Ba Gua and Hsing-I of BK Frantzis

[JessOBrien]

Hi all,

 

I'm putting word out that well-known internal martial arts teacher BK Frantzis

is going to be teaching his martial arts systems next month here in California.

 

For those of us who enjoyed his book "Power of Internal Martial Arts", this is a

good opportunity to get exposed to his approach to Ba Gua and Hsing-I. He

trained with many famous teachers in the 1970's and 80's in Taiwan, Hong Kong

and China.

 

This summer's classes will give the participants a strong foundation in his

system, and will be of interest to beginning and advanced students alike.

 

The first course will be on Ba Gua's Single and Double Palm Changes. These are

the first two forms of the Ba Gua system. Details:

Ba Gua

 

The second course will be a weekend of training in Hsing-I's San Ti standing

practice. Details:

Hsing-I

 

If you are interested in his internal martial arts, this is a great chance to

check them out in person.

 

Sincerely,

 

Jess O'Brien

[Baguakid]

Does anyone know what this Onsite/Offsite descriptions mean?

 

Course fee: $995 offsite/$1,445 onsite if paid by April 19; $1,195 offsite/$1,595 onsite thereafter

[JessOBrien]

The onsite cost refers to if you are staying on campus during the event. Offsite means you stay elsewhere and commute to the event.

I've never stayed there myself, but it seems like a nice enough campus.

 

I posted this event here because it is focused on the first two forms of Ba Gua and the first form of Hsing-I. People who are interested in his method would do well to start from the beginning like this and get some of the basic training. Much of what he teaches is aimed at students who've been with him for a long time, so it's a nice opportunity to get in on the fundamental material.

 

He teaches the Palm Changes in terms of the I Ching trigrams. The Single Palm Change called Dan Huan Zhang teaches you to open, stretch, and lengthen the tissues of the body, as well as expansion of the mind to everything surrounding you. This is the energy of Heaven. The Double Palm called Shuang Huan Zhang is about the Earth energy which trains a number of things including the ability to withdraw and fold the body while remaining extended physically, using soft yin power in striking, and accessing the rising energy of the Earth that fills and powers the legs. The rest of his palm changes go though the trigrams and teach you how to feel the essence of each one which training solo and in partner exercises. I think it's pretty cool.

 

-Jess O

[Baguakid]

Maybe cool, maybe not.

 

I think it's quite expensive, especially since the hours are not outlined and since it's basic material. The first day starts training at 3pm and I'm sure the last day wouldn't be a full day. Any idea of the total hours in class?

[JBliss]

The pricing of this is outrageous. I wouldn't listen to BK Frantzis if he came to my house begging me

to have tea.

[doc benway]

I think Frantzis is quite accomplished in martial arts and Daoist meditation.

The price is high but good instruction is priceless.

We'll see what the market says...

I would like to spend some time with him given the opportunity.

Reading through some of his Daoist meditation work shows that he knows what he is talking about.

[cheya]

 

 

Maybe cool, maybe not.

I think it's quite expensive, especially since the hours are not outlined and since it's basic material. The first day starts training at 3pm and I'm sure the last day wouldn't be a full day. Any idea of the total hours in class?

I did Bruce's week long TuiNa course a couple years ago.
In terms of content, I was a newbie and fairly adrift, but the experience was totally worth the cost to me. Bruce is amazing, and input from his instructors and others who've been studying with him for years is an added bonus.
While it is "only" five days total, if you really jump in, the experience offers so much that, by the end of the week, you'll find yourself somewhat relieved that it doesn't go on longer. The energy was very strong. I couldn't get this from his books.

Although the dorm accommodations were somewhat spartan, the campus was beautiful, and the food was GREAT! I'm REALLY glad I went, and if I had more $$, I'd be at "Camp Kumar" every year, regardless of what he was teaching!

 

[Baguakid]

Sure, I've been around others who's Energy is fantastic. Only problem is, when you leave them the energy dissipates. I would have to meet BK Frantzis first to make a determination if it would be worth it. I'm not a newbie so to me beginning instruction for that much money is way out of line, regardless of the beautiful location. I've also viewed his Youtube material and have not yet been impressed. Perhaps I have not seen the right video, don't know. To each his own. I guess everyone needs to think about retirement.

 

Best,

[dwai]

I think Frantzis is quite accomplished in martial arts and Daoist meditation.

The price is high but good instruction is priceless.

We'll see what the market says...

I would like to spend some time with him given the opportunity.

Reading through some of his Daoist meditation work shows that he knows what he is talking about.

 

I agree. He has dedicated his life to the IMA, so why should we not pay to learn from him? Would those who complain about the fees rather stay on under his tutelage and do all the chores he asked you to do (in the traditional student-teacher model) instead? Like doing his laundry, his dishes, cook for him, clean his house, etc?

[JessOBrien]

Thanks to everyone for their input.

 

Remember this is just an opportunity to learn something. I'm not saying you should quit your teacher and join his school, etc. If you liked his books, then this event might be worth checking out.

 

Baguakid- I said the course material is cool. The price is a different matter entirely, which is subjective for each person and their income. Where I live this is the going rate. Where others live may be quite different. In terms of teaching hours, probably 3 hours the first day and 5 hours on each of the full days. As for evaluating the teacher before purchase, I guess that may be the best way to do things. Personally I have visited and paid dozens of teachers in my attempt to broaden my experience. Some were worth it some weren't. But in the world of martial arts that's the gamble one has to take in order to get exposed to the arts.

 

Adeha, thanks for contributing. I agree that his Tui Na classes are pretty good. He spent a lot of time working on those skills and it shows in his bodywork and in his lessons.

 

Dwai, I agree with your post. I'm interested in specific skills and methods, and I'll pay in order to get access to the lessons that teach those skills. A disciple relationship would be a much greater price to pay and if that was the only way to get access I'd be screwed.

 

My experience of training Hsing-I with Kumar is that he teaches in an extremely detailed manner, which includes body mechanics, and training the mind as well. His classes are meant to give you material to train for a year afterward, and as Adeha said the things he teaches gives you a lot to work on later. He is someone who has trained San Ti more than most of us have trained everything put together and has a deep knowledge of it. If you like San Ti, I think you would like his class. That's just my opinion though!

 

Jess O

[Baguakid]

Hey Jess,

 

Well, to be fair, I've also complained about Wang Liping's class pricing structure so BK Frantzis is in good company.

 

Again, I would have to meet the man first. Just to say this, I paid less than BK's seminar cost for a flight to China and nearly a year's tuition with my teacher. Of course, I can speak Chinese and was lucky to find a great teacher. In addition, I started CMAs in the early 80s and the MA atmosphere then was much different than it is now. I'll leave it at that.

 

Best,