The Tao and Baptism (christian)

[Birch]

Or do a little searching on baptism and you might find it has more to do with Daoism than you might think at first. Apparently they used to be a little more hardcore with their baptisms and certainly didn't do it to anyone except consenting adults...

 

Think of the Christmas FIR TREE in the living room;-)

 

So yeah, while it may be fully symbolic of your desire to escape your Mom's control/influence, it has nothing to do with the kid. Probably better to find another way to escape Mom's control. Or attempts at control. Which is what it is anyway, you don't have to give in.

 

I've found kindly standing up for myself the best. Leaving the area when necessary;-) It's been pretty hit and miss over the years however and I have sometimes reverted to snivelling mess. I hate it when that happens

[Guest paul walter]

THAT, and playing with ping-pong with your kid as the ball, just because you happen to change belief systems whenever it suits you doesn't make you a very responsible father...!

 

Dude, wake up.

The Christian religion maybe a bit silly but witchcraft and energy practices can be a nightmare!

It's MUCH safer for a baby to grow up in a Judeo-Christian belief system. He is well protected there, and this should be your main concern, if you are a responsible parent, which i very much doubt.

 

Or better yet, stop fighting and arguing on it, and LET HIM DECIDE.

 

 

None of this is really about religion/spirituality. It's about the old control freak mother and family/new-born baby thing--yawn. It happens a lot. When that bit is worked out then you can all give spiritual advice. But since it won't I don't hink it's good to pressure someone into doing what they are trying to get away from--giving in once again to a controlling, destructive influence. Involving your child in this is just carrying the abuse to the next generation, which Krazy would probably like to stop so he can get on with bringing up his child without too much stress or feeling like he initiated his child into a cult. Correct me if I'm wrong Krazy. Paul.

[krazykoyote]

Nail right on the head there Paul, I don't want my son to have to do the spiritual bouncing I have for 30 years because I think differently, and have questions that one religion can't answer. If he can have the freedom to choose and decide for himself, that is all I really want for him.

[Guest paul walter]

Nail right on the head there Paul, I don't want my son to have to do the spiritual bouncing I have for 30 years because I think differently, and have questions that one religion can't answer. If he can have the freedom to choose and decide for himself, that is all I really want for him.

 

 

 

You also are in an enviable position if you can muster the humility to look at it this way--you have a master embryonic breather, someone with the suppleness and strength of an old tai chi master and someone who has the clarity of mind and non-attatchment of a master meditator. How do we nurture this and not trick ourselves that we know better than biology?). So 'real' taoist stuff is right on the money for child-rearing. Anything close to a taoist sort of view of the world will give someone the strength of mind to not be overly influenced by fashion and to protect themselves from the bad vibes all around.

Respect for the child is of course paramount, but are you prepared to learn what we were all made to forget from having roles such as 'child', 'teenager' 'adult' forced upon us? It is a great secret of 'parenthood' that it is another chance to nurture what was lost in ourselves, to learn how not to give it up yet again and to let another life benefit from what we learnt (or have partly learnt ) the hard way. It's a tall order being a parent but respect for life/the child should answer many hard 'social' questions and point one in the right direction (even if that way is the oppossite to the norm). Good going, Paul.

Edited February 19, 2010 by paul walter

[altiora]

My mom is very much the fanatical christian to the point that she has to work in the church, then gossips about all the problems and people in it. But that is another issue.

 

I appreciate all the different views and input on this topic, I know I do not want to just go along with it, just to make her happy, she needs to learn that she can't run my familys life, and my new wife is very good at keeping me focused, but I still need to find the right approach. It has been ten years since the issue with Wicca, and since I went back to christianity for a time, but have found the path that I have been on always (Tao... or is that redundant?) and I want my son to have the freedom of choice, and not have the guilt that seems to prevail from the christian path.

 

Any advice from those raising their kids in the Tao or another path?

 

Thanks

 

 

Well I have to be honest --I've refrained from commenting until now -- but you seem to be engaged in the "tug of war" over the child, as much as your mother is. And to be really honest, I don't think a lot of this "tell her to butt out or else" advice you've been getting helps at all: it seems to reveal people who haven't a clue how family relationships work, and if you follow you're going to have a very unhappy family.

 

There are two issues here:

 

(1) whether the child should be baptised

(2) what spiritual upbringing should the child have.

 

Now they are NOT necessarily linked.

 

I was baptised an Anglican as a child. I no longer adhere to the Anglican faith, but baptism did give me two things (Anglican baptism is pretty much the same as Catholic). First, a sense of community: should I ever feel I need to, the Anglican church is there for me to go as a member. I have a right to attend as a baptised person. Secondly, it created a new relationship between me and my godparents (who are my mothers' best friends). 32 years later, that relationship still continues and we keep in touch. The fact that I was baptised didn't prevent me from exploring other paths. It just ensured that the path of my family and ancestors was open to me should I every want to go down it.

 

And who knows your child might decide that the Catholic Church provides the path for him or her. If that is his or her choice, then you must accept it. Just as you wish you mother would accept your spiritual choices.

 

So given these possible benefits, and to keep your mother happy, I say what has your child to lose in being baptised? It also creates a ceremony that celebrates your child as well.

 

With respect to the upbringing, you don't need to send your child to mass or to sunday school etc. Although, if you are genuinely openminded, then you need to be let your child have the opportunity to attend if he or she wishes. Just as you'd no doubt let your child explore alterative faiths.

 

If I were you, I'd agree to the baptism but get your mother to understand that your child is to be raised as a secular person until he or she is ready to make the choice, and explore spirituality him or herself. That's not to say no exposure to religion, just that there is no attempt to "convert" one way or the other.

 

At the end of the day, it's your choice. But it's your choice "on behalf" of your child. It's not about control or about moulding your child's path in favour of your ego or you mother's ego.

Edited February 22, 2010 by altiora