The Wind Path

[Encephalon]

It's summer in Los Angeles again. I overheated badly last year at this time and have recently allowed my MCO to travel in reverse. The literature on this is limited; "The Root of Chinese Chi Kung" by Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming is the only reference I've found it in. He says it's indicated for ameliorating too much yang. All I know is that it's very natural for me and the current is strong. Any enlightened observations/precautions?

Thanks in advance.

[Kameel]

Good intuition. Mostly oral tradition. Advice? If psychic stuff gets too intense, reverse the reverse, ground, and place awareness on the belt channels. Tongue up (especially for yin MCO).

 

Prefered method for many.

Edited July 19, 2010 by Kameel

[hagar]

Good intuition. Mostly oral tradition. Advice? If psychic stuff gets too intense, reverse the reverse, ground, and place awareness on the belt channels. Tongue up (especially for yin MCO).

 

Prefered method for many.

 

This is probably irrelevant, but the "reverse MCO" is the natural way. I.e how the energy runs trough your ren and du channels if you do nothing, and use no technique.

 

In my qigong forms we lead chi intentionally through this "reverse" mco.

 

My best advice is to not focus so much on the flow and instead tune into the cosmic or static state. More potent,and beyond imbalances....

 

h

[Starjumper]

Reverse MCO is not natural, forward is, this is one reason that in tai chi when the palms are facing down in front of you it is called 'with the flow', when palms are facing up in front of you it is called 'against the flow'.

 

... have recently allowed my MCO to travel in reverse.

 

Allowed or forced?

Edited July 19, 2010 by Starjumper7

[Encephalon]

Reverse MCO is not natural, forward is, this is one reason that in tai chi when the palms are facing down in front of you it is called 'with the flow', when palms are facing up in front of you it is called 'against the flow'.

 

Allowed or forced?

 

That would be "allowed." This was the initial direction when the Little Orbit first started circulating almost a year ago. I standardized it with the forward direction as this seemed like such prevalent advice, but the reverse feels great and smooth. I guess there will always be contrary views, yes?

[Aetherous]

Wind path is great.

 

I remember you asking about it in the past, Blasto...seems you are being led to it frequently!

 

It's totally natural, and can be practiced in a gentle way (by just guiding with awareness, instead of pushing your sensations around). It does good things! It's a more spiritual type of circulation, whereas regular MCO is for strengthening your energy.

 

If you're doing it wrong, your body will let you know. Simple.

 

For cooling off the body in the summer, it'd probably be better to have a lot of cooling foods, drink enough water, and to keep a fan on you.

[Pero]

Reverse MCO is not natural, forward is, this is one reason that in tai chi when the palms are facing down in front of you it is called 'with the flow', when palms are facing up in front of you it is called 'against the flow'.

 

What Hagar was talking about was how the chi flow is generally in those meridians according to TCM. And it is indeed up the conception vessel and not down. Though the flow in the governing is up as well.

[Pero]

Also Blasto, are you sure this is the wind path? My memory might be off since it's been a while since I read about it, but I thought the reverse orbit was the water path, "normal" was the fire path and the wind path was actually using a little different channels.

[Aetherous]

Water path is up the spine. Wind is reverse orbit.

 

...this delineation is according to Yang Jwing Ming. Other schools might call these different things.

Edited July 20, 2010 by Scotty

[Starjumper]

 

Reverse MCO is not natural, forward is, this is one reason that in tai chi when the palms are facing down in front of you it is called 'with the flow', when palms are facing up in front of you it is called 'against the flow'.

 

Allowed or forced?

 

That would be "allowed." This was the initial direction when the Little Orbit first started circulating almost a year ago. I standardized it with the forward direction as this seemed like such prevalent advice, but the reverse feels great and smooth. I guess there will always be contrary views, yes?

 

I'm sorry, I didn't say it right, natural was not the correct word. If you get reverse flow happening by itself then that is indeed natural. Whether t flows either way is 'natural'. What I meant to say is that in general, in most people, most of the time, the flow is the forward way, not reverse .. which TAA DAA, is why it's called reverse

 

So I wasn't as contrary as I lead you to believe - but I can be contrary =) For example, what I'm going to say next is pretty contrary around these parts: Just observe the flows, don't force them. ALSO observe all the flows, in all parts of your body, for if you only watch one thing it's almost as bad as forcing it. This is because chi follows your attention so it makes sense to watch what youare giving your attention to. Everyone knows this, and yet they read somewhere that they should do the circle jerk for enlightenment ROFL

[Pero]

Water path is up the spine. Wind is reverse orbit.

 

...this delineation is according to Yang Jwing Ming. Other schools might call these different things.

 

I see. I just checked in the big medical qigong book by dr. J.A. Johnson and there it says

fire=up the governing, down the conception

water=up the conception, down the governing

wind=up the taiji pole, down the conception.

[Aetherous]

Interesting.

[Mokona]

I'm sorry, I didn't say it right, natural was not the correct word. If you get reverse flow happening by itself then that is indeed natural. Whether t flows either way is 'natural'. What I meant to say is that in general, in most people, most of the time, the flow is the forward way, not reverse .. which TAA DAA, is why it's called reverse

 

So I wasn't as contrary as I lead you to believe - but I can be contrary =) For example, what I'm going to say next is pretty contrary around these parts: Just observe the flows, don't force them. ALSO observe all the flows, in all parts of your body, for if you only watch one thing it's almost as bad as forcing it. This is because chi follows your attention so it makes sense to watch what youare giving your attention to. Everyone knows this, and yet they read somewhere that they should do the circle jerk for enlightenment ROFL

 

Though you don't notice anything breaking up or paths being cleared when you do MCO or related energy moving? I do, I just figured it was the same for everybody, what is it that you experience?

[Pero]

Interesting.

 

Here's something that I didn't know and might be of interest also:

 

The Governing and Conception Vessels each have two energy flows on the anterior and posterior vertical midline of the body. Each vessel's pathway is complete, being composed of an ascending energetic flow and a descending energetic flow. The duality of these two medial lines joins at the extremities (the head and perineum), forming one complete circle of energetic current. Both vessels are superimposed on each other, with the energy of the Governing Vessel being predominant up the back and inferior down the front (behind the Conception Vessel);the energy of the Conception Vessel is predominant up the front and inferior down the back (behind the Governing

Vessel).

Edited July 20, 2010 by Pero

[Birch]

"This is because chi follows your attention so it makes sense to watch what youare giving your attention to. Everyone knows this"

 

- yeah, but I (at least) forget. All the time, which is why I practice

 

I may burn this screen with all the attention I'm giving it (sound of someone's hardrive going down )

 

Nah, seriously. Starjaumper, you're a smart guy but I find you somewhat heavy on the snarkasm. Must be the mirror getting dusty again

[Starjumper]

Though you don't notice anything breaking up or paths being cleared when you do MCO or related energy moving? I do, I just figured it was the same for everybody, what is it that you experience?

 

My teacher told me not to do things such as the MCO. All my energy flows were wide open AND I had a huge amount of energy before trying the MCO, which I only did once. I felt a lot of heat when I did it, and in the end it was quite detrimental to my practice. You can find a fuller description of it in the Qi is not energy thread, around page three of that, I think.

[Starjumper]

Nah, seriously. Starjaumper, you're a smart guy but I find you somewhat heavy on the snarkasm. Must be the mirror getting dusty again

 

I like to think of it as the mirror having an amplifier. I take the passive agresive turds dropped by Vaj the Buddhist and, like when shit hits the fan, throw them back with great vigah. Vaj doesn't realize he's covered in poo as he continues on his ignorant unaware way.

 

Just watch, hell say something inane about this which he thinks is clever.

[forestofclarity]

I wonder if it is possible to "force" chi. My experience tends to say the opposite--- that you get more out of opening and relaxing than anything else.

[joeblast]

I wonder if it is possible to "force" chi. My experience tends to say the opposite--- that you get more out of opening and relaxing than anything else.

Quite a few people whose opinions I respect have given the water analogy - if you want to get water somewhere, lead it - if you push it is only going to go down any outlet it might find, and you might not want those results - leading with intent only cajoles it into the direction of intent...

[Encephalon]

I bought Chunyi Lin's intro pak awhile ago and had some good results with his MCO approach - you inhale into each point on the circuit and exhale toward the next point, repeating as you go. There's no sense of forcing, more like a coaxing of the breath through a tube.

[Starjumper]

You can find a fuller description of it in the Qi is not energy thread, around page three of that, I think.

 

Sorry, that was way off, it's more like 2 - 3 pages from the end of that thread.

[Birch]

"the water analogy - if you want to get water somewhere, lead it"

 

I will approach this as an other-defined "water person". Water isn't "lead" but will flow to where things are needed, also where things are open. So open it and water will come. That's what it does

 

Of course this is pure analogy and speculation and invective on my part.

[Aetherous]

A thought...

 

Maybe how you circulate the orbit is more important than opening it up. When the back and front unite as one flow, then spiritual stuff happens...and as a result of that (embryonic state) the body heals and opens up.

[Birch]

"then spiritual stuff happens"

 

What exactly happens? How is it "spiritual"

 

Thanks Scott

[Encephalon]

"then spiritual stuff happens"

 

What exactly happens? How is it "spiritual"

 

Thanks Scott

 

 

Yeah, I'd kinda like to get in on the "spiritual" conversation too. I've read some of the esoteric Chinese stuff (English translations of course) and have plowed through a few works on the psychology of the Chakras (Anodea Judith and Caroline Myss have some thoughtful insights). I've heard people speak most guardedly about the fireworks that come with the Third Eye opens, but I still haven't gotten any solid depictions of these internal states.

 

It sort of takes me back 30 years when accomplished LSD aficionados made lame attempts to explain their powerful insights, and now I've learned that there really is a language and vocabulary to explain altered states of consciousness without impenetrable abstractions.

 

My guess is that these experiences will of course have to be defined with basic psychological principles. My guess is that Taoism, Buddhist psychology, eco-psychology all play an important role in getting us to a participatory experience of Indra's Web. There I go again - playing the ecology card again, but I don't see astral projection as a likely alternative, at least not for most of us.

 

Any doctors or therapists care to chime in?