Being Skeptical, Logical, Rational And Critical of Teachers and Teachings?

[Thunder_Gooch]

I wonder sometimes, maybe it is because I come from an atheist background. I spent most of my youth as a devout atheist before I had a shared experience that forced me to renounce that world view.

 

It feels like I am still stuck in an extremely skeptical and critical mindset especially when it comes to new teachers and systems and teachings.

 

I want to see some of hard evidence for a teacher or system's ability to get results before I invest any time or effort with it. I don't even want to waste my time listening to people who haven't accomplished anything themselves. To me this way of thinking seems perfectly rational, others I've met here disagree with me.

 

Is being rational, skeptical, and critical of new teachers/teachings unreasonable? I can't understand why more people aren't skeptical and critical of teachers and systems. From my perspective almost all (99.999999%) of what is on the market is just garbage people made up to sell books, and none of the authors of these books or systems have ever accomplished anything notable. It seems as though there is a flood of disinformation by new age hippy authors just saturating everything.

 

Really it makes me ill to even think about, am I the only one who feels this way?

Edited April 24, 2010 by More_Pie_Guy

[xakarii]

Everyone feels this way.

 

Though false gold only exists because there's such a thing as real gold- if you were to go into a medical, business or other trade school and ask why you should believe they are qualified to teach you, you'd likely be shown the door pretty quickly.

[goldisheavy]

I wonder sometimes, maybe it is because I come from an atheist background. I spent most of my youth as a devout atheist before I had a shared experience that forced me to renounce that world view.

 

Very similar story here.

 

It feels like I am still stuck in an extremely skeptical and critical mindset especially when it comes to new teachers and systems and teachings.

 

I want to see some of hard evidence for a teacher or system's ability to get results before I invest any time or effort with it. I don't even want to waste my time listening to people who haven't accomplished anything themselves. To me this way of thinking seems perfectly rational, others I've met here disagree with me.

 

I'm different in this regard. I am very critical, but not skeptical. There is a difference!

 

Because I am not skeptical, when I read about some teacher or technique, I often think "Yes, I can see how given the right mentality this could work." But then I think, "Does this method introduce unnecessary concepts? Does this method complicate things unnecessarily? Does this method raise more questions than it answers? Is this method logically consistent?" So instead of demanding hard evidence, which is not practical, I subject the method to the fire of reason. Yea, I know something can be done, but should it be done? That's the question.

 

I know about the power of mind these days. Given that I know about it, why should I accept lower forms of that power? For example, why should I believe in some "chi" as an intermediary energy that flows along meridians? Why can't I just use intent directly? Of course I can. "Chi" is an unnecessary complication. And many other methods and systems are like that. They all depend on the power of mind to work, but at the same time, they impose unneeded complications and unnecessary restrictions on the full power that the mind is capable of.

 

It's like the people who invent these methods lack imagination. Or they lack understanding. They think that these subtle energies are actually substantial and not mind-made -- this would be a serious flaw in their understanding.

 

Is being rational, skeptical, and critical of new teachers/teachings unreasonable?

 

Skepticism slows down change and brings more stability into your day to day experience. Is this reasonable or not? It depends on what you want. If you enjoy a stable and predictable experience and if you do not want magic, you should remain very skeptical. Without knowing your aim I cannot tell you if it's reasonable or not. Things are reasonable if they are consistent with your aims.

 

We could bring convention into this analysis too. I am too lazy now to do so.

 

I can't understand why more people aren't skeptical and critical of teachers and systems. From my perspective almost all (99.999999%) of what is on the market is just garbage people made up to sell books, and none of the authors of these books or systems have ever accomplished anything notable. It seems as though there is a flood of disinformation by new age hippy authors just saturating everything.

 

Really it makes me ill to even think about, am I the only one who feels this way?

 

I am critical of teachers, but not skeptical. I think that a lot of things teachers advertise can be done, but they are stupid and useless. You can do the same things they advertise with fewer restriction, with more fun, using your own wisdom and imagination.

Edited April 24, 2010 by goldisheavy

[goldisheavy]

Everyone feels this way.

 

Though false gold only exists because there's such a thing as real gold- if you were to go into a medical, business or other trade school and ask why you should believe they are qualified to teach you, you'd likely be shown the door pretty quickly.

 

Nobody likes to be challenged like that.

[innerspace_cadet]

I wonder sometimes, maybe it is because I come from an atheist background. I spent most of my youth as a devout atheist before I had a shared experience that forced me to renounce that world view.

 

It feels like I am still stuck in an extremely skeptical and critical mindset especially when it comes to new teachers and systems and teachings.

 

I want to see some of hard evidence for a teacher or system's ability to get results before I invest any time or effort with it. I don't even want to waste my time listening to people who haven't accomplished anything themselves. To me this way of thinking seems perfectly rational, others I've met here disagree with me.

 

Is being rational, skeptical, and critical of new teachers/teachings unreasonable? I can't understand why more people aren't skeptical and critical of teachers and systems. From my perspective almost all (99.999999%) of what is on the market is just garbage people made up to sell books, and none of the authors of these books or systems have ever accomplished anything notable. It seems as though there is a flood of disinformation by new age hippy authors just saturating everything.

 

Really it makes me ill to even think about, am I the only one who feels this way?

 

No, you aren't the only one. It is never unreasonable to be skeptical or critical of teachers/systems; it is the sign of a healthy mind. Healthy skepticism could someday help you avoid a sticky situation, such as joining a cult that requires you to fork over your money and your autonomy. (Tom Cruise didn't join Scientology because he was being too skeptical; it was because he wasn't being skeptical enough.)

 

If you want to learn about the evidence for say, meditation's beneficial properties, there are scientific studies done covering just that. Studies have also been done on Tai chi, qigong, etc.

[Aetherous]

...teacher or system's ability to get results...

 

What results are you looking for? That's the key thing here.

[Eric Yudelove]

What results are you looking for? That's the key thing here.

 

The GOAL of Taoism is to live in harmony with the Tao. This includes as basics: good health, long life, wonderful sexuality, balancing the energies in your body, establishing good personal moral qualities and calmness. At a higher level the goal is to silence the mind so as to perceive your Original Nature, Embryonic Breathing and creation of the immortal spirit body.

None of this is just fancy talk, to a long time practicing Taoist it can become a reality.

I'm not a New Age hippy author. I wrote about authentic Taoist practices some of which date back thousands of years. I didn't make anything up. But I can only speak for myself. As far as anyone having success with my books, I know of a number of people who've had spectacular success and I've never gotten any negative feedback in the 15 years since my 1st book was published.

Being sceptical is healthy. I myself am very skeptical and agree that alot of the material out there is crap. But it's not 99.9999999% crap. Being a nihilist puts you in conflict with the unity of the Tao. These practices require much work over a long period of time, in our age of instant gratification, this is something that most people cannot do. I've been at it for 40 years. I've achieved some incredible successes and I'm still learning and practicing. Life is really a great mystery when you get down to it.

There is a great difference between the beliefs of St.Doubting Thomas who proclaimed "I believe, maybe" and believing in nothing at all. To a Taoist this is the difference between someone who has potentional and someone who does not. Belief is the Magic that makes it all work.

 

MESY

 

MESY

[Aetherous]

Hello Eric,

 

I agree...

 

I hope to see More Pie Guy's answer as to what results he wants exactly.

[idquest]

The GOAL of Taoism is to live in harmony with the Tao. This includes as basics: good health, long life, wonderful sexuality, balancing the energies in your body, establishing good personal moral qualities and calmness. At a higher level the goal is to silence the mind so as to perceive your Original Nature, Embryonic Breathing and creation of the immortal spirit body.

None of this is just fancy talk, to a long time practicing Taoist it can become a reality.

I'm not a New Age hippy author. I wrote about authentic Taoist practices some of which date back thousands of years. I didn't make anything up. But I can only speak for myself. As far as anyone having success with my books, I know of a number of people who've had spectacular success and I've never gotten any negative feedback in the 15 years since my 1st book was published.

Being sceptical is healthy. I myself am very skeptical and agree that alot of the material out there is crap. But it's not 99.9999999% crap. Being a nihilist puts you in conflict with the unity of the Tao. These practices require much work over a long period of time, in our age of instant gratification, this is something that most people cannot do. I've been at it for 40 years. I've achieved some incredible successes and I'm still learning and practicing. Life is really a great mystery when you get down to it.

There is a great difference between the beliefs of St.Doubting Thomas who proclaimed "I believe, maybe" and believing in nothing at all. To a Taoist this is the difference between someone who has potentional and someone who does not. Belief is the Magic that makes it all work.

 

MESY

 

MESY

+1

[Marblehead]

The GOAL of Taoism is to live in harmony with the Tao. This includes as basics: good health, long life, wonderful sexuality, balancing the energies in your body, establishing good personal moral qualities and calmness. At a higher level the goal is to silence the mind so as to perceive your Original Nature, Embryonic Breathing and creation of the immortal spirit body.

 

 

I like that!

 

I enjoyed the entire post. Thanks for sharing with us.

 

Peace & Love!

[Sloppy Zhang]

I think the best attitude to have is, instead of not believing anything until you see proof otherwise, is to withhold your judgment until you see something that makes you lean one way or another.

 

There are lots of people making lots of claims out there. I don't think that believing all of them until they disprove you (by, say, sexually abusing someone, getting their butt kicked in a bullshido throwdown, stealing money, etc etc) is any way to go, as you can easily be taken advantage of.

 

But not believing anyone until they prove to you otherwise (they are super healthy even into their late years, they can demonstrate some sort of ability, they visit you in dreams, you feel energy transmission, etc etc) is any way to go either, because there is a lot of good stuff written by just plain people- they might not have reached the highest of immortal heights in their lifetime, but the advice they give comes from a life well lived, and to not listen to that advice because they don't pass some immortal test isn't a very good strategy either.

 

Which is why, again, one should try to withhold judgment until enough information is given. This, in my opinion, doesn't conflict with having a skeptical, or inquisitive mind, and it doesn't turn you into some mindless "follow the leader" zombie either.

 

Everyone has to be on one side of the fence or the other these days- you either have to believe a teacher is legit, or believe he is full of crap. Why can't you just not comment because you haven't met the teacher or practiced their stuff?

 

There's nothing wrong with not having an opinion on someone or something.

[AmagicalFishy]

[de_paradise]

A successful wizard can receive a new piece of information and integrate it in his belief system in moments. As Sloppy Z says, it might come in a dream or be so fast that if you blink you miss it.