KAP

[Vajrasattva]

Santi and Susan,

 

 

 

Well as far as I can see, the study isn't peer reviewed or published. Which means that the people involved may be biased. That is a big deal.

 

Basically if I had the title of 'Dr' added onto my name, I could do a false study and just say, "yeah we tested it at this university and it cures cancer! Buy my product now!"

 

My point is that if it's not peer reviewed, then it's basically worthless...especially if it presents a risk to people who don't know what they're doing!

 

I would advise all those who are interested in actually helping others heal, to not spread statements like "electrical currents cure cancer".

 

 

http://www.thaimed.us/israeli-scientist-halt-glioblastoma-multiforme-electric-field-brain-cancer-treatment/2009/11/03/

 

http://www.rife.de/electricity_frequencies_and_cancer.html

 

http://arasysperfector.com/articles/?p=526

 

http://www.news-medical.net/news/2007/08/03/28403.aspx

 

interesting reads

[Aetherous]

I just think it's risky to say something (that's potentially very dangerous) cures cancer, when we truly don't know.

 

How many Tao Bums will think applying zappers to themselves is actually healthy? Too many already!

 

Sure a lot of people will die during the time it takes to get something published, who could possibly benefit from such treatments...but on the flip side, if the treatment isn't actually healing, they will be better off having not gotten it!

 

Personally, I've done my own experimentation, and tend to be very cautious with using electrical currents for healing. Seems to be really bad for the organs.

 

It shouldn't even be necessary for true healers, since the body stores and produces a ton of electrical current anyway...hmm...

 

By the way, you said - what motivation is there to study a treatment that costs little to nothing? Well there are numerous studies on exercise being beneficial...that's a totally free activity.

 

People perform and submit studies to journals in order to further medical knowledge, to help people. So if electrical currents do in any way cure cancer, you'd think that someone would be submitting their research...yet there is nothing out there.

[ShaktiMama]

 

I believe it was Joel's foot.

 

As far as the seminar I shall continue in the Tao Bums spirit

 

I didn't like it because there was NO :

 

- free shaktipats which invoked such responses that the bliss was felt even by just being present in the same room

- four hour free session on Friday and an option to still pay the lower rate that day

- demonstration of a chi push/pull, multiple times

- unannounced cimande healing where man were made (Diamond fingers KNOW)

- room of people so warm (and not from tummo) and sincere, not because they were being nice but because that was what they are

- Electro man with an Adidas hat, who makes you see lighting when he touches you and when asked "How/why" says that he'll teach you

- demonstrations for the sceptic on the right who was constantly asking questions

- funny stories how a young man discovered what all he can do with his "powers" and how to use them in a more, ehm, practical way (gas, waiters, won't say the last one)

- faces saying "What the fuck, fucking unbelievable, aaa" when energy sending was done

- connection. I can't imagine seeing one of the participants from the workshop and him/her greeting me like a brother and me doing likewise

- revealing secrets of the masters (e.g. switching direction)

 

So yeah, I can't really say that this was one of the top three weekends of my life.

 

Also every day the class ended EXACTLY at time, never going past the official hour. Damn, boi.

 

you a cute, funny guy...it was a pleasure to meet you... we loved teasing you!

 

those "hail mary" looks are fun to see... or the WTF looks as you call them.

 

i want you to know that what you saw is not difficult to do and Santi and I are more than happy to teach what we know. Too bad we didn't have more time because we could teach for a month non stop and still not give you all that we want.

 

didnt you just love when santi moved someone off center and tossed him to the ground by just using his mind?

 

dont have to be a martial artist to do that as I was demonstrating it to others too.

 

i love the fact that a roomful of strangers become brothers and sisters to each other very quickly. there were lifetime friendships made in that room. I have some great friends in that room who were once first my students. I look forward to having more great friends come out of that

class.

[voidisyinyang]

thanks

 

electropermeabilization

 

http://www.thaimed.us/israeli-scientist-halt-glioblastoma-multiforme-electric-field-brain-cancer-treatment/2009/11/03/

 

http://www.rife.de/electricity_frequencies_and_cancer.html

 

http://arasysperfector.com/articles/?p=526

 

http://www.news-medical.net/news/2007/08/03/28403.aspx

 

interesting reads

[ShaktiMama]

I just think it's risky to say something (that's potentially very dangerous) cures cancer, when we truly don't know.

 

How many Tao Bums will think applying zappers to themselves is actually healthy? Too many already!

 

Sure a lot of people will die during the time it takes to get something published, who could possibly benefit from such treatments...but on the flip side, if the treatment isn't actually healing, they will be better off having not gotten it!

 

Personally, I've done my own experimentation, and tend to be very cautious with using electrical currents for healing. Seems to be really bad for the organs.

 

It shouldn't even be necessary for true healers, since the body stores and produces a ton of electrical current anyway...hmm...

 

By the way, you said - what motivation is there to study a treatment that costs little to nothing? Well there are numerous studies on exercise being beneficial...that's a totally free activity.

 

People perform and submit studies to journals in order to further medical knowledge, to help people. So if electrical currents do in any way cure cancer, you'd think that someone would be submitting their research...yet there is nothing out there.

 

Da Bums are going to do whatever they want. I am not their babysitter and they can take responsibility for their own actions. You cant control what people will do with information. If they want to be stupid or wise about it that is their decision not mine to make for them.

 

chemotherapy kills cancers too and can kill the patient also. Makes them sick for days and they go bald. It is a horrible way to get better. Chemotherapy and radiation does not claim to cure cancer either. No one can truly say definatively that it does but traditional cancer therapy is a billion dollar business. $10k for one shot? Yes...and more. No doctor will claim they can cure or heal anyone. They will say they don't really know for sure. I know because I have sat in the room with a patient while the doctor explains treatment to them. One doesn't have to believe claims. One can go and investigate claims for themselves.

 

I know weight loss can cure diabetes. It happens over and over with diabetics who loose significant portions of weight. But you will never see a medical professional claim that because there will always be some anomaly that will prevent this from being proven across the board. If it doesnt happen then there is a lawsuit. For a few it doesn't cure diabetes. This just means we don't know everyting that there is to know about something. How could we? No one has all the answers but that doesn't mean we should not investigate and try.

 

The body only stores a natural current that we are born with. Enough to power the heart. The rest comes from an internal cultivation practice. Most people don't know how to do that. Even healers have a hard time generating that. How many healers can touch you with their fingers and it feels like they are pushing red hot rods of steel through your body? I have only met a couple in my lifetime. Pak is one of them. You don't develop that ability overnight. If electricity is bad for the body why then cultivate to store it? Can energy be bad for the organs and be something that healers naturally have?

 

Yes there are studies about exercise but how many people exercise on their own? How many pay for someone to exercise them? Overall, one example does not erase the enormous profit motive there is in medicine to create problems and treatments for the public. Do we really need medicine for shyness?

 

No, there are studies out there. Just got to look for the research.

Edited January 20, 2010 by ShaktiMama

[Vajrasattva]

I just think it's risky to say something (that's potentially very dangerous) cures cancer, when we truly don't know.

 

How many Tao Bums will think applying zappers to themselves is actually healthy? Too many already!

 

Sure a lot of people will die during the time it takes to get something published, who could possibly benefit from such treatments...but on the flip side, if the treatment isn't actually healing, they will be better off having not gotten it!

 

Personally, I've done my own experimentation, and tend to be very cautious with using electrical currents for healing. Seems to be really bad for the organs.

 

It shouldn't even be necessary for true healers, since the body stores and produces a ton of electrical current anyway...hmm...

 

By the way, you said - what motivation is there to study a treatment that costs little to nothing? Well there are numerous studies on exercise being beneficial...that's a totally free activity.

 

People perform and submit studies to journals in order to further medical knowledge, to help people. So if electrical currents do in any way cure cancer, you'd think that someone would be submitting their research...yet there is nothing out there.

 

considering the fact that WESTERN medicine's methods seem to KILL cancer patients a lot more i would opt for herbs, healing energy, zapping, and going to see good healers. But hey that is what I would do.

 

There are SOME good Doctors in Western Medicine but that is "Some".

 

Also keep in mind that there are MANY things that aid substantially in the cure of cancer but the FDA will never admit it.

[Vajrasattva]

Edited January 20, 2010 by Vajrasattva

[Kameel]

Ah...integration, a true blessing of life. Welcome back Susan and Santi. Couple things to put this page in perspective. IME, as a consultant and conductor (not the word they use, but I like it )for various peer-reviewed double-blinded placebo controlled studies, they ALL contain bias. Everyone single one I have ever seen or been involved in has exhibited some degree of subconscious bias, energetic, unknown factors, morphogenic field, etc. So awareness is valid and luminous.

Also, electricity from a wall as a conduit for healing does not strike me as unreasonable. Everyday, lasers (Fraxel, Thermage,Vbeam, Light Sheer Diode,etc) are plugged into walls and sensations such as "I felt like I was being hit by bacon grease", and "little tiny fire daggers repeatedly stabbing me" are experienced. Of course, the companies claim it feels like "a rubber band snapping". But results are obtained and people come back for more. And this is just for aesthetics. No deep energetic healing here. Funny thing though...it's not the lasers that have caused the most dramatic negative effects in skilled hands...it's the numbing cream. Apply BLT mixture over large surface areas such as a petite woman's lower extemeties and death may result (from systemic absorption). Thankfully have never seen that with my own eyes, but it is discussed in the literature and has happened. So just putting things in perspective...

[Aetherous]

Hmm...

 

1) We don't know that electricity cures cancer, so we shouldn't say that it does.

 

2) If we really believe that it does, we should still be responsible and admit that we haven't fully tested it.

 

3) If it does help in some cases, is that going to be true in all cases, or are some people going to be seriously hurt? Once again, we don't know and are walking into dangerous territory.

 

4) I'm not trying to start any kind of debate about the corruption of Western medicine...I'm simply looking to keep people from doing damaging things to themselves. What we say has a lot of power...people pick up on little catch phrases like "zappers cure cancer" and assume it's true. What if it's the opposite of true, and it actually causes cancer?

 

That's the last thing I'll say, because it's really the only point and contention I have...

[Kameel]

Oh, don't worry about starting a thread about corruption of medicine...it already is. But remember the first three words describing corruption are "the act of changing"...But let's change topics anyways.

 

Shakti barfs, Shakti shivers, Shakti shits...detox can be intense, but remember to look what is left in place afterwards. That is your gift.

Edited January 20, 2010 by Kameel

[寒月 Hanyue]

I just think it's risky to say something (that's potentially very dangerous) cures cancer, when we truly don't know.

 

How many Tao Bums will think applying zappers to themselves is actually healthy? Too many already!

 

Sure a lot of people will die during the time it takes to get something published, who could possibly benefit from such treatments...but on the flip side, if the treatment isn't actually healing, they will be better off having not gotten it!

 

Personally, I've done my own experimentation, and tend to be very cautious with using electrical currents for healing. Seems to be really bad for the organs.

 

It shouldn't even be necessary for true healers, since the body stores and produces a ton of electrical current anyway...hmm...

 

By the way, you said - what motivation is there to study a treatment that costs little to nothing? Well there are numerous studies on exercise being beneficial...that's a totally free activity.

 

People perform and submit studies to journals in order to further medical knowledge, to help people. So if electrical currents do in any way cure cancer, you'd think that someone would be submitting their research...yet there is nothing out there.

 

Hi Scotty

 

I hear you on this.

 

But i feel that you are slightly mis-reading things ( I maybe wrong), this is probably due to the all annoying nature of the internet and forums.

 

The ELECTRICITY is not healing anything, per se (as i see it, at least). It is a tool that a powerful healer like Pak can use to heal someone. I could zap people, or fill them with acupuncture needles like a pin cushion, or give the herbs, or prescribe medicine, but given that i am NOT a healer and do NOT know how to use these tools, that would probably be a very DUMB idea.

 

As Santi explained;

 

"As for the Electricity, Pak Muhammad.....uses the energy to open channels and clear negative energy, He runs his Shakti or Tenaga through the energy as well with his intent & prayers to open and heal things more."

 

It is not just plugging into the mains and running current, there is more going on. The electricity is a tool/vehicle. Like the difference between using needles alone, needles with a small current, or needles with strong qi and intent.

 

Your skepticism is well placed, i don't think just running current through someone would have the result of being treated by Pak. Though any studies would likely reduce things to this to remove the 'subjective' and the uncontrollable variables, and then they would be missing the point.

 

Any one who watches a guy squat 900lbs, and then goes out to try without training or building up to it, is well dumb. Same with this. Having felt this, it does not make me think i can go home and plug in to the mains and play, and if anyone does they are well...you know. If they read it on a forum and think they can do it, well...mmm.

 

So does 'electricity' cure cancer? I am not qualified to say, but like any tool it can be used well in the right hands and not in the hands of others, even many who should know better. As for dangerous, my Father died because of the treatment of his cancer, not the cancer. Shit happens, but allopathic medicine has some f*cked up treatments.

 

Take care

 

B

[Aetherous]

Thanks B...totally agree with you.

[voidisyinyang]

yeah here's a new study saying electromagnetic exposure from cell phones can treat Alzheimer's Disease -- which is ironic considering the cancer causation studies:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKUS1sF5oD4&feature=PlayList&p=0BAF50BC77E49A4E&index=4&playnext=5&playnext_from=PL

 

Thanks B...totally agree with you.

[suninmyeyes]

Yes he looked and felt so much better. And he squirmed & Vomitted many times as we gave him both healing & Shaktipat. This happened later with another student we gave shaktipat too the next day and it happened again with a woman I gave Shaktipat to later. She removed 4 jinns from her body. I had seen them & then Pak Confirmed aswell.

hi vajrasattva,how do jinns look like to you?do many people have them,or just rarley?what are they made of?what do they want?

thanks

[RobB]

Dear Santi & Susan,

 

I'm glad your visit to the UK went well. I'd be interested to read any comments about the seminar in general. I'd have liked to make it myself but not possible this time. I did try and 'tune in' on Saturday night (I have no idea how to do that) and seemed to get a lot of tingling around my crown point, a sense of light in the forehead and a strong, strong straightening stretch in my neck/cervical spine. I don't know if it was you guys or not. It was good though and outside of the usual parameters of my normal breathing practice

 

Cheers

 

Rob

[Mal]

How many Tao Bums will think applying zappers to themselves is actually healthy? Too many already!

 

I was very sceptical till I tried my Terminator II http://www.worldwithoutparasites.com/index.html

 

I'm happy to have brought it (and it was EXPENSIVE)good purchase YMMV. Anecdotes are not peer reviewed

[3bob]

I would recommend a PM to Santi or Susan. They are both busy (especially currently) and I can't speak for them but their generosity and hearts are huge. If I thought that I could adequately help, I would. But I am quite certain that my answers and explanations would be similar to the exchanges about electricity on this thread(3bob, I feel for you.) Several months of KAP have greatly changed my life for the better but I am far from ready to try and convey what I have learned.

 

Not at all sure what you are saying above in regards to me Deepbluesea?

 

Anyway, I'm glad that I didn't just let certain statements about the potentially fatal use of electricity SLIDE.

And I'm also glad that some people here took note, maybe doing so will prevent serious harm or worse to someone out there?

 

As the for the intial presentation and bragging-up of the material regarding "220 VAC" it was irresponsible and foolish in my book, regardless of any of the later rationalizations for same; although thankfully warnings did come out.

 

Om

[Vajrasattva]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I believe it was Joel's foot.

 

As far as the seminar I shall continue in the Tao Bums spirit

 

I didn't like it because there was NO :

 

- free shaktipats which invoked such responses that the bliss was felt even by just being present in the same room

- four hour free session on Friday and an option to still pay the lower rate that day

- demonstration of a chi push/pull, multiple times

- unannounced cimande healing where man were made (Diamond fingers KNOW)

- room of people so warm (and not from tummo) and sincere, not because they were being nice but because that was what they are

- Electro man with an Adidas hat, who makes you see lighting when he touches you and when asked "How/why" says that he'll teach you

- demonstrations for the sceptic on the right who was constantly asking questions

- funny stories how a young man discovered what all he can do with his "powers" and how to use them in a more, ehm, practical way (gas, waiters, won't say the last one)

- faces saying "What the fuck, fucking unbelievable, aaa" when energy sending was done

- connection. I can't imagine seeing one of the participants from the workshop and him/her greeting me like a brother and me doing likewise

- revealing secrets of the masters (e.g. switching direction)

 

So yeah, I can't really say that this was one of the top three weekends of my life.

 

Also every day the class ended EXACTLY at time, never going past the official hour. Damn, boi.

 

 

hah you forgot there was no people vibrating from shaktipat and tears of joy and bliss rushing in.

 

there was no iron palm silat tenaga dalam slap/tibetan red palm to bring brett's blood up so his arm looked like it was "burned" with finger tips. KAP SUCKS

Edited January 21, 2010 by Vajrasattva

[Vajrasattva]

oh we forgot there was also no charity work done

[One love]

hah you forgot there was no people vibrating from shaktipat and tears of joy and bliss rushing in.

 

- free shaktipats which invoked such responses that the bliss was felt even by just being present in the same room

 

Don't be nitpicking

 

And of course I don't believe in the iron palm because I haven't done it myself

 

I forgot to mention that we all HAD to go out while Santi and Susan were doing the Shaktipats, so no one would free lech the energy.

 

And yeah, there was also no guy with the glasses who said "Wow I see so clearly and focused" as he put down his glasses after a shaktipat.

 

Also no constantly smiling people.

 

KAP SUCKS

 

+35 or how much was it ?

 

By the way prepare your gMail for a mass FAQ in a day or two

 

Bok

Edited January 21, 2010 by One love

[Vajrasattva]

Don't be nitpicking

 

And of course I don't believe in the iron palm because I haven't done it myself

 

I forgot to mention that we all HAD to go out while Santi and Susan were doing the Shaktipats, so no one would free lech the energy.

 

And yeah, there was also no guy with the glasses who said "Wow I see so clearly and focused" as he put down his glasses after a shaktipat.

 

Also no constantly smiling people.

 

 

 

+35 or how much was it ?

 

By the way prepare your gMail for a mass FAQ in a day or two

 

Bok

 

"Randi" we forgot

 

there was no "Authentic" tibetan/ Shamanic/ Sufi/ Taoist & Tantric methods, transmissions, given to everyone for 2 days straight. Instead everyone got a happy meal with a "veggie" burger but no real MEAT.

[Vajrasattva]

whoever asked , a Jinn can look like an elemental but the bigger ones look like the ones in the face of the chic in the 4th kind. So go see that movie.

[~jK~]

Why don't someone show me PROOF of the awakened kundalini and enlightenment of any indian, tibetan or chineese master? It has to be one that shows something no western Derren Brown type can do though. Everything the Mo PAy guy does could well be magick tricks. Who has ever seen proof of kundalini in anyone? Of abilities with chi sure, but proof of kundalini???? Of enlightenment?????????????

 

We really do need a remake of the parting of the red sea. Egypt could pay santi to make a sort of biblical remake tour doing all the miracles of Moses where they were actaully performed

Good point Marken !

I try to find the reality within what I work for as well.

 

A person doesn't need to be a master to experience the Kundalini rising - the Master thing is only a title that a student gives to someone they trust to lead them.

Although - the rising must be experienced to know it. I've used only the book "The Five Tibetans" and had good results - strong results for the first year and slightly less sensational for the 3 years later - all the high points have been directly associated with my intensity of practice.

When does it end ? In reality - I hope it never does although I have noticed a tapering off of the 'risings' as I have passed through the higher chakras. 'Risings' are like mini sexual orgasims that happen as your spirit as well as your energy flow is aligned toward a more normal flow. Quite pleasurable but a bit distracting as they happen, sometimes, at odd times - but they last only for about 5 seconds.

 

The Enlightenment is a total different thing - I experienced it as well in phases with the last time being about 5 years ago and a real ball buster. I was blinded, for maybe 5 min. by visions of pure light and a tiny bird... go figure.

The way I got to it was by meditating and walking in the mountains. One day I stopped to rest by a stream and it happened as I meditated on nothing.

I would begin with the book - it's been out for over 10 years so there are many used ones - and go from there.

[ShaktiMama]

Good point Marken !

I try to find the reality within what I work for as well.

 

A person doesn't need to be a master to experience the Kundalini rising - the Master thing is only a title that a student gives to someone they trust to lead them.

Although - the rising must be experienced to know it. I've used only the book "The Five Tibetans" and had good results - strong results for the first year and slightly less sensational for the 3 years later - all the high points have been directly associated with my intensity of practice.

When does it end ? In reality - I hope it never does although I have noticed a tapering off of the 'risings' as I have passed through the higher chakras. 'Risings' are like mini sexual orgasims that happen as your spirit as well as your energy flow is aligned toward a more normal flow. Quite pleasurable but a bit distracting as they happen, sometimes, at odd times - but they last only for about 5 seconds.

 

The Enlightenment is a total different thing - I experienced it as well in phases with the last time being about 5 years ago and a real ball buster. I was blinded, for maybe 5 min. by visions of pure light and a tiny bird... go figure.

The way I got to it was by meditating and walking in the mountains. One day I stopped to rest by a stream and it happened as I meditated on nothing.

I would begin with the book - it's been out for over 10 years so there are many used ones - and go from there.

 

Indeed...kundalini rising is not just for masters, nor does it ever end. Like the peeling of an onion it continues over the years. I hope it never ends. Always new things to explore and discover about myself and the Universe I live in. I think enlightenment is over rated, but that is my opinion. To me, I can quiet myself and drop the veil between myself and All That Is and experience nothing but scintillating ecstatic visions of clear, blinding light. Then it's chop wood, carry water. Once one knows who one is in relation to All That Is, death is not feared and all beings are to be honored and loved. Love Self, Honor Self.

 

What is important to me is that Kundalini increases my capacity to be of service to this planet and to those that live on it in many different ways.

 

Santi and I are nothing. It is our openness to Source, to be an open vessel or conduit, the bone flute in which the energy of Source flows which matters to us. If people could only look through our eyes and see what we see..how extraordinarily beautiful all beings in this Universe are they would fall to their knees and weep in the joy of the discovery of it.

[3bob]

Indeed...kundalini rising is not just for masters, nor does it ever end. Like the peeling of an onion it continues over the years. I hope it never ends. Always new things to explore and discover about myself and the Universe I live in. I think enlightenment is over rated, but that is my opinion. To me, I can quiet myself and drop the veil between myself and All That Is and experience nothing but scintillating ecstatic visions of clear, blinding light. Then it's chop wood, carry water. Once one knows who one is in relation to All That Is, death is not feared and all beings are to be honored and loved. Love Self, Honor Self.

 

What is important to me is that Kundalini increases my capacity to be of service to this planet and to those that live on it in many different ways.

 

Santi and I are nothing. It is our openness to Source, to be an open vessel or conduit, the bone flute in which the energy of Source flows which matters to us. If people could only look through our eyes and see what we see..how extraordinarily beautiful all beings in this Universe are they would fall to their knees and weep in the joy of the discovery of it.

 

ShaktiMama,

An inspiring witness except near the end where you state: "...If people could only look through our eyes and see what we see..." as stated this sentence totally misses the mark and might be very self-revealing for you?

 

Om