Should a Taoist Forum focus primarily on Taoism?

[nac]

Oh!! I forgot to say... writing on here or anywhere is a practice too... In fact, every moment is practice of the Dharma.

We can see that.

[~jK~]

Edited August 20, 2009 by ~jK~

[Vajrahridaya]

To become one with all.

See you there.

Good Videos.

 

(~jK~)

 

You guys go ahead and be one with all... I'll see you in the next universe evolve from amoebas.

 

It'll be fun!

[Marblehead]

You guys go ahead and be one with all... I'll see you in the next universe evolve from amoebas.

 

It'll be fun!

 

There we go again with that implied Christian concept of an eternal soul of man being implanted into a new-born baby.

 

Some people just can't leave superstition alone.

 

Be well!

[~jK~]

You seem to be missing the important portion:

The Hatching. - Next step in evolution?

But - you are right - it is fun!

As always - what is real-

Is obvious.

 

Why are so many looking into Taoist theory, Astral projection, book: "Childhoods End" by Author C. Clarke

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Songs_of_Distant_Earth

Even 600+ year old book "The Secret of The Golden Flower" is about leaving out body behind..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood's_End

It seems we as the human race have outgrown our planetary home AKA our Egg.

Download Clarke, Arthur C. - Earthlight free ebook

The universal constant: Matter and Energy can not be created or destroyed.

Free Books !!! http://www.truly-free.org/#fC

But both are interchangable as their vibratory state raises or lowers.

 

Energy seeks enthropy.

Mass seeks to evolve.

Galatic Reincarnation?

Edited August 21, 2009 by ~jK~

[Marblehead]

You seem to be missing the important portion:

 

The Hatching. - Next step in evolution?

 

Why are so many looking into Taoist theory, Astral projection, books written: "Childhoods End" by Author C. Clarke - about 40 years back?

 

Even 600+ year old book "The Secret of The Golden Flower" is about leaving out body behind..

 

It seems we as the human race have outgrown our planetary home AKA our Egg.

 

Strange. I don't feel I am missing anything. I was an egg for nine months. I hatched. Now I am a chicken (well, rooster, actually). One day I will be someone's supper. The end.

 

What did I miss?

 

Be well!

[~jK~]

Strange. I don't feel I am missing anything. I was an egg for nine months. I hatched. Now I am a chicken (well, rooster, actually). One day I will be someone's supper. The end.

 

What did I miss?

 

Be well!

 

Look back one page

[Vajrahridaya]

There we go again with that implied Christian concept of an eternal soul of man being implanted into a new-born baby.

 

Some people just can't leave superstition alone.

 

Be well!

 

Some people haven't been that deep in meditation. I have no superstition of an eternal soul... I just understand and have seen directly how dependent origination works and how moments of consciousness transcend the physical body. Which has nothing to do with a permanent soul.

 

Impermanence is permanent though.

 

Get off your low horse.

 

Strange. I don't feel I am missing anything. I was an egg for nine months. I hatched. Now I am a chicken (well, rooster, actually). One day I will be someone's supper. The end.

 

What did I miss?

 

Be well!

 

Yes, and you think physical death is the end...

 

We'll you might just experience it as so because your belief is strongly wrapped around such ideas. So, you will most likely just forget as soon as your causation leads you to another life after this one.

 

You have no idea what beings traverse the region around you at this moment, do you?

[~jK~]

Some people haven't been that deep in meditation. I have no superstition of an eternal soul... I just understand and have seen directly how dependent origination works and how moments of consciousness transcend the physical body. Which has nothing to do with a permanent soul.

 

Impermanence is permanent though.

 

Get off your low horse.

Yes, and you think physical death is the end...

 

We'll you might just experience it as so because your belief is strongly wrapped around such ideas. So, you will most likely just forget as soon as your causation leads you to another life after this one.

 

You have no idea what beings traverse the region around you at this moment, do you?

 

You seem to be missing the important portion:

The Hatching. - Next step in evolution?

But - you are right - it is fun!

As always - what is real-

Is obvious.

 

Why are so many looking into Taoist theory, Astral projection, book: "Childhoods End" by Author C. Clarke

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Songs_of_Distant_Earth

Even 600+ year old book "The Secret of The Golden Flower" is about leaving our body behind..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood's_End

It seems we as the human race have outgrown our planetary home AKA our Egg.

Download Clarke, Arthur C. - Earthlight free ebook

The universal constant: Matter and Energy can not be created or destroyed.

Free Books !!! http://www.truly-free.org/#fC

But both are interchangable as their vibratory state raises or lowers.

 

Energy seeks enthropy.

Mass seeks to evolve.

Galatic Reincarnation

[Vajrahridaya]

Has anyone read, "Joseph Chilton Pearce"?

 

Click on the link above. His works include, "Cracking the Cosmic Egg", which revolutionized child psychology in the 70's.

 

Take care!

 

 

 

 

 

You seem to be missing the important portion:

The Hatching. - Next step in evolution?

But - you are right - it is fun!

As always - what is real-

Is obvious.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yoga_Vasistha

 

Energy seeks enthropy.

Mass seeks to evolve.

Galatic Reincarnation

 

You are an interesting person.

 

I've known about Mung beans for quite some time, but not in the way you have given me. Thanks!

[Marblehead]

You have no idea what beings traverse the region around you at this moment, do you?

 

Nope! And this is because none have ever presented themself to me nor have I ever visualized any. I'm not saying there are none (we can never prove that something does not exist) all I am saying is that I have never had the experience.

 

Maybe they present themself to only those who believe?

 

I will say once again so that I am never misunderstood. Unless I quote someone else's words everything I say in this forum is my opinion based upon my understanding. I am not, nor will I ever suggest that everyone should believe the way I do.

 

And even if someone were to accept my opinion as valid my 'way' may not be a 'good way' for that person. All I am saying is that 'my way' works for 'me'. We each must walk our own path.

 

But I think it is good for someone who is just beginning their journey to understand that there are more ways than one to walk one's path.

 

Opinions are just that - opinions. Even the texts that many of us reference are nothing more than the opinions of the author. There are no absolutes!!!!! And what is good for me might be very bad for another.

 

But if we have no choices we have no free will! This is important! I will say it again. "If we have no choices we have no free will." I am presenting an alternative choice to others. What is done with any word I speak (type on the keyboard) here is little more than spit in the wind. If it lands on someone it will effect them in some way - if it lands on noone no matter.

 

I cannot be like you - you cannot be like me. We are each our own person and we must walk our talk else we are deceiving ourself and all who listen to us.

 

So, no, I do not believe in ghosts, I do not believe in spirits that fly all around the universe, I do not believe in big foot, and on and on.

 

But I do rather feel much better when I am talking about those things that I believe in. I believe in me. I exist. I can talk about me. I believe that you exist so therefore I can speak with you and have constructive conversations. But it is impossible for me to believe in something that I believe does not exist whether it exists or not. My belief is key to me - your belief is key to you.

 

Be well!

 

 

 

Look back one page

 

Please specify.

 

Be well!

[nac]

The universal constant: Matter and Energy can not be created or destroyed.

Yes they can!

[Marblehead]

 

The universal constant: Matter and Energy can not be created or destroyed.

 

Yes they can!

 

Are you sure I included the word 'matter' in what I said? Yes, I have said that energy is never lost. Yes, it does get transformed but it is never lost. More often than not it transforms into heat.

 

I do see what you are pointing at but I have no way to respond to what you have not yet spoken. Hehehe. How's that for a cop-out?

 

Matter is constantly being created out of the Mystery. I have always accepted this concept since I accepted Taoism into my life. I cannot speak to the idea of new energy being created as I have not considered this thought. Is there a finite amount of energy in the universe? Is there some process that allows Tao to create more energy than is currently in existence? I don't know.

 

It is said that the galaxies are movving further apart. To me that would mean that the universe is getting larger. But this does not require the creation of new matter or energy. Perhaps the universe will continue expanding and eventuall die a cold death. I don't know but I do know that this would be contrary to the Taoist thoughts of cycles and reversion.

 

So what were we talking about? The possible existence of ghosts? Or a soul that never dies?

 

Be well!

[nac]

Energy can be spontaneously created and destroyed in minute quantum time periods as long as the energy debt is repaid quickly.

[dwai]

Are you sure I included the word 'matter' in what I said? Yes, I have said that energy is never lost. Yes, it does get transformed but it is never lost. More often than not it transforms into heat.

 

I do see what you are pointing at but I have no way to respond to what you have not yet spoken. Hehehe. How's that for a cop-out?

 

Matter is constantly being created out of the Mystery. I have always accepted this concept since I accepted Taoism into my life. I cannot speak to the idea of new energy being created as I have not considered this thought. Is there a finite amount of energy in the universe? Is there some process that allows Tao to create more energy than is currently in existence? I don't know.

 

It is said that the galaxies are movving further apart. To me that would mean that the universe is getting larger. But this does not require the creation of new matter or energy. Perhaps the universe will continue expanding and eventuall die a cold death. I don't know but I do know that this would be contrary to the Taoist thoughts of cycles and reversion.

 

So what were we talking about? The possible existence of ghosts? Or a soul that never dies?

 

Be well!

 

Er...actually if you consider the case of a Blackhole, you'll find that matter (condensed energy) seems to sink into a "void" (thus destroyed).

 

Of course, there are hypotheses of Whiteholes that complement the blackholes but none have been found yet and are considered to be founts of energy/matter without any evident cause/source.

But to think of it, "Blackhole - Yin, Whitehole Yang, Wormhole - Taijitu"?

[Marblehead]

Er...actually if you consider the case of a Blackhole, you'll find that matter (condensed energy) seems to sink into a "void" (thus destroyed).

 

Hehehe. But then if you consider that I do not accept this theory we are back where we were before.

 

 

Of course, there are hypotheses of Whiteholes that complement the blackholes but none have been found yet and are considered to be founts of energy/matter without any evident cause/source.

But to think of it, "Blackhole - Yin, Whitehole Yang, Wormhole - Taijitu"?

 

I have been hearing more about these thoughts recently. I have not seriously considered whiteholes yet but at this poin in time what little info I have doesn't conflict with my Taoist beliefs. (Well, okay, I must state "My Supplimented Taoist Beliefs".)

 

But to think of it, "Blackhole - Yin, Whitehole Yang, Wormhole - Taijitu"?

 

Interesting. That might be a valid association.

 

Be well!

[Pietro]

Er...actually if you consider the case of a Blackhole, you'll find that matter (condensed energy) seems to sink into a "void" (thus destroyed).

 

Of course, there are hypotheses of Whiteholes that complement the blackholes but none have been found yet and are considered to be founts of energy/matter without any evident cause/source.

But to think of it, "Blackhole - Yin, Whitehole Yang, Wormhole - Taijitu"?

 

I thought the idea was that eventually a universe with all blackhole would explode back into a new big bang.

 

After all the big bang is the only whie hole we kind of have (indirectly) observed

 

Energy can be spontaneously created and destroyed in minute quantum time periods as long as the energy debt is repaid quickly.

 

 

ok, so for t>"quickly" energy+matter cannot be created or destroyed.

 

Do we agree on this?

[~jK~]

Has anyone read, "Joseph Chilton Pearce"?

 

Click on the link above. His works include, "Cracking the Cosmic Egg", which revolutionized child psychology in the 70's.

 

Take care!

 

 

You are an interesting person.

 

I've known about Mung beans for quite some time, but not in the way you have given me. Thanks!

 

Welcome - it works,

I have read the websites.

At age 17 to 21, I had teachers from India.

I don't try to escape samsara, I seek to control it.

I need return to my birth mother it was she that taught me.

My first memory of meditating was from age 4 - it was an inborn talent.

Born in deep Appalachian mountains, my mother reached level of PhD in Education.

My favourite book in the field of "Psych is "I'm Ok 're Ok". The graphic analytical technique.

 

Bondage through desires is the only enemy.

[Zhuo Ming-Dao]

Er...actually if you consider the case of a Blackhole, you'll find that matter (condensed energy) seems to sink into a "void" (thus destroyed).

 

Of course, there are hypotheses of Whiteholes that complement the blackholes but none have been found yet and are considered to be founts of energy/matter without any evident cause/source.

But to think of it, "Blackhole - Yin, Whitehole Yang, Wormhole - Taijitu"?

 

The singularity theory was disproved by Steven Hawking. Matter and energy that enter a black hole is crunched into a type of cosmic radiation that leaks back out of the black hole and is called Hawking Radiation. This has been verified many times over the last few years by astrophysicists.

[Creation]

Sorry to perpetuate off-topic-ness, but I'm on a bit of a crusade to right the wrongs of popular science writing.

 

About mass being created and destroyed on small time scales: These "zero-point" fluctuations are not observable. They were first hypothesized held to "exist" because of the great confusion that is the philosophical and mathematical foundations of quantum physics, and are thought to be "proven" because assuming they exist predicts the (experimentally verified) Casmir effect and accurately describes certain properties of electron orbits that quantum theory without the fluctuations cannot account for. Now these effects can be predicted with other models that don't have these unobservable fluctuations (fluctuation-dissipation theorem). So their "existence" is dubious.

 

About black holes: A black hole is a region of spacetime from which a massive particle cannot escape. That doesn't mean it is a "void". It's just that something inside is cut off from communicating with the world outside. But life can go on inside just fine. Now, such an object develops a "singularity" in its gravitational field (proved by Roger Penrose, I believe). Hawking reversed this argument and said any universe with enough mass had to have a singularity at its beginning (big bang). (This is the first thing that Hawking got attention for.) These are mathematical consequences of general relativity. Now, is the way that GR models things applicable to these scales? No. Has anyone ever observed a black hole and seen if anyone's theories about them are correct? No. There are just distant objects that, given their observed properties, GR predicts should be black holes. Has anyone solved the equations of GR for a realistic configuration of mass falling into a realistic model of a black hole (i.e. not modeling both by points)? No. So most of the stuff about black holes, white holes, big bangs, universes branching off of each other, etc. is pure speculation.

 

The singularity theory was disproved by Steven Hawking. Matter and energy that enter a black hole is crunched into a type of cosmic radiation that leaks back out of the black hole and is called Hawking Radiation. This has been verified many times over the last few years by astrophysicists.

Hmmm... I was under the impression that Hawking radiation has never been experimentally observed. I mean, how could you observe it? Hawking once lamented that it was too bad it is near-impossible to observe, because if someone observed it he would definitely get a Nobel prize. Actually, since Hawking proved a singularity theorem (see above) I think you are a bit mixed up.

 

Anyone who is interested in a comprehensive look at modern physics that does not confuse what is proven with what is currently fashionable to speculate about, check out Roger Penrose's The Road to Reality http://www.amazon.com/Road-Reality-Complet...7517&sr=8-1.

[~jK~]

The singularity theory was disproved by Steven Hawking. Matter and energy that enter a black hole is crunched into a type of cosmic radiation that leaks back out of the black hole and is called Hawking Radiation. This has been verified many times over the last few years by astrophysicists.

Er - MeThinks you are far - far over your head with the physics.

#0 supporting evidence fr your claims is Er - like where?

#1>Begin with the possible causes of a black hole.

#2> What is in the black hole?

#3> What else leaks out?

#4>What is Radiation?

[~jK~]

Sorry to perpetuate off-topic-ness, but I'm on a bit of a crusade to right the wrongs of popular science writing.

 

About mass being created and destroyed on small time scales: These "zero-point" fluctuations are not observable. They were first hypothesized held to "exist" because of the great confusion that is the philosophical and mathematical foundations of quantum physics, and are thought to be "proven" because assuming they exist predicts the (experimentally verified) Casmir effect and accurately describes certain properties of electron orbits that quantum theory without the fluctuations cannot account for. Now these effects can be predicted with other models that don't have these unobservable fluctuations (fluctuation-dissipation theorem). So their "existence" is dubious.

 

About black holes: A black hole is a region of spacetime from which a massive particle cannot escape. That doesn't mean it is a "void". It's just that something inside is cut off from communicating with the world outside. But life can go on inside just fine. Now, such an object develops a "singularity" in its gravitational field (proved by Roger Penrose, I believe). Hawking reversed this argument and said any universe with enough mass had to have a singularity at its beginning (big bang). (This is the first thing that Hawking got attention for.) These are mathematical consequences of general relativity. Now, is the way that GR models things applicable to these scales? No. Has anyone ever observed a black hole and seen if anyone's theories about them are correct? No. There are just distant objects that, given their observed properties, GR predicts should be black holes. Has anyone solved the equations of GR for a realistic configuration of mass falling into a realistic model of a black hole (i.e. not modeling both by points)? No. So most of the stuff about black holes, white holes, big bangs, universes branching off of each other, etc. is pure speculation.

Hmmm... I was under the impression that Hawking radiation has never been experimentally observed. I mean, how could you observe it? Hawking once lamented that it was too bad it is near-impossible to observe, because if someone observed it he would definitely get a Nobel prize. Actually, since Hawking proved a singularity theorem (see above) I think you are a bit mixed up.

 

Anyone who is interested in a comprehensive look at modern physics that does not confuse what is proven with what is currently fashionable to speculate about, check out Roger Penrose's The Road to Reality http://www.amazon.com/Road-Reality-Complet...7517&sr=8-1.

 

The Law of Conservation of energy is one of the most examined laws of physics. one way of stating it is : E=MC2

Here it is a bit more explained:

The law of conservation of energy states that the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant. A consequence of this law is that energy cannot be created nor destroyed. The only thing that can happen with energy in an isolated system is that it can change form, for instance kinetic energy can become thermal energy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy

[Pietro]

Sorry to perpetuate off-topic-ness, but I'm on a bit of a crusade to right the wrongs of popular science writing.

 

About mass being created and destroyed on small time scales: These "zero-point" fluctuations are not observable. They were first hypothesized held to "exist" because of the great confusion that is the philosophical and mathematical foundations of quantum physics, and are thought to be "proven" because assuming they exist predicts the (experimentally verified) Casmir effect and accurately describes certain properties of electron orbits that quantum theory without the fluctuations cannot account for. Now these effects can be predicted with other models that don't have these unobservable fluctuations (fluctuation-dissipation theorem). So their "existence" is dubious.

 

Thanks for clearing that out. There are good reasonw why I generally keep myself off quantum stuff. I never understood it while at the Uni. And I had to give an exam on it!

 

Anyone who is interested in a comprehensive look at modern physics that does not confuse what is proven with what is currently fashionable to speculate about, check out Roger Penrose's The Road to Reality http://www.amazon.com/Road-Reality-Complet...7517&sr=8-1.

I certainly will.

 

Pietro

[~jK~]

THE REVIEW:

Where's the physics? That's what really matters!" Unfortunately, I felt that this book suffered from just that. And that gave me the impression that today's theoretical physics had left physics behind. If that is true, then this book, for all its problems, has succeeded in making this clear. If it is false, then this book has done physics a disservice.

[Vajrahridaya]

Er...actually if you consider the case of a Blackhole, you'll find that matter (condensed energy) seems to sink into a "void" (thus destroyed).

 

Of course, there are hypotheses of Whiteholes that complement the blackholes but none have been found yet and are considered to be founts of energy/matter without any evident cause/source.

But to think of it, "Blackhole - Yin, Whitehole Yang, Wormhole - Taijitu"?

 

I would more say put out of reach, into unconscious potentiality.

 

 

 

Welcome - it works,

I have read the websites.

At age 17 to 21, I had teachers from India.

I don't try to escape samsara, I seek to control it.

I need return to my birth mother it was she that taught me.

My first memory of meditating was from age 4 - it was an inborn talent.

Born in deep Appalachian mountains, my mother reached level of PhD in Education.

My favourite book in the field of "Psych is "I'm Ok 're Ok". The graphic analytical technique.

 

Bondage through desires is the only enemy.

 

Yes, my Mother is a PHD as well. I also experienced spontaneous meditation as a young child and experienced the first few jhanas spontaneously as a kid. My first movements were hatha yoga body postures, due to the fact that my mother would do hatha yoga pregnant with me, and these were the strongest and most deep impressions on my psyche so they were my first movements as a baby. Pretty cool, eh? So, get your wives to do yoga when they are pregnant, because it's very peaceful and releases very good energy into the womb.