Flying Phoenix Chi Kung

[Shiva33]

The Golden Flying Phoenix is another subsystem of Flying Phoenix. $299 for 3 meds on whitetigerkungfu website. One of those videos done by GM Doo Way with no breakdowns, so good luck learning it. Also you can probably revive small animals with normal Flying Phoenix later on too.

[Earl Grey]

Ah. That's the one, thank you both very much. This thread really does need to be read through completely at least several times (I have only read from beginning to end once). 

 

I think I have plenty to practice now first with Sifu Terry's current DVDs and apparently, his forthcoming ones next year, so before I jump into that, I will prioritize the existing DVD series and online or in-person sessions for perfecting my form with Flying Phoenix.

[Vajra Fist]

I asked Eric Isen to test Golden Phoenix when it came out. I had a dream I learned it from Sifu Christer. However he said:

 

"This Golden Flying Phoenix is OK but somewhat limited in what it would do for you. It would help the liver and have some good results with intuition.

 

"The Terry Dunn Flying Phoenix results in a more powerful movement of the Kundalini spiritual energy than this one and develops the power 3rd chakra in you quite powerfully."

 

Bear in mind though it's a personal reading.

[tao stillness]

What is golden is the gift that Eric has which allows us to become aware of which method might be better suited for us on an individual basis.

Tonight I had a super helpful reading with him for a sudden health issue that my medical doctor had no clue about. Sudden high blood pressure and even more frequent urination than usual. From working with Eric in the past I had a sense that he would trace the symptoms to the result of a recent change in diet for the worse. And that was it. But it was amazing how he tied the symptoms from  the processed food creating toxins in the lymphatic system to this aggravating vata condition which pushed down to the prostate and liver being inflamed and the toxins reaching the heart thru the bloodstream as the heart was working to rid itself of the toxins from  the lymph system and this creates the high blood pressure. There was more to it that he saw but this will suffice as an overview of his gift. He also confirmed that the protein powder that I recently switched to, although one of the best on the market, cannot be digested well by my system so it too contributes to the toxins as undigested food always will. His testing then confirmed that my previous brand protein powder which I need as a vegetarian was the right one for me. He also saw that the herbal formula I recently began taking for my weak liver is actually so powerful that it is cleansing the toxins from the lymphatic system doing so in such a strong manner that it contributes to the increase in urination. So he recommended a different formula for the liver which will have milder effects and not increase urination. Now what MD is going to come up with all of that? I knew I was not in the right hands when earlier this week my MD thought my sudden rise in blood pressure might be due to stress. He never asked me if I was doing anything different in any area of my life. Meaning he did not ask about eating habits.

[tao stillness]

I think it was Garry Hearfield one or two years ago who told me I did not need Golden Phoenix Qigong if I was already doing Sunn Yee Gung or Flying Phoenix Chi Kung. He said that his qigong methods are for the specific kung fu systems that he teaches. Each kung fu method has a corresponding qigong method.

[Earl Grey]

I really need to book a session with Eric Isen soon. That is absolutely fantastic and I am happy for you. 

[SeekerOfHealing]

I do not know if it's only me but for me golden pheonix the way Grandmaster shows and explains (stress free release form especially) gives genuine effects.

[Earl Grey]

I just recently encountered some discussion about placement of the tongue on the roof of the mouth.

 

Generally, in my other practices, I place it in the water position--in the soft part of the palate in the back of the mouth, but for Flying Phoenix or any other practice I have been taught to make the "L" sound just behind the teeth--the air position-- I do it this way.

 

From what I understood previously, it doesn't make a difference except when noted otherwise, like those who study the Microcosmic Orbit and do the water, fire, or air positions. 

 

My question is this to Sifu Terry or anyone who can comment: is it strictly and absolutely important that we only use the air position for tongue placement, or is the water or fire position okay? I ask because oftentimes, my body during the static meditations moves involuntarily, not just head shaking or upper torso moving, but at times, the tongue moves from air position to the water position. For my martial practices, I've never had the problem of the tongue moving from air to water position, but during Flying Phoenix, it does move on its own involuntarily. 

[cihan]

I just recently encountered some discussion about placement of the tongue on the roof of the mouth.

 

Generally, in my other practices, I place it in the water position--in the soft part of the palate in the back of the mouth, but for Flying Phoenix or any other practice I have been taught to make the "L" sound just behind the teeth--the air position-- I do it this way.

 

From what I understood previously, it doesn't make a difference except when noted otherwise, like those who study the Microcosmic Orbit and do the water, fire, or air positions.

 

My question is this to Sifu Terry or anyone who can comment: is it strictly and absolutely important that we only use the air position for tongue placement, or is the water or fire position okay? I ask because oftentimes, my body during the static meditations moves involuntarily, not just head shaking or upper torso moving, but at times, the tongue moves from air position to the water position. For my martial practices, I've never had the problem of the tongue moving from air to water position, but during Flying Phoenix, it does move on its own involuntarily.

I came across the positioning of the tongue 5 years after practicing FPCK with the tongue in soft palate and did some research and contemplation of my own.

There are actually 3 positions, water/ soft palate switching the front channel to the central channel, also nourishing all internal organs + enabling one to do some "spine" work, like deep meditations.

Fire place is at the hard palate on top, which I suspect what they call as "roof of the mouth" which GMDW is always instructing to put the tip of tongue on his videos.

There is also the wind place where every one in this forum talks about to be told to keep their tongues at, behind the top teeth. I did not come across any official reference about this, I may have missed it, but I was so serious to find it out, so I tried all the positions. All have different effects as they switch to different places.

For martial arts, limbic system is a priority, wind place connects front and back channels, boosting external organs and make me feel lighter both in the mind and body while doing any moving exercises, but mind chatter is literally boosted.

I am guessing all who came into this system with a prior martial art experience accepts this position without any further thinking.

Fire place kind of balances both internal and external, and in my experience boosts the root. It combines stillness with the movement and reduces mind chatter considerably.

Water place I believe is where we will all end up after a certain practice time, as it allows the spine with all these chakras to act directly, bypassing intellect and allowing our higher self to operate with more freedom in this environment.

Tongue finds its correct position with respect to practice experience. It is very logical to begin with the wind/external and move on, if not told officially otherwise ☺

Cheers

Edited November 14, 2016 by cihan

[Earl Grey]

Yes, I read about the three positions here on TDB that's how I got to questioning the air, fire, and water positions.

 

I tend to be most comfortable with the water position and only stick to the air position when instructed to unless water itself is the ultimate ideal, because in the Vedic system, it's the kechari chakra. It's apparently so important that some yogis would slice off bits of their tongue until they could reach back and hit this comfortably and effortlessly endlessly. No thanks!!! 

[zen-bear]

post deleted

Edited November 16, 2016 by zen-bear

[Shiva33]

Its called kechari mudra and its almost always done with Ujjayi pranayam (specific breathing exercise to induce one pointed focus, relaxation and meditation). You get what some call Jnana kechari mudra, where you just place the tongue at the back of the palate and then there is the Tantric one, or highest level of the mudra, where you place it in the nasal cavity behind the uvula, but there are tongue exercises that you one can do to achieve this without cutting the Frenulum. Kechari mudra according to Yoga\Tantra is to enable one to raise the Kundalini and stimulate the amrita(elixir) in the head, to drip down onto the tongue (instead of dripping down to the stomach, where the fire of digestion destroys it) so that the amrit gets transformed and purified at the Vishuddhi Chakra (throat) the yogi then goes into a deep state of samadhi. So this is done for specific reasons within a yogic system that follows a different alchemical process.

 

I don't think its a good idea to mix this with Flying Phoenix practice, but the basic mudra would maybe be ok? I keep mine just behind the teeth when practicing Flying Phoenix.

[Earl Grey]

Its called kechari mudra and its almost always done with Ujjayi pranayam (specific breathing exercise to induce one pointed focus, relaxation and meditation). You get what some call Jnana kechari mudra, where you just place the tongue at the back of the palate and then there is the Tantric one, or highest level of the mudra, where you place it in the nasal cavity behind the uvula, but there are tongue exercises that you one can do to achieve this without cutting the Frenulum. Kechari mudra according to Yoga\Tantra is to enable one to raise the Kundalini and stimulate the amrita(elixir) in the head, to drip down onto the tongue (instead of dripping down to the stomach, where the fire of digestion destroys it) so that the amrit gets transformed and purified at the Vishuddhi Chakra (throat) the yogi then goes into a deep state of samadhi. So this is done for specific reasons within a yogic system that follows a different alchemical process.

 

I don't think its a good idea to mix this with Flying Phoenix practice, but the basic mudra would maybe be ok? I keep mine just behind the teeth when practicing Flying Phoenix.

 

 

Like I said, I usually don't willingly stick it there in the water position, but it spontaneously rolls back involuntarily...

[Shiva33]

It may be that you are approaching a trance like state or very deep meditation. In Yoga there are techniques and after effects that mimic what happens to the body in a trance state, epileptic fit, seizures, time just before death. Kechari mudra (tongue rolled back), shambhavi mudra (rolling the eyes upward to 3rd eye), bandha (body locks) and psychic stiffening (where body, arms etc. becomes very stiff in meditation). These techniques help to still the mind and experience higher states of consciousness, by focusing more energy up to the brain, but all this can happen spontaneously when approaching a deep state so its probably normal. I would like to know what thoughts Sifu Terry has on this. Also does this mostly happen during seated practice?

[Earl Grey]

It may be that you are approaching a trance like state or very deep meditation. In Yoga there are techniques and after effects that mimic what happens to the body in a trance state, epileptic fit, seizures, time just before death. Kechari mudra (tongue rolled back), shambhavi mudra (rolling the eyes upward to 3rd eye), bandha (body locks) and psychic stiffening (where body, arms etc. becomes very stiff in meditation). These techniques help to still the mind and experience higher states of consciousness, by focusing more energy up to the brain, but all this can happen spontaneously when approaching a deep state so its probably normal. I would like to know what thoughts Sifu Terry has on this. Also does this mostly happen during seated practice?

 

It tends to happen equally both standing and seated, movement and dynamic. 

 

I'm waiting to hear what Sifu Terry says too so I can figure out if this is anything to worry about or if like some others I've spoken to for practices like zhan zhuang, they say that it's mainly to generate saliva to swallow, and to connect the channels, regardless of the air, fire, or water points. 

[Cosmic Soldier]

Has anyones tinnitus improved using Flying Phoenix?

[SeekerOfHealing]

All chronic diseases have remission thru practice Flying Phoenix, I can guarantee that with my hand - cut it off if I'm lying, the thing is you do not know when it happens because it's happens over-night. I had pretty bad conditions and they getting better and better but only when the Qi really sink into the body, it's can take time to settle. Sometimes even month of regular practice seems doing nothing besides shaking, weird heat effects but after you woke up - you will see you are different person with different feel of existence but this stuff is hard work in the sense you really need to practice it, the best is 1-2 hours if you are serious about healing yourself and really do not hold expectation as it's work mysterious ways on it's own. Sometimes after practice you will see things in Ultra HD effect like on LSD or something, sometimes you will feel heavy or "bad" sometimes you will feel different way. It's like balancing journey into middle way but it's work on it's own. It's takes time and patience to really sink into effects but you get "spiritual skills" (gong fu) with time to sink with your mind into that energy and tap that even without doing physical moves you can actually do practice in your mind with similar effects.

[ridingtheox]

hmmm  the thread gets loonier and loonier ...

 

i am a strictly  practice  is  healing and spirit  opening   process ...  

 

currently i am in the starting phase of 108 day journey .. (day 19) for long form  for the last 5 days I have done 2x daily standing

this morning's mirror image practice was very near 30 min duration.  The holidays and family wil be on us soon keep hoping the journey flows thru those days ...

 

My tcc practice has also taken another rise to new plateau.    Li YuenFei'  Ba Duan Jin has also been quite rich experientially.

 

My advice is not to speculate too much or believe too easily,  but to practice with an open heart-mind.

 

Enjoy

[tao stillness]

I like RidingtheOx's advice. When this thread starts sounding like sci-fi it may time to drop back to discussing the basics.

On the other hand, the one major healing that I have had from doing chi kung happened literally overnight when I did spend close to 4 hours in one day doing one qigong method as instructed. So I think that is probably does take a lot of time spent doing the movements to get tangible healing.

[Astral_butterfly]

What do you mean when you give your durations? Do you include the warm-ups? I literally do 10 minutes warm up with up to ten minutes of one or two standing meds per day as, as I have mentioned before, I have very limited time. From time to time I do more as I can manage to fit in. However I do feel the connection and the energy. This is why I am amazed at how powerful the system is. Sometimes I really only have time to just about start a med when my daughter starts yanking at me but just having been able to touch the energy is a consolation.

 

Somebody please elaborate on the warm-ups and how their importance may or not fluctuate with time.

 

To be safe I generally do the full ten minutes but sometimes I am so desperate and have so little time that I skip it. How will this influence the progress?

 

I sometimes abandon the warm-up when I feel the heat increasing to a sufficient level to get me satisfied enough to leap straight to the exercises.

 

Please advise?

[Earl Grey]

Somebody please elaborate on the warm-ups and how their importance may or not fluctuate with time.

 

To be safe I generally do the full ten minutes but sometimes I am so desperate and have so little time that I skip it. How will this influence the progress?

 

I sometimes abandon the warm-up when I feel the heat increasing to a sufficient level to get me satisfied enough to leap straight to the exercises.

 

Please advise?

 

I recall reading that the warm-ups weren't necessary if you have experience, and as far as I understand, they were just that: warm-ups to prepare you for Flying Phoenix Qigong. Those movements help you familiarize your body with the movements you'll do with the sequences eventually, and so you don't need the warm-ups once you get to the main forms. It's somewhere on this thread, but someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. 

[ridingtheox]

i am now at day 23  the last days doing long form 2x daily,  usually one of those is mirror image.

 

Warm ups ... are reallyimportant for beginners,  but skipping them occasionally is not nearly as important as NOT having time then to do your chosen FP meditations.   It is quite important to do the breath percentages.   Again there are exceptions,  sometimes when i am just working on the forms, revewing them,  refreshing them,  watching and imitating Sifu on dvd or now sometimes on line,  I skip them.  And yet feel as if I had all the benefits of a more formal practice.

 

If you have a chronic condition healing may come slowly.   On the other hand a crisis may well, as noted by tao stillness, respond to a very intense practice regimen in one session  or one day etc.

 

Note that i consider other qi gong and TCC practice as a part of my health program  (ba duan jin, wu xing, and some silk reeling).

 

Peace  for  all  sentient beings

Edited November 23, 2016 by ridingtheox

[zen-bear]

Happy Thanksgiving to all FP Practitioners on this side of the ponds:

 

I just got back from from a trip to the east coast, including a week training in Tai Chi Chuan with the wonderful GM William C.C. Chen, and will respond to a number of interesting comments and questions posted over the past 2 weeks.

 

But first I wanted to share some interesting feedback I got from attendees of an FP Qigong workshop I gave in New York City last Sunday the 13th--on very short notice. We only posted notices for it 6 days before on the Nov. 6.  At any rate, we had a nice turn out--and greetings again to Dr. Emil Mondoa who came all the way up from Delaware with his wife for a 4-hour workshop.

 

I used the Tao Tan Pai system's  Power Yoga as a warm-up, even though that practice in and of itself is very powerful and serious Nei Kung.  In the first 30 minutes, I led the class in the first 4 standing exercises of the TTP-31 followed by Meditation No. 16 which is 5 breath retentions seated with legs extended forward.  This constitutes what Tao Tan Pai practitioners know as the "Short Form Nei Kung" or the "Power Yoga".  Then we covered all the exercises on Volumes 1 and 2 over the course of the next 2 hours.

 

Quite unexpected was the feedback after the first hour of FP Qigong practice.  After we did all the basic standing meditations of Vol.1 and the first 3 seated warmup mediations from Vol.2:  the universal comment from all the women (7 out of 10), who commented that after one hour of the Flying Phoenix Qigong they felt completely "cleansed and cleared" of the depression, pall, anxiety, anger, and worry from the election 5 days earler.   One woman, the host of the workshop, said that her clouded vision had cleared up and that she didn't even realize that her vision had clouded over as a result taking the results of the election so hard.  The feedback showed me how hard-hit many people have been by the election, especially women and also how severe its spiritual fallout has been for many.
 

At any rate, that Sunday workshop's feedback told me to share this piece of holistic health and wellness advice:  if anyone is feeling anxious, blue, vexed, oppressed, distressed, or out of sorts because of the election, make the time--take 35-45 minutes or more--and go through all the standing meditations on Volume 1 of my DVD series, and do at least the first 4 seated meditations of Vol.2 . Practicing that minimum amount will rinse off the psychic fall-out from the election.

 

For experienced FP practitioners, if you do two rounds of the Long Form Standing Meditation (Vol.4) back to back, that would be equivalent to a super-wash, rinse and polish of your spirit in the material.

 

When it comes to self-exorcising psychic fall-out, Flying Phoenix Qigong is a most reliable method.  For those who haven't practiced FP Qigong to that degree of concentration, just try it as an experiment.  But you have to cross the threshold of about 25 to 35 minutes of continuous practice of any of the Flying Phoenix exercises in any order or combination for the FP Healing energy to manifest.

 

Sifu Terry Dunn

 

 

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Edited November 24, 2016 by zen-bear

[zen-bear]

What is golden is the gift that Eric has which allows us to become aware of which method might be better suited for us on an individual basis.

Tonight I had a super helpful reading with him for a sudden health issue that my medical doctor had no clue about. Sudden high blood pressure and even more frequent urination than usual. From working with Eric in the past I had a sense that he would trace the symptoms to the result of a recent change in diet for the worse. And that was it. But it was amazing how he tied the symptoms from  the processed food creating toxins in the lymphatic system to this aggravating vata condition which pushed down to the prostate and liver being inflamed and the toxins reaching the heart thru the bloodstream as the heart was working to rid itself of the toxins from  the lymph system and this creates the high blood pressure. There was more to it that he saw but this will suffice as an overview of his gift. He also confirmed that the protein powder that I recently switched to, although one of the best on the market, cannot be digested well by my system so it too contributes to the toxins as undigested food always will. His testing then confirmed that my previous brand protein powder which I need as a vegetarian was the right one for me. He also saw that the herbal formula I recently began taking for my weak liver is actually so powerful that it is cleansing the toxins from the lymphatic system doing so in such a strong manner that it contributes to the increase in urination. So he recommended a different formula for the liver which will have milder effects and not increase urination. Now what MD is going to come up with all of that? I knew I was not in the right hands when earlier this week my MD thought my sudden rise in blood pressure might be due to stress. He never asked me if I was doing anything different in any area of my life. Meaning he did not ask about eating habits.

Hi Steve,

I'm glad to hear that Eric Isen was able to read to the root of your recent problem.  Since you first introduced him to me and to this thread and I read deeply into his detailed readings of each Flying Phoenix exercise and the FP system as a whole, verifying that he is both gifted and annointed to his type of work, I have been recommending his services to people I know far and wide--beyond those practicing FP Qigong.  I can't thank you enough for bringing Eric into your discussion of FP Qigong.

 

Eric's work is at a high level and can serve as an essential, sometimes life-saving, supplement to institutional healthcare.  That your doctor never asked you about change of diet is a symptom of the fact that medical schools still don't teach nutrition to any practical extent.  Sadly, that's been the fact of medical education in the U.S. throughout its history.  Why?  Because outside of traumatic physical injuries (from football tackles, dark alley muggings, car accidents,  falls off tall bldins, gunshot, knifing, etc.)  49% of disease are caused by bad diet, and 49% are caused by stress.

 

I'm very glad that you got that blood pressure scare sorted out.

 

Happy Thanksgiving.

 

Sifu Terry

Edited November 25, 2016 by zen-bear

[zen-bear]

I do not know if it's only me but for me golden pheonix the way Grandmaster shows and explains (stress free release form especially) gives genuine effects.

Hello SoH,

 

Golden Mantis is a geniune system in under the Ehrmeishan White Tiger tradtion, but it is not as broad nor as expansive (vast) a system as either SYG or FP Qigong.  Golden Mantis of course has genuine effects and health value.  Otherwise it wouldn't exist.

 

Best Regards,

 

Sifu Terry Dunn

Edited November 25, 2016 by zen-bear