8 Extraordinary Ch's Confluent Acupts

[Trunk]

Well, I find the confluent pts of each of the 8 extra channels so useful that I'm linking to the acupoint pdf's (~500k) for each. Consider this an advertisement for Peter Deadman's "A Manual of Acupuncture". (The link is to the hardback, digital version also around somewhere.) I put the pdf's in mostly for acupoint locations, but you'll notice that Deadman's text is scintillating brilliance.

 

SmI-3: governing vessel

L-7: conception vessel

BL-62: yang motility vessel

K-6: yin motility vessel

Sp-4: penetrating vessel

GB-41: girdling vessel

P-6: yin linking vessel

SJ-5: yang linking vessel

 

I got into these acupoints as they are the cornerstone of what is recommended in the currently out-of-print book Essential Shiatsu. A really good book that apparently is being re-printed for release in June of this yr.

 

[gendao]

Well, I find the confluent pts of each of the 8 extra channels so useful that I'm linking to the acupoint pdf's (~500k) for each. Consider this an advertisement for Peter Deadman's "A Manual of Acupuncture". (The link is to the hardback, digital version also around somewhere.) I put the pdf's in mostly for acupoint locations, but you'll notice that Deadman's text is scintillating brilliance.

 

SmI-3: governing vessel

L-7: conception vessel

BL-62: yang motility vessel

K-6: yin motility vessel

Sp-4: penetrating vessel

GB-41: girdling vessel

P-6: yin linking vessel

SJ-5: yang linking vessel

 

I got into these acupoints as they are the cornerstone of what is recommended in the currently out-of-print book Essential Shiatsu. A really good book that apparently is being re-printed for release in June of this yr.

 

Ok, guess I can re-ask my questions here, lol..

 

I don't quite understand how a confluent pt works, though? It links one of 8 extraordinary vessels with one of the 12 meridians...yet is often not on the actual extraordinary vessel itself? Is that correct?

 

Like the first 2 confluent pts you have listed link the du mai & ren mai to other meridians...yet are both by the hands...and not anywhere near the midline on the torso by those vessels. So, they somehow work remotely (distally)? If so, how exactly?

 

Sorry, I'm confused here..

 

Deadman's book looks awesome btw, but $144? Ouch.. Still worth it?

[cheya]

[cheya]

I don't quite understand how a confluent pt works, though? It links one of 8 extraordinary vessels with one of the 12 meridians...yet is often not on the actual extraordinary vessel itself? Is that correct?

 

Like the first 2 confluent pts you have listed link the du mai & ren mai to other meridians...yet are both by the hands...and not anywhere near the midline on the torso by those vessels. So, they somehow work remotely (distally)? If so, how exactly?

 

Sorry, I'm confused here..

 

Deadman's book looks awesome btw, but $144? Ouch.. Still worth it?

 

Hi Vortex,

Sorry I don't know the answers to your questions! Maybe an acupuncturist can explain the mechanics of why it works. I'm more interested in what happens than why.

 

Used alone, the EEV points seem to open palpable energy flows in the body. Someone at Tribe.net compared the master point to a light switch that turns on the related extraordinary vessel. Other sources say you turn on an EEV by using first the master point and then the coupled point, needling or stimulating them in specific sequences.

 

Another simple and interesting book that includes both chakra and EEV work is Acupuncture and the Chakra Energy System, by John Cross. It's inexpensive and very practically oriented.

Iona Teerguarden's method, Jin Shin Do, is a bodywork form that uses the EEVs, and her 3 books on Jin Shin are excellent.

 

Re Deadman: it's THE source if you want to really get into the meridians and points. If you're dabbling, there are less expensive books that will serve. It was only reading Trunk's comments on Deadman's book a couple years ago that I realized I actually HAD it, left to me by a relative with a whole passel of others, along with the EEV classics. What a goldmine!

But would I buy it new now? Probably not. if you want it, keep an eye on eBay, it sells for less there.

 

Hope that helps!

 

Edited June 29, 2014 by cheya

[Trunk]

PTI, but I've been distracted by my nose.

 

I don't quite understand how a confluent pt works, though?

 

I'll dig up some quotes later, but a few thoughts riffin', and I really don't know much about the eight extraordinary vessels (EEV), but...

 

The only of the EEV's that have acupoints of their own are du & ren (the orbit). All the other pts for the other of the 8 are on other (regular) channels.

 

The EEV are obviously deeper. They have to do with congenital jing, and big stuff like heaven~earth~man integration and the deeper meditations (central vessel). They "regulate" the regular channels, meaning they both buffer stress and provide back-supplies of vitality when needed... or something like that, I don't think I'm describing "regulate" correctly. (help!?) So, anyway, the EEV are important and fascinating for qi gong nerds.

 

The thing is, with all this stuff... I mean, with the integral body - it all works together. I just don't believe that you can open the orbit (or any small set of channels) and solve all your woes. I think that probably practically much more effective is to work on everything in a balanced fashion... but how?, and is it too much for me to ever learn?

 

Well, my understanding of the confluent acupoints for the 8 extraordinary vessels, is that it's a short hand way of giving a balanced activating treatment to all of the EEVs. I think it's interesting to experiment with vs. just the orbit.

 

I think the EEV's are a cool topic and anyone who wants to say anything about 'm, I'm all ears.

 

- Trunk

[yuanqi]

The extraordinary vessels are used for many different reasons. They are paired together in the following manner.

 

SI3 and UB62

LU7 and KD6

PC6 and SP4

SJ5 and GB41

 

The first one opens up the Yang Qiao and Du channel

The second opens up the Yin Qiao and Ren channels

The third opens up Yin Wei and Chong channels

The last opens up the Yang Wei and Dai channels

 

More specifically SI3 opens Du

Ub62 opens up the Yang Qiao

Lu7 opens up the ren

Kd6 opens up the Yin Qiao

Pc6 opens up the Yin Wei

Sp4 opens up the Chong

Sj5 opens up the Yang Wei

Gb41 opens up the Dai (dai wraps around the waist)

 

You can use them for all sorts of different reasons, from internal problems to esoteric type of treatments and relaxation among many other things.

 

There are points called coalescent points that are opened when these pairs are used. For instance the Yang Wei Sj5 is the "master point" and Gb41 is the coupled point, they have about 16 regular points that are "opened" when they are used that consists of points on the UB channel, The SI channel, The ST channel, the Du channel etc. These have actions on the EOVs and since only the Du and Ren are the only ones to have points of their own, the coalescent points are considered shared points.

 

so if you dont like alot of needles, then you can sometimes just use the EOV's and attach Ion Pumping Cords (a Japanese thing) and have very very powerful treatments.

 

They are used in the pairs in Chinese Acupuncture and particularly in Japanese Acupuncture. I studied both in school.

 

Other questions I can answer as well if you are specific. Sometimes however, the "why" can be answered and sometimes that is just how it is. LOL I had alot of Chinese professors that gave you answers and sometimes they just said this is that way because it is. In Deadman there are reasons for things like why SI3 is on the hand but opens the Du. Many times it has to do with the divergent channels and by virtue of their pathways or sometimes it can be due to the external/internal relationship of organs etc etc etc, it is too much to list here. For instance, SI3 is considered Taiyang, as is the Bladder. The bladder channel runs on the back as does the Du so it can treat the back, also the SI is internally/externally related to the HT so it can also calm the spirt due to this relationship.

 

This is why I would need specifics.

Edited March 30, 2010 by yuanqi

[Fire Dragon]

Hello

 

This free e-book has been on this forum before and I plan to start practising from it next year.

 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/21277833/The-Eight-Extraordinary-Meridians-Qigong

 

It has as far as I can see a good reputation.

 

 

FD

[Trunk]

Couple notes:

 

1) The confluent acupts are all near the hands and feet, and in similar positions on the hands & feet. So, they're easy to reach and easy to remember.

 

2) I find that doing a little bit of wrist and ankle rotations helps flow this process along.

[Trunk]

Here's an easier reference to the point locations. One graphic for the points near the hand, one for the foot.

 

Also, I put similarly located pts in the same positions in the graphics. For instance, there's a point near the pinky finger in the upper left of the hand graphic, and a pt near the pinky toe in the upper left of the foot graphic. There's one at the inner wrist at bottom left, one at inner ankle similarly.

 

 

[Fire Dragon]

Good thread trunk!

 

 

Thanks so much fire dragon. I'm enjoying the read immensely!

 

 

Fine, it is a good book, I think. Have not read it completely jet.

 

F D

[cheya]

[Birch]

Excellent! Thanks Trunk and Cheya.

 

I've been "fiddling" with sword fingers on my hands. Definite something going on. Not sure what.

If you do self acupuncture/pressure/twiddling, do you "automatically" self-regulate? I would speculate that if you intend to do such then yes, but if you're trying for a high or a "power" then it could be tricky/risk harm. What do you think?

[Friend]

Edited November 16, 2011 by Friend

[cheya]

If you do self acupuncture/pressure/twiddling, do you "automatically" self-regulate? I would speculate that if you intend to do such then yes, but if you're trying for a high or a "power" then it could be tricky/risk harm. What do you think?

 

Hi Kate,

Personally, I don't exactly think about it as self-regulation, and I'm not clear yet about risk/harm.

What I'm aiming at is increased feeling of the energy flow throughout my body, not just a sensation at the point I'm focusing on. Sometimes I'm working on a beginning point of a meridian and I get sensation at the other end of it. Sometimes the general path of the meridian sort of lights up. Sometimes whole areas of by body light up, often not obviously related to the meridian/channel I'm focusing on. I work to get the energy started by focusing on a point (or by breathing from my heels, working with the Chinese health balls, or just doing swing arms exercise). After the energy gets moving, I just watch where it goes. The energy seems to have its own agenda re where it goes in my body. My job is to get it started and then just watch.

 

I'm not interested in "powers" or a high, but on days when lots of my body gets "lit" or energized at the same time, I seem to be very cheerful and happy the rest of the day, more at ease in my life than on days I don't manage to practice, or days when I just don't/can't "get there". I'm focusing on increasing the portion of my field that "lights up" at the same time, until I feel it all lit up at the same time. I'm reminded of Carlos Castaneda's report that Don Juan said the goal was to have all the fibers of his being lit up at the same time.

 

Some days it gets really intense, and I can feel a little tired the rest of the day and may even slack off practice the next day. Currently, I think of that as an energetic detox, like opening clogged channels sets free a lot of crud which has to clear before my body's willing to release any more.

 

Don't know if I've addressed your question....

 

Edited June 29, 2014 by cheya

[Birch]

Hi Cheya,

 

Thanks for your reply. I supposed it might answer my question if I extrapolate it enough. But maybe I shouldn't take the chance?

 

I've also noticed the way certain areas/meridians/bone/fascia seem to play together. But doing sword fingers is intented to regulate/open things that need opening. I was just concerned that doing it to myself could lead to error. Much like poking around in a scab might not be a really good idea There are no needles involved.