KAP

[~jK~]

It is Amazing how many ways, that has stood the trials of time, as material from 1,000 + years ago can be twisted for cash.

[markern]

It is Amazing how many ways, that has stood the trials of time, as material from 1,000 + years ago can be twisted for cash.

 

 

I am not sure what you refer to but you should remember that the teachings that were "free" in monasteries were "free" because someone GAVE food and to some extent money to the monks. There are some instances of monks that supported themselves solely on their own farming etc and so had less time to cultivate and to teach but at least to a very large extent these teachings have been free because someone else paid for it to be free. Now if I run into some serious cash later in my life my plan is to pay people that I think are excellent teachers to teach free in order to reach more people who can not afford a course or who would otherwise not bother. Mostly I think I would support just introductory level classes in meditation to get people hooked but to the extent I find some system or teachers to be especially good I would either support them fully or subsidize their teachings to make it very cheap. I just have to find the money first

 

But anyway this is what I would do IF I had the money. I think it is to most meaningful thing I could do. At least on some smaller scale some of us should be able to do something like that. If you can pay for 20 hours of a good meditation teachers time you could pay one to give a free meditation course to psychology and medical students which would make it likely several of them would get seriously into meditation and throughout their lives recommend it to hundreds of patients. That I am going to be able to manage to support to some extent and will do for sure once I graduate and get in a more solid financial situation.

 

If we are serious about these things WE need to step up and give the support for these teachings to be free. Skip two holidays to the canary islands and you have got yourself the cash for an excellent introductory course to meditation that could change the lives of many people. Putting all the responsibility for providing the teachings for free on the teachers neglects our own responsibility completely. As people trying to grow spiritually taking such a responsibility should certainly be an area of focus.

 

Currently in the west not enough people are supporting the free teaching of such teachings. In the future that may change as more and more people get into these kinds of teachings but at present most teachers have to charge.

 

By the way isn't the price for KAP, 333 dollars, also the number representing the devils son Maybe just in popular culture like in the Omen movies or something but still kind of weird

[everseeking]

markern--

 

I love the way you put that. As I pointed out once before, there are many video series out there that teach maybe 3 practices--and still cost more than KAP. So in that sense, its a bargain just for the info.

 

I don't understand where people are getting this idea that spiritual teaching should be free.

 

Teaching takes time, and food isn't free, nor rent, car payments, etc.

 

The day someone finds a master that can fly from point A to point B, is in a state of Bigu and therefore needs no food, and has no family to feed, house to pay for, etc....and will travel the world to teach for free..well, if that ever happens, I hope to hear about it.

 

 

But I doubt anyone will be traveling to Dagobah and learning from Master Yoda.

[zazaza]

there are vipassana meditation centers all over the world which offer free food and free place to stay for 10 days.

if K.A.P. can't get enough voluntary donations like vipassana can,

 

then i figure they could at least get enough money donated so they can do the online courses for free.

 

 

 

 

 

maybe i'm wrong though, maybe not

Edited December 5, 2009 by zazaza

[Prince...]

We really do need a remake of the parting of the red sea. Egypt could pay santi to make a sort of biblical remake tour doing all the miracles of Moses where they were actaully performed

 

It would be awesome if Santi could do this, since Moses did not actually part the Red Sea. What the scripture actually says is they crossed the Sea of Reeds.

 

"How does one prove that anyway? I know far back when someone doubted Santi he sent a chi ball the size of mount Vesuvio up the guys spine although he had only read his posts and did not know who he was and where he were and the guy endorsed Santiago after that and confirmed the time of the Chi ball."

That happened to Hundun in a topic about "Path Notes". I tried searching for it, but I have not been able to find it.

 

It is Amazing how many ways, that has stood the trials of time, as material from 1,000 + years ago can be twisted for cash.

 

I guess the 100k that was sunk into my bachelor's degree in Religion; the 50k+ it will cost me to complete my Master's of Divinity degree and get ordained; and what I've spent learning taiji and meditation should all just be thrown away so that I can teach for free, right? When the utilities companies are turning off the lights and water to my home AND the utilities to the church, I can say "hey bro, I teach for free, it's cool." When the mortgage company wants their money on my home AND the church property, I can say "hey it's cool, bro, I teach for free."

 

I know a real Taoist priest who was raised in a temple. He travels the country teaching the Qigong from his temple. Guess what? He charges! I guess he should teach for free, right? Maybe he should get a dayjob? Cool, but tell me how many places are going to hire a 90 year old chinese guy that doesn't speak much english.

 

~jK~, or whatever it is you call yourself, you are full of shit, and I mean that.

 

Just two quotes I would like to share:

"When I was young," John began,"I really did not pay attention to the different things that my teacher, Liao Sifu, had told me about metaphysics. I was not really interested, you see; I wanted simply to learn to fight and to have power. But many things came back to me later."

JC, Magus of Java

I had stayed away from the religious aspects as I was quite content being a failed Methodist and still feel that way except for the occasional excursions into goddess worship. My concerns were purely technical and my expectations were to gain control over my body's electrical system.

Doc, Path Notes

 

Not everyone who meditates/cultivates/etc is seeking enlightenment. I'm not. For me, that's up to God.

Edited December 5, 2009 by Prince...

[Way]

there are vipassana meditation centers all over the world which offer free food and free place to stay for 10 days.

if K.A.P. can't get enough voluntary donations like vipassana can,

 

then i figure they could at least get enough money donated so they can do the online courses for free.

maybe i'm wrong though, maybe not

 

Well, I guess you have your own answer then. Go stay at one of those free centers, get some free food and some free teaching.

 

Problem solved! Except you mentioned that not only do you want it all for free, but you indicated that you are also unwilling to to put time and effort into it. To be honest you give the impression of being a bit of a loser. I'm sure that, for you KAP would indeed be a waste of money.

[C T]

Well, I guess you have your own answer then. Go stay at one of those free centers, get some free food and some free teaching.

 

Problem solved! Except you mentioned that not only do you want it all for free, but you indicated that you are also unwilling to to put time and effort into it. To be honest you give the impression of being a bit of a loser. I'm sure that, for you KAP would indeed be a waste of money.

 

Your "signature" appears very noble indeed. Unfortunately it does not seem to be reflected in the manner in which your opinion is voiced.

 

Just an observation.. no offense please.

 

(apologies for side-tracking here.)

[Lucky7Strikes]

~jK~, or whatever it is you call yourself, you are full of shit, and I mean that.

 

I think, only partially.

 

But,

 

I think KAP's great. Santi's great. Yes, you should pay him. Money is a form of giving, and I think one needs to invest in the teacher, whether it is money, effort, loyalty, or whatever. Anyways, he gives great discounts to returning students.

 

KAP is not just about awakening Kundalini. It's like the "greatest hits" collection from various internal practices without much of the other garbage.

[zazaza]

Well, I guess you have your own answer then. Go stay at one of those free centers, get some free food and some free teaching.

 

Problem solved! Except you mentioned that not only do you want it all for free, but you indicated that you are also unwilling to to put time and effort into it. To be honest you give the impression of being a bit of a loser. I'm sure that, for you KAP would indeed be a waste of money.

 

i don't think you're doing yourself a favor by being like that,

sorry mate

Your "signature" appears very noble indeed. Unfortunately it does not seem to be reflected in the manner in which your opinion is voiced.

 

Just an observation.. no offense please.

 

(apologies for side-tracking here.)

oops you were first.

he's indeed harming himself.

[Way]

Your "signature" appears very noble indeed. Unfortunately it does not seem to be reflected in the manner in which your opinion is voiced.

 

Just an observation.. no offense please.

 

(apologies for side-tracking here.)

 

No offence taken - you are absolutly correct. Sometimes it's very hard not to take the bait, though!

 

 

i don't think you're doing yourself a favor by being like that,

sorry mate

 

oops you were first.

he's indeed harming himself.

 

Sometimes it just best just tell it as it is.

[zazaza]

Sometimes it just best just tell it as it is.

i admit that i make mistakes.

but not everything you think is a mistake is a mistake.

not everything you think is right is right.

 

you don't know me or my situation.

you don't know everything, you are a little part of the whole... as i am..

 

it's not good to judge too much,

it's not good to be too convinced of some the ideas in our heads

 

Edited December 5, 2009 by zazaza

[jaloo]

Its odd. Every time a practice/class/teacher comes along that someone here at TTB finds useful, there are a boat load of folks who jump out of the wood work to tear it down.

 

Now, why would anyone take the advice of an anonymous coward whose contribution is only there to tear something down. Why would anyone take the advice of an anonymous coward at all when it comes to their spiritual development?

 

KAPReview offered a decent OPINION in which an attempt was made to be balanced. Others offered positive OPINIONs, which are just as useful. In the end they are just OPINIONs and your mileage may vary with any teacher.

 

Bottom line is what does your heart say? If you have real reservations, don't take the class or avoid the teacher. You don't deserve anything. No one is that important. The teachers don't need you. They have nothing to prove to you. You don't DESERVE free teachings.

 

If your heart says DO IT, then do it. Take the class, practice the technique, embrace the teacher. Practice the technique or lineage in depth. Ask lots of questions. Then and only then can YOU decide if its right for YOU. If you are too simple to make up your own mind without having a bunch of anonymous trolls give you opinions, well then in my OPINION, maybe you should work on your mundane personality issues before trying any work on yourself.

[C T]

Look guys..

 

Its very simple. This thing about teachers and tuition fees, i mean.

 

First of all, THERE AINT NO FREE LUNCH. Period.

 

Free things nowadays make people suspicious. So its not a marketable concept anymore. No matter how authentic a teacher may be, if he says the teachings are for free, chances are he would be taken for a clown. Sadly, that is the way of the world today.

 

The funny mentality with us now is that expensive = must be fantastic. So its not entirely a one-sided game. After all, the customers are always right, so if they want to fork out plenty to get a sense of fantastic value, its only logical there will be those who will gladly market accordingly. This is common business sensibility.

 

There are established Teachers, with a stable of equally established senior students, who have become self-sufficient in that they have lined up plenty of 'benefactors' who support their cause, usually after enduring long periods of hardships. These are the ones who can afford to teach for free, and they do, well, most of them anyway. But in the early days, you can bet the first thing on their minds would be to devise an effective plan whereby these benefactors could be materialized as quickly as possible, before the 'ship' begins to flounder. And you can be sure there were many sleepless nights spent thinking about trying to make ends meet, while at the same time trying to maintain a sense of calmness and equanimity among the school or sangha etc.

 

So its really not as straightforward and clear-cut as some of us might want to believe - it boils down to initial survival, and then the long and arduous process of establishing one's reputation thru various means. These things require money, somehow. Even if the students themselves are not asked for fees, you can be sure there are other sources that provide the finances.

 

Just some thoughts on the matter.

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

Its odd. Every time a practice/class/teacher comes along that someone here at TTB finds useful, there are a boat load of folks who jump out of the wood work to tear it down.

 

Now, why would anyone take the advice of an anonymous coward whose contribution is only there to tear something down. Why would anyone take the advice of an anonymous coward at all when it comes to their spiritual development?

 

KAPReview offered a decent OPINION in which an attempt was made to be balanced. Others offered positive OPINIONs, which are just as useful. In the end they are just OPINIONs and your mileage may vary with any teacher.

 

Bottom line is what does your heart say? If you have real reservations, don't take the class or avoid the teacher. You don't deserve anything. No one is that important. The teachers don't need you. They have nothing to prove to you. You don't DESERVE free teachings.

 

If your heart says DO IT, then do it. Take the class, practice the technique, embrace the teacher. Practice the technique or lineage in depth. Ask lots of questions. Then and only then can YOU decide if its right for YOU. If you are too simple to make up your own mind without having a bunch of anonymous trolls give you opinions, well then in my OPINION, maybe you should work on your mundane personality issues before trying any work on yourself.

 

Ah, now there's some wise words...

[voidisyinyang]

Well since Chunyi Lin was mentioned I'll add a few comments.

 

When I first posted about my "O at a D" discovery Santiago exclaimed that I shouldn't do this because I was just burning off my sex energy -- losing energy big time.

 

So then I explained that the full-lotus takes in as much energy as it loses -- there's an equal exchange.

 

Actually it's not quite true -- the yin energy has different sources. Yin is the jing electrochemical energy that is taken in through the lower body. As Mantak Chia emphasizes it's "stem cell" energy -- sex energy that can make anything your body needs. That's the best source of taking in energy but if I'm healing old people they don't have much jing to give back.

 

So the healing is an energy exchange -- chi or shen out -- transmitted by the healer (since most can not do this) and then jing or electrochemical energy in.

 

Now that's the great secret of healing so I researched this to great extent. There's a book called "Modernity in Witchcraft" -- about African witchcraft where this is known directly. The energy healer EATS HIS OWN KIN -- the sexual energy -- and then sends out the healing energy in return.

 

So cannibalism was the opposite of healing energy -- a person not part of the kin network could be literally eaten as an energy source.

 

I also traced this back to Bushmen healing culture -- I read all the anthropological literature.

 

Now Santiago states that the Bushmen do not rely on eating the female jing sexual energy -- called the N/UM in Bushmen culture.

 

Santiago's source for this though is a Western modern female -- a healer also -- but female healers in Bushmen culture are not the norm.

 

Instead for females to become healers the use of psychotropic plants helped the females to open up the third eye yet the PAIN of the healing is too strong.

 

Read the book NISA -- the Bushmen female healer explains that it's stated females can handle the pain of childbirth but can not handle the pain of healing.

 

So it's not just the female sex energy taken in but also all the other lower emotional electrochemical energy which hasn't been resonated or harmonized back to pure consciousness, the source of light.

 

True Shakti or Shen transmission is very very rare. You will definitely know if you get a Shen or Shakti transmission -- it feels just like a laser and you will see light -- and your whole body will fill with bliss better than sex.

 

Still to open the third eye to transmit any energy requires that enough electromagnetic chi was transformed into shen to create the macrocosmic orbit.

 

As Master Nan, Huai-chin states most modern practitioners "fall back into worldliness" because of "heroic overexuberance." In other words before you open the third eye you have very strong chi energy which also gives you telepathy, telekinesis, precognition and strong healing powers.

 

People WANT this energy so bad that they'll scream in pain to get it -- they will freak out -- because their subconscious spirit possession -- their lower emotional energy -- is being driven out of them!!

 

It's a dangerous situation to be in because you've switched to free energy and eating any food will shut the system down. You literally EAT the lower emotional energy of other people and then in turn transmit the healing energy back to them.

 

But people are in DENIAL about this process.

 

I've been doing healing without money. Sure my transmission is FA JING -- which means it's primarily the electrochemical jing energy transmitted but in order to transmit the FA JING through the third eye you have to again open up the macrocosmic orbit -- the transmission is done through a foundation of laser light shen and electromagnetic chi.

 

As Dr. David Palmer details in "Qigong Fever" -- qi transmission is composed of the three -- jing, chi, and shen -- with different proportions of each depending on the level of the transmission.

 

Anyway after I explained to Santiago and others how the jing energy is taken in then Santiago instead of stating I was losing my sex energy also added that Glenn Morris knew how to take in people's jing energy as well. This, of course, implies that Santiago does the same which contradicts Santiago passing on about the Bushmen healers not relying on taking in female sex energy.

 

In fact this is a natural resonance -- the transmission is impersonal like a waterfall -- it happens through subconscious properties and only LATER does the rational left-brain conscious mind figure out what happened.

 

So if you do like me -- heal without charging money -- then what happens is people are in CONTINUAL DENIAL about the healing -- even though they know they feel better they do not know why -- or don't want to admit it.

 

At my former workplace I was in a special situation where people would come to me for "charge ups" because work had tired them out. I had a couple coworkers -- males -- who wanted to learn about healing and started to practice a bit and so while they were in constant denial because their subconscious lower emotional energy would take over -- they still would want to ask me about the energy healing.

 

One time a female from another department of the office came up to me, asking about my full-lotus sitting and what I had been talking about with a male worker in my department. I had been charging him up and she wanted in on it.

 

So I transmitted energy to her while in full-lotus. I looked into her eyes. When I'm talking that means it's left-brain dominant and the energy is not transmitted. So then I would pause in my talking and then she would see my vagus nerve pulsating on the right side of my neck. After I transmitted I would then explain what this meant to her.

 

So we had a mutual climax together. Then her boss came into the room and playfully told her to stop distracting me from my work. She then told her boss that I had transmitted energy to her.

 

Now normally this stuff is taboo -- why? because it's sex energy! Language itself was created to repress sex energy so that long-distance hunting could be carried out -- sex for food exchange. Read Professor Chris Knight's book BLOOD RELATIONS.

 

I did this with another female coworker as well -- and she too acknowledged the energy transmission. But the most profound energy transmissions I did at work had to remain secret because they went completely against the patriarchal technological commodity fetish -- repressed sex energy and projected anger-fear energy -- of the office hierarchy.

 

This stuff undermines the monogamous bourgeois "commodity unit" of marriage which goes all the way back to gibbons and fruit eating!! It's the original forbidden fruit.

 

The menstrual cycle synchronous with the moon cycle by females was the original communal "sex strike" to enforce long distance hunting by males so that increased iron content could enlarge the human brain with the side effect of increased blood loss.

 

Originally gold and silver -- money -- was for the SOLAR AND LUNAR SACRED SEX TEMPLE RITUALS OF BLOOD SACRIFICE.

 

Money was standardized by the Greeks but paper money was first used by the Chinese empire -- enforced through fiat -- military force. Both Greek imperialism and Chinese imperialism were the origins of today's standardized money value.

 

The loss of money as the original complementary opposite gold-solar, silver-lunar ALCHEMICAL value is a great secret.

 

Solar is electromagnetic energy and Lunar is electrochemical energy.

 

Chunyi Lin does give free healings in special cases but keep in mind that there are many NUMBER 1 people now a days -- especially in the inner city. Gurdjieff describes Number 1 persons as having a hard-wired lower chakra essence which comes from sexual ejaculation focus before puberty is finished. Hard-wired meaning it's subconscious and all language will say one thing while meaning another!! This is the "Freudian Slip" on acid -- meaning all their language will have the secret goal of sucking off your sex energy for their own ejaculation.

 

The Bushmen had very strict sexual training - if a male wanted to get married he first had to move in to the female's parents house (the opposite of today's female exogamy which parallels the chimp's war culture).

 

So the male lives with the female's parents but there's still no sex. Not until he hunts for 3 years providing the food for the female's parents can he and the female consummate the marriage.

 

Still after that every time he goes hunting there is no contact with females for several days and also a period of fasting. Any meat caught is then not eaten until the next morning -- giving plenty of time for digestion before the all night trance dance.

 

These type of strict standards are easily misconstrued in today's "sex sells" culture -- where there's a "commodity fetish" driving the repressed desires which then are projected as destructive war-based technology. It's the anger-fear cycle of civilization based on

 

male ejaculation!!

 

Money in contrast is the repressed sex energy recycled as SHIT.

 

"It smells like money" is a common phrase from the French phrase about money as shit.

 

That's the other great secret of alchemy. Nonwestern horticulture -- Asian traditional farming and African farming -- relies on HUMANURE -- recycling shit back into food.

 

The same sublimation of sex energy also sublimates anaerobic bacteria -- the e. coli shit bacteria of the lower body.

 

That's why the free energy system relies on eating very little food and instead directly taking in ionized electrochemical energy as blissful heat. Sure food also creates jing energy -- but food is an impure source!!

 

When we live off money instead of recycled SHIT (as food) and SEX then we repress the shit as much as the sex --

 

and the repressed shit piles up.

 

So the Number One person will use language to demand things subconsciously -- just like the motto

 

"the customer is always right" -- or

 

"I don't 'buy' it" -- I call this MALL SCIENCE -- unless it's a mass-produced product then it's not proven.

 

The Number One person actually just wants to jerk off -- a pervert who wants to feed off sex energy for ejaculation.

 

The mass psychotic leaders of civilization are actually Number One pervs -- like G.W. Bush, Hitler, Hoover, even Clinton, JFK, etc.

 

It's a mass hypnosis because the Number 1 perv -- the opposite of a healer -- has their ELECTROMAGNETIC QI ESSENCE STUCK IN THEIR LOWER CHAKRA.

 

Their goal is to suck people off by activating a person's electromagnetic energy and then deconverting it to sex ejaculation -- so the person's will power is converted to FEAR.

 

If the Number 1 perv doesn't accomplish this goal for their own ejaculation then they do the next step:

 

ANGER -- and that's where you get the dopamine addicted sex crime serial killers masking as global leaders -- civilized gentleman, etc.

 

It's the whole Take the Toys Away from the Boys shtick -- all these missiles and rockets -- spears and stones -- are just big sword fights based on sex power.

 

This problem can be defined by Foucault and the leftist Freudian-Marxists but the ANSWER is still not provided.

 

Why not? Because the answer is based on nonwestern music -- on something discovered through deep psychological physiological transformation and passed on through lineage. Trance dance healing through sex ionization acoustic alchemy.

 

As Chunyi Lin says he's NOT ATTACHED to material wealth and traditionally a Taoist master would be paid not in money necessarily but based on the MEANS of the person -- as long as the client was sincere in seeking healing.

 

Chunyi Lin prefers phone healings because he says there's less ego involved on his part. The energy healing is impersonal! The voice is the generative force energy -- the jing energy -- that's why phone healing works so well. If you can see the person directly then the aura reading by an energy master picks up too much information! If you make personal judgments against someone then that will block the energy transmission.

 

MONEY comes from MONISM -- the basis for MONOTHEISM -- whereas healing energy is the Law of Three -- complementary opposite resonance.

 

God comes from GOTT which means BULL -- BRAHMAN -- the original Tantric Bull Priesthood of fertility with gold-solar and silver-lunar ritual temple sacrifice money.

 

The bull was god was formed with Plow-Based farming of the original City-State empires formed by the "Symbolic Revolution" (Jaques Cauvin) of around 9000 BCE.

 

The "symbolic revolution" was based on the idea that the eternal energy of consciousness could be "contained" in geometric visual symbols -- money. This co-evolved with the domestication of bulls and goats for food.

 

When the moon caused a solar eclipse then an animal was sacrificed in order to save the SON -- because the SUN WAS SICK -- this is the original patriarchal animal domestication religion documented in Kenya.

 

And so alchemy became patriarchal because the SUN (son) was held primary along with the development of plow-based farming and the invention of the chariot technology through the proto-Pythagorean Theorem -- ritual sacrifice geometry as a solar priesthood.

 

The moon energy again is the subconscious energy which is the JING energy -- both the start and end of alchemy. It's the female energy that resonates from female formless awareness.

 

If "sex sells" then HEALING ENERGY is the final stage of late-capitalism -- it's the final "sex" commodity fetish -- so much sex energy that it is sublimated into so much bliss that the brain explodes back into a

 

post-death, post-apocalyptic -- trance healing state beyond spacetime itself. Humans merge back into primordial awareness of the Rainbow Snake of dream time.

 

The snake statue found in a Bushmen cave -- 70,000 BCE -- is the original religion -- the secret of good and evil. The sex energy which feeds back into itself as parthenogenesis -- virgin birth -- through the Solar-Lunar resonance.

Edited December 5, 2009 by drewhempel

[Zenshiite]

i admit that i make mistakes.

but not everything you think is a mistake is a mistake.

not everything you think is right is right.

 

you don't know me or my situation.

you don't know everything, you are a little part of the whole... as i am..

 

it's not good to judge too much,

it's not good to be too convinced of some the ideas in our heads

 

 

Sometimes calling a spade a spade is what the doctor ordered. If you indicate you don't want to invest in the teaching, all you're doing is expressing a notion of entitlement. In truth, you often have to put in just as much effort to prove you're worth investing the time into being taught as you might like to with the teaching. The fact of the matter is, if you're unwilling to invest in acquiring the teaching, chances are you're unlikely to invest in the practice of the teaching. It will not benefit you because you have no real impetus to follow through on whatever it is you're hoping to attain.

 

Rare indeed has it been that people have received something for nothing. Including monks in monasteries. More often than not initiates have responsibilities around the temple or monastery that involve intensive labor in addition to their daily meditation and cultivation activities. And even then, their room and board has often been because there are wealthy patrons that make the upkeep of monks and monastery possible. Usually that has been kings and emperors.

 

Martial arts teachers have rarely taught their skills for free, either. If it's not monetary compensation, it's personal service to the teacher. Traditional forms are, unfortunately, a thing of the past for the most part. Nowadays monetary compensation is the norm. In my experience, those teachers that don't require some kind of investment in the acquisition of the teaching don't produce much results. And that's no fault of the teacher, perhaps, but the students. But the freebies tend to attract so many people there is little opportunity for one-to-one interaction and thus less opportunity for real deep personalization of the instruction, as well as the more lackadaisical approach the overwhelming majority of the students will take towards what is being given out for free.

[C T]

Sorry Drew, but try as I did, I just could not relate to your post.

[voidisyinyang]

That's because I didn't transmit energy with my post! Normally I sit in full-lotus when I'm at the computer. Today I'm eating tons of food to build up my jing more and therefore am taking a break from full-lotus.

 

Again this energy is SUBCONSCIOUS -- so go ahead -- be mad -- sad -- worried -- !!

 

It's all very silly how the energy is transformed based on feelings -- it can be turned off and on.

 

But people react as if they are CUSTOMERS --

 

I don't buy it.

 

etc.

 

ha! It's hilarious. Charge away Santiago.

 

Sorry Drew, but try as I did, I just could not relate to your post.

[Way]

i admit that i make mistakes.

but not everything you think is a mistake is a mistake.

not everything you think is right is right.

 

you don't know me or my situation.

you don't know everything, you are a little part of the whole... as i am..

 

it's not good to judge too much,

it's not good to be too convinced of some the ideas in our heads

 

 

Ok, I would like to apologize for saying that you came across as a loser just because you expressed a desire to have what KAP claims to offer, but for free and with little time and effort.

 

By way of an offering, I would like to post a link to practice as recently taught by Tao Semko (KAP instructor for anyone who may not know).

 

Tao, taught the Sadhana " Bliss and Ecstasy in Tantric Hatha Yoga", an hour or more, 5-6 days a week for 6 weeks live on Ustream and has since indexed the sessions on his website.

 

The practice is powerful, effective, clearly taught and enjoyable - but above all, FREE!! Of course it still takes time and effort - how much depends on what you've done before.

 

Free Sadhana: Bliss and Ecstasy in Tantric Hatha Yoga

 

P.S. This practice will also be of interest to those who were interested in DMT / Ayahuasca.

[John Zen]

I don't appreciate the criticisms I've received for my post that questions the authenticity of KAP. How could you possibly blame me for questioning a website that looks like any other scam website?

 

It appears that it is an authentic program, and that's fine. Don't put me down for saying that it doesnt LOOK authentic...

[voidisyinyang]

John Zen -- it's a group-cult mindset you're confronting. For example Santiago posted his photo of himself sitting in full-lotus. Now I had no idea who Santiago "was" (as per taobums) -- so I just said what I thought, just as you did.

 

I said -- ha! his feet are not even fully up on his thighs -- that's not even a real full-lotus posture!

 

THEN suddenly I was "informed" that the GREAT Santiago had spoken! I was told that Santiago could beat me up physically and that at any time I was welcome to his house

 

"for a lesson."

 

haha.

 

So John Zen -- join the club of free thinkers! haha.

 

 

 

I don't appreciate the criticisms I've received for my post that questions the authenticity of KAP. How could you possibly blame me for questioning a website that looks like any other scam website?

 

It appears that it is an authentic program, and that's fine. Don't put me down for saying that it doesnt LOOK authentic...

[fiveelementtao]

I don't appreciate the criticisms I've received for my post that questions the authenticity of KAP. How could you possibly blame me for questioning a website that looks like any other scam website?

 

It appears that it is an authentic program, and that's fine. Don't put me down for saying that it doesn't LOOK authentic...

 

JZ, You're on a discussion forum... Just as you are free to make an unsubstantiated judgement with no personal experience based solely at looking on a website one time, you can't then demand that no one can share their perceptions of your post...

 

I withholding any comment on KAP because I have not trained in their system and the overwhelming reviews I have seen are very positive.

I have certainly discovered for myself that no teacher or system is perfect. But being a teacher myself, I see no need to trash someone for being human or any system for not being perfect. My main issues with energetic systems are whether they are dangerous. I haven't heard anything about the system itself that leads me to believe it is dangerous.

 

In terms of this free teaching debate, I have weighed in very heavily on other threads about this subject. But, I will say that any valuable teaching will always demand an exchange of energy. For those who use the idea of monasteries as being "free" teaching, I would strongly urge that you train in a monastery first before you speak about how free they are. While it is possible that you may not have to pay with money, you will be paying with far more expense. How do you think monasteries survive? You will still have to work very hard to earn your keep...possibly full time. They need cooks and gardeners etc... Not only that, but you will pay with your freedom. You will not be able to come and go as you wish. You will also be directly responsible to a teacher who will probably have you on a very strict regimen and you will be directly responsible to their personal instruction... If you do not earn your keep and follow rules, you will be expelled. When all is said and done, I feel very confident that you will wish that the only thing you had to do was pay someone a few hundred dollars.

 

People are also not making the distinction between spiritual teachings ( Such as compassion, kindness, love, mindfullness etc..) as opposed to energetic techniques. I agree that a priest or a teacher need not charge for teachings about morality and basic meditation etc... But to expect someone to devote countless hours to you to teach you energetic techniques that took them years and thousands of hours to master is the height of narcissism. And the first thing anyone will need to learn before gaining any benefit from a spiritual teaching is to face and overcome their own narcissism.

 

I have said before but it bears repeating... If any teacher does not require some sacrifice from the student in some way, that teacher either has nothing of value to teach, does not know how to teach, has some personal agenda or is a downright fraud. Sacrifice is necessary for the student to value the teaching. If they do not value the teaching, they will not learn. If they do not learn, the teacher has failed. As a teacher, my priority is to make sure the student learns.

Edited December 5, 2009 by fiveelementtao

[everseeking]

"But to expect someone to devote countless hours to you to teach you energetic techniques that took them years and thousands of hours to master is the height of narcissism."

 

 

Words of wisdom!!!

 

Drew--too long, didn't read.

 

Also, I tend to tune things out at this point when they contain the words/phrases:

 

vagus nerve, full lotus, electrochemical energy, 'O at a D", etc...sorry dude.

[C T]

 

 

 

But, I will say that any valuable teaching will always demand an exchange of energy. For those who use the idea of monasteries as being "free" teaching, I would strongly urge that you train in a monastery first before you speak about how free they are. While it is possible that you may not have to pay with money, you will be paying with far more expense. How do you think monasteries survive? You will still have to work very hard to earn your keep...possibly full time. They need cooks and gardeners etc... Not only that, but you will pay with your freedom. You will not be able to come and go as you wish. You will also be directly responsible to a teacher who will probably have you on a very strict regimen and you will be directly responsible to their personal instruction... If you do not earn your keep and follow rules, you will be expelled. When all is said and done, I feel very confident that you will wish that the only thing you had to do was pay someone a few hundred dollars.

 

People are also not making the distinction between spiritual teachings ( Such as compassion, kindness, love, mindfullness etc..) as opposed to energetic techniques. I agree that a priest or a teacher need not charge for teachings about morality and basic meditation etc... But to expect someone to devote countless hours to you to teach you energetic techniques that took them years and thousands of hours to master is the height of narcissism. And the first thing anyone will need to learn before gaining any benefit from a spiritual teaching is to face and overcome their own narcissism.

 

 

Nicely said, 5ET.

 

I can relate to your observations based on personal experience at monasteries and retreat centers, and have friends who have had similar experiences at ashrams and temples as well.

 

(I think nowadays even God charges for His services.. )

Edited December 5, 2009 by CowTao

[John Zen]

JZ, You're on a discussion forum... Just as you are free to make an unsubstantiated judgement with no personal experience based solely at looking on a website one time, you can't then demand that no one can share their perceptions of your post...

 

But to expect someone to devote countless hours to you to teach you energetic techniques that took them years and thousands of hours to master is the height of narcissism. And the first thing anyone will need to learn before gaining any benefit from a spiritual teaching is to face and overcome their own narcissism.

 

 

He asked for what we thought of the website. In my experience, websites that look like that are scams. So now I'm being accused of narcissism and ignorance? Tell me I'm wrong, don't put me down.