Why I am against 'powers'

[goldisheavy]

I'm puzzled - is James Randi being considered an authority in science? o_O

 

 

 

Are you a subscriber to the 'you create your reality' idea?

 

Kind of like my nose creates my face? Not exactly.

[That Guy]

I'm puzzled - is James Randi being considered an authority in science? o_O

 

 

Hes an authority is trickery.

 

If anyone had really gone to him with a solid skill they can do at will, which is not a trick, they could've won by now. If you can levitate, move an object with your mind, predict what card is gonna come up etc without guessing there is no way he can fail you in some test in which he isn't cheating or something.

[Sloppy Zhang]

Hes an authority is trickery.

 

If anyone had really gone to him with a solid skill they can do at will, which is not a trick, they could've won by now. If you can levitate, move an object with your mind, predict what card is gonna come up etc without guessing there is no way he can fail you in some test in which he isn't cheating or something.

 

(bold added by me)

 

That's the thing though, look at the rules- it's not "anyone". To pass the preliminary qualifications, you have to be someone who is known to possess some sort of ability, that's gotta be your title. Sylvia Brown, for instance, would qualify the initial phase of the Randi Challenge because she is a known psychic (though she doesn't need to take the challenge to

)

 

The rules are also set up so that both parties must agree to the set up, what that means is that if it looks like Randi is going to lose he can back out on the grounds of the experiment set-up. Basically, Randi has it set up so that he can never lose, even to a legitimate user.

 

Furthermore, Randi also seems to have the sort of belief that if he can recreate it using non psychic means, that you are a fraud. As someone else on the net has astutely pointed out, we have pretty successfully recreated various things through film and media (which are fake), which (using Randi's logic) means that most of real life is also a fraud......

 

Yeah. Randi can be seen both ways, depending on what you want to see. I do agree though that people making a claim should prove it. But to Randi? Hmm.

Edited April 7, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[markern]

 

 

 

 

Furthermore, Randi also seems to have the sort of belief that if he can recreate it using non psychic means, that you are a fraud. As someone else on the net has astutely pointed out, we have pretty successfully recreated various things through film and media (which are fake), which (using Randi's logic) means that most of real life is also a fraud......

 

Yeah. Randi can be seen both ways, depending on what you want to see. I do agree though that people making a claim should prove it. But to Randi? Hmm.

 

 

 

That made my day.

 

A bunch of people with claims to abilites have and are undergoing tests with serious scienetists. Especially in China it seems.

[That Guy]

(bold added by me)

 

That's the thing though, look at the rules- it's not "anyone". To pass the preliminary qualifications, you have to be someone who is known to possess some sort of ability, that's gotta be your title. Sylvia Brown, for instance, would qualify the initial phase of the Randi Challenge because she is a known psychic (though she doesn't need to take the challenge to

)

 

The rules are also set up so that both parties must agree to the set up, what that means is that if it looks like Randi is going to lose he can back out on the grounds of the experiment set-up. Basically, Randi has it set up so that he can never lose, even to a legitimate user.

 

Furthermore, Randi also seems to have the sort of belief that if he can recreate it using non psychic means, that you are a fraud. As someone else on the net has astutely pointed out, we have pretty successfully recreated various things through film and media (which are fake), which (using Randi's logic) means that most of real life is also a fraud......

 

Yeah. Randi can be seen both ways, depending on what you want to see. I do agree though that people making a claim should prove it. But to Randi? Hmm.

 

If the psychic sees they'll be exposed they can back out too. But here is the things...

 

Randi HAS tested paranormal power, under conditions BOTH parties agreed upon. So he has fairly tested people, you can say what if what if, but he has at least on some occasions given people a fair test, open to the public, and they failed.

 

People who claim these powers have no solid track record, because they don't dare to try and get one, if they prove themselves to be real things can only get better as far as their authenticity reputation goes.

 

Hes 81! for goodness sake, you think he really cares to keep the world of paranormal as fake? At this age I'm sure he'd be happier knowing there is an afterlife for example

 

Go to a TV station, levitate infront of people, it is a sure thing some reporter will come see whats going on. Show him, he'll get you on TV, once on TV issue Randi the challenge in front of the world so to spea. He'll have to accept! For 1 million $$$ its hardly any work....

 

for powers like psychic mind reading between you and your buddies or talking to ghosts it may not be so easy, but if you have a power that you can demonstrate effects our solid world you're sure to win.

 

Spiritualists have this sort of belief that just because a practitioner of some occult practice claims some power it is not trickery.

 

 

 

To sum it up:

 

Sceptics debunk frauds on the world stage.

Real practitioners are yet to beat the sceptics on the world stage.

[Sloppy Zhang]

Real practitioners are yet to beat the sceptics on the world stage.

 

If I had, say, mind control powers, I'd be must less interested in getting a shot on tv and 1 million dollars from Randi than I would be in, say, I dunno, becoming the head of a 100 company, or becoming the president. I'd be using one million dollars to wipe my ass, not trying and prove myself to a bunch of nobodies.

Edited April 7, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[That Guy]

If I had, say, mind control powers, I'd be must less interested in getting a shot on tv and 1 million dollars from Randi than I would be in, say, I dunno, becoming the head of a 100 company, or becoming the president. I'd be using one million dollars to wipe my ass, not trying and prove myself to a bunch of nobodies.

Well obviously your quest for power has corrupted you

 

I would do it just to help the world see theres more to it than they think.

[Greentea with Brownrice]

Hello,

 

New here... probably not a great idea to post a reply on such a polarized topic... however, I must say i read the entire post and can relate completely... i realized long ago it ook far more real power to walk away from a fight... to accept a loss, a dissapointment... to love freely and act regardless of fears.

 

although i feel i am a mere visitor to this place... i say thank you for posting this.

 

~Enjoyed

[Sloppy Zhang]

Hello,

 

New here... probably not a great idea to post a reply on such a polarized topic... however, I must say i read the entire post and can relate completely... i realized long ago it ook far more real power to walk away from a fight... to accept a loss, a dissapointment... to love freely and act regardless of fears.

 

although i feel i am a mere visitor to this place... i say thank you for posting this.

 

~Enjoyed

 

Don't feel hesitant to post ever

 

You make some good points, and I agree.

 

Some people reach a point where it just doesn't matter- it doesn't matter whether they get power or not, it doesn't matter if someone believes them or not, it doesn't matter if they are rich or poor. You reach a point where you are looking for something "else" that nobody seems to care about but what you feel matters more.

 

I dunno what that is, and I can't say that I'm there yet, but there are a lot of things that I just don't feel are important anymore.... like beating someone in a discussion on the internet.

Edited April 7, 2010 by Sloppy Zhang

[That Guy]

.... like beating someone in a discussion on the internet.

Agreed. Usually After a long post or 2 I'm beat and just leave it, go do something else.

[3bob]

"I am not sure what you mean by true power". SFJane

 

Well, I meant along the lines of the source and foundation of power as alluded to in this partial quote from the upanishads:

 

" 1. To him who sees, perceives, and understands this, the spirit

(prana) springs from the Self, hope springs from the Self, memory

springs from the Self; so do ether, fire, water, appearance and

disappearance, food, power, understanding, reflection, consideration,

will, Mind, speech, names, sacred hymns, and sacrifices--aye, all this

springs from the Self.

 

2. There is this verse, "He who sees this, does not see death, nor

illness, nor pain; he who sees this, sees everything, and obtains

everything everywhere".

 

Om

[TheSongsofDistantEarth]

My take on it is that subtle abilities can be defeated in a psychically hostile environment...The Skeptics are not open minded, but are there to create an atmosphere that will defeat the 'quacks'. There was an experiment where Skeptics 'disproved' Therapeutic Touch by testing people with abilities in difficult circumstances and with hostile recipients and the abilities did not manifest. If you practice healing, you can imagine that unless your abilities and psyche is very strong, the negative thought field actually may counteract any force of healing.

[Mark Foote]

My take on it is that subtle abilities can be defeated in a psychically hostile environment...The Skeptics are not open minded, but are there to create an atmosphere that will defeat the 'quacks'. There was an experiment where Skeptics 'disproved' Therapeutic Touch by testing people with abilities in difficult circumstances and with hostile recipients and the abilities did not manifest. If you practice healing, you can imagine that unless your abilities and psyche is very strong, the negative thought field actually may counteract any force of healing.

 

SFJane is talking about moving objects with the mind- my experience is that there is only one object worth moving through mind, and that is the body. That might sound laughable, but I'm not talking about moving the body through the exercise of will by the mind. I am talking about the occurrence of consciousness causing action in the body solely by virtue of consciousness taking place.

 

"Sometimes zazen gets up and walks around", Kobun Chino Otogawa said; "The windy element" moves the body, Buddhaghosa wrote; "to one who knows thus, sees thus, there are no illusions that mine is the doer with respect to this consciousness-informed body", the Gautamid said.

 

"An empty hand grasps the hoe-handle

Walking along, I ride the ox

The ox crosses the wooden bridge

The bridge is flowing, the water is still"- from Fuxi, 5th century C.E.

 

"the bridge is flowing, the water is still"- here is a wonderful explanation of this line from a Shunryu Suzuki lecture (edited by Bill Redican):

 

"You may say that your mind is practicing zazen and ignore your body, the practice of your body. Sometimes when you think that you are doing zazen with an imperturbable mind, you ignore the body, but it is also necessary to have the opposite understanding at the same time. Your body is practicing zazen in imperturbability while your mind is moving."

 

Suzuki also said, "only zazen can sit zazen". Now I would say, the body practicing zazen in imperturbability while the mind is moving is zazen that sits zazen, and at such time the action of the body apart from the movement of mind is still. As Kobun said, the action of the body with the movement of mind can sometimes get up and walk. If you want to see it for yourself, then I think you have to arrive at a necessity of breath that depends on the free occurrence of consciousness, on the impact of that consciousness in the stretch already in existence, and on the feeling that is opened through activity out of impact. To arrive at our own necessity, we must witness how aversion to pain, attraction to pleasure, or ignorance of the sensation which is neither can condition the occurrence of consciousness.

 

I am not saying to do anything.

Edited April 8, 2010 by Mark Foote

[SFJane]

When I get a chance I'd like to make some more replies but for now I'd like to address two things.

 

The first: What would I do if had the real deal telekinesis? I would hide it at first and prove it to myself. If I could move a piece of paper it stands to reason with more practice I could move several pieces. I'd practice at different ranges with different barricades. I would make TK training stations and do circuits. When I was absolutely sure I could move reasonably impressive objects such as a cinder-block I would then make a video of me moving a cinder-block from ten feet away with my mind. Then I would contact the press.

 

As That Guy stated, I would have my platform to get Randi's attention pretty quick at that point. Then for my trick, I would have James Randi hold the check or facsimile of in his open hand at ten feet away and then I would take the check right out of his hand as many times as people wanted to see it. Promptly after that I would go before the scientific community having just won Randi's challenge and proudly demonstrate the results of so much concentration practice.

 

Then I would disappear into the bush in Australia after a spirit in a dream told me that the human race was not ready for such knowledge. Ha! Psyche! Just kidding. I would be on hand to demo before the world stage that what so many have imagined and longed for was finally true. I would encourage others to learn how to do it and make my training formula available (for a good price) to those that wanted in on it. I would sell my hard won skill and knowledge and help people train for a future of TKs.

 

And I don't mind telling you all that I would gloat a little in front of Mr Randi and every other skeptic with a 'I told you so' winning smile on my face. If there was even one person with a real power that they could prove, I see no reason why they should not also do as I would do and take that million dollar check right out of his hand with their mind. But alas, it has yet to happen and I highly doubt that it will. But I do hope that it happens someday because I have just enough child left in me to think that that would be wonderful. While I do still hope that someone can pull it off, I am not going to go all googly eyed over TK tricks that can only be done under 'perfect' conditions set up by the TKer. You either have it or you don't. You can do it or you can't. None of this 'your negative chi is turning off my powers' crap.

[enouch]

When I get a chance I'd like to make some more replies but for now I'd like to address two things.

 

The first: What would I do if had the real deal telekinesis? I would hide it at first and prove it to myself. If I could move a piece of paper it stands to reason with more practice I could move several pieces. I'd practice at different ranges with different barricades. I would make TK training stations and do circuits. When I was absolutely sure I could move reasonably impressive objects such as a cinder-block I would then make a video of me moving a cinder-block from ten feet away with my mind. Then I would contact the press.

 

As That Guy stated, I would have my platform to get Randi's attention pretty quick at that point. Then for my trick, I would have James Randi hold the check or facsimile of in his open hand at ten feet away and then I would take the check right out of his hand as many times as people wanted to see it. Promptly after that I would go before the scientific community having just won Randi's challenge and proudly demonstrate the results of so much concentration practice.

 

Then I would disappear into the bush in Australia after a spirit in a dream told me that the human race was not ready for such knowledge. Ha! Psyche! Just kidding. I would be on hand to demo before the world stage that what so many have imagined and longed for was finally true. I would encourage others to learn how to do it and make my training formula available (for a good price) to those that wanted in on it. I would sell my hard won skill and knowledge and help people train for a future of TKs.

 

And I don't mind telling you all that I would gloat a little in front of Mr Randi and every other skeptic with a 'I told you so' winning smile on my face. If there was even one person with a real power that they could prove, I see no reason why they should not also do as I would do and take that million dollar check right out of his hand with their mind. But alas, it has yet to happen and I highly doubt that it will. But I do hope that it happens someday because I have just enough child left in me to think that that would be wonderful. While I do still hope that someone can pull it off, I am not going to go all googly eyed over TK tricks that can only be done under 'perfect' conditions set up by the TKer. You either have it or you don't. You can do it or you can't. None of this 'your negative chi is turning off my powers' crap.

 

 

 

 

 

Here you go,Jane, you beautiful, sexy, powerful woman! http://sadhanamandir.org/BFB2.pdf

[SFJane]

The second thing I wanted to cover was this. I went out on a limb here, talking about my personal practice and the things I've tried to do in the past. I tried to be as honest as I could. I was willing to test myself, exhaustively so, in order to see if anything in my toolkit could take the million dollar challenge. Then I came forward and admitted in a public forum that I had nothing that could withstand the scrutiny of science.

 

To do that required that I be brutally honest with myself and be fully engaged with reality testing. If you can't figure out what is real psi and what is stage magic or confirmation bias or Darrin Brown style rapport and suggestion then how the heck are you going to find the beginning and end of your own consciousness? How are going to find the mindstream? How are you going to root out your ego and obtain a core of realistic honesty with yourself and your inner world if you can't tell the difference between a power and a trick?

 

Siddhi are treated as spiritual currency. Siddhis are a carrot to entice the student. 'Study my system and you'll get powers like me' is the promise of some teachers. At the end of the day, contentedness and inner equilibrium are not all the exciting nor larger than life. To sex up something like meditation you have to appeal to the little child in everyone that wants magic and psi to be real. You target people who don't even need to be convinced because they already believe in an almost religious way that these abilities are real. Folks like that are asking to be taken for a ride. Look at what the demonstration of siddhi has led to some of those Indian masters. What is it with the gurus from India that they need to have sex with white women, children and men? When you believe in someone that much you are asking to be exploited by someone without scruples.

 

To avoid exploitation and being caught up in the quest for powers you have to be able to discern reality. You have to be able to reality check what you are seeing or what you think you can do. One of the best ways I know to do that is cultivate extreme honesty to the point of uncomfortableness. When you can be so honest with yourself that you encroach your own comfort zone then you are going somewhere.

 

You are going to need that honesty and ability to determine the real from the false if you seriously intend on working with the most subtle levels of consciousness. Otherwise your own mind will take you on a ride and tell you or show you exactly what you expect or want to see. The mind is that powerful that you can enchant yourself against looking too closely at phenomena and avoid asking unconformable questions or engaging in a fierce query. Then you will go nowhere for a long time until you can break that chain of self deception.

Edited April 8, 2010 by SFJane

[dwai]

Siddhi are treated as spiritual currency. Siddhis are a carrot to entice the student. 'Study my system and you'll get powers like me' is the promise of some teachers. At the end of the day, contentedness and inner equilibrium are not all the exciting nor larger than life. To sex up something like meditation you have to appeal to the little child in everyone that wants magic and psi to be real. You target people who don't even need to be convinced because they already believe in an almost religious way that these abilities are real. Folks like that are asking to be taken for a ride. Look at what the demonstration of siddhi has led to some of those Indian masters. What is it with the gurus from India that they need to have sex with white women, children and men? When you believe in someone that much you are asking to be exploited by someone without scruples.

 

 

 

No self-respecting Guru or tradition would use Siddhis as a carrot. They invariably attract the wrong kind of seeker (eg: those who want to develop TK ability).

 

Of what use is a Siddhi like TK ability? Does it take the seeker closer to knowing the Self? I don't think so.

 

I think you are being unfairly unkind towards "Gurus from India"...but I suppose you have your personal experiences/biases associated with that kind of thinking.

 

I can make similar unjustified generalizations and ask "What is it with these White women who strive for TK ability and waste perfectly good time (thousands of hours purportedly) on trying to attain such Siddhis?" Can't they simply focus on Spiritual practice instead of trying to become Mutant Ninja Turtles?

[SFJane]

 

 

I can make similar unjustified generalizations and ask "What is it with these White women who strive for TK ability and waste perfectly good time (thousands of hours purportedly) on trying to attain such Siddhis?" Can't they simply focus on Spiritual practice instead of trying to become Mutant Ninja Turtles?

 

You do understand that I no longer practice such things yes? And that I gave the answer at the beginning. I was scared and I wanted to protect myself and I wanted revenge. What more reason do you need than passion? Passion drove me to train that hard that long in those things. And I often had plenty of forced seclusion or isolation during my childhood and teens with nothing better to do than to try to teleport myself out of a lockdown, walk through it's walls or blast down it's doors with sheer mental power. I believed I had a need for that power and I was certainly open-minded enough to try.

 

 

I think you are being unfairly unkind towards "Gurus from India"...but I suppose you have your personal experiences/biases associated with that kind of thinking.

 

 

This might have something to do with it. Guru's who can't keep their dick in their dhoti.

 

More

 

and more

 

and more...

 

Unfair? These guys do it to themselves. Their siddhi goes to their little head and we see how enlightened they really are.

Edited April 8, 2010 by SFJane

[goldisheavy]

I don't think people understand the real implications of abilities like "telekinesis". Sorry if this sounds negative, but I don't mean to be a bummer and harsh your mellows or anything like that. I just don't know how to put it any nicer than that.

 

We all have an idea of what the world should be like. And we cling to that idea with all we got. Should anything appear contrary to our idea of reality, without special contemplative training, we would become extremely disturbed, scared and lost. This is why mentally ill people have very hard time being functional. They are scared. They don't know what to trust. It's like having no ground to stand on.

 

Hard blatant magic implies the total and utter destruction of the world as you know it. Total. Utter. Gone. No world. No universe. No other people. No things. No dogs or cats. No driveway. No home. No stars or planets. No space or time. When I say "destruction," of course nothing is actually destroyed, but all ideas about it are removed from the depths of your own mind.

 

It's not just that you'd be breaking rules of physics, that's nothing. You'd be breaking the boundary between yourself and the world. What are you? If you're not limited by your body, then what are you? You are not human. That's huge. All your ideas about what you are, what you can and cannot do, would be shattered. You'd have the biggest identity crisis this side of the universe.

 

People sometimes commit suicide from the most minor minor trivial things when they reach midlife crisis. People reach 30-40 and realize they didn't achieve any goals or didn't live the life they wanted (as a human! they want to be a limited human, they have goals, plans, wishes, hopes for the human!), and they hang themselves, or they reinvent themselves. Think what this implies. Not only do most (99.99999999%) people not want any psychic abilities, but people want to remain stupid and limited humans, on purpose. They have goals, wishes, hopes and dreams for those stupid little limited un-psychic mounds of flesh that they all fervently believe they are. They can't just give it all up. Not until they fulfill themselves a million times over and get tired of being a human first.

 

People are so fucking scared of real psychic abilities, that even the slightest hint of them, and they are willing to burn the witch they think has them. That's a lot of people around the world. And the only reason we no longer have witch burnings in the developed world is not because people have matured or become more fearless, or because they have expanded their minds, hell no. The reason why we don't have witch burnings in the developed world is because everyone got utterly convinced that such things simply do not exist. Should people believe they do exist, they could easily revert to witch burning behavior of the past due to tremendous fear.

 

People want to have ground under their feet. They want to be sure that when they open the door of their home, there is a familiar street on the other side. People want to be sure that when they release an object from their hand, it falls to the ground. This is comforting. This is familiar. It's stability.

 

These desires are so deep in our minds we don't even realize they are there. Just me mentioning it is not likely to give you a realization of what I am describing. You have to crack your own reality at least briefly to understand what I am talking about.

 

People think that having a psychic ability is an add-on. It's not. People think that we have Jane over here and add psychic ability and voila, we have psychic Jane. So the formula would be:

 

Jane + psychic training = psychic Jane.

 

Sort of like:

 

Jane + carpentry training = carpenter Jane

 

or

 

Jane + math training = mathematician Jane

 

But having a real magic ability is unlike any mundane ability. Mundane abilities are built by building on top of your core beliefs about reality. Since your core beliefs about reality are untouched, acquiring mundane abilities feels relatively easy and safe to mundane beings. It feels like a step by step process, as you add more conditioning on top of your already-existing conditioning.

 

Supramundane abilities are restored to the original limitless being by uprooting and dissolving the deeply nested core beliefs about reality. This is what makes them unlike anything you've ever known. It's not even training. I say "training", but it's not. It's not like training for a marathon. It's not like lifting weights. It's not rote. It's not repetitive. It's not cycling energy. It's not opening chakras. It's not microcosmic orbit. It's not anything most people are obsessed with doing on this here forum. It's not any of that spiritual confetti.

 

This is why someone who circulates energy is not going to get any powers. And they don't. You won't become immortals. If you conserve your energy, you won't get anything. It's all a waste of time. And of course reality supports what I am saying, because if you test any person on this forum, a la Randi, I can guarantee you they will have no power, and SFJane has been brave and honest enough to realize that in her own training. Good for her. Bravo.

 

Nobody here will have any kind of special power. Why not? You don't do what you need to do to have it. Why not? You don't want to. Deep down, you don't. If you deep down wanted to, you'd pick a practice that opens the gates so to speak. But you don't pick it. Instead you pick something rote, something you can do in the morning every day, something that doesn't ruin your life. You can do it before breakfast, then have your oatmeal, nice and healthy, then go about your day as a limited little lump of human flesh. You need that stability of being human. You need the safety of the known. You need physics to continue to function so that you don't freak out. You have dreams, hopes, plans, goals, wishes that you strive for as a human. You don't want to stop being a human. You don't want to destroy this world. Etc. and so on. You just want to spice this place up! Spicy. You want a little something spicy on top. That's all.

 

The only practice that yields power is contemplation, and even then, contemplation has to be coupled with willingness. You have to be a willing, non-resisting participant. That's huge. To get this kind of willingness you must have tremendous emotional maturity that transcends human emotional maturity. It's when you know everything there is to know about being human. It's when you are utterly, utterly satisfied with being who you are and having lived as you had, and have nothing more to gain from it. It's like you had your fill and now you can do something else. But not until then. If you still enjoy the human games, you can't play the games of immortals.

 

So does this mean you should stop enjoying being human so you can become immortals? Hell no! The dirty secret is that you are already an immortal who magically made this human world. You love all of this. You love this game. You are not yet done playing. There is nothing anywhere that can hurry you up. You cannot contrive anything. You cannot artificially with some kind of practice change your innermost desire. This is why the highest spiritual practices stress that there is no artifice, no practice, no rote training. Why? Because intent has to be clear and if you are applying techniques your intent is still dirty. It's not clear. To understand why this is actually the case, one has to contemplate for a very long time. No, you don't need a master for this. You don't need a Guru. You don't need to be a Buddhist or a Daoist or any ist. You just need to be ready and willing. When you are ready and willing, you'll have the requisite wisdom to know what it is you need to contemplate. You'll be able to sense where it is that limitations emanate from. You'll be able to consider things that most people cannot even consider.

 

So enjoy yourselves. Have fun. Be good to each other. Don't rush anything. When you are ready, you'll start asking different sorts of questions than when you love being human and want to remain human in a human world, with all that it implies, and you just want a little something extra special on top, a little spicy spice on top. A little spicy microcosmic orbit practice. A little spicy chakra practice. Something that is guaranteed not to disturb or change your dream of human in a human world even in the slightest. Something safe.

 

Enjoy!

Edited April 8, 2010 by goldisheavy

[forestofclarity]

GIH,

 

What do you mean by the word, "intent"?

 

 

Because intent has to be clear and if you are applying techniques your intent is still dirty. It's not clear. T

 

Enjoy!

[NeiChuan]

The second thing I wanted to cover was this. I went out on a limb here, talking about my personal practice and the things I've tried to do in the past. I tried to be as honest as I could. I was willing to test myself, exhaustively so, in order to see if anything in my toolkit could take the million dollar challenge. Then I came forward and admitted in a public forum that I had nothing that could withstand the scrutiny of science.

 

To do that required that I be brutally honest with myself and be fully engaged with reality testing. If you can't figure out what is real psi and what is stage magic or confirmation bias or Darrin Brown style rapport and suggestion then how the heck are you going to find the beginning and end of your own consciousness? How are going to find the mindstream? How are you going to root out your ego and obtain a core of realistic honesty with yourself and your inner world if you can't tell the difference between a power and a trick?

 

Siddhi are treated as spiritual currency. Siddhis are a carrot to entice the student. 'Study my system and you'll get powers like me' is the promise of some teachers. At the end of the day, contentedness and inner equilibrium are not all the exciting nor larger than life. To sex up something like meditation you have to appeal to the little child in everyone that wants magic and psi to be real. You target people who don't even need to be convinced because they already believe in an almost religious way that these abilities are real. Folks like that are asking to be taken for a ride. Look at what the demonstration of siddhi has led to some of those Indian masters. What is it with the gurus from India that they need to have sex with white women, children and men? When you believe in someone that much you are asking to be exploited by someone without scruples.

 

To avoid exploitation and being caught up in the quest for powers you have to be able to discern reality. You have to be able to reality check what you are seeing or what you think you can do. One of the best ways I know to do that is cultivate extreme honesty to the point of uncomfortableness. When you can be so honest with yourself that you encroach your own comfort zone then you are going somewhere.

 

You are going to need that honesty and ability to determine the real from the false if you seriously intend on working with the most subtle levels of consciousness. Otherwise your own mind will take you on a ride and tell you or show you exactly what you expect or want to see. The mind is that powerful that you can enchant yourself against looking too closely at phenomena and avoid asking unconformable questions or engaging in a fierce query. Then you will go nowhere for a long time until you can break that chain of self deception.

 

 

 

Well said.

[goldisheavy]

GIH,

 

What do you mean by the word, "intent"?

 

Same thing anyone else means by it. Just what's in the dictionary. And by clear intent I mean intent that's been freed of structured conditioning.

[EagleShen]

Great Post, thanks for sharing, a great commentary on how we get hypnotised by our own egos.

 

Personally i think Siddhis are attainable, but only really in an individual totally 'surrendered' to the subtlest Will.

 

I came across a Buddhist discussion of Siddhis at one point (i can't seem to find it, thought i'd bookmarked it...) and they discussed internal and external Siddhis, the external Siddhis being what most people refer to as powers, and that these were dead ends in terms of true realisation. The internal Siddhis were things such as concentration, focus, faith, discrimination, etc., and that seeking these Siddhis lead one to realisation. I really like this approach.

 

If i do find the link i'll post it.

[forestofclarity]

Most people tend to be sloppy and imprecise with these things.

 

Same thing anyone else means by it. Just what's in the dictionary. And by clear intent I mean intent that's been freed of structured conditioning.

[goldisheavy]

Most people tend to be sloppy and imprecise with these things.

 

If you perceive an ambiguity, just call it out and I will do my best to disambiguate it. To call out an ambiguity, please provide good descriptions of two different and incompatible understandings that can arise due to an ambiguity. In other words, if you just say "it's ambiguous" and leave it at that, I will not respond (or at least, not kindly).

Edited April 9, 2010 by goldisheavy