Time to move on

[C T]

I'll have to sit with that and let it percolate. I'm not sure that I can buy into that. Is that more a personal interpretation or a pretty universal one?

maybe it means attaining to the kind of wisdom that no longer needs to dwell on any opposable, subjective realities.

 

Prajnaparamita - Transcendent Wisdom? Whatever is thrown up one is able to see that it is never a dead-end street. Always resting in the joyous acknowledgement that one can go beyond... Being (also referring to the person) able to rest continuously in this state one cast no shadows, for shadows appear only where arising/ceasing duality exists, and furthermore, this dualistic existence only has time to manifest when one is caught in the 'self'. Without being caught where is the platform for duality to stand on? One-pointed wisdom -wisdom gone beyond - adamantine wisdom - wisdom without equal... are some of the inadequate descriptions of this kind of abiding-in.

 

--------

 

When thoughts are allowed to come and go without any self-referencing in the manipulation of their subtle movements, these energies get less room to leave any imprints (shadows). I think this is also similar to the Sitting in Oblivion of the Tao tradition.

 

--------

 

 

(Just a couple of ways of interpreting the above. Hope you dont mind my butting in Mr Songs. Btw i just read what you wrote in the 'new age bullies' thread - it was excellent! Bravo!)

[Starjumper]

Whats your definition of nei kung starjumper?

 

 

And I just know the hardcore guys I saw in "Among White CLouds" documentary looked like a bunch of depressed people (except 1, who had a group of students). Are those guys that leave everything and go live isolated until they whatever (ascend?) not following the teaching right? (if you ve seen the documentary)

And also in that, there was a guy close to enlightenment or something like that, they spoke with him a bit, seemed like a any miserable guy I can find just down the street, what gives?

 

I'll check that thread and see. I did read the Book Encounters with Chinese Hermits.

 

If a person wants to live ins olitude to practice that's fine, in fact my Nei kung makes people go through a stage where they REALLY want to be hermits. Maybe that's because it was originally a practice for hermits Just kidding, that's not why, but it was originally by and for hermits.

 

A person can get very depressed after enlightenment, some go crazy, and they can be depressed before enlightenment too.

[Vajrahridaya]

Look in the mirror, Bozo.

 

What I said above is exactly right, study that, scholar.

 

 

 

Studied? ROFL I don't study no frikin' books man.

 

 

Thus you remain conditioned by your own limited thoughts, feelings and interpretations.

 

Vajrahridaya:

EDIT: The Buddha also taught that enlightenment is the freedom from all shadows, or "dark sides" as you put it. This really means perspectives based on ignorance, and has nothing to do with the black and white thinking that you are expressing.

I know what Buddha taught and I know what you fundamentalists preach. Remember, religion is for the spiritually handicapped.

 

As the Buddha taught, there are different degrees of enlightenment and there are also different degrees to what people want from spirituality. I find the different traditions reflect this fact very deeply and sometimes only subtlety. Though enlightenment can happen anywhere, to anyone... there are traditions that speak more genuinely about what it's about. But, there are both serious students with open and brilliant minds and students filled with short comings in their interpretations located in any spiritual tradition.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Vajrahridaya]

 

A person can get very depressed after enlightenment, some go crazy,

 

It's definitely not enlightenment then and merely an experience on the path of life.

 

and they can be depressed before enlightenment too.

Sure, this can happen.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Vajrahridaya]

I think this is also similar to the Sitting in Oblivion of the Tao tradition.

 

As long as it means all the facets of life, like walking, talking, brushing one's teeth, pooping, and not just sitting on the cushion? Then yes...

[C T]

I'll check that thread and see. I did read the Book Encounters with Chinese Hermits.

 

You just said above you do not need to read anything?

[Starjumper]

Thus you remain conditioned by your own limited thoughts, feelings and interpretations.

 

Look in the mirror again Bozo.

 

As the Buddha taught, there are different degrees of enlightenment and there are also different degrees to what people want from spirituality. I find the different traditions reflect this fact very deeply and sometimes only subtlety. Though enlightenment can happen anywhere, to anyone... there are traditions that speak more genuinely about what it's about. But, there are both serious students with open and brilliant minds and students filled with short comings in their interpretations located in any spiritual tradition.

 

Why do you always come across with this "as the Buddha taught" when it's like kindergarten level obvious common knowledge? Does that make it seem deep to you?

Edited July 20, 2010 by Starjumper7

[C T]

As long as it means all the facets of life, like walking, talking, brushing one's teeth, pooping, and not just sitting on the cushion? Then yes...

yes, all actions and thoughts become inseparably spontaneous, without the need for any compartmentalizations and prior motives. Brushing teeth and sitting becomes one continuous action of flow sort of way...

 

Thanks!

Edited July 20, 2010 by CowTao

[Vajrahridaya]

Look in the mirror again Bozo.

 

I try to all the time... all the time. I rather try to surrender to the mirror... excuse the inadequacy of language here.

 

.... when it's like kindergarten level obvious common knowledge? Does that make it seem deep to you?

 

I like playing in shallow sandboxes with wide fields of mud to work with... You can build very high towers in the middle with such a vast supply of wet Earth.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Starjumper]

You just said above you do not need to read anything?

 

I do sometimes read books about people who practice but not so much anymore, I have no appetite for pompous religious philosophy dictates.

 

In the book Encounter's with Chines Hermits it mentions a Buddhist hermit who is "Just waiting for the Fire" (funeral pyre) A common Buddhist fundamentalist sentiment.

 

It's definitely not enlightenment then and merely an experience on the path of life.

 

Once again your fundamentalist dogma disagrees with reality.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Starjumper7

[Vajrahridaya]

yes, all actions and thoughts become inseparably spontaneous, without the need for any compartmentalizations and prior motives. Brushing teeth and sitting becomes one continuous action of flow sort of way...

 

Thanks!

 

Based upon connection to infinite regress and emptiness, not as one or two, just thus. Of course.

 

From William Blake's poem The Marriage of Heaven and Hell:

 

"If the doors of perception were cleansed every thing would appear to man as it is, infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things through narrow chinks of his cavern."

[Vajrahridaya]

 

In the book Encounter's with Chines Hermits it mentions a Buddhist hermit who is "Just waiting for the Fire" (funeral pyre) A common Buddhist fundamentalist sentiment.

 

 

Only for those that mis-understand the Buddhas teaching. Which plenty of Buddhists do.

[Starjumper]

Only for those that mis-understand the Buddhas teaching. Which plenty of Buddhists do.

Of course you aren't one of them:D.

 

Hey, you finally said something correct. Why don't you go find some books and read about why that is. ROFL

Edited July 20, 2010 by Starjumper7

[C T]

I do sometimes read books about people who practice but not so much anymore, I have no appetite for pompous religious philosophy dictates.

 

In the book Encounter's with Chines Hermits it mentions a Buddhist hermit who is "Just waiting for the Fire" (funeral pyre) A common Buddhist fundamentalist sentiment.

 

Good to know you are a man who can bend with the wind Starjumper.

 

This 'waiting' you mentioned is common perhaps to all hermits from all the different traditions? Each waiting for their own whatever. Who can really say what the inner being awaits eh? Maybe the joy is in the waiting, not so much that which is waited for. Is this not another way of looking at developing the eternal virtue of patience? In your esteemed opinion, how do you see Taoists cultivating patience? Is patience a fundamentalistic notion too? Your thoughts?

Edited July 20, 2010 by CowTao

[Vajrahridaya]

It's definitely not enlightenment then and merely an experience on the path of life.

 

 

Once again your fundamentalist dogma disagrees with reality.

 

There is no inherent reality, only relativity and if one is always enlightened of this fact, there is only continuous joy in ever changing visions, tastes, smells, sounds, thoughts and feelings.

[Vajrahridaya]

Good to know you are a man who can bend with the wind Starjumper.

 

This 'waiting' you mentioned is common perhaps to all hermits from all the different traditions? Each waiting for their own whatever. Who can really say what the inner being awaits eh? Maybe the joy is in the waiting, not so much that which is waited for.

 

Nice play on the Buddhas words, "Paths are made for traveling and not destinations." Which of course is a relative truth in fact, but a nice revelation of insight.

[Starjumper]

This 'waiting' you mentioned is common perhaps to all hermits from all the different traditions? Each waiting for their own whatever. Who can really say what the inner being awaits eh? Maybe the joy is in the waiting, not so much that which is waited for. Is this not another way of looking at developing the eternal virtue of patience? In your esteemed opinion, how do you see Taoists cultivating patience? Is patience a fundamentalistic notion too? Your thoughts?

Patience is not fundamentalist, patience comes from being able to love.

 

There are some people who are excited about life. They jump out of bed in the morning and hit the floor running, excited about and looking forward to the new day and what it holds. Unfortunately most of them are under five years old.

 

The Buddhist mentioned above was depressive and wanted to end life, looking forward to the fire. Taoists are more like the five year olds I just mentioned.

 

The sage is like a child, yes?

[Vajrahridaya]

 

The Buddhist mentioned above was depressive and wanted to end life, looking forward to the fire.

 

Not very Buddhist to me.

 

The sage is like a child, yes?

 

Yes, but without excusing responsibility.

[Starjumper]

The Buddhist mentioned above was depressive and wanted to end life, looking forward to the fire.

Not very Buddhist to me.

Wrong again. Buddhists tend to focus on suffering and depression and what people give their attention to they will attract into their lives.

 

Gross, I just realized, I better stop giving you my attention ROFL.

[C T]

Patience is not fundamentalist, patience comes from being able to love.

 

There are some people who are excited about life. They jump out of bed in the morning and hit the floor running, excited about and looking forward to the new day and what it holds. Unfortunately most of them are under five years old.

 

The Buddhist mentioned above was depressive and wanted to end life, looking forward to the fire. Taoists are more like the five year olds I just mentioned.

 

The sage is like a child, yes?

Yes the sage is like a child... in all stages as one whole unfolding. So even when one reaches 90, the mind can still 'hit the floor running..."

 

I do not think it was very accurate to take the one presumed view of an individual to reflect against the general presumed views of the vast majority of Taoists, yes?

 

If you hold the general notion that all Buddhists are as depressed as that individual portrayed, then i do not know what else to say except its a flabbergasting way of looking at others, considering you seem to know the right ways of looking at all things? If you are as enthused about life as you say (which is great btw) then how can you so easily be taken in by the little irritations that confronts you, as evidenced by some of your responses? Not all though, just some...

[Vajrahridaya]

Wrong again. Buddhists tend to focus on suffering and depression and what people give their attention to they will attract into their lives.

 

Nope, Buddhists focus on the removal of suffering by seeing that it's merely a delusion in perception.

 

Thus the 4 noble truths, and only the first one says that there is suffering on a relative level to the second noble truth, the one which names it's relative cause as ignorance in some readings or craving in others. So basically an educated Buddhist understands that suffering only exists relative to one's ignorance of the nature of things. The other 2 noble truths focus on it's removal and the complete freedom from suffering that is understood directly through including the 8 fold path into ones life. These include the 8 Jhana or bliss states of meditation for cultivating incredible joy of form to formless degrees and finally freeing oneself from attachment to these as well, even while enjoying and mastering them fully.

 

You do need to read more.

[宁]

We're Taoists and Buddhists only in our minds, just because our monkey clings to something just to make us look important.

We're beings of flesh blood and breath...

And we're all going to die.

 

Starting from that only certain fact in life, can you start building on truth?

[Vajrahridaya]

We're Taoists and Buddhists only in our minds, just because our monkey clings to something just to make us look important.

We're beings of flesh blood and breath...

And we're all going to die.

 

Starting from that only certain fact in life, can you start building on truth?

 

Death is really just a voyage to another life. Just like the death of one thought leads to the other, directly or indirectly linked to the prier thought. Death is an illusion of perception, even the physical elements move on to feed new life. The mind or energy of the individual move on to manifest a new life in either higher or lower dimensions or this very same or similar one depending on how these energies have focused.

 

This fact of life can be experienced in the 3rd to 4th meditative Jhana as well as between the 4th and 5th Jhana directly. Jhana means meditative absorption.

 

I find there is a lot more to what a person believes in then merely the surface of we are merely all bodies. I don't find that we are actually bodies much at all, and even bodies aren't really bodies either, physics speaking.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Vajrahridaya

[Pero]

I know what Buddha taught

 

LOL, no, you obviously don't.

[C T]

Death is really just a voyage to another life. Just like the death of one thought leads to the other, directly or indirectly linked to the prier thought. Death is an illusion of perception, even the physical elements move on to feed new life. The mind or energy of the individual move on to manifest a new life in either higher or lower dimensions or this very same or similar one depending on how these energies have focused.

 

This fact of life can be experienced in the 3rd to 4th meditative Jhana as well as between the 4th and 5th Jhana directly. Jhana means meditative absorption.

 

I find there is a lot more to what a person believes in then merely the surface of we are merely all bodies. I don't find that we are actually bodies much at all, and even bodies aren't really bodies either, physics speaking.

I think the core message Little1 is putting across is: Cease bickering like little toddlers nudging for playground space!! :lol:

 

But your explanation is a good reminder too, to keep the thoughts of liberation fresh.