Vipassana Retreat

[doc benway]

Anyone have an opinion on the value of attending a Vipassana retreat?

I'm thinking of doing it. My primary practice is Daoist meditation but I feel that an intensive retreat experience might be beneficial even if I don't choose to focus on Vipassana practice long term.

Any advice?

[goldisheavy]

Anyone have an opinion on the value of attending a Vipassana retreat?

I'm thinking of doing it. My primary practice is Daoist meditation but I feel that an intensive retreat experience might be beneficial even if I don't choose to focus on Vipassana practice long term.

Any advice?

 

I haven't been to a retreat, but I think it's a good idea. First, no one knows what you're practicing. You can listen to Vipassana instructions, if any, and just proceed with your Daoist meditation. Is it so terribly bad and wrong? I don't think so. Secondly, I think Vipassana is fine as is.

 

And it would be cool if you could share your experiences after you came back.

 

So how does this work for you? Are you married? If yes, do you bring your wife along or what does she say about that?

[C T]

Anyone have an opinion on the value of attending a Vipassana retreat?

I'm thinking of doing it. My primary practice is Daoist meditation but I feel that an intensive retreat experience might be beneficial even if I don't choose to focus on Vipassana practice long term.

Any advice?

Back in 96, i took a year off work and volunteered my services at a Buddhist retreat centre, where in

exchange i got to attend all the retreats that were held there that year. Some were of very short durations,

like a weekend for example, while others lasted anything between a week to 10 days. It was a great

experience, a year well spent. Met loads of teachers, each with their own style - some taught well, while

others were only there to gain some teaching experience. This i think ought to be your main consideration

Steve, before you decide on which one to go for - find out the teacher's background first, otherwise you

may leave the retreat feeling as if you could have taught the teacher some...

[doc benway]

 

 

So how does this work for you? Are you married? If yes, do you bring your wife along or what does she say about that?

Married with kids (they're old enough to be pretty self-sufficient). My wife wouldn't love the idea of me being away for 10 days and it's not her thing. I feel the calling of a period of silence and contemplation - very tough to do in my daily life.

 

Back in 96, i took a year off work and volunteered my services at a Buddhist retreat centre, where in

exchange i got to attend all the retreats that were held there that year. Some were of very short durations,

like a weekend for example, while others lasted anything between a week to 10 days. It was a great

experience, a year well spent. Met loads of teachers, each with their own style - some taught well, while

others were only there to gain some teaching experience. This i think ought to be your main consideration

Steve, before you decide on which one to go for - find out the teacher's background first, otherwise you

may leave the retreat feeling as if you could have taught the teacher some...

Thanks for those perspectives. My main interest is the silent retreat experience. Whether the teachers have something to offer or not doesn't concern me as much, although I would wager that I can learn something from just about anyone in a position of guiding at a retreat, provided I can simply be open enough. That alone would be a valuable lesson, I think.

[Pero]

You can listen to Vipassana instructions, if any, and just proceed with your Daoist meditation. Is it so terribly bad and wrong? I don't think so.

 

Maybe, but that would be kind of dumb.

[C T]

 

Thanks for those perspectives. My main interest is the silent retreat experience. Whether the teachers have something to offer or not doesn't concern me as much, although I would wager that I can learn something from just about anyone in a position of guiding at a retreat, provided I can simply be open enough. That alone would be a valuable lesson, I think.

Fair enough. But there will be periods where retreatants are given time to ask questions, and you could most

certainly do with a teacher who would be able to skillfully address them, especially if you start pondering about

dependent origination, for example..

[forestofclarity]

Is this a Goenka retreat?

 

If so, its a lot of hard work, but you'll get some good concentration going. They tend to have a narrow view of things, but they tend to be good people. A Goenka retreat was my 1st retreat.

 

 

Anyone have an opinion on the value of attending a Vipassana retreat?

I'm thinking of doing it. My primary practice is Daoist meditation but I feel that an intensive retreat experience might be beneficial even if I don't choose to focus on Vipassana practice long term.

Any advice?

[doc benway]

Is this a Goenka retreat?

 

If so, its a lot of hard work, but you'll get some good concentration going. They tend to have a narrow view of things, but they tend to be good people. A Goenka retreat was my 1st retreat.

That's what I was looking at.

 

Fair enough. But there will be periods where retreatants are given time to ask questions, and you could most

certainly do with a teacher who would be able to skillfully address them, especially if you start pondering about

dependent origination, for example..

Touche!

[goldisheavy]

Is retreat cheaper than a vacation getaway of the same duration? I think the biggest thing there is what will the wife think, right? For example, if you go for a week in Hawaii, alone, your wife might wonder "what the fuck is going on here???" How do you explain this to her? On the other hand, if it says "retreat" right on the invoice, that will raise fewer questions. However, as far as simply getting away from home for some alone time, I don't see how formal retreats have anything superior on the offer compared to other options. For example, if you go to a camping ground and set up a tent for a week, that's easy and cheap. There are other people there, but no one is going to care if you meditate in your tent, or if you meditate in the forest and no one will care about the particular type of meditation you do. And depending on which camp ground you choose, other people may not even be all that close to you.

 

So picking a formal retreat vs. simply getting away has only two advantages I can think of:

 

1. explains things to your wife/husband.

 

2. has a teacher there.

 

Number 2 is pretty worthless, unless it's a 1 on 1 with some Buddha-level teacher. I can guarantee you that I can tell you everything any retreat teacher will tell you. Maybe even better. And I am almost certain that you, Steve, will know almost as much, if not more, than any teacher on any retreat. If I am wrong, I would like to know, in precise language, what is it anyone learned from a retreat teacher that they didn't know before.

 

So it seems like number 1 is the only issue left to consider.

 

In my day, I have plenty of time to do whatever I want. My wife also meditates and would understand if I wanted to meditate any amount. So I wouldn't have to go anywhere. My only limitation is my own intention and not anything physical in my environment. This is why I don't go on a retreat. I know if I was serious, I could do a retreat right in my own home.

 

---

 

I just thought of one other concern. If you get into a weird state of mind, it might be good to have a friend there, like a babysitter. Kind of like drug sitters. In this sense retreat might be better, because it might come with a sitter. But if you have a friend to go with, that concern is eliminated. You can take turns with your friend between diving deep and babysitting. Also, not everyone cares about such things. Some people will be OK with whatever happens and will not want/need a sitter there for extra safety/comfort.

Edited December 20, 2009 by goldisheavy

[doc benway]

Is retreat cheaper than a vacation getaway of the same duration? I think the biggest thing there is what will the wife think, right? For example, if you go for a week in Hawaii, alone, your wife might wonder "what the fuck is going on here???" How do you explain this to her? On the other hand, if it says "retreat" right on the invoice, that will raise fewer questions. However, as far as simply getting away from home for some alone time, I don't see how formal retreats have anything superior on the offer compared to other options. For example, if you go to a camping ground and set up a tent for a week, that's easy and cheap. There are other people there, but no one is going to care if you meditate in your tent, or if you meditate in the forest and no one will care about the particular type of meditation you do. And depending on which camp ground you choose, other people may not even be all that close to you.

 

So picking a formal retreat vs. simply getting away has only two advantages I can think of:

 

1. explains things to your wife/husband.

 

2. has a teacher there.

 

Number 2 is pretty worthless, unless it's a 1 on 1 with some Buddha-level teacher. I can guarantee you that I can tell you everything any retreat teacher will tell you. Maybe even better. And I am almost certain that you, Steve, will know almost as much, if not more, than any teacher on any retreat. If I am wrong, I would like to know, in precise language, what is it anyone learned from a retreat teacher that they didn't know before.

 

So it seems like number 1 is the only issue left to consider.

 

In my day, I have plenty of time to do whatever I want. My wife also meditates and would understand if I wanted to meditate any amount. So I wouldn't have to go anywhere. My only limitation is my own intention and not anything physical in my environment. This is why I don't go on a retreat. I know if I was serious, I could do a retreat right in my own home.

 

---

 

I just thought of one other concern. If you get into a weird state of mind, it might be good to have a friend there, like a babysitter. Kind of like drug sitters. In this sense retreat might be better, because it might come with a sitter. But if you have a friend to go with, that concern is eliminated. You can take turns with your friend between diving deep and babysitting. Also, not everyone cares about such things. Some people will be OK with whatever happens and will not want/need a sitter there for extra safety/comfort.

All good and true points, Gold. I appreciate your response and all others as well.

I've considered the meditation vacation option very seriously.

A few retreat advantages -

- free (Goenke Vipassana at least) or inexpensive (a place like Dharma Drum)

- structured - perhaps I would create my own structured retreat environment on a 'meditation vacation' but that would take planning and effort and may or may not come to fruition

- room and board with healthy environs and veggie meals - I could do this on my own with some effort

- fellow participants help to create an environment conducive to the cause and double as 'sitters'

- and as you say, the retreat receipt validates the purpose of the experience with the family

- there is no way I could carry this off at home - way too hectic and demanding lifestyle that is unlikely to change in the near future

[goldisheavy]

All good and true points, Gold. I appreciate your response and all others as well.

I've considered the meditation vacation option very seriously.

A few retreat advantages -

- free (Goenke Vipassana at least) or inexpensive (a place like Dharma Drum)

 

Maybe this shows how materialistic I can get, but this one point seals the advantage to me, together with the veggie meals. If it's that much cheaper, then there is no doubt it's worth it. I had no idea Goenka retreat was free. I thought there was at least a nominal cost. I think that point alone would seal the deal.

 

Back in my e-sangha days, I've heard mixed reviews from Goenka retreats. However, most complaints centered around the, what some people perceived to be, cult-like and hypnotic figure of Goenka himself. I haven't heard of any complaints as far as the community or meals or the environment go. Plus, many people just plain liked Goenka.

 

- and as you say, the retreat receipt validates the purpose of the experience with the family

 

This peace of mind is worth something.

 

- structured - perhaps I would create my own structured retreat environment on a 'meditation vacation' but that would take planning and effort and may or may not come to fruition

- room and board with healthy environs and veggie meals - I could do this on my own with some effort

- fellow participants help to create an environment conducive to the cause and double as 'sitters'

- there is no way I could carry this off at home - way too hectic and demanding lifestyle that is unlikely to change in the near future

 

A lot of this stuff is dependent on the level of interest, the firmness of resolve, and intent (three ways to say the same thing). If your level of interest is very high, there is little or no chance you'll get distracted and there is no need for a structured environment. On the other hand, if your level of interest is flagging, a structured environment will help some and may even boost your interest to the point where later on you could be in a retreat mindset no matter where you were.

 

For example, dream yoga. I know anyone who sleeps can practice dream yoga. So only the firmness of resolve is necessary for this practice. As far as formal walking, standing, sitting, lying down meditations go, I agree this might be a little awkward if your family is not already habituated to such things.

 

This is why I would never keep some things like meditation a secret. What if some day I want to meditate in front of my wife or friends? If I made sure to keep my spiritual life a secret, then I might be in an awkward situation later on. This is why all my family and friends know about such things, so that if I ever do them, there is no surprise.

Edited December 20, 2009 by goldisheavy

[Smile]

OK.........I've attended a Vipassana retreat. A very good way to learn how to meditate if you have trouble sitting for a long time. I went to the one in Massachusetts. A very good center and was lucky enough to be alone in the room. Here are some pointers to make it easy as can possibly be:

1. Take your own cushions from home with you.

2. Take all your bed linens from home with you.

3. Take an alarm that can vibrate.

4. No reading materials or food brought from home allowed.

5. No other practices other then the method taught allowed.

6. When they tell you have an option to meditate some period of time in your own room instead the main hall, do not do that and stick with the main hall.

7. Follow all the instructions to the letter. You may want to relax and just let go, but stick to following the method. Do not slack off.

8. Do not move during meditation or open your eyes. If you do, your pain will be greater. If you don't think you won't feel pain, hahahahahahahahahah.... too funny.

9. Do not talk to anyone, and try not to ask any questions to the teacher during short meetings you have unless you don't understand the technique. The teachers are there to make sure to teach you the technique properly, not to tak about your experiences, thoughts, feelings etc. Also teachers may change every retreat or so. Some are good and some are ok. Doesn't really matter. They are just there to make sure you learn the method.

10. The best way to survive the 11 hours a day of meditation is to take 5 minute brakes every 1-2 hours of meditation. Drink lots of water. Walk a lot after they feed you to stretch your legs.

11. Make sure you mediate at 4 in the morning in the main hall. Don't try to do it in your own room.

12. Give them a donation at the end as your donations keep the center operational.

 

Hope this helps. If you go, you will never forget this.

[Sarnyn]

OK.........I've attended a Vipassana retreat. A very good way to learn how to meditate if you have trouble sitting for a long time. I went to the one in Massachusetts. A very good center and was lucky enough to be alone in the room. Here are some pointers to make it easy as can possibly be:

1. Take your own cushions from home with you.

2. Take all your bed linens from home with you.

3. Take an alarm that can vibrate.

4. No reading materials or food brought from home allowed.

5. No other practices other then the method taught allowed.

6. When they tell you have an option to meditate some period of time in your own room instead the main hall, do not do that and stick with the main hall.

7. Follow all the instructions to the letter. You may want to relax and just let go, but stick to following the method. Do not slack off.

8. Do not move during meditation or open your eyes. If you do, your pain will be greater. If you don't think you won't feel pain, hahahahahahahahahah.... too funny.

9. Do not talk to anyone, and try not to ask any questions to the teacher during short meetings you have unless you don't understand the technique. The teachers are there to make sure to teach you the technique properly, not to tak about your experiences, thoughts, feelings etc. Also teachers may change every retreat or so. Some are good and some are ok. Doesn't really matter. They are just there to make sure you learn the method.

10. The best way to survive the 11 hours a day of meditation is to take 5 minute brakes every 1-2 hours of meditation. Drink lots of water. Walk a lot after they feed you to stretch your legs.

11. Make sure you mediate at 4 in the morning in the main hall. Don't try to do it in your own room.

12. Give them a donation at the end as your donations keep the center operational.

 

Hope this helps. If you go, you will never forget this.

That sounds like one of Goenkas retreats. I've been to a couple.

 

Great advice btw! All true. :werd: on the cushions. Bring enough to be comfy, bring a shawl or some kind of body wrap that you can wear in the hall. I found I was able to meditate just fine in my own quarters, though it took a lot of will. The only bad part about that was the snoring. If you go to a retreat, you will get put in a room next to somebody who snores. LOUDLY. Its not a big deal while you you are supposed to sleep because you will be exhausted and will sleep through it. But for some reason that same person who snores will always be that person who sleeps through all the personal meditation hours, making it difficult to meditate in your own room.

 

Personally I woke up half an hour early every day so that I could stretch and take a shower before everybody else got up. I felt like it is easier to maintain the precepts the less contact you have with others. Stretching thoroughly before each group meditation will help you a lot.

[SAMANTABHADRA]

Sounds like a great idea, Steve. I'm heading down to South America for an indefinite period in a couple of weeks, and I plan on attending a Goenka 10-day vipassana retreat in Buenos Aires in March. I think the atmosphere should ideally push you to practice with more ease and resolve. Vegetarian food is a plus, too. Free room and board for 10 days, and getting closer to wisdom. Win-win

[Smile]

Bring enough to be comfy, bring a shawl or some kind of body wrap that you can wear in the hall.

Yes forgot about that. Definitely bring a shawl. I was there during Christmas and the New Year's and it was really cold in the hall especially in the morning. The blanket I got from the center and slept with had poison Ivy on it and by the end of the first day I was observing sensations related to my poison ivy all over my body. It was all gone by the end of day 5. Great experience and memories!

[forestofclarity]

I might also suggest checking out Bhante G's monastary:

 

Bhavana Society

 

Great center, good food, all on dana. Also, good teachers. Classic mindfulness practice, lucidly explained.

 

The drawbacks about Goenka tend to be:

 

1. A militant mindset. This can be good, depending on who you are. Some people call it Buddhist boot camp.

 

2. A narrow view of dharma. This is the way, the only way, and the best way. Don't think about anything else.

 

3. Lack of personal experience. The teachers all follow a script, and the teachings are all through video. There's no personalizing the message.