong, you can finally start learning how to be right. Ya know?

I have in fact, I have admitted that I could be wrong about Taoist interpretation of cosmos on the thread put up by Sillicon... sound familiar? Then I re-read the I-Ching and see reification of a mysterious non-conceptual ground of all being, that everything is supposed to be a modification of? Buddhas teaching cuts through that mysterious unknowableness, thus there is true omniscience through Buddhism. Yes, I can indeed quote many Buddhas to prove Lau Tzu wrong. Then again, maybe it's just the English translations of his words that give the wrong assumptions? This happens with Dzogchen texts a whole lot. So many Westerners mistaken Dzogchen teachings as a reification of some Divine source of all reality due to reading translations. Which is a mis-interpretation of the teaching.

 

Oh... also it took a lot to realize that the Buddhas teachings were subtler than Vedanta, because I grew up reifying a source of all existence, both intellectually, and experientially, so my intuition was all based upon this fundamental lie that keeps endless beings recycling. I admitted my conversion to the very people I argued against for years on E-Sangha.

 

If you can really prove me wrong with scriptural support and logic. Which you think I have none of, then I'll humbly concede only after I apply the information to my meditation and experience the truth of your assertions first hand. As experience is what it took to convert me to Buddhism. I grew up with a view such as yours, not understanding Buddhism, thinking much like Dwai that all these Buddhists mis-interpret the Buddha and Vedanta has the real understanding of what the Buddha taught. It was quite hard to convert for me, and it took a lot of letting go, it was very painful and took a number of years of contemplation and inner debate. But, my quest is for Truth, not dogma. The Vedas pose a deep dogma that all being comes from one source and that there is an intelligent personal/impersonal creator of all things. That all paths lead to the same truth because they come from the same truth. This is based upon a mistaken cognition and mistaken interpretation of spiritual experience.

Oh, I loooove Florida. I don't get neck injuries trying to look at the sky. Summer is pretty much year round. The waters are so warm. The air so much clearer. People are so much nicer and I feel again that I'm where I'm supposed to be. My Mom lives here and it's just very nice for me. Thanks for proving more of your subjectivity to yourself again.

 

If you took a second to look at yourself with even a little bit of objectivity you would see how full of crap you are. You take your time to read my posts, mistinterpret them, call them boring, then follow me around and attack me personally starting whole new threads just to do so. I must threaten you? When you don't know the first thing about me, or my life, or my history. Your entire interpretation of me is based upon ill informed assumptions. Or pre-conceptions based upon the fact that I'm making you insecure by subverting your interpretation of cosmos. So, you have to kill the enemy. Screw the words, just kill the enemy, go for the throat.

I hope I didn't bore you to death this time.

 

 

Yeah, still boring. Maybe a 12-Step group for Recovering Narcissists?

 

 

 

 

 

.

[Vajrahridaya]

Yeah, still boring. Maybe a 12-Step group for Recovering Narcissists?

.

 

For you it would be the 8-fold noble path.

 

Of course you won't admit how wrong you are. I have a number of times online. I'm very proud of that. As a narcissist, ya know?

[Old Man Contradiction]

I'm no master, but I heard it's impossible to argue with someone that accepts you unconditionally as you are.

[Vajrahridaya]

Yeah, still boring. Maybe a 12-Step group for Recovering Narcissists?

.

 

Oh! Great tags by the way. You really showed me... man. I'm glad I live next to my Mom... I can go there and cry to her and ask if I can maybe crawl into her bed so she can comfort me.

Edited August 11, 2009 by Vajrahridaya

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

Oh! Great tags by the way. You really showed me... man. I'm glad I live next to my Mom... I can go there and cry to her and ask if I can maybe crawl into her bed so she can comfort me.

 

 

You can probably pinch a few of her Xanax to help get you to sleep...she probably won't notice.

 

g'nite!

Edited August 11, 2009 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[Vajrahridaya]

Say what?? What the hell does that mean? More of your fancy uber-pedantic utterly meaningless buddhaspeak, O Mighty Mighty?

But hey. Good times!

 

Ok... I'll try to simplify through more words. Since your having a hard time unpacking less words.

 

It means basically that to mistake any experience as a solid Self, is a deeply subtle pride. It's what the Buddha say's is the cause for rebirth in the Deva realms or the long lived formless consciousness realms. It's also the cause of being a first born in a cosmic eon after the last cosmic eon passes into formless potentiality, which Toaism and Hinduism seems to take as the absolute Truth of things, that formless potentiality. Being the first born, seeing all else come after your formless awakened awareness one thinks that one is the actual creator of everything else and that all things are one with you literally on a substantial non-conceptual level. It's a very deeply blissful state and hugely powerful, but it's also ignorance. In Vedic cosmology they talk about how when his eyes are closed there is no universe and then when his eyes open the universe is there, they also do it the other way around. It's a cosmology based upon this assumption though. It's put many different way's in Vedanta, but it's basically reifying a formless source of all existence. So, it's the biggest form of narcissism and the subtlest as it seems non-dual, compassionate as you experience love and bliss for everyone but it does not have omniscience, or insight. It's a very deep delusion that's extremely hard to get over because it's a very, very attractive type of ignorance. But, it's a false liberation as when the merit dies out, that long lived god state will go to sleep, and awaken in a new cosmos completely ignorant of what happened, until one see's emptiness/D.O. directly and starts awakening memories in one's storehouse. Memories that are even older than the current cosmic eon.

 

I hope I'm wrong about this feeling I'm having that I'm talking to a trampoline.

 

You can probably pinch a few of her Xanax to help get you to sleep...she probably won't notice.

 

g'nite!

 

She doesn't use any drug at all actually. She's quite a good Hindu Yogini. Quite clear and saintly.

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

Ok... I'll try to simplify through more words. Since your having a hard time unpacking less words.

 

It means basically that to mistake any experience as a solid Self, is a deeply subtle pride. It's what the Buddha say's is the cause for rebirth in the Deva realms or the long lived formless consciousness realms. It's also the cause of being a first born in a cosmic eon after the last cosmic eon passes into formless potentiality, which Toaism and Hinduism seems to take as the absolute Truth of things, that formless potentiality. Being the first born, seeing all else come after your formless awakened awareness one thinks that one is the actual creator of everything else and that all things are one with you literally on a substantial non-conceptual level. It's a very deeply blissful state and hugely powerful, but it's also ignorance. In Vedic cosmology they talk about how when his eyes are closed there is no universe and then when his eyes open the universe is there, they also do it the other way around. It's a cosmology based upon this assumption though. It's put many different way's in Vedanta, but it's basically reifying a formless source of all existence. So, it's the biggest form of narcissism and the subtlest as it seems non-dual, compassionate as you experience love and bliss for everyone but it does not have omniscience, or insight. It's a very deep delusion that's extremely hard to get over because it's a very, very attractive type of ignorance. But, it's a false liberation as when the merit dies out, that long lived god state will go to sleep, and awaken in a new cosmos completely ignorant of what happened, until one see's emptiness/D.O. directly and starts awakening memories in one's storehouse. Memories that are even older than the current cosmic eon.

 

 

 

more nonsense. and more boring, if that's possible. hey, i thought you were going to climb into Divine Mother's bed for the night?

Edited August 11, 2009 by TheSongsofDistantEarth

[Vajrahridaya]

more nonsense. and more boring, if that's possible. hey, i thought you were going to climb into Divine Mother's bed for the night?

 

Wow... you are a trampoline.

 

It's sad... you can't really read, but you can sure insult what you don't understand. I'm actually sad for you. I know, I shouldn't pity.

 

Well, I'm glad you do some practices and have some spiritual experience. This will lead to higher rebirth.

[Vajrahridaya]

I'll try one more.

 

Buddha's teachings is a path that attempts to pull people out of the programing of coming from one source and returning to one source. Which is a constant recycling that is beginningless.