Do any Bums stare at Goats?

[voidisyinyang]

Witch -- this is a fun Sapolsky lecture on human hormone-neurotransmitters and sex behavior:

 

 

At minute 27 he goes into dopamine as the "anticipation of reward" -- the "goal directed behavior" is fueled by dopamine.

 

Dayum. I stand corrected! Hmmm...I have some people to talk to about that article.

Edited November 18, 2009 by drewhempel

[witch]

Can't watch at work, but I have no problem with the reward system of the body. I'm not a Buddhist, and I think the body is pretty smart. I love dopamine. And I don't like the value our culture places on serotonin.

[voidisyinyang]

At minute 30 of Sapolsky's "human uniqueness" lecture he states that the dopamine "anticipation of reward" and dopamine "intentional goal behavior" is SO STRONG in humans that we actually undergo intense pain based on the belief we will be rewarded in the afterlife.... through religion.

 

Can't watch at work, but I have no problem with the reward system of the body. I'm not a Buddhist, and I think the body is pretty smart. I love dopamine. And I don't like the value our culture places on serotonin.

[Andrei]

And I don't like the value our culture places on serotonin.

 

The pop culture places the value on adrenaline and testosterone.

The spiritual culture places the value on serotonin and oxytocin.

The underground culture places the value on dopamine.

Which culture are you refering to?

[witch]

The pop culture places value on serotonin and adrenaline. Our society is driven by serotonin and adrenaline.

[gendao]

The pop culture places the value on adrenaline and testosterone.

The spiritual culture places the value on serotonin and oxytocin.

The underground culture places the value on dopamine.

Which culture are you refering to?

Haha, I like this!

 

Can someone summarize the properties of each hormone here, though? What stimulates their production, and what behaviors they induce?

[witch]

Here's more on our culture pushing serotonin-dominated personality

 

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/20851

 

Testosterone is under attack on all sides, from BPA to female hormones in our drinking water.

[Andrei]

Here's more on our culture pushing serotonin-dominated personality

 

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/20851

 

Testosterone is under attack on all sides, from BPA to female hormones in our drinking water.

 

 

I don't know, maybe we live in different cultures...

I read the article on diagonal, I couldn't see any reference to serotonin, only the fact that our society is depressive and the solution is Prozac.

 

The modern society is depressive because of the testosterone, adrenaline and dopamine which put the emphasis on desire without having any fulfilling reward. Because of that is depressing.

 

Car races, football, soccer, fighting sports, shooting videogames, action movies, special effects, show business, music business, fashion...everything arround us emphasis the testosterone, adrenaline and dopamine response in people. This is the modern society which is a rebellion against traditional societies. And the problem is that we don't LIVE, we don't reward and satisfy the hormonal responses in our bodies.

 

Traditional societies were built arround religions and spirituality, and churches and families. They put the emphasis on serotonin (meditation, relaxation, taichi, yoga, prayer, qigong, contemplation, monasteries, seclusion) and on the oxytocin (the bonding hormone of social gatherings, of families and couples, the love hormone)

 

Actually the solution to depression is serotonin, oxytocin and prolactin.

Do you know the piramid of human psychological needs?

http://www.businessballs.com/maslow.htm

 

The first level are the physiological needs trigered by hormones, but the second level - safety - triggers the serotonin, and the third level - belongingness and love - triggers the oxytocin.

 

You were right, serotonin in excess reduces or even kill the libido. I believe also prolactin is involved in this. But this is the exact confirmatory sign of the first stage in the spiritual path. I mean for male spirituality, because female spirituality is different.

 

The spiritual stages are:

 

1. When the Jing is full, you don't feel the need of sex - this is because the serotonin reached a certain level that inhibits any sexual desire. Of course there may be tentations that can induce dopamine spikes and this is the reason why spiritual mens secluded themselves in monasteries away from the female tentations.

 

2. When the Qi is full, you don't feel the hunger - I don't know exactly why, but I believe Drew's theory that the serotonin ionizes in the bio-electro-magnetic fields of the body inhibits the hunger sensation. This is proven by so many saints and yogis all arround the world and cultures from all times. As a proof you have the fasting in all cultures around the globe.

 

3. When the Shen is full, you don't feel the need of sleep. This is because the melatonin reached so high level that the cyrcadian rhytm is changed and the need of sleep is reduced. It is well known that very advanced spiritual masters sleep very little or not at all.

[witch]

The effect of Prozac is to raise serotonin levels to a constant ridiculously high level.

 

Bother. I'm not sure where people here are getting their science, but the biochemistry assumptions here are no better than the physics assumptions.

 

Do you know what is raised by "meditation, relaxation, taichi, yoga, prayer, qigong, contemplation, monasteries, seclusion"? Dopamine.

 

Here is some science on raising serotonin:

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2077351/

 

Vigorous exercise, bright natural spectrum light, taking tryptophan supplements (not food).

[gendao]

I don't know, maybe we live in different cultures...

I read the article on diagonal, I couldn't see any reference to serotonin, only the fact that our society is depressive and the solution is Prozac.

 

The modern society is depressive because of the testosterone, adrenaline and dopamine which put the emphasis on desire without having any fulfilling reward. Because of that is depressing.

 

Car races, football, soccer, fighting sports, shooting videogames, action movies, special effects, show business, music business, fashion...everything arround us emphasis the testosterone, adrenaline and dopamine response in people. This is the modern society which is a rebellion against traditional societies. And the problem is that we don't LIVE, we don't reward and satisfy the hormonal responses in our bodies.

 

Traditional societies were built arround religions and spirituality, and churches and families. They put the emphasis on serotonin (meditation, relaxation, taichi, yoga, prayer, qigong, contemplation, monasteries, seclusion) and on the oxytocin (the bonding hormone of social gatherings, of families and couples, the love hormone)

 

Actually the solution to depression is serotonin, oxytocin and prolactin.

Do you know the piramid of human psychological needs?

http://www.businessballs.com/maslow.htm

 

The first level are the physiological needs trigered by hormones, but the second level - safety - triggers the serotonin, and the third level - belongingness and love - triggers the oxytocin.

 

You were right, serotonin in excess reduces or even kill the libido. I believe also prolactin is involved in this. But this is the exact confirmatory sign of the first stage in the spiritual path. I mean for male spirituality, because female spirituality is different.

 

The spiritual stages are:

 

1. When the Jing is full, you don't feel the need of sex - this is because the serotonin reached a certain level that inhibits any sexual desire. Of course there may be tentations that can induce dopamine spikes and this is the reason why spiritual mens secluded themselves in monasteries away from the female tentations.

 

2. When the Qi is full, you don't feel the hunger - I don't know exactly why, but I believe Drew's theory that the serotonin ionizes in the bio-electro-magnetic fields of the body inhibits the hunger sensation. This is proven by so many saints and yogis all arround the world and cultures from all times. As a proof you have the fasting in all cultures around the globe.

 

3. When the Shen is full, you don't feel the need of sleep. This is because the melatonin reached so high level that the cyrcadian rhytm is changed and the need of sleep is reduced. It is well known that very advanced spiritual masters sleep very little or not at all.

Damn, a neatly simplified hormonal view of neidan.

 

You really need to post more, dude. What systems do you study, btw? Thanks!

[voidisyinyang]

Steam -- this is an interesting analysis but should be further clarified:

 

Qigong works because the body's blood and serotonin is overly focused in the stomach. When we do reverse breathing and most importantly, the FULL-LOTUS, then the vagus nerve is activated which then TRANSDUCES serotonin to the BRAIN. So we get bliss from a huge increase of serotonin because we have tons of serotonin it's just in our stomachs normally.

 

Now it's not just reverse breathing, nor is it just posture or body movement but it's most importantly mind concentration which IONIZES the serotonin in the stomach, through ultrasound. That's my own model. Others claim it's because the brain frequency goes down to theta which is also infrasound and the lower frequency enables a higher AMPLITUDE of energy. So that's the classical model whereas the increased brain frequency is the quantum model. Both are just Western analogies.

 

So to answer your first question -- the body stops being hungry because the lower tan tien is FULL OF ELECTROMAGNETIC FIELDS -- while the brain is full of serotonin. When the lower tan tien is full of electromagnetic fields then, as Chunyi Lin states, the chi can create all the necessary nutrition that the body needs. Or as Mantak Chia states since the jing comes from sex energy this is literally "stem cell" energy that can then create whatever the body needs.

 

When the jing is full actually the sex energy is primed and ready to go. You WILL be chased after and hit on by females and also by male pervs. Also you will be susceptible to ANY subconscious sex desire -- this is why monks can't see movies. So the avatars on this website are a good example. What needs to be understood is that, as Gurdjieff states, if you can SELF-REMEMBER right when an attachment occurs, then you can DOUBLE the energy gained. So if someone is hitting on you what they really want is

 

YOUR QI ENERGY. That's the GREAT secret of sex -- female desire is actually for QI or male electromagnetic energy. Male sex fluid is MADE from the electromagnetic energy of the brain -- the hormones as electrochemical energy are female energy. So if a person wants your electromagnetic energy then in turn they will also be giving you their electrochemical energy. So if females want to hit on you that's o.k.

 

Now if males want to hit on you -- that's a problem -- because the male sex focus is on ejaculation and when ejaculation occurs it TRIGGERS the STRESS sympathetic nervous system. When the female climaxes it's through the relaxation PARASYMPATHETIC vagus nerve. So the full-lotus enables the internal climax through the vagus nerve and therefore the chi flows into the female and then the female climaxes providing MALE HORMONE TESTOSTERONE back to the male.

 

So male energy is really electromagnetic -- yet this, again, is totally lost with the focus all on "female" electrochemical energy!!

 

As for sleep -- in fact what happens is that in deep meditation, as Chunyi Lin states: 20 minutes of DEEP meditation is worth 4 HOURS of sleep! So people often have trouble sleeping because their mind is racing from too much dopamine! They're stressed out or they ate too much salt or too much sugar -- both causing dopamine spikes -- or caffeine. Sure, as Witch states, this eventually over-stress the system, causing kidney failure and then too much serotonin.

 

No -- the meditation enables over-riding sleep because SLEEP is an electrochemical state of the brain while, again, chi energy and shen -- light -- are electromagnetic. So sleep is actually just an "energy blockage" -- just like food! haha.

 

I mean I can sleep in full-lotus and I do that quite a bit. Here's how it works. I'm in full-lotus and I'm doing healing through the O at a D -- psychic mutual climax. So the vagus nerve is pulsating, the serotonin is transduced to my brain, it goes to the pineal gland, it is transduced INTO electromagnetic fields which are then sucked out and shot into the main YIN source around me -- through walls, ceiling, etc. Meanwhile the yin source gives off the electrochemical energy which I then suck in through the lower body of the full-lotus pressure.

 

O.K. so this is happening and it's through PURE AWARENESS the source of light. But since it's a dynamic that goes through yin and yang (electrochemical and electromagnetic) then my thoughts crop in. My thoughts being:

 

Damn I'm tired! Wow I really want to go to sleep! I'd like to go out of the full-lotus and lie down.

 

But it's too late! Back into the emptiness I go and this time the energy is more intense - this time the brain is MORE magnetized -- with stronger electromagnetic fields. This time the brain fills with light.

 

And so it goes. In other words the sensation of sleep -- the tiredness, just like any other energy blockage, is literally SUCKED OUT OF MY BRAIN.

 

Because in fact the 4th state of awareness -- turiya -- is beyond deep, dreamless sleep.

 

Take another example. I'm falling asleep -- lying in bed. As I fall asleep my mind begins to go into dream state -- what's call the hypnogagic state or something. I'm aware of my dreams though as they are happening but now I'm getting really sleepy and then suddenly

 

the dreams stop and as I go into dreamless deep sleep the brain fills with light and what remains is this:

 

AWARENESS.

 

I'm not asleep -- but I'm not awake. I'm just aware that light is being created in my brain. There's no thoughts -- it's just awareness of light.

 

I don't know, maybe we live in different cultures...

I read the article on diagonal, I couldn't see any reference to serotonin, only the fact that our society is depressive and the solution is Prozac.

 

The modern society is depressive because of the testosterone, adrenaline and dopamine which put the emphasis on desire without having any fulfilling reward. Because of that is depressing.

 

Car races, football, soccer, fighting sports, shooting videogames, action movies, special effects, show business, music business, fashion...everything arround us emphasis the testosterone, adrenaline and dopamine response in people. This is the modern society which is a rebellion against traditional societies. And the problem is that we don't LIVE, we don't reward and satisfy the hormonal responses in our bodies.

 

Traditional societies were built arround religions and spirituality, and churches and families. They put the emphasis on serotonin (meditation, relaxation, taichi, yoga, prayer, qigong, contemplation, monasteries, seclusion) and on the oxytocin (the bonding hormone of social gatherings, of families and couples, the love hormone)

 

Actually the solution to depression is serotonin, oxytocin and prolactin.

Do you know the piramid of human psychological needs?

http://www.businessballs.com/maslow.htm

 

The first level are the physiological needs trigered by hormones, but the second level - safety - triggers the serotonin, and the third level - belongingness and love - triggers the oxytocin.

 

You were right, serotonin in excess reduces or even kill the libido. I believe also prolactin is involved in this. But this is the exact confirmatory sign of the first stage in the spiritual path. I mean for male spirituality, because female spirituality is different.

 

The spiritual stages are:

 

1. When the Jing is full, you don't feel the need of sex - this is because the serotonin reached a certain level that inhibits any sexual desire. Of course there may be tentations that can induce dopamine spikes and this is the reason why spiritual mens secluded themselves in monasteries away from the female tentations.

 

2. When the Qi is full, you don't feel the hunger - I don't know exactly why, but I believe Drew's theory that the serotonin ionizes in the bio-electro-magnetic fields of the body inhibits the hunger sensation. This is proven by so many saints and yogis all arround the world and cultures from all times. As a proof you have the fasting in all cultures around the globe.

 

3. When the Shen is full, you don't feel the need of sleep. This is because the melatonin reached so high level that the cyrcadian rhytm is changed and the need of sleep is reduced. It is well known that very advanced spiritual masters sleep very little or not at all.

[witch]

Dopamine does not cause the mind to race. If anything, serotonin will cause the mind to race. Dopamine is the pleasure neurotransmitter. Smoking pot raises dopamine--that's the sort of feeling that dopamine gives. Maybe you are thinking of adrenaline? I don't know, but you are really way off base.

[Andrei]

Damn, a neatly simplified hormonal view of neidan.

You really need to post more, dude. What systems do you study, btw? Thanks!

 

Hi vortex, the simplified hormonal view of neidan is from William Bodri (meditationexpert.com: http://www.meditationexpert.com/ebok/howtomeditate.pdf page 4) and Mantak Chia (Darkness technology: http://www.universal-tao.com/dark_room/DarkRoom.pdf page 4)

 

I do a lot of things, I like to change and to adapt to my lifestile, I did martial arts (judo, karate, wushu, taichi), I do qigong and meditation, I practice zhan zhuang, I practised hun yuan qigong, I experimented with kunlun, I did wheight exercises and bodyweight exercises (calistenics), I am experimenting and seeking balance and harmony. I live by the sutra from my signature.

 

I'm falling asleep -- lying in bed. As I fall asleep my mind begins to go into dream state -- what's call the hypnogagic state or something. I'm aware of my dreams though as they are happening but now I'm getting really sleepy and then suddenly

 

the dreams stop and as I go into dreamless deep sleep the brain fills with light and what remains is this:

 

AWARENESS.

 

I'm not asleep -- but I'm not awake. I'm just aware that light is being created in my brain. There's no thoughts -- it's just awareness of light.

 

Hi Drew, I totally agree with you, I would say you are already "enlightened" but I am not sure that all the buddhists lurking arround in this forum will agree.... anyhow you have all my respect. I also reached a dreamless deep sleep (theta waves) just I don't have the light in the brain.... anyhow I have some experiences during meditation a small concentrated light in the darkness of my visual cortex. In my humble opinion the light comes from the electrical stimulation of the visual cortex that comes from the lower dantiens. It seems to me that you have opened all the channels and the pineal, and all the alchemical transmutations are done very easy to you. Respect.

 

Dopamine does not cause the mind to race. If anything, serotonin will cause the mind to race. Dopamine is the pleasure neurotransmitter.

 

Hi Witch, every link you post in fact agrees with what I said.

Dopamine and serotonin are not antagonists. They can be synergic as usually they are in normal people. The antagonist of dopamine is prolactin, while the antagonist of the serotonin is the adrenaline.

 

I will make you a drawing inspired by the dopamine graph of the Standford University guy, see attached hormon.bmp.

I don't like the linear graph, I prefer this one more, because is circular and endless moving:

 

 

P.S.

sorry, I forgot to mention, witch I respect you too for your heart chackra orgasms, but as I already said the spirituality of a woman is different to the spirituality of the man because the sexuality is different. I really think you are spiritually accomplished, but you need to understand there is a conflict in the spirituality of the sexes. Male spirituality is based on sexual abstinence and spiritual practices, while female spirtuality is totally opposite, she needs to embrace fully the sexuality (and the maternity too) which you already accomplished, respect to you too.

Edited November 19, 2009 by steam

[voidisyinyang]

Steam funny that you mentioned Bodri because I came across that phrase in his "Measuring Meditation" -- "when the jing is full you don't think about sex, when the chi is full you don't think about hunger, when the shen is full you don't think about sleep." I thought of your comment right away and thought there was a connection.

 

Also right after I did my week long energy feast -- on just half glass of water -- what's called "achieving cessation" in theravada Buddhism -- well Chunyi Lin later did say it was my "enlightenment experience" but he said that next time I should not get too over-excited or afraid. haha. Also that I should have called him. haha.

 

So I think I did achieve the "emptiness" or nirvikalpa samadhi but when the room starting going into a vortex around me when I sat in full-lotus -- then I got scared. So I sought out the answers in books and sure enough I saw a Sri Chimnoy book on the shelf in the store. I thought hmm. I grab it, flip it open to this question:

 

What happens when the room starts spinning around us?

 

Sri Chimnoy: Oh that's just the cosmic energy.

 

And that was it! I'm thinking -- look that answer is not good enough. haha.

 

Then soon after I discovered Master Nan, Huai-chin's books and I had to read them 3 times each just to get the basic jist of his concepts down. Now Master Nan, Huai-chin states that almost all modern practitioners "fall back into worldliness" due to "heroic overexurberance."

 

That's definitely what happened to me -- at the end of my week long bigu energy feast I had telepathy, telekinesis, precognition. But I stopped practicing because people around me were freaking out so bad. I mean I was doing serious EXORCISMS of evil spirit possession! haha.

 

And Chunyi Lin said that we should call him instead of stop practicing when our energy gets that strong. But then he stuck his finger to my forward before my channels closed up fully and shot the middle of the brain with the laser-love. Then there was a permanent magnetic bliss in the center of the brain. I still was sitting in full-lotus off and on so then I really stopped practicing -- for 2 or 3 months -- NO QIGONG -- and STILL I had the magnetic bliss in my brain. I wanted to see if it was permanent or if it would go away.

[witch]

I never said that dopamine and serotonin were antagonists--I'm just saying neither of you seem to understand the effects of serotonin. Too much serotonin causes hyperactivity, for example. And while prolactin is an antagonist of dopamine, I don't think that epinephrine/adrenaline is an antagonist of serotonin. Steroids are serotonin antagonists. If you have a link on the epinephrine as an antagonist I'd like to learn more.

 

As for spirituality, I think you misunderstand me. For men who do not have a female partner, yes, refraining from orgasm is the only way to get the sexual energy up to the forehead. I agree with that. However, I believe that with an adept female partner that a man can give the woman his sexual energy during sex through ejaculation, and she can return it to him through the heart chakra, thereby speeding up the process of getting the sexual energy up to his forehead.

[voidisyinyang]

Well the heart ejaculation is the jing electrochemical energy -- I've received this from a female with strong jing once. But the reason she transmitted it to me was because of my strong male electromagnetic chi energy that she was attracted to. So that's the difference Steam is alluding to -- or the O at a D free energy exchange. I do agree with you Witch that for the typical male, after ejaculation, there is "infantilization" as Camille Paglia calls it -- essentially the lover then becomes the mother and transmits the energy back to the male through the heart chakra as compassion. When the male and female both have their heart chakras open and giving like this it's a very deep connection beyond the other lower emotions of anger, fear, worry, sadness and lust.

 

But then for the male to create strong chi he first has to have strong jing and I also agree with you Witch that after heavy serotonin diet (say lots of pasta and no meat) the sex drive of the male plummets, thereby lessening the conversion of jing to chi. On the other hand food is an impure source of jing energy -- it's much better to get it directly as female sex energy. This is why tantra in considered the highest practice in esoteric Buddhism -- and the fastest. But it's very intense so has to be under the proper conditions.

 

I never said that dopamine and serotonin were antagonists--I'm just saying neither of you seem to understand the effects of serotonin. Too much serotonin causes hyperactivity, for example. And while prolactin is an antagonist of dopamine, I don't think that epinephrine/adrenaline is an antagonist of serotonin. Steroids are serotonin antagonists. If you have a link on the epinephrine as an antagonist I'd like to learn more.

 

As for spirituality, I think you misunderstand me. For men who do not have a female partner, yes, refraining from orgasm is the only way to get the sexual energy up to the forehead. I agree with that. However, I believe that with an adept female partner that a man can give the woman his sexual energy during sex through ejaculation, and she can return it to him through the heart chakra, thereby speeding up the process of getting the sexual energy up to his forehead.

[Andrei]

Too much serotonin causes hyperactivity, for example.

...

If you have a link on the epinephrine as an antagonist I'd like to learn more.

 

I'm happy we agree. Too much of a good thing is a bad thing.... It's the Tao way. I am learning too, you know...

 

As for spirituality, I think you misunderstand me. For men who do not have a female partner, yes, refraining from orgasm is the only way to get the sexual energy up to the forehead. I agree with that. However, I believe that with an adept female partner that a man can give the woman his sexual energy during sex through ejaculation, and she can return it to him through the heart chakra, thereby speeding up the process of getting the sexual energy up to his forehead.

 

I agree again, but my question to you: how many females with the heart chakra open are out there, and how many understand this dynamic? I would say as little as non-ejaculatory sexual active men...

[witch]

For the record, when I have a heart chakra orgasm, it's an orgasm. It's not some sort of sublime feeling of compassion. My back arches and my chest convulses, ejaculating out energy. The center of my chest orgasms. It is accompanied by an emotional release--sometimes I burst into tears or even faint, but the orgasm itself is an automatic physiological reaction.

[voidisyinyang]

Have you tried it on any male animals?

 

For the record, when I have a heart chakra orgasm, it's an orgasm. It's not some sort of sublime feeling of compassion. My back arches and my chest convulses, ejaculating out energy. The center of my chest orgasms. It is accompanied by an emotional release--sometimes I burst into tears or even faint, but the orgasm itself is an automatic physiological reaction.

[witch]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Uh, Drew, did I mention it was sexual? It's an orgasm. Animals--I'm not into that.

[Andrei]

i used to give such orgasm to my 12 years long-term relationship girlfriend, I f_ed her till she was crying of happiness but unfortunately we were chemically incompatible and I figured out by Four Pillar Taoist Astrology and it was too late to repair...

 

here is some interesting ideas:

BEHHKV-xkFw

[xenolith]

...she can return it to him through the heart chakra...

By what path does that energy travel from the female heart into the male?

[witch]

By what path does that energy travel from the female heart into the male?

 

Chests pressed against each other, preferably naked. The energy from my heart is ejaculated directly into my partner's chest. Some men have an opening there, although for most it's hard and impenetrable--like between the legs of a Barbie doll.

[voidisyinyang]

speaking of between the legs of a barbie doll....

 

http://scienceblogs.com/neurotopia/2009/11...ocin_1.php#more

 

 

Chests pressed against each other, preferably naked. The energy from my heart is ejaculated directly into my partner's chest. Some men have an opening there, although for most it's hard and impenetrable--like between the legs of a Barbie doll.

[xenolith]

Chests pressed against each other, preferably naked. The energy from my heart is ejaculated directly into my partner's chest. Some men have an opening there, although for most it's hard and impenetrable--like between the legs of a Barbie doll.

The Shuan-Chung...heart chakra...is central to the Functional Channel of the MCO, the 'inertia' channel, much less capable of motivating chi than the 'driver' Governor Channel. I'm not didactic, whatever may be may be...I mention channel characteristics for reference only...point is the mechanism for such an energy transference is not described elsewhere that I'm aware of, not that that means it's not possible...

 

However, based on my experience of being a Libra INFJ SKF adept who has cultivated sexual alchemy with one woman exclusively for 24 years, during which many types of orgasms have ocurred between us, I have to say that all of hers have conveyed themselves to me along Governor Channel vectors.

 

Understand that what you deliver (or think you've delivered) may not in fact be received by your counterpart irrespective of your belief that it has, nor have the effect that you assert it does irrespective of it being perceived by you to have...please describe the evidence conveyed to you by your male partners that makes you think that they have experienced something due to your heart orgasms. And why you think that whatever that may be would facilitate "speeding up the process of getting the sexual energy up to his forehead."

 

Nice to think that my degree of cultivation is correlative to that of a wad of plastic...appreciate awareness of room for improvement I do.

 

Really.

 

Lotsa Love,

 

xeno

 

edit: corrected grammer

Edited November 21, 2009 by xenolith