Art Posted November 10, 2009 Greetings all, To begin with, let me state that I am relatively new to Taoism and could be labeled an Integrationist for lack of better terms.... At any rate, I came across an idea last week that I have not been able to shake. To help you visualize what I am talking about, those familiar with Kunlun should have the image of Stage 1, with the left hand near the lower Dan Tien and the right hand near the middle.... I have been interested in bioenergy and chi for awhile now, and incorporating these into the energy chakras of the palm got me thinking about fire rising and water falling.... Again, back to the Kunlun practice, I imagined a dual flow. Fire energy from the left palm, rising up to the right palm. Water energy from the right palm, falling to the left. Fire rises, water falls. Ever since I have thought about this, I have sensed an energetic increase in my palms. Surely I have an active imagination, but I do feel as if this is more than that.... Any advice, info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Art P.S. - a few people may ask why I would ponder such things. Simply put, I would like to develop an ability to heal. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joeblast Posted November 10, 2009 basics, basics, basics - you'll wind up having to forget everything you know before you know anything. that said, you manifest what you train for. just dont spend all day looking at the leaves, branches, flowers...root must come before all of that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spirit Ape Posted November 10, 2009 Any awareness on the palms will increase chi, holding the ball posture is a skill to develop and cultivate chi as well later manifest it. You can also look at fire between you palms and sometimes water or ice, remember when people have inflamation you use cold/coolness to ease the swelling, for blood and chi moving energy you would increase the energy to hot and warm. Later you can send that ball for healing by programing it and send it in distant healing. This is stuff my system trains, well done keep at it! Remember intent and no intent!!! That is the .......................???? Ape P.S Fire and Water is much deeper then that, just remember when you drink the water, remember where the stream starts!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrei Posted November 10, 2009 Greetings all, To begin with, let me state that I am relatively new to Taoism and could be labeled an Integrationist for lack of better terms.... At any rate, I came across an idea last week that I have not been able to shake. To help you visualize what I am talking about, those familiar with Kunlun should have the image of Stage 1, with the left hand near the lower Dan Tien and the right hand near the middle.... I have been interested in bioenergy and chi for awhile now, and incorporating these into the energy chakras of the palm got me thinking about fire rising and water falling.... Again, back to the Kunlun practice, I imagined a dual flow. Fire energy from the left palm, rising up to the right palm. Water energy from the right palm, falling to the left. Fire rises, water falls. Ever since I have thought about this, I have sensed an energetic increase in my palms. Surely I have an active imagination, but I do feel as if this is more than that.... Any advice, info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Art P.S. - a few people may ask why I would ponder such things. Simply put, I would like to develop an ability to heal. Yes exactly what you describe, it was also my experience. I have a friend that confirmed it too, he can see the energy flow inside the body (his or anyone else). He explained to me there are three channels, there is a central channel which is called Shushumna, and two smaller paralel channels Ida and Pingala, which the taoists call them the Lunar/Water channel that passes through right side of the body and the Solar/Fire channel that passes through the left side of the body. The energy flows in both directions (up and down) in all three channels. When the "holding the ball" hands posture like you describe is maintained, after 10 min or so appears an energy ball in the central channel that oscillates up and down with a high speed. When the hands are in the position right up and left down, the right hand "pour" the water energy of the lunar channel from the right side of the body into the solar channel - left side of the body, while the left hand "rises" the fire from the solar channel into the lunar channel, the effect being a heating effect of the right side of the body especially liver and right kidney and cooling effect of the left side of the body - heart and spleen. If the palms are reversed, the energy is just reversed also, the left side of the body is heated and the right side of the body is cooled, while the energy ball still is oscilating into the central channel, just it has a different nature. When I practised kunlun, I used the standard posture but very quickly turned to be harming to me, heating very much my liver and right kidney. Then I found out that I already have a natural imbalances due to astrological influences, so my practised should be reversed, which I did reversed the posture and turned to be very good to me, and balancing the energy of my body. The idea is that energy from colateral channels to be blended and focused in the central channel to supply the brain with balanced energy and to open the pineal, which in my opinion this is the Fire and Water alchemy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rain Posted November 10, 2009 (edited) Yes exactly what you describe, it was also my experience. I have a friend that confirmed it too, he can see the energy flow inside the body (his or anyone else). He explained to me there are three channels, there is a central channel which is called Shushumna, and two smaller paralel channels Ida and Pingala, which the taoists call them the Lunar/Water channel that passes through right side of the body and the Solar/Fire channel that passes through the left side of the body. The energy flows in both directions (up and down) in all three channels. When the "holding the ball" hands posture like you describe is maintained, after 10 min or so appears an energy ball in the central channel that oscillates up and down with a high speed. When the hands are in the position right up and left down, the right hand "pour" the water energy of the lunar channel from the right side of the body into the solar channel - left side of the body, while the left hand "rises" the fire from the solar channel into the lunar channel, the effect being a heating effect of the right side of the body especially liver and right kidney and cooling effect of the left side of the body - heart and spleen. If the palms are reversed, the energy is just reversed also, the left side of the body is heated and the right side of the body is cooled, while the energy ball still is oscilating into the central channel, just it has a different nature. When I practised kunlun, I used the standard posture but very quickly turned to be harming to me, heating very much my liver and right kidney. Then I found out that I already have a natural imbalances due to astrological influences, so my practised should be reversed, which I did reversed the posture and turned to be very good to me, and balancing the energy of my body. The idea is that energy from colateral channels to be blended and focused in the central channel to supply the brain with balanced energy and to open the pineal, which in my opinion this is the Fire and Water alchemy. Interesting. I can only add my current observations standing in a luohan static qigong pose. This pose is designed to send spiral qi crossing through the body. My various part of body senses cold and heat. Until now after one month in stance always the same body parts. I interpret the sensations to be recognition of heat or cold suddenly releasing and flowing to blend in balanced with the required temperature of the rest of my body's various organs and textures optimal functional need. According to my teacher the fingers are important in the way that each finger represents positive and negative ion activity..and when energy streams ions literally jump from one finer to the next..thus helps us balance. What we perceive with our awareness is thus balanceactivity. Ahem forgot to write what I initially remembered when reading about fire and water experience. I was sitting on my couch in a simplified lotus hands resting on thighs with each hands middle fingers connected to the thumbs breathing slowly deply connected to lower dantien then hara chakra listening to a tape made by a friend that described a boat crossing an ocean simultanously with bellsbowls chiming and a monk chanting very deeply and woof there was something smooth and wavelike entering from above as the lower enrgetic fire rose to meet in fact these energies longed for each other so much and it TILTED inside me and a gazeus sexual energy filled my entire being. and yes I know what an orgasm is. Edited November 10, 2009 by rain Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrei Posted November 10, 2009 Interesting. I can only add my current observations standing in a luohan static qigong pose. This pose is designed to send spiral qi crossing through the body. My various part of body senses cold and heat. Until now after one month in stance always the same body parts. I interpret the sensations to be recognition of heat or cold suddenly releasing and flowing to blend in balanced with the required temperature of the rest of my body's various organs and textures optimal functional need. According to my teacher the fingers are important in the way that each finger represents positive and negative ion activity..and when energy streams ions literally jump from one finer to the next..thus helps us balance. What we perceive with our awareness is thus balanceactivity. Yes, I agree. Qigong practices - like standing stake or MCO or Kunlun - uses the so called Eight Extra Meridians which are the Governor Vessel (Du Mai), Conception Vessel (Ren Mai), Central Vessel (Chong Mai), Belt Vessel (Dai Mai), Yin Link Vessel, Yang Link Vessel, Yin Heel Vessel, Yang Heel Vessel. In acupuncture and TCM they say the belt vessel is just a vessel around the waist (which is true) but the energy goes spiral along the body from head to toes. http://www.acumedico.com/meridians.htm http://www.acumedico.com/arm.htm Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rain Posted November 10, 2009 (edited) Yes, I agree. Qigong practices - like standing stake or MCO or Kunlun - uses the so called Eight Extra Meridians which are the Governor Vessel (Du Mai), Conception Vessel (Ren Mai), Central Vessel (Chong Mai), Belt Vessel (Dai Mai), Yin Link Vessel, Yang Link Vessel, Yin Heel Vessel, Yang Heel Vessel. In acupuncture and TCM they say the belt vessel is just a vessel around the waist (which is true) but the energy goes spiral along the body from head to toes. http://www.acumedico.com/meridians.htm http://www.acumedico.com/arm.htm yep. hey I forgot to mention something. added above now. + in my system youve got to work on the 12 ordinary before the 8 extraordinary. Edited November 10, 2009 by rain Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funkytortoise Posted November 10, 2009 art, i have yin and yang tattoos on my forearms describing exactly what you're talking about. i knew it would when i saw the topic. thought it was cool. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Art Posted November 11, 2009 art, i have yin and yang tattoos on my forearms describing exactly what you're talking about. i knew it would when i saw the topic. thought it was cool. Way cool! Any pictures? Thanks for the replies. I will take everything into careful consideration, espectially joesblast's reply. Thanks again, Art Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
