Qi is NOT Energy

[Taomeow]

Qi is energy like bike is transportation. If you're peddling it is...if you're not it isn't.

 

p.s. peddle.

Your qi moves your blood... it might move it vigorously enough to inspire you to ride a bicycle, but if it doesn't move your blood you won't move the bicycle. It's true you use energy (li, muscle force) to pedal a bicycle. Qi, however, is not li, as any good taiji teacher won't fail to mention to any decent student, along with the mantra of the art:

 

use qi, not li.

 

When you use li, you pant... when you use qi, you pattern. A child doesn't strain to grow... a bodybuilder does. In the first case, qi is used, in the second, energy. Qi is not energy.

[宁]

>What is the Unchanging?[/b]

 

all the realm of the Xiantian which contains many things such as Ling, Zhen, Qi, Shen, Benwo....

 

 

in the quoted discussion above, i forgot to ask the 'guest', what is Benwo?

anybody has any idea?

durchrod? Taomeow? Song Yongdao? YaMu? Exorcist? Anybody?

[Mokona]

Has anyone here felt qi like static or a fuzzy feeling on the skin? Like a super quick vibration or like when you hyperventalate. Anyway, that is one of the ways I have felt it, but It isn't easy to find a few hours to practice breathing in a totally quiet and non-distracting enviroment.

[Cueball]

YES! Developed INTENT and Qi combined WILL feedback on each other increasing the other. I kinda simplified the previous statement as I have probably written this before. But also required, in addition to qi time & effort cultivation and developed INTENT is the practice of Virtue, alignment with Spirit, and calmness.

 

That makes a whole lot of sense to me.

 

 

I missed your post. To me, it's like this: think about making love. When we make love, we make love with everything that we are, we know and we can. It should be the same with practice.

I say should, because it's not what it happens... one big error is the 'mind over matter' attitude of most of the cultivators, which gives them all the necessary arguments for keeping things mostly intelectual.

What i mean by that, is that having understanding is different than having information.

Understanding - you embody knowledge, it's not limited to your brain and mind.

It's body knowledge, and this definition is, i think, mostly related to cultivators of a certain (refined if you wish) quality.

 

So, this (presence or lack of) understanding is what you bring into play when cultivating. And it makes a huge difference.

 

Yes, the mind over matter attitude is a bit of a hang up I agree. I like your point about doing it with everything. With regards to qi, sometimes I've felt the (commonly taught) emphasis is more on matter over mind, which can be a similar problem. Personally, I find it really interesting how information gets translated into understanding, and also vice versa.

Edited April 27, 2010 by Cueball

[宁]

bump

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

Qi IS Energy.. behaving as intended by Consciousness. and.. That is Consciousness as the Undifferentiated Whole, AND as the Independently Functioning Versions of itself, we/us/Life.. Qi IS Energy, and it seems that a lot of people want to confine it to a particular Culture's beliefs about it.. experience it beyond the limitations of Culture..

 

Be well..

[3bob]

Greetings..

 

Qi IS Energy.. behaving as intended by Consciousness. and.. That is Consciousness as the Undifferentiated Whole, AND as the Independently Functioning Versions of itself, we/us/Life.. Qi IS Energy, and it seems that a lot of people want to confine it to a particular Culture's beliefs about it.. experience it beyond the limitations of Culture..

 

Be well..

 

Ok TzuJanLi and agreed,

Btw, it was somewhat strange to me to hear you say in another string that you could not tell us certain things and then soon there-after you apparently proceeded to beat around the bush about those certain things?

 

Om Na Ma Si Va Ya

Edited June 29, 2010 by 3bob

[Brian]

..

[Old Man Contradiction]

Qi is breath. Qi is also oxygen. Qi(breath and O2) is vital to health and the martial arts, because oxygen is vital to health (ex. it's role in removing free radicals and the citric acid cycle), and because the intercostals, transverse abdominis, diaphgram, etc.. are so important in creating power. The belief in a mystical energy is unneeded and unprovable at this point in time, regardless of whether it is true or not.

[Martial Development]

If every artist was required to agree on the definition of their craft before proceeding, then we would have no art in this world.

[voidisyinyang]

Chunyi Lin Hello my dear friends! Everything starts with a single thought and is created by the consciousness. Since everything is a product of consciousness and everything is a form of energy, we can use our consciousness to transform any form of energy.

 

http://www.facebook.com/SpringForestQigong

[Spectrum]

Practice releasing Awareness of Chi before sleep

 

after sleep you might wake as a sapling the meridian movement memorizes intent with water remembering it's course, when practicing some Taoist classical forms that follow a

natural course windows of opportunites where natural stillness as movement take the course is a pleasuree, to the follower of the way. Each path in the forest offers new insights into Nature.

Edited June 28, 2010 by Spectrum

[宁]

Qi is steam, Qi is smoke

 

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

Btw, it was somewhat strange to me to hear you say in another string that you could not tell us certain things and then soon there-after you apparently proceeded to beat around the bush about those certain things?

Could you be more clear? I do not wish to be misunderstood.. "Oh Lord, Please don't let me be misunderstood", Eric Burdon and The Animals, circa 1967.. (google it)

 

Be well..

[Tao99]

Edited July 9, 2010 by Tao99

[三江源]

Nice definition from Gilles Marin :

 

Chi is not neutral. Chi is the energy carrying the deliberate intent to promote life and existence. It is a power that comes with an intention. It is the breath of creation.

 

The classical chinese character for chi is air/vapor/breath.. the second is 'rice' or 'essence'. The rice ideograph symbolizes the presence of the life force, the energy and the information that brings life. Chi is often translated as 'the breath of god'. Communist ideology simplified the character of Chi by removing the 'spark of life contained in a single grain of rice" ideograph, keeping only the 'flow of life' ideograph.. thereby eliminating any spiritual connection with the concept of chi, and translating it as neutral and to do purely with energy and breath.

[Starjumper]

I've been contemplating the information carrying aspect of chi. When I think about chi, which is hardly ever, I think of it as a sort of form of 'raw' energy. That is, energy without much information other than it's frequency. All electromagnetic (broadcasted) energy must have a frequency (as opposed to stored energy, as in a battery).

 

This frequency is the most basic of oscillations and therefore carries no real information except for it's rate of vibration.

 

But then there are other things like intent and mind reading. For example if someone thrusts or swings a sword at you it is possible to know where it is being aimed at and dodge it while you are blindfolded. This is picking up on the intent of the other person (if they do it without intent it isn't possible, or at least it's much more difficult) This is different than sending chi out the sword, which canthen be felt as chi. Also, there is mind reading and telepathy.

 

Previously I had thought of these psychic things as not being chi, but I suppose that chi could be the carrier of the information and that it is highly modulated so that it can carry complex information.

 

_______________

 

 

Also, the idea that chi is air or breath is a carryover of past, more ignorant times, it is incorrect. However, there is chi IN the air, or the air space.

Edited June 29, 2010 by Starjumper7

[gendao]

But then there are other things like intent and mind reading. For example if someone thrusts or swings a sword at you it is possible to know where it is being aimed at and dodge it while you are blindfolded. This is picking up on the intent of the other person (if they do it without intent it isn't possible, or at least it's much more difficult) This is different than sending chi out the sword, which canthen be felt as chi. Also, there is mind reading and telepathy.

I think you may be actually sensing yi, not qi, there.

 

I think you could throw a strike with varying amounts of both yi or qi. Although since yi leads qi, I think throwing one with a lot of qi qould require a lot of yi too.

 

I dunno. I can definitely throw a non-telegraphing punch with little yi. However, it may not contain much qi, either! ...I dunno?!

[Vanir Thunder Dojo Tan]

[Old Man Contradiction]

I don't know really what Qi is, and it's best that I keep it that way.

 

Although, pragmatically I'll understand Qi as oxygen and the breath. No other questions really need to be asked right now.

[Baguakid]

I'm seeing Qi as two main types as it concerns us and the human body.

 

1. The internal Qi that is generated by the body. This qi is best represented by the Chinese character Qi 氣. This character depicts how Qi is created rather than what it is. The combination of Breath and Food creates Qi used in our daily life. I perfect example of this (outside the human body) is a steam engine. Coals (our kidneys) provide flame to burn wood (consumed food). The wood burns in combination with air to produce heat over water to produce steam. Steam pushes the pistons to move the train. Of course the body is more complex but that's the jest of it. Also, use a gas engine. A gas engine can run rich (too much gas/food), or lean (too much air) and the body is the same. Our metabolism (governed by our kidneys (coals))decreases with age. We therefore "accumulate" food in our sluggish bodies. Breath sourced Qigong (an increase in breath) changes the rich running engine to more of a lean or just right engine. This in turn, if done correctly, also fires the coals and reverses the decline in metabolism.

 

So, is it really that important to put a definition to Qi or is it more important to understand how Qi is generated and the fact that the body needs Qi? Pure, refined Qi just feels good and promotes radiant health.

 

 

2. The universal Qi that permeates everything.

 

I have no analogy for this one. Only to say that in my case, proper body alignment and mind intent will bring this qi into the body. And, the effect seems similar to the one above but it is different in that this method will also remove dirty Qi. Ya Mu I think has a great handle on this one.

 

Ya Mu wrote:

 

What we have found is that certain people have an innate ability to "see" sick energy and inside of people's bodies but that this ability does not manifest until they raise their energy body vibrationals.

 

This is completely consistant with my experiences as well.

[Starjumper]

I think you may be actually sensing yi, not qi, there.

Yes, I said I could feel their intent, and yi is intent. BUT intent leading chi is usually in reference to the way it works in your own body. What I was getting at is that if you can read another person's intent in a psychic manner this requires the transmittance of information through the air, and the only way that information can be transmitted through the air is with some kind of electromagnetic radiation, which in the case of sight is visible light. Sensing with eyes closed means the transmission is using some part of the electromagnetic spectrum other than visible light.

 

I was thinking that if it is an energy that can be sensed in this manner then it is some form of chi, but it is different than projected chi, which you can feel in a tactile manner. The sensing of intent is not tactile but is psychic.

 

So this gets back to the same old question: how does picking up psychic information and telepathy work? It may be another part of the chi spectrum with much information embedded.

[宁]

Some questions for the ones more inclined to contemplate inner alchemy theory:

 

- we know two main types of Qi: pre-heaven and post-heaven (XianTien and HouTien)

- this is also the case with Yuan Qi, it can be either pre-heaven or post-heaven

 

Q1: What is the difference between pre-heaven Yuan Qi and post-heaven Yuan Qi?

Q2: What is the principle that permits the turning (Bianhua) of post-heaven Yuan Qi to pre-heaven Yuan Qi?

 

These are mysteries of the youthful longevity path.

Many practitioners can turn post-heaven Qi into post-heaven Yuan Qi, thereby sparing the FINITE resources of pre-heaven Yuan Qi.

The resources of pre-heaven Yuan Qi are said to be the ones that account for extended/prolongued life and youthfulness.

 

So, actually, what are the chanses of finding a decent answer on a daoist forum mostly interested in sex, masturbation and buddhist circular logic? omg...

Edited June 30, 2010 by Little1

[三江源]

Some questions for the ones more inclined to contemplate inner alchemy theory:

 

- we know two main types of Qi: pre-heaven and post-heaven (XianTien and HouTien)

- this is also the case with Yuan Qi, it can be either pre-heaven or post-heaven

 

Q1: What is the difference between pre-heaven Yuan Qi and post-heaven Yuan Qi?

Q2: What is the principle that permits the turning (Bianhua) of post-heaven Yuan Qi to pre-heaven Yuan Qi?

 

These are mysteries of the youthful longevity path.

Many practitioners can turn post-heaven Qi into post-heaven Yuan Qi, thereby sparing the FINITE resources of pre-heaven Yuan Qi.

The resources of pre-heaven Yuan Qi are said to be the ones that account for extended/prolongued life and youthfulness.

 

So, actually, what are the chanses of finding a decent answer on a daoist forum mostly interested in sex, masturbation and buddhist circular logic? omg...

 

 

q1 is interesting.. do you experience a difference ?

 

I think they are the same, but yuan qi that one has 'reclaimed' or processed/refined ... how to say... hmmm... it has been through your system, maybe there is some imprint of you within it, some flavour, some hue that you can experience more acutely because it went through your own refinery. But .. I dont know.

 

To go back a bit : my sense of it is that the difference between pre heaven yuan qi and post heaven yuan qi is that there is simply MORE primordial, it's pure unadulterated. Early heaven is half and half, ie half of early heaven resides within duality, and later heaven is only fractionally yuan qi. But the yuan qi itself is the same. Like gold running through rock.

[三江源]

I've been contemplating the information carrying aspect of chi. When I think about chi, which is hardly ever, I think of it as a sort of form of 'raw' energy. That is, energy without much information other than it's frequency. All electromagnetic (broadcasted) energy must have a frequency (as opposed to stored energy, as in a battery).

 

This frequency is the most basic of oscillations and therefore carries no real information except for it's rate of vibration.

 

But then there are other things like intent and mind reading. For example if someone thrusts or swings a sword at you it is possible to know where it is being aimed at and dodge it while you are blindfolded. This is picking up on the intent of the other person (if they do it without intent it isn't possible, or at least it's much more difficult) This is different than sending chi out the sword, which canthen be felt as chi. Also, there is mind reading and telepathy.

 

Previously I had thought of these psychic things as not being chi, but I suppose that chi could be the carrier of the information and that it is highly modulated so that it can carry complex information.

 

_______________

 

 

Also, the idea that chi is air or breath is a carryover of past, more ignorant times, it is incorrect. However, there is chi IN the air, or the air space.

 

 

Revelation comes from being filled with divinity.... if one is filled with chi, the dulling of the senses is blown away... telepathic communication is our natural way I think, but we are fogged by life such as it is.

Meditating one night in my living room in the dark, I felt a line of energy running round the parameter of the room, and sensed it as kind of infra red. Turned out it was a mouse in the skirtingboard. Hunters used to sense their prey, as well as call them. Much we have lost, can be regained as we clear ourselves out of the way. Less self, more receptivity. You know this already of course!