Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 (edited) Edited September 25, 2009 by Marblehead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 "But wait!" cried the religious man. "If I discard my religion and my illusion of happiness and fail in my search to find real happiness won't I risk the chance of being unhappy the rest of my life?" Â To this replied the Taoist Sage, "There is always that possibility. There are no universal absolutes. There are no universal truths. All life, all things, all non-things are in constant flux." Â And so, at this point a choice needs be made. Those who wish to hold to their illusional happiness based upon their man-made religion may stop reading any further. Those who wish to continue the journey must await the next installment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sunya Posted September 25, 2009 "But wait!" cried the religious man. "If I discard my religion and my illusion of happiness and fail in my search to find real happiness won't I risk the chance of being unhappy the rest of my life?" Â To this replied the Taoist Sage, "There is always that possibility. There are no universal absolutes. There are no universal truths. All life, all things, all non-things are in constant flux." Â And so, at this point a choice needs be made. Those who wish to hold to their illusional happiness based upon their man-made religion may stop reading any further. Those who wish to continue the journey must await the next installment. Â "There are no universal truths" isn't that itself a universal truth? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 (edited) "There are no universal truths" isn't that itself a universal truth? Â I have no idea. But I will ask the next Taoist sage I see. I promise! Â Happy Trails! Â Hey! I saw one about 15 minutes ago. I asked him and he said, "Only if you want it to be." I asked him what that meant and he just smiled and walked away. So there you go. Â Don't Worry! Be Happy! Edited September 25, 2009 by Marblehead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eviander Posted September 25, 2009 (edited) "There are no universal truths" isn't that itself a universal truth? Â Indeed it is. Â Again..words fail ontology..wisdom is not knowledge. Â edit- Â I would like to suggest that "real happiness" is a subjective attribute..since everyone has different value judgments and standards for what they consider happiness to be. Â So what is real happiness then? Edited September 25, 2009 by Eviander Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 (edited) So what is real happiness then? Â Patience! Patience! That is what this search is all about. Afterall Rome was not built in just one day nor was it destroyed in just one day. Â Learn to fly with the birds! Edited September 25, 2009 by Marblehead Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CarsonZi Posted September 25, 2009 So what is real happiness then?  The cessation of all suffering....IMO anyways  Love, Carson Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eviander Posted September 25, 2009 The cessation of all suffering....IMO anyways  Love, Carson   So death is happiness?  That definition has to be extended before it can be fulfilled.  What is suffering? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CarsonZi Posted September 25, 2009 (edited) So death is happiness?  That definition has to be extended before it can be fulfilled.  What is suffering?  What is death?  Suffering is individual. What is suffering for one is Bliss for another. Suffering to me is not resting in my True Nature, which is (for me) Pure Bliss Conciousness.  Love, Carson  The thought that suffering is mandatory and death is final is an illusion....a lie. Edited September 25, 2009 by CarsonZi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 Be patient my loving children. All will be revealed in due time. Â Go now. Give your mind a bath and get some rest. Â Don't forget to stop and smell the roses. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eviander Posted September 25, 2009 What is death?  Suffering is individual. What is suffering for one is Bliss for another. Suffering to me is not resting in my True Nature, which is (for me) Pure Bliss Conciousness.  Love, Carson  Both suffering and death are illusions.  By your standards then..happiness must also be an illusion. Since happiness is the cessation of an illusory condition called suffering.  But yes I agree on one thing..suffering is individual. That must also mean happiness to is individual..which puts us back at point 1.  But death is only in form..this I am sure you also agree with..for consciousness as we all should know..is timeless. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CarsonZi Posted September 25, 2009 By your standards then..happiness must also be an illusion. Since happiness is the cessation of an illusory condition called suffering.  But yes I agree on one thing..suffering is individual. That must also mean happiness to is individual..which puts us back at point 1.  But death is only in form..this I am sure you also agree with..for consciousness as we all should know..is timeless.  Sorry Eviander....  I shouldn't have posted so quickly and should have properly wrote what I meant before posting. I editted like 5 times to get the wording that more adaquately portrays my point.  What I meant was "The thought that suffering is mandatory and death is final is an illusion....a lie."  All things are impermanent, so happiness is in a sense an illusion if you define happiness as a static state. But REAL happiness is not static....it is flowing...it is all encompassing Bliss no matter the circumstances. It is our true nature. But yes, happiness is DEFINED individually.....but when experienced it is Universal  Love, Carson Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 By early evening decisions had been made. Those who wished to hold to their various religions departed and those who chose to be seekers assembled near the Sage's hut and the commotion brought the Sage to the door of his hut. He asked, "What is all this commotion?" The seekers replied, "We are ready to begin our search." Some of the seekers noticed the silhouette of a young maiden on the shade of the Sage's hut window. Giggling erupted. The Sage cried out, "Silence! Silence! Go to bed now and get some rest and we will begin our journey in the morning." With that the Sage returned to his hut. Â Â PS I'm glad you guys are having fun with this. There will be many more opportunities, I am sure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eviander Posted September 25, 2009 Sorry Eviander....  I shouldn't have posted so quickly and should have properly wrote what I meant before posting. I editted like 5 times to get the wording that more adaquately portrays my point.  What I meant was "The thought that suffering is mandatory and death is final is an illusion....a lie."  All things are impermanent, so happiness is in a sense an illusion if you define happiness as a static state. But REAL happiness is not static....it is flowing...it is all encompassing Bliss no matter the circumstances. It is our true nature. But yes, happiness is DEFINED individually.....but when experienced it is Universal  Love, Carson  Well said.  But how could an individual essence be experienced as a universal? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CarsonZi Posted September 25, 2009 But how could an individual essence be experienced as a universal? Â There is no such thing as an "individual" essence.....that is ego and it is not Real. Â Love, Carson Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eviander Posted September 25, 2009 There is no such thing as an "individual" essence.....that is ego and it is not Real.  Love, Carson  Well..at one point individuality must be realized. For instance the fact that we are experiencing the vibrations of reality from separate minds or filters is an expression of the fact that a kind of unified separation exists. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CarsonZi Posted September 25, 2009 Well..at one point individuality must be realized. For instance the fact that we are experiencing the vibrations of reality from separate minds or filters is an expression of the fact that a kind of unified separation exists.  At one point individuality must be realized as a lie. Sure we have individual experiences, but we are not our experiences.  Love, Carson  Seperation exists but it is not Reality Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eviander Posted September 25, 2009 At one point individuality must be realized as a lie. Sure we have individual experiences, but we are not our experiences.  Love, Carson  Seperation exists but it is not Reality   That's it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tao99 Posted September 25, 2009 By early evening decisions had been made. Those who wished to hold to their various religions departed and those who chose to be seekers assembled near the Sage's hut and the commotion brought the Sage to the door of his hut. He asked, "What is all this commotion?" The seekers replied, "We are ready to begin our search." Some of the seekers noticed the silhouette of a young maiden on the shade of the Sage's hut window. Giggling erputed. Â hehehehe!! woohoo!! She purdy! My rinky dink is quivering like it's got a mind of its own! Â The Sage cried out, "Silence! Silence! Go to bed now and get some rest and we will begin our journey in the morning." With that the Sage returned to his hut. Â sorry. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 25, 2009 Â sorry. Â No need. We are going to have fun with this whether I want to or not. Â Don't forget to dance! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 26, 2009 A new day! Â The dawn is breaking; the animals are stirring; the seekers begin to assemble. Â The Sage appears. Â "Where shall we begin our search?" asks the Sage. The seekers remain silent. Â "Let us ask one of the greatest seekers of all time, Rene Descartes." suggests the Sage. "Gather your affairs, my seekers so that our search for 'Real Happiness' can begin." Â The seekers hurry off to get their affairs in order. The Sage returns to his hut to prepare himself for the journey. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted September 26, 2009 Rene Descartes practicing Universal Doubt refused to see anyone who couldn't prove beyond doubt that they existed. Hidden in his oven (or stove or whatever it was) he hurled insults at the seekers as they gathered outside. Â "Oh great philosopher we have come seeking truth, " they shouted. Â "Go away!" replied the crusty old Frenchman. Â "How can we go away if we don't exist?" the asked disingenuously. Â "Rats!" said Descartes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Marblehead Posted September 26, 2009 That was cute Apepch7! Â "Well, come in then, if you must." he said. They all crowded into the room and Rene asks, "So why have you come?" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeiChuan Posted September 26, 2009 A person who's really happy must not believe anything.. They have to know.. Then they can be genuinely happy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Apech Posted September 26, 2009 That was cute Apepch7! Â "Well, come in then, if you must." he said. They all crowded into the room and Rene asks, "So why have you come?" Â The seekers pushed the oldest to the front. Â "We seek therefore we are," he said. Â "Merde!" the muffled voice of the philosopher replied " Zey have stolen my best line!" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
