Disturbing conclusion

[3bob]

Step by Step, Eddie Rabbit (click arrow)

 

http://new.music.yahoo.com/eddie-rabbitt/tracks/step-by-step--1506577

 

...and some of his other songs will play afterwards if you leave it at that player.

 

Edited February 26, 2010 by 3bob

[Guest paul walter]

I understand the need for a lot of you to engage with Non for whatever reasons of your own but the fact is he is vegan and his diet is WRONG and is affecting his behaviour/thinking. He also has big 'life' issues which he never talks about. I suggest leaving this thread alone from now on--there is nothing to be done about his situation online. Paul.

[Mal]

Too many absolutes and stereotyping can be problematic. People are individuals, approach them as such.

 

Stereotyping concepts can give you a general framework to work from and information you may not guess by yourself (i.e. the difference between what people say and what they want) If you are not happy with where you are a different perspective can certainly help you pick a tactic / work and angle i.e fake it till you make it.

 

But don't lock yourself into stereotypes and generalizations. Just be present in the now and you will feel the dynamic, the relationship, the connection. You can connect souls, or collect notches on the bedpost. Some behaviors favor one result over the other.

 

And yes, do your practices and forget all of this

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

I urged the bums to not feed non by continuing to respond to him and give advice that he then bitterly rejects. It's clear that he's pretty troubled, and to give him advice that you would give to someone who is healthier is useless, and he keeps acting out here by posting more and more disturbed posts (including threatening suicide). Best we all pull back and ignore him or at best, just wish him well. He's using all of us if we don't, and we're feeding his dysfunction. Please, stop the advice.

[Guest paul walter]

I urged the bums to not feed non by continuing to respond to him and give advice that he then bitterly rejects. It's clear that he's pretty troubled, and to give him advice that you would give to someone who is healthier is useless, and he keeps acting out here by posting more and more disturbed posts (including threatening suicide). Best we all pull back and ignore him or at best, just wish him well. He's using all of us if we don't, and we're feeding his dysfunction. Please, stop the advice.

 

 

What's interesting about all this is how a serious mental illness issue is treated as a personality issue. We live in an illusion now where the democratic ideal of "every man for himself" has reached monstrous proportions--there seems to be no understanding of how someone is NOT responsible for their behaviours at some stage in their downfall. Paul.

[gendao]

I understand the need for a lot of you to engage with Non for whatever reasons of your own but the fact is he is vegan and his diet is WRONG and is affecting his behaviour/thinking. He also has big 'life' issues which he never talks about. I suggest leaving this thread alone from now on--there is nothing to be done about his situation online. Paul.

I think Non has boxed himself into a no-win situation...but this inner conflict is nothing new and something that MANY post-Baby Boomer men have gone through.

 

In fact, just witness the mental and persona transformation of TUPAC - and how deeply it was influenced by real-life female feedback:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9myAkp28wT4

He went from a sensitive magnet school performing arts student...who falsely idea(o)lized women and wouldn't even UTTER the "B-word" - to a gangsta rapper who shouted BITCH with every other word!

 

And guess which version women actually liked better???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlvS_Uk5yJM

So, I DON'T think this is ALL in Non's head at all. It IS a very real phenomenom today. I don't think he's entirely crazy at all. He is just struggling with how to deal with it...in congruence with his own self-identity & definition of "morality."

Edited March 2, 2010 by vortex

[mYTHmAKER]

I understand the need for a lot of you to engage with Non for whatever reasons of your own but the fact is he is vegan and his diet is WRONG and is affecting his behaviour/thinking. He also has big 'life' issues which he never talks about. I suggest leaving this thread alone from now on--there is nothing to be done about his situation online. Paul.

 

Paul are you saying all vegan diets are wrong. BTW I am not a vegan so am not being defensive.

I agree that food - diet affects behavior/ thinking, however, one can be psychotic whether vegetarian, vegan or flesh eater.

One can also be healthy eating in any of these modes.

It is the junk, sugar , chemicals that causes psychosis.

I know I've been there.

[RyanO]

That Tupac video is very interesting.

[Mal]

[Dreamingawake]

What's interesting about all this is how a serious mental illness issue is treated as a personality issue. We live in an illusion now where the democratic ideal of "every man for himself" has reached monstrous proportions--there seems to be no understanding of how someone is NOT responsible for their behaviours at some stage in their downfall. Paul.

 

I can definitely understand what you mean. That said. . . Unless there is some external molevolent entity involved, or if your brain is physically damaged/malformed/whatever, every thought is a choice. If one chooses not to examine thier thoughts/choices or their concequences, then they risk delusion on par with the health of their choices. Whether it's as small as low self esteem or anger issues, or as large as thinking your a hotdog who has been kidnapped by the pope who happens to be reptillian, it's still cause and effect. Once you sink deep enough into the delusions you've created it can be very difficult to find your way out without help.

 

Non was just posting a couple weeks ago in the ormus thread about women honking and smiling at him. He also mentioned a group of girls hitting on him which he brushed off. Now he's here posting about how he has never had any positive interaction with any female ever. While I'm not a doctor, it seems to me that either he is desperate for attention or he is controlling his thoughts so poorly that he has become unstable. Without a professional to help him regain control it could be very difficult for him to get out of this maze of his own habits/thought/choices.

 

However, before any progress can be made, the doctor still has to get a patient to:

A. Realize there is a problem &

B. Take control of their thoughts/choices

 

 

I believe the reason psychological dysfunction tends to be percieved as a character flaw is because on some level people understand at least the basics of what I just said.

Again, I'm not a doctor nor am I trainig to become one. This is merely my experience and understanding so if you know better (or just think you might) please feel free to correct my thinking. I do hope non gets the help he needs. Life can be so much more enjoyable than his seems to be.

 

P.s. Please don't mind my grammar/spelling, I'm posting from my phone since I'm at work=P

[Guest paul walter]

Paul are you saying all vegan diets are wrong. BTW I am not a vegan so am not being defensive.

I agree that food - diet affects behavior/ thinking, however, one can be psychotic whether vegetarian, vegan or flesh eater.

One can also be healthy eating in any of these modes.

It is the junk, sugar , chemicals that causes psychosis.

I know I've been there.

 

 

I've been vegan (still am) for a couple of decades so have "seen it all" in myself and others unfortunately. No-the diet can be done proper but it takes a fair bit of knowledge. Non has also been smoking pot-unfortunately I've also seen the effects of this on vegans-one friend ended in the psych unit several times because of it. Not many know how diet effects them period, let alone a vegan one. Non has too little protein, too high carb, no veges judging from his contact with me. his fat intake is also low/wrong and this really sends you over the edge. That's roughly why Non can't 'learn' from others, why he thinks he is possessed--he is! but not by something outside of himself. He is prone to self-diagnosis and self-prescription--seen it all before. The panic of his situation/state of mind makes him buy Ormus as a miracle cure rather than buy organic veges or even a balanced supplement. It's hard for people to understand this situation since the effect of diet on the mind is not what people know about diet generally. Anyway, he hasn't contacted me again though he has on two seperate occassions without the needed follow through. This is also simply how it is in this situation--no integrity of thought or process. I only hope his suicide talk is self-pity and bluff. To those who have tried to reason with him--that was good of you. Paul

Edited March 2, 2010 by paul walter

[Guest paul walter]

I can definitely understand what you mean. That said. . . Unless there is some external molevolent entity involved, or if your brain is physically damaged/malformed/whatever, every thought is a choice. If one chooses not to examine thier thoughts/choices or their concequences, then they risk delusion on par with the health of their choices.Non was just posting a couple weeks ago in the ormus thread about women honking and smiling at him. He also mentioned a group of girls hitting on him which he brushed off. Now he's here posting about how he has never had any positive interaction with any female ever. While I'm not a doctor, it seems to me that either he is desperate for attention or he is controlling his thoughts so poorly that he has become unstable. Without a professional to help him regain control it could be very difficult for him to get out of this maze of his own habits/thought/choices.

 

 

Not getting the right essential fats can in fact give brain damage over time. You will have noticed that Nons' talk of being vegan is 'purity' based-based oin being better than the crap world around him. This thinking is what has split him in two-it is a reaction to a situation he hasn't faced, namely integrating himself with life. Fundamentalists of all stripes do this (see Richard Dawkins for a good example )and it takes them further from accepting the 'mess' of life/themselves. Yes he needs a "professional" who understands the psychology of his martyrdom, vegan and all. He won't be able to have a base for his 'ideas' about life until the diet and some self-searching is worked on and this is notoriously difficult for someone with no experiences of the perceived goals he thinks will answer his problems. It's cart before horse with this type of psychology. thanks Dreamingawake for concern..Paul.

[Dreamingawake]

Nicely put Paul

[mYTHmAKER]

I've been vegan (still am) for a couple of decades so have "seen it all" in myself and others unfortunately. No-the diet can be done proper but it takes a fair bit of knowledge. Non has also been smoking pot-unfortunately I've also seen the effects of this on vegans-one friend ended in the psych unit several times because of it. Not many know how diet effects them period, let alone a vegan one. Non has too little protein, too high carb, no veges judging from his contact with me. his fat intake is also low/wrong and this really sends you over the edge. That's roughly why Non can't 'learn' from others, why he thinks he is possessed--he is! but not by something outside of himself. He is prone to self-diagnosis and self-prescription--seen it all before. The panic of his situation/state of mind makes him buy Ormus as a miracle cure rather than buy organic veges or even a balanced supplement. It's hard for people to understand this situation since the effect of diet on the mind is not what people know about diet generally. Anyway, he hasn't contacted me again though he has on two seperate occassions without the needed follow through. This is also simply how it is in this situation--no integrity of thought or process. I only hope his suicide talk is self-pity and bluff. To those who have tried to reason with him--that was good of you. Paul

 

Thanks for the clarification

[thelerner]

I've been vegan (still am) for a couple of decades so have "seen it all" in myself and others unfortunately. No-the diet can be done proper but it takes a fair bit of knowledge. Non has also been smoking pot-unfortunately I've also seen the effects of this on vegans-one friend ended in the psych unit several times because of it. Not many know how diet effects them period, let alone a vegan one. Non has too little protein, too high carb, no veges judging from his contact with me. his fat intake is also low/wrong and this really sends you over the edge. That's roughly why Non can't 'learn' from others, why he thinks he is possessed--he is! but not by something outside of himself. He is prone to self-diagnosis and self-prescription--seen it all before. The panic of his situation/state of mind makes him buy Ormus as a miracle cure rather than buy organic veges or even a balanced supplement. It's hard for people to understand this situation since the effect of diet on the mind is not what people know about diet generally. Anyway, he hasn't contacted me again though he has on two seperate occassions without the needed follow through. This is also simply how it is in this situation--no integrity of thought or process. I only hope his suicide talk is self-pity and bluff. To those who have tried to reason with him--that was good of you. Paul

 

This is my fear for my son who went vegetarian at 9 1/2. He's a great kid, but its been 2 years and judging by his diet he's not getting the healthy fats and sadly vegetables (other then lots of carrots & apples) that he should. We lay out lots of choices for him, but he's pretty stubborn. I'm hoping time and modeling good behavior will help.

 

One of Daniel Reid's book has a case of a man in his early 20's who was dysfunction and depressed. Once his diet was cleaned up the change was night and day. Sometimes its amazing what a change in diet can do.

 

Michael

 

P.S. I was a teenage nerd, phew I said it. Nerdy and gawky in my 20's too. A nice guy and had friends who were the same. We had the same problems as Non, (though not so extreme) and we came through. Things change, they change faster if you have a goal and take actions that move you in there direction. We have bad days, sometimes bad decades, but things get better, we become more comfortable in our skins.

[SFJane]

Hello Non,

 

Not sure if you are still reading this so I'll keep it short.

 

Your problem is not with women.

 

Your problem is with you.

 

You are not the only person to ever have problems attracting members of the opposite sex or with feeling suicidal. I am not going to tell you that suicide is a bad option. I've been as far down that road as a person can get before they are in the ground forever. All I can say is that I am glad I didn't. I ended up very happy later on.

 

I can tell you what will happen if you seek out psychiatric services. You are most likely going to be told you have a genetic chemical imbalance and that your only solution is to take meds for the rest of your life. You get a nice diagnosis. Now you have something to blame for all your problems. Maybe you get some ECT. Whatever. You never get to the heart of your issues because it's just some mental condition that you have no control over.

 

At the risk of doing armchair diagnosis all I am going to say is that you are not a complete spirit. The way I see it, your inability to get a woman in your life is driving you insane. Therein lies your problem.

 

Brief anecdote. I got rejected pretty hard once by someone I thought was my soulmate. It led to stalking and restraining orders and all sorts of bad stuff. I was so sick for so long physically and mentally over that loss that I thought I'd never recover.

 

One day it came to me that my happiness and place in this world should not be bound to a connection with another person. The reason I was so broken and so ruined after that relationship was that my entire being was latched on to that person. I was a not a complete human being to begin with and when that relationship ended I was energetically ripped apart.

 

So I took ten years off from relationships to get my head on straight. During that time I worked on nothing but becoming a complete and whole person. Chi kung and meditation have the power to unify all the energies of your Being and make you quite comfortable being you. All by yourself. When that happens you will radiate a different kind of energy and sure enough people will start to get attracted to you. I was not celibate all those years. As taoist practices made me stronger, calmer and more confident, it got easier to have noncommittal recreational sex with people I was not interested in getting to know long term. (especially since I still had some issues)

 

Your inner war with yourself and your brokenness is obvious to women on a subconscious (or conscious) level when you try to interact with them. So, they feel how disturbed you are. They feel your lack of confidence, self possessiveness and emotional grace and that is the sign of an immature human being and that my friend, makes you non breeding, non caretaker material.

 

You can feel sorry for yourself as much as you want but that's not going to change your situation. The reality is you have to change inside before your interactions with women are going to improve. My advice is to drop all ideas of getting in a relationship and grow up first. Find yourself. Don't be dependent on someone else to be complete or happy. When you are comfortable with yourself life will get better.

Edited March 2, 2010 by SFJane

[RyanO]

Hello Non,

 

Not sure if you are still reading this...

 

 

Nice post. As an aside, I agree that the current Western psychiatric model has a ton of limitations. I think the advice to seek help is sort of a disclaimer that advice from a forum can only go so far. In person counsel is far better. Perhaps the first step would be not to see a psychiatrist, but a spiritually understanding licensed counselor.

[onlyindreams]

non, your many posts and topics all point out your isolation, anti-social nature, loneliness and unwanted celibacy. Honestly, I'm not sure why we keep replying, you seem so angry and bitter and you don't seem to have let go of your resentments that the world and women especially owe you something. And yet, many of us can identify with at least part of your difficulties.

 

When I was young, I too felt alienated from women. Never had a date in high school, never went to the prom. I too was angry at women for not realizing who I was. But as long as I was stuck in this bitterness and resentment, women stayed far away from me. If I tried to be different, before long I would go back to being angry, because they still didn't pay any attention to me. It was not until I began to live my life, get involved in other things, worked as a bartender, continued school, worked in political campaigns, did I really lose the bitterness and begin to turn things around.

 

So your quandry: "how do I stop feeling this way (bad, angry, resentful= female repellant) and begin feeling another way (good, worthy, capable, confident+ female attractant)?

 

Well, the answer is not to sit at your computer screen putting up topics on forums about how fucked up you are and daring others to make you feel better about yourself...and shooting down their suggestions.

 

There is hope. Things change. I did well with women from my mid-to late twenties on. By the time I was 30, I became invisible to younger women (early twenties and single) but not to women my own age. Now, at 50, I have worked on myself, developed physically, spiritually and emotionally, grown as a person... and now, believe it or not, I am attracting all types of women...now even young ones. I actually am not interested in younger women (aside from a brief fling with a 23 year old months before my 50th birthday, which I think I did to prove I still 'had it' and to rebel in the face of getting older, perhaps) because I'm at a different place in life. I like a women with character and charisma and experience.

 

Wallowing in your misery, going around in circles at your computer (I'm almost positive you have a strong internet porn habit) will only lead to more of the same. Find yourself a fantastic therapist (and there are some!), get out of your apartment, get involved in something... embrace life, and you will find things slowly beginning to change. The key is not to judge things and get discouraged. If you go back to bitterness and resentment, no women. Find yourself a good female friend or friends(and leave it at friendship, do NOT put out a vibe of wanting to be romantically involved with them) so you can at least begin to see that women are o.k. They may advise you on dating, or clothes or whatever, and that will be good.

 

Practice kaizen...small, incremental, even infinitesimal steps toward changing yourself. You can do it. You have to. Over all these threads and posts you have done here at ttb, you don't seem to have changed at all. Cut that shit out. Don't post your misery here again and again. Start yourself a personal practice forum here and report back on what you are doing, what you are trying to change your situation. (And change your name, Mr. non, non equals nothing. Maybe you feel like that, but then that's where you will stay. Pick out a strong screen name and pick out a powerful image for your avatar).You're allowed to get discouraged, but no self-pity, whining or sniveling. We're already getting tired of that crap from you. Do as i have suggested, and I guarantee you'll have a whole bunch of us cheering you on if you're really trying to get there.

 

bravo!

[onlyindreams]

I strongly agree. If you research non's posts and topics he's started, it's the same thing over and over with no progress. I think we're just enabling his disturbed notions about the world. Enough already. Time to stop pandering to the guy, he rejects it and it may delay him from getting the real help that he needs. Blessings to him.

 

 

quoted for future readers

[gendao]

That Tupac video is very interesting.

Here's another interesting true-life story revealing a side of women that many naive men might prefer to stay in denial of:

Michael Murphy is an alleged womanizer who seduces women, uses them to satisfy his needs and then discards them like trash. What sets this player apart from the rest, though, is that he's done all of this while in the slammer -- with five female guards, a clinical therapist and other prison workers. The 36-year-old's exploits while at a Montana prison, where he was serving a 25-year sentence for burglary, forgery and theft

Here's the confession from his MARRIED therapist, Killian Thomas:

I would kill myself...if my sisters knew if my husband knew

 

he was annoying to me, he was absolutely annoying to me and then he kissed me one day in my office and I just thought what the fuck did I just do, what just happened, um you know from that point on, I felt like I couldn't do anything, I couldn't say no to him

um I probably sent him probably $400

It was oral sex

probably six or seven I don't know

And "happily-married" guard Lisa Mantz also wrote him a note about:

The sexual, how I couldn't wait to screw him, fuck him, ride his dick, I mean stuff I should have never said and I pretty, once that note went, I was scared to death what did you do with the note?

[SirYuri]

Here's another interesting true-life story revealing a side of women that many naive men might prefer to stay in denial of:

Here's the confession from his MARRIED therapist, Killian Thomas:And "happily-married" guard Lisa Mantz also wrote him a note about:

 

Interesting indeed. This just goes to prove another theory that women "unconsciously wanted to be lead" by a man, who is man enough to lead them and stand-up for whatever their mood may be. They just don't want the responsibility on their shoulders that's why they do sometimes act bitchy. Its in their system to be submissive. If you'll do just a little research and careful observation and look at history and society, you'll soon start to realize that woman submits themselves to a man who is man enough to lead them and stand up for their bitchiness.

 

The world is unfair to those who are unaware and ignorant of certain things.

Answers are reserved for those who search and not for those who complain, blame, and justify. As the saying goes- Once you know your opponent, winning is inevitable.

 

 

 

Regards,

SY

Edited March 17, 2010 by SirYuri

[Birch]

Ancient bitch saying: "Do not engage"

i HAVE to say that this story is nicely told.