Energy vs Western Medicine

[Gerard]

I have moved several of my posts of the healing circle because I found inappropriate having that sort of discussion mainly because of respect to the OP. TheSongsofDistantEarth's posts are in bold writing.

 

 

I recommend very seriously looking in to Pyridoxamine (or P-5-P)and CoEnzyme Q10(link). Don't expect much from a regular doctor, a Functional Medicine practitioner (usually an M.D. or D.O) may be of help.

 

 

I would say: stay away from that JUNK.

 

 

Why do you call this "junk"? Do you know what you're talking about? Man, this forum sure has devolved.

 

 

Simply because that product contains "Pyridorin", a drug designed by Biostratum, Inc.

 

I hope the OP sees a qualified TCM practitioner soon in order to heal, activate and strengthen the spirit of the Kidney with acupuncture and herbal treatment.

 

Happy healing!!

 

 

Note: well it is not just the kidney element. TCM approaches healing from a holistic perspective. Liver, spleen and invigorating blood flow need to be carefully looked into.

 

 

 

Pyradoxamine is very, very promising as a kidney treatment, and is a form of vitamin B6, so why is that "JUNK", durkrod? Even if it has been unfairly patented by Biostratum, it still seems like a great thing to consider. The problem is that Biostratum patented a naturally occurring compound for a specific use, not that Pyridoxamine is "junk". Had you bothered to read further, you would have found out that Pyridoxal-5-Phosphate (P-5-P) is another form of B-6 with similar properties, and is not under patent by a drug company. I believe that would be very valuable to someone with severe kidney problems. Why do you always seem dismiss everything else but TCM (which is but one form of acupuncture anyway)? TCM is but one piece of the healing puzzle, my friend...

 

 

No reply to this last message.

 

 

.................................

 

My question is:

 

Is Western Medicine enough to heal the sick in the long term, or you'd rather approach if from an energetic and emotional perspective.

[Ya Mu]

...

 

My question is:

 

Is Western Medicine enough to heal the sick in the long term, or you'd rather approach if from an energetic and emotional perspective.

 

I am a big fan of "whatever works". I believe we should take the best of Eastern and Western medicine and integrate into a whole.

And, it is true that what is know as TCM is but a small part of Chinese medicine. I have had better results from naturopathic approaches many times than from TCM. But sometimes TCM is the ticket. Don't throw anything out that works.

[That Guy]

Too broad, too general to really debate over.

[sifusufi]

I am a big fan of "whatever works". I believe we should take the best of Eastern and Western medicine and integrate into a whole.

And, it is true that what is know as TCM is but a small part of Chinese medicine. I have had better results from naturopathic approaches many times than from TCM. But sometimes TCM is the ticket. Don't throw anything out that works.

 

My two sense (sic) here if there is a major trauma (limb mutilation due to a combine harvester) for example a trauma surgeon and antibiotics

might be at the top of your list.

 

Having said that I am a firm believer in energy medicine!

 

I am by no means a purist

 

Question why is the western world (medicine, bio-nanotechnology) et al flooded with Asians, East Indians, Middle Eastern folk, Africans, et al?

Edited May 11, 2010 by sifusufi

[Ya Mu]

My two sense (sic) here if there is a major trauma (limb mutilation due to a combine harvester) for example a trauma surgeon and antibiotics

might be at the top of your list.

 

Having said that I am a firm believer in energy medicine!

 

...

Nah, go to your acupuncturist for a minor thing like that! :lol:

 

I agree, there should be someone practicing medical qigong in that hospital to start energy treatment as soon as you walk in and throughout the surgery. Would need less drugs for pain and healing would increase by a large factor. Work together and not separate.

[Sloppy Zhang]

My opinion is a blend of everything that has been said in this thread so far.

[Ya Mu]

Dang, I was cloning a hard drive on a new computer build and reading this at the same time and thought the thread title was "Eastern vs Western Medicine" so my reply was based on that.

So I want to add, now that I see the actual title.

I have stated this before but I firmly believe that energetic medicine positive effects are increasing each year. While at the same time Western medicine, in many ways, is working less. IMO Medical Qigong IS Future's medicine.

[sifusufi]

I have stated this before but I firmly believe that energetic medicine positive effects are increasing each year. While at the same time Western medicine, in many ways, is working less. IMO Medical Qigong IS Future's medicine.

Grazie Ya Mu

 

I offer up to the great spirit that the good ol' U.S. of A won't ban it like other healing modalities.

 

Peace brother,

Robert ( Mo Yo!)

[Gerard]

My two sense (sic) here if there is a major trauma (limb mutilation due to a combine harvester) for example a trauma surgeon and antibiotics

might be at the top of your list.

 

Having said that I am a firm believer in energy medicine!

 

I am by no means a purist

 

Question why is the western world (medicine, bio-nanotechnology) et al flooded with Asians, East Indians, Middle Eastern folk, Africans, et al?

 

 

Note that I said: sick. I never mentioned injured. These are two different concepts.

 

I opened the thread with regard to the first.

 

Hope this clears things up a bit.

[Aetherous]

Both types of medicine rock at times. Throwing out Western medicine is completely ignorant.

[tyler zambori]

I take P-5-P as part of my whole supplement regimen, and it helps.

 

Now I really got the aging thing slowed down, which is good, because

various health problems were causing a speedup of that situation.

(I'm 51, and diabetic, and hypothyroid).

 

Benfotiamine is also really good for the kidneys and nerves too.

 

I don't ask an M.D. what vitamins and supplements to take because

most of them neither know nor care about that. However, I do

research all of them, and look up stuff on pubmed.

Edited May 12, 2010 by tyler zambori

[sifusufi]

Note that I said: sick.

 

 

 

 

Hope this clears things up a bit.

 

Grazie Durkrod!

 

I meant (sic) as in misspelled, not as in HIV infection.

I know what you mean anyway, thought I would be cute and use sense instead of cents

When I state that Steve Vai is one sick player it is a highest order compliment

 

I was listening to Gregg Braden wax poetic regarding more people being slaughtered due to differences in the last hundred years than in all previous history (!) However technology advances double annually I can't say this is good or bad.

 

Always cool to see you and the best avatar ever ( my maternal grandmother's family was from Alsace, my mother went to her grave arguing with her brother that she was French, he swears German, I maintain Italian. This stuff matters to some folk) I should get a genetic exam

some feel I need a head exam

 

Ray Kurzweil has some ideas on the future of medicine that are mindblowing

 

When I maintained a purest attitude regarding by beliefs (sobriety, jazz, kung fu) I found my self ostracized more often than not

maybe thats why I love Ornette Coleman (now there's a futurist is every sense of the word)

 

Peace,

Robert

[Ya Mu]

Both types of medicine rock at times. Throwing out Western medicine is completely ignorant.

Agreed,

But two things have irked me for a long time and one of them is not getting better.

 

The first thing is "natural healers" who are totally anti western medicine. I have seen total ignorance of this and it is not true that all western meds are bad as many natural type people profess who really don't understand why or who they are advising nor the drug reaction they spew nonsense against.

 

But the situation that is getting worse instead of better is the acceptance and integration of energy medicine in the western system. Back in 1993 I was actually teaching medical qigong at a western hospital as part of the family medicine program. More of an overview than the actual thing but still a foot in the door. Now it is 2010, almost 20 years later. So I am at the dentist and the girl in the room over is screaming in pain with TMJ syndrome. I tell the dentist I can help her and have actually seen success with several hundred TMJ patients. But he ignorantly refused to tell his patient about it and just let her go on hurting. So I am dropping off literature at an arthritis doc's office, people are hobbling around grunting in pain. I explained to them that I have had success with several hundred arthritis patients. What did the doc do with my literature? Threw it in the wastebasket. Not a single referral for these folks.

 

Even though I do get physician referrals the system is badly broken. I think western medicine, as we know it, is on its way out. The drugs are not working as well, no really new good drugs for common conditions, the drug companies only focusing on the highly lucrative products, insurance corruption, etc. Hopefully it will reform to give humanity the best instead of the worst it has to offer.

 

World medicine with integration of the best of all is the ticket.

 

Edit: Also, why not have a minimum of 6 medical qigong folks on staff in a hospital - why has this not yet occurred? Ignorance and prejudice? Mostly. Elitism? Yes, that too. Or is it "science's fault? Surely. Can't objectively measure qi, now can we. In "Science" subjective things like "my pain is gone" is meaningless. IMO, PURE STUPIDITY.

Edited May 12, 2010 by Ya Mu

[Baguakid]

IMO, PURE STUPIDITY

 

Agreed.

 

The only thing I can say is "they are not yet ready to be unplugged".

 

 

It's a hard path to know the truth and see people who could be helped with it and yet they just pass it by like it's a rotting, dead animal.

[That Guy]

Well, if you guys wont make a real reputation for your healing methods then someone else will, and people will make their decisions based on that.

You guys need to build a stronger and more solid reputation, stop 2nd class practitioners from teaching and "healing", expose the frauds by showing what real masters can do, set official standards.

 

 

"they are not yet ready to be unplugged" when they're unplugged they shall wake up in a goo pod only to find out they are a battery for the machines! Oh Please....

They simply do not believe, because for their whole life no one has given them a reason to believe. Western medicine on the other hand has (should/do they believe everything it says? no, but in their mind it is their best bet)

[Aetherous]

You guys need to build a stronger and more solid reputation, stop 2nd class practitioners from teaching and "healing", expose the frauds by showing what real masters can do, set official standards.

 

Agree with this!

[Ya Mu]

Well, if you guys wont make a real reputation for your healing methods then someone else will, and people will make their decisions based on that.

You guys need to build a stronger and more solid reputation, stop 2nd class practitioners from teaching and "healing", expose the frauds by showing what real masters can do, set official standards.

 

 

"they are not yet ready to be unplugged" when they're unplugged they shall wake up in a goo pod only to find out they are a battery for the machines! Oh Please....

They simply do not believe, because for their whole life no one has given them a reason to believe. Western medicine on the other hand has (should/do they believe everything it says? no, but in their mind it is their best bet)

Agree with this!

 

Well let us see. I really don't think you guys understand what is involved.

 

I have been promoting this for 30 years or so. Yes, I have had many physicians as clients including neurosurgeons that send their entire family to me. Yes I have great reputation. But that doesn't mean anything whatsoever as far as education of the medical profession. What else has been done? Well to "weed out the 2nd class practitioners" is a very difficult thing as no person has any control. If they have a license to touch (massage, chiropractic, PT, etc) then they use this (IMO stupid) phrase called "energy work". So someone goes to this person, has no results, but never understands that medical qigong is an entirely different thing. What has been done to educate? The NQA (www.nqa.org) has gone to great lengths to do this but do you realize the funds it would take to really educate the medical profession much less the public?

 

The NQA has addressed the issue of "weeding out 2nd class practitioners". I was on the standards committee and for two years we hashed out standards for medical qigong practitioners; these standards are in place and the NQA does issue certification. But all the massage/chiropractic/PT practitioners can ignore this and say they do "energy work" and tell people it is the same thing as medical qigong. There are NO federal or state standards in place other than the NQA organizational one.

I have taught at 2 major medical schools and one hospital. The problem is, when the particular physician that was sponsoring died or transferred, no one else was willing to even talk about it.

 

AS far as the public goes, if a medical qigong practitioner lives in a place with a large enough population, then if they have efficacy they will have plenty of clients. But this doesn't mean the medical profession will recognize it much less endorse it.

[Baguakid]

Yes, I'm not a Medical Qigong practioner (do not carry this title) but I have tried to help people by offering Qigong exercises which would help them with their conditions and yes, they look at you like a deer in the headlights. Like they've just seen an alien, or they engage in your conversation with interest and forget everything you said the moment you leave. Most are drawn in by the drugs, medical science, etc to solve "ALL" of their health problems. Western medicine is great in a lot of areas but at the same time Qigong is also a fantastic way of minimizing the need for any western medicine.

 

My own sister, who has problems with her sight has been to neurologists, had a CAT Scans, a Spinal Tap, Blood work, etc and the doctors (in the end) can find nothing wrong with her. The neurologist first said she had borderline MS so he starts treating her with some MS drugs. Made my sister loopy. Said her sight would be cleared up in a couple weeks... After three weeks, nothing. Then he decides to do a spinal tap. Done. Then he concludes she doesn't have MS but it must be Diabetes. She goes for blood work. They say no, no diabetes. So, to date, still no answer. She can't work, she can see sometimes, goes in and out. So, Western medicine is good when they know what's wrong and can treat it. Otherwise it's like their patients are lab rats. Let's try this, let's try that. Do they care that what they're trying is costing you thousands of dollars??? Hell no.

 

Now, I'm fairly certain if my sister would listen to me and practice Wuji for 2 hours a day (she's not doing anything but sitting in front of the TV all day now) then she would see results. But, she can't get it, doesn't want to get it, and doesn't care to practice.

 

So??

 

Another quick story. My coworker's mom had some intestinal problem that was causing her to lose weight. She went to doctors who insisted her small intestine was the problem and they told her to have sugery to take a portion of it out. Which she did. Did it help??? HELL NO.. ! So then she goes to another hospital who said it was something else. And they are still working on it. But meanwhile, her small intestine cannot be replaced.

 

WTF? Does the doctor care that what he did didn't work? Hell No! Did the woman try any Eastern or Energy medicine at my suggestion? Hell No!

 

So??

 

No, people don't care to be unplugged.

Edited May 13, 2010 by Baguakid

[Baguakid]

One other thing. I lived in China for nearly 2 years and can say there's a deep difference between the people of China and those in the US.

 

Most here want to be treated. They want someone else to take care of their problem and fix it for them. People in China want to be in control of their health as much as possible. Go to any park in the morning and see how many people are out there practicing. How many people talk about what foods to eat and when, etc etc..

 

Go to the park here? Hardly anyone that I see.

 

The differences are deep.

 

Of course this is general. Not all in China and all in the US are stuffed into the above. Just most.

[That Guy]

Hmmm well can you find sick or in pain doctors to show them? to convert them, bring them to your side through experience, then they wont throw out your fliers and stuff.

And have you considered or tried addressing the problem at the root, by demonstrating these things at the educational level? When future doctors are more open to new ideas.

 

And without laws in place to stop these poor "energy workers" from practising or false advertising as medical qi gong you're kinda stuck, standards will be all over the place. And it will only take 1 bad one to convince some people its all bad. When a doctor is found to be doing things "wrong" however they stop him from practising, which pushes for certain standards being kept.(as far as I know)

 

Baguakid

 

Yes it sucks that people don't try other things, but things like exercise take more time and effects aren't as immediate for people to have faith in them. You have to make a really strong case because people dont understand what you're even trying to get them to do, how it works and they ve lived their whole life believing in another thing.

I dont know if you live with your sister, but keep trying, and really trying by doing the exercise with her everyday if you have to. Patients dont even follow doctors orders a lot of the times, its just how people are for the most part, lazy. But basically, don't just tell her, show her.

 

People simply dont believe, they dont have a strong enough case to believe this stuff works. I've tried to get someone with arthritis to try out tai chi, they just said "this is silly, slow, hows this even gonna work? these things are fake (energy healing type stuff)". Can I do anything to prove them wrong? No. I dont practice myself or have health problems to try and solve either.(thank god)

I call pull out some success stories videos, but they can look so fake I think a lot of them do more harm than good.

 

 

Me, I would rather try everything before before I let anyone cut me open.

 

As far as the public is concerned you're in the same boat as the guy on the picture, and I wouldn't entrust people from his "group" with my health.

[RiverSnake]

I feel that the argument of West versus East in terms of medicine is an example of the "Right Brain versus Left Brain" argument. Both sides have validity and a healthy balance between the two is best.

[genmaicha]

As far as the public is concerned you're in the same boat as the guy on the picture, and I wouldn't entrust people from his "group" with my health.

 

Wow, great picture. Sort of the psychic version of the Undercover Brother.

I thought at first that it was from a comedy movie or something but apparently this guy is for real :-)

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=VKpye0xzp4k

Edited May 13, 2010 by genmaicha