Loneliness

[hajimesaito]

A tiger only gets sex when he/she wants it, and with no attachments right? Well I'm pretty sure that if you could not get sex even when you wanted to you would feel lonely. I know I would. In fact it seems that would be the only reason why I'd feel lonely sometimes.

 

Maybe you wouldn't care. What if you were a virgin at the age of 35 and couldn't get any woman? I'm pretty sure that would make you feel lonely. A virgin at 24 and can't get a woman? I'm pretty sure you would feel lonely and frustrated. Couldn't even make friends, when you wanted. Couldn't even socialize with any woman because well... they all reject you no matter what, even before you start talking to any they all look you down. You might feel a bit lonely.

 

Solitude is when you choose to be lonely. When you're ok with it. Not when you're sick (physiologically) of it. It's a very physical need for bodily health. If you don't think so then look at the trouble people have with SEX everyday. Sure you could live alone, but sex, now that's another thing.

 

Im a yang fire tiger..

 

As a tiger, you might just need less contact with others and prefer less contact with others. But you still desire at least the minimum. If you don't get that minimum you'll probably desire it a lot more. You want to choose when you want to have someone, and when to not, not have it "dictate" you. Or distract you. Would you truly be happy to be absolutely alone your entire life?

 

How about if you come across daily many beautiful women, and you cannot even socialize with any one of them. It just annoys you. You're like a tied up horse and they want to burn you from behind but can't move. They all reject you, without pity or concern. In fact most of them don't even know they do, or it's just unconscious to them. In fact it may even be unconscious to them why they are attracted to others and not you. In fact they may disregard you as some nothing, no matter what you do. No matter what.

 

You'd feel alone.

 

 

Non,

 

Since now you've compelled me to reply I will go a bit on my personal life. Thats because nobody here knows who I am except my nick (I wouldn't like to be known beyond that either). Whatever symptoms you have given are still that of the first kind among my classification.

 

I also lost virginity relatively late in life (22 yrs). But I was never desperate to loose it in the first place. I respected girls and womankind in general and even when my bodily desires compelled my mind to perceive woman with lust (which happened many many times) for a moment, my respect for the beauty of women, overtook the lost always. I was a little shy of girls too. On top of that, it has always been my luck that I had very few girls around me where ever I went. I still waited. Then one day I fell in love with a girl. I was deeply in love. It was more like a fantasy love where I care for my girl a lot, loved her, and tried to make her as happy as I could. I did not even care about sex for the first few months. Because that was not important. Then one day I lost virginity. And we both made love a couple of times more subsequently. We both loved each other a lot and this reflected even on bed.

 

But then things changed, mistakes happened, suspicion, betrayal etc. My heart was shattered too like hers. Months went by and slowly I began to accept the reality. My body had been perhaps desiring sex, but my mind was still deep beneath the sea of emotions for her. I went to another place, away from her. May be it was a sense of revenge too in my mind, because I ultimately decided to have sex with a prostitute. Perhaps it must have been loneliness too as I was new in the city. But when I went to bed with her, I felt nothing at all. Nothing. All my lust that had been growing over these months suddenly got destroyed. I also felt a strong sense of guilt for doing whatever I was doing. I realized that sex is not everything. It is in fact nothing great for people to run after it so madly. I have learned a lesson now and have resumed my life as before. I no longer crave for sex. Perhaps some amount of love still exists in my heart for my ex...but thats all. Besides, that I have no other craving.

 

Also, in the wild every Tiger has his tigresses who have territories surrounding the male's territory. And it is usually the Tigresses that go to the Tiger when its the season. But the Tiger still remains alone.

[Non]

Non,

 

Since now you've compelled me to reply I will go a bit on my personal life. Thats because nobody here knows who I am except my nick (I wouldn't like to be known beyond that either). Whatever symptoms you have given are still that of the first kind among my classification.

 

I also lost virginity relatively late in life (22 yrs). But I was never desperate to loose it in the first place. I respected girls and womankind in general and even when my bodily desires compelled my mind to perceive woman with lust (which happened many many times) for a moment, my respect for the beauty of women, overtook the lost always. I was a little shy of girls too. On top of that, it has always been my luck that I had very few girls around me where ever I went. I still waited. Then one day I fell in love with a girl. I was deeply in love. It was more like a fantasy love where I care for my girl a lot, loved her, and tried to make her as happy as I could. I did not even care about sex for the first few months. Because that was not important. Then one day I lost virginity. And we both made love a couple of times more subsequently. We both loved each other a lot and this reflected even on bed.

 

But then things changed, mistakes happened, suspicion, betrayal etc. My heart was shattered too like hers. Months went by and slowly I began to accept the reality. My body had been perhaps desiring sex, but my mind was still deep beneath the sea of emotions for her. I went to another place, away from her. May be it was a sense of revenge too in my mind, because I ultimately decided to have sex with a prostitute. Perhaps it must have been loneliness too as I was new in the city. But when I went to bed with her, I felt nothing at all. Nothing. All my lust that had been growing over these months suddenly got destroyed. I also felt a strong sense of guilt for doing whatever I was doing. I realized that sex is not everything. It is in fact nothing great for people to run after it so madly. I have learned a lesson now and have resumed my life as before. I no longer crave for sex. Perhaps some amount of love still exists in my heart for my ex...but thats all. Besides, that I have no other craving.

 

Also, in the wild every Tiger has his tigresses who have territories surrounding the male's territory. And it is usually the Tigresses that go to the Tiger when its the season. But the Tiger still remains alone.

 

You may think sex is nothing now. Now that I'm a virgin I do care less about sex also... but I think being a virgin huts my chances of anything deep. I think it hurts me, just to be a virgin. Being a virgin at 24 means everything to me. But if it was just about sex, then I would just get a prostitute. I don't get one.. because I know that won't solve my problems. I want love.. not just seex. Yea I do want to love my virginity but only because it holds me back. AS a male...I feel forced sometims as if I need to care about sex a lot jus so a woman could accept me for who I am, like I need to be like the other guys.

 

Thr reality is, the reason why most relationships, it seems, they break apart.. is because it's romantic love, and they dont practice tantric sex, or karezza. Even if they do and it stilll ends up in a separation at least it will be on good terms and not a violent seperation, like with what occurs with normal sexual relations. Though I do think, sometimes sex is necessary.. at least if you want to stay a sexual being, perhaps with a gender role that fits your gender. Even so, frustration can build up. Just like a virgin does. Karezza can be very balancing, tantra can help one spiritually. Sure you can be alone your whole life and practice brahmacharya but.. goood luck with that. I know you'll be struggling.

[Niklas]

hey appear to be very unapproachable and even disregard me as a person it seems..

like, they ignore me...

or like I'm just a nobody, even when I try to say something.

 

That's just when KNOWING that they ignore you and that you are nobody. If you make your mind

think that and convince yourself that you are nobody then you'll think that everyone thinks

you are nobody.

Try to pretend as if you were in their body. They themselves also see themselves

as the center of the earth. They also have ego like you do. They also want to prove you that

they are someone. They might also think that they are nobody. So if you talk to them you will

make them happy in proving them that they are someone. If you talk to them with the will of wanting

them to be happy it's going to be easier.

BUT it's not easy to make this happen unconsciously. Practice meditation everyday. Metta meditation.

Here try this link http://www.wildmind.org/metta

Especially metta toward yourself http://www.wildmind.org/metta/one

I myself do this and I can feel the energy very strongly in my throat and heart.

You can even do this while walking, waiting and everything.

 

So.. I don't approach them, for fear of scaring them off. But then again there are girls

that think you should be aggressive and dominant and such. To me it seems the way the game

is set up.. is that a man HAS to be aggressive, not assertive

 

If you are aggressive they will hate you, not like you. You shouldn't have such a negative view

of interaction and relationships. Try to talk to them while you feel in your heart that you

want them to be happy, you'll see they'll love you (after a couple of good dedicated hours of

meditation).

 

the richest most brutally dominant men you would ever know that would make any man cringe

at the thought of seducing her.

 

Of course they like that, it's in the genes and in the feminine liking to be lead, directed,

dominated, swept away. But there is a loving way of doing that. While you make love to her

you can be the most dominating and bad ass guy, but it will only stay in the context of sex.

Because in sex it is the cause of arousal and a proof to her that you are aroused,

so being a bad ass guy that way just makes her more aroused and love it even more.

It's not the same thing being bad ass guy in real as it is in sex. Women are not looking for

a bad ass shit guy who treats her like shit in real, because that way she'll feel

that she is being treated badly. In sex she would feel that she is being treated in a more

sexual way...

Dominant also means that she has to be lead and directed, because the feminine has a hard time

finding the right direction. But brutally dominant is just a man with low self esteem, who

acts brutally when he feels bad about himself and thinks that he is just shit, because he was used

to get beat up by his father screaming "you're just shit" at him.

Saying that "brutally dominant men" are bad men is wrong, because everyone is human and that's

just the way it is.

 

I'm sorry.... sick world. I know this was harsh.

 

This world is only sick when looking at it with a sick mind.

Edited October 14, 2010 by Niklas

[Non]

That's just when KNOWING that they ignore you and that you are nobody. If you make your mind

think that and convince yourself that you are nobody then you'll think that everyone thinks

you are nobody.

Try to pretend as if you were in their body. They themselves also see themselves

as the center of the earth. They also have ego like you do. They also want to prove you that

they are someone. They might also think that they are nobody. So if you talk to them you will

make them happy in proving them that they are someone. If you talk to them with the will of wanting

them to be happy it's going to be easier.

BUT it's not easy to make this happen unconsciously. Practice meditation everyday. Metta meditation.

Here try this link http://www.wildmind.org/metta

Especially metta toward yourself http://www.wildmind.org/metta/one

I myself do this and I can feel the energy very strongly in my throat and heart.

You can even do this while walking, waiting and everything.

 

 

 

If you are aggressive they will hate you, not like you. You shouldn't have such a negative view

of interaction and relationships. Try to talk to them while you feel in your heart that you

want them to be happy, you'll see they'll love you (after a couple of good dedicated hours of

meditation).

 

 

 

Of course they like that, it's in the genes and in the feminine liking to be lead, directed,

dominated, swept away. But there is a loving way of doing that. While you make love to her

you can be the most dominating and bad ass guy, but it will only stay in the context of sex.

Because in sex it is the cause of arousal and a proof to her that you are aroused,

so being a bad ass guy that way just makes her more aroused and love it even more.

It's not the same thing being bad ass guy in real as it is in sex. Women are not looking for

a bad ass shit guy who treats her like shit in real, because that way she'll feel

that she is being treated badly. In sex she would feel that she is being treated in a more

sexual way...

Dominant also means that she has to be lead and directed, because the feminine has a hard time

finding the right direction. But brutally dominant is just a man with low self esteem, who

acts brutally when he feels bad about himself and thinks that he is just shit, because he was used

to get beat up by his father screaming "you're just shit" at him.

Saying that "brutally dominant men" are bad men is wrong, because everyone is human and that's

just the way it is.

 

 

 

This world is only sick when looking at it with a sick mind.

 

I'm sorry but even in bed no guy should be a "bad ass". Not even in bed. that just associates sexuality with negative connotations. It's masochist.

 

One can be passionate, or aroused, and not have to be "bad". Throw out the word BAD and you just have arousal. Simple.

 

And that's very stereotypical to think that all women have a hard time finding the right direction. That's like saying all woman are dumb.

 

Even if it was the case.. then woman most often do not even seek to find the right direction with the right man. They unconsciously find a "bad man" thinking they will lead them to the right direction.

 

They ALL do this. They ALL want bad men.

 

Because our ancestors fought against each other. brother against brother. For women. They wouldn't have it any other way. Man on Man war.

 

Most wars are about passion and lust.

 

"It's Just the way it is".

 

I have both men AND WOMEN tell me it's exactly the way I describe it.

 

So I know I'm not just making this up.

 

I saw it today, I see it everyday. Violence makes the world go round, and women's nipples hard, and that's why violence will never end. In fact, it may even be that right now we have violence because it makes women horny.

 

It's damn true. That's why a third of men die to make the population equally men and women, yet more men are born than women. But because of sex wars they tend to equal each other out.

 

If you were an extraterrestrial, you would see that perhaps most of the worlds problems are due to procreation in a very real sense. Both subtle and explicit. Or at least, the ignorance of higher forms of sexuality.

Edited October 14, 2010 by Non

[Non]

Anyone who doesn't agree is just desensitized to the violence. People come to accept it as normal and incorporate it as part of their lives. They become it. They might have once seen what I saw.. but they had to give into it sooner or later. Associating bad and universally evil things with sexuality is black magick. Black sex magick. Nobody is innocent.

Edited October 14, 2010 by Non

[gendao]

I'm sorry but even in bed no guy should be a "bad ass". Not even in bed. that just associates sexuality with negative connotations. It's masochist.

Well, the more BAD ASS (PARTICULARLY in bed!) a guy is...the more badness women will put up with to F*** him!

Today when you’re at lunch, walking through your local office park look around the eating area. I’ll bet you’ll see a woman reading a piece of urban lit, True to the Game 3,Bad Girlz 4 Life or any other novel written by someone fresh out of jail. Woman like thugs, d-boys and men with bullet holes or stab wounds etched on there skin. I think for the hope of one day having their life resemble one of their favorite books with out the bloody ending. Yet in the age of straight legged jeans and big man scarfs is the thug still appealing or is his sex appeal starting to sag?

 

Style – As complicated as woman are, they are the simple at the same time. A tattoo, a wife beater and a pair of Jordans can make a woman gush with moisture. An oversized Yankee fitted hat covering the brow can automatically make a man marriage material.

 

Talk – Broken grammar, slang and curse words can make a woman feel like she’s living on the edge. The risk of losing it all drives her to give more. All for the love of the challenge.

 

But, the most important reason woman still dig the thug, is because most thugs know how to FCK. We are not talking about makin love, going downtown or whispering sweet nothing in her ear. We are talking about spankings, hair pulling, choking, and calling her dirty names during the act. Its rough, mildly painful and highly enjoyable and may happen anywhere.

 

Good sex can make a woman put up with loudness, drug paraphernalia, warrants, baby mama’s and putting stuff in their name. As long as the backstroke is there, the mind can not function right, so although thugs are going out of style, they still are a prominent force in dating.

Another straight confession from one of the horses' mouths themselves... Edited October 14, 2010 by vortex

[Non]

Well, the more BAD ASS (PARTICULARLY in bed!) a guy is...the more badness women will put up with to F*** him!Another straight confession from one of the horses' mouths themselves...

 

 

A man can be the sexiest thing without having to be dirty, or bad.

 

Even women say this... but usually aren't consistent with what they say.

Edited October 14, 2010 by Non

[Maddie]

A man can be the sexiest thing without having to be dirty, or bad.

 

Even women say this... but usually aren't consistent with what they say.

 

I understand the reasons people are giving external answers as an attempt to help with this problem, such as techniques for picking up women and such, but I strongly believe that the root of such problems is not your technique in picking up babes, but your internal balance, or the lack thereof. I believe that problems such as feeling lonely, and feeling uncomfortable speaking to ladies such as has been discussed on here lately are symptoms of internal energy blockages. Therefore I think that the real solution is not to learn how to pick up chicks, but how to find what it is within that is causing this discomfort in the first place and then to learn how to clearn that out.

[Soulthriller]

A friend of mine had sent me a short video on "how to be alone" and it turned out to be a wonderful little video giving advice on how to strengthen the relationship one has with oneself through being alone sometimes.

 

[Mal]

[Trunk]

Take up a musical instrument.

[Birch]

I was thinking about Non yesterday and I felt so sorry for him.

 

But I can't say he's entirely wrong in his perception of male/female dynamics in the younger generation (note I just put myself in the "old generation" category ).

 

Take a bus with high school kids or go hang out in a coffee shop and just listen.

 

So if indeed his (our) world is filled with this stuff (and we have Mr Vortex cheering it up because - well, because he wants to support this perspective) then I find it unsurprising that Non has adopted an "against" position if he's not getting what he wants, whether that's sex or love (and I would not claim an instant to know the "real" difference between them because in my experience it has always been a combination of both).

 

I think it's unfortunate that Non's "against" position treats women so harshly - but that's just because I am one so discard that position because it's obviously biased.

 

So isn't the point of Taoist practice to help people get to where (and what) they want?

 

Non, I reckon you should go for slightly younger women who may not be ready to sleep with you and would appreciate the romanticism. You might have to spend time getting to know her and she might not fit the "hottie" standards you might unwittingly be beholden to, but you ought to be "against" that as well (might as well be coherent).

 

Alternatively, hit the Christian fundie set who have promised to their fathers that they will not engage in sex before marriage (not that it actually works, but at least it puts the perverse parental ownership thing out in the open for all to see).

 

The approach thing is just something to get over. I have a friend my age who has the same problem and he just waits for women to come to him then he complains that they're not what he wants. So don't put yourself in situations where an "approach" is needed. Try places/events where you have to talk to women as part of whatever it is.

 

Also, playing music is a guaranteed transformation. Check out Jamie Cullum.

[hajimesaito]

Non,

 

This is the best way for you to apply the theories of Taoism.

Remember, the more you crave for attention, the lesser you will get it. The more you run after girls, the further they will go away from you. Look at the likes of Bodhidharma, Lao Tzu etc. Nobody knows anything about them. They didn't care about fame and name, but only wanted to go away from society. But not only the people around them know them so well today, but all over the world their names are quite easily heard nowadays. But still they wouldn't care I am sure.

 

The more you run after sex, the more you think about it all day, the more you invest time in trying to improve sex, the lesser you will enjoy it. Thats the reality. Its the law of the world. Perverts don't enjoy sex and thats why they keep pursuing it to finally achieve that ultimate and completely satisfying orgasm which they never get, because it doesn't exist.

 

But all this doesn't mean that to get better sex, you should deliberately run away from it. Of course, its the intention that matters. As long as you have the craving, you will never be satisfied.

 

You want the company of opposite sex so desperately. But I can guarantee you - you can mark my words - the day you really get what you desire, you will be quite amazed that it wasn't worth so much craving and efforts. You would still feel unsatisfied and crave for even more; because then you would be desperate in searching for the great thing that you had always been desiring which turned out to be so mundane (but which in reality has always been mundane).

 

 

The aim is to not think too much. And you are doing exactly that.

[Enishi]

The relationship dynamics of the younger generation here in the US is indeed quite bad. I think that many of those who reached adulthood in the 1960-1980s period have a hard time understanding what it is really like.

 

Personally speaking, I feel like I'm trapped between different worlds and don't fit into any specific group. I hated the conservative, stuffy patriarchal "all sex before marriage is a sin" environment I grew up in among the Jehovahs Witnesses as a child. However, I have just as much contempt now for the promiscuous thug worshiping culture which exists among people in their twenties and younger.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Enishi

[Mal]

Thanks for the reminder and definitely a must view

 

A friend of mine had sent me a short video on "how to be alone" and it turned out to be a wonderful little video giving advice on how to strengthen the relationship one has with oneself through being alone sometimes.

 

 

Thank you so much for sharing that link _/\_

[Aetherous]

The relationship dynamics of the younger generation here in the US is indeed quite bad.

 

Too many itty-bitty boys.

[TheWhiteRabbit]

The relationship dynamics of the younger generation here in the US is indeed quite bad. I think that many of those who reached adulthood in the 1960-1980s period have a hard time understanding what it is really like.

 

Personally speaking, I feel like I'm trapped between different worlds and don't fit into any specific group. I hated the conservative, stuffy patriarchal "all sex before marriage is a sin" environment I grew up in among the Jehovahs Witnesses as a child. However, I have just as much contempt now for the promiscuous thug worshiping culture which exists among people in their twenties and younger.

 

I understand. I spent a lot of time "dismantling" what I originally believed and even dismantling what a lot of people believe.

 

One of the reason why I sought out forums like this. In the end it seems people like us realize certain things... sometimes it becomes so much more blantantly obvious to people like us when people become so trapped in their thoughts... There is no advancement then and it seems the only choice is that we must deal with trying to fit in or unfortunately continuing by ourselves which is not an awesome path because we have no secondary feedback.

Edited October 16, 2010 by TheWhiteRabbit

[Everything]

You can discuss the source of your loneliness all you want. These are all animal instincts. Reptilian instincts and they push us towards a more mature self. Replication value or social skills may lead to more sex, but that doesn't make it by any means the main goal. Sex is just a physical thing. It means you can attract. Secondly comes friendship, your emotional developement as a human being is important too. And commitment, the intellectual complementary bond.

Sex sells, so that is what the media gives us, shows about naked women, sexy men, etc. Attraction takes over the mind, it brings the 2 milion year old self above.

 

By not showing what is desirable, you will cause the hearts of people to remain undisturbed.

This quote is not only so for Tao but also islam, who dress there women in a way as to not trigger male animal instincts. In the western culture, males are expected to keep cool when surrounded by naked beautiful women, so thats an option aswell.

 

Same with dogs who get angry if you touched their food while they're eating, animal instinct, he can learn to control it. Same with people who have strict rules on eating table. One can get really irritated if his food gets taken away by someone else while he is eating and hungry. Also an instinct you can learn to control by focus, presence, simply logical thinking. In the islam I've heard some say that it is "Haraam" to touch the person/animal or his/her food while they're eating or drinking. These are all reptilian brain herritages, they cannot be changed. And this is the only part of the brain that is specific for both sexes. For example females and males have the similar mammal/emotional brains and intellectual brains or cortex, but they have diffrent reptilian/physical brains.

 

Men are attracted mainly to beauty. Then comes women who raise their rank among other men (thats where cheerleading comes from), then a challenge coming from women in some sort.

Women are attracted mainly to mystery. Secondly "alpha" or skills similar to maxium in gladiator of winning the crowd, and lastly I think accepting the challenge I guess.

 

These are all things we have to live with, wether you like it or not. Believe me or not, some people hate it feel attracted to the opposite sex. lol

[Trunk]

Esoteric practices aside, just a couple of very down-to-earth practical tips re: loneliness. Two fundamental arts.

 

1) Learn to cook.

 

2) Learn a musical instrument + sing.

Music is one of the best ways to harmonize your emotions when you're alone, and one of the best ways to have fun with others. Everyone likes music. It's something that is endlessly rich that can last your whole life.

 

Both of these are helpful whether you're alone, looking for a relationship, in a relationship, or married w/ children.

 

If you're a serious mystic, then you're a little weird and you'll find that - as things progress - you'll have less & less in common w/ most people and more likely you'll find yourself 'socially challenged' BUT everyone likes music and everyone eats. Two ways that you can connect w/ people and that will make you much more socially viable as well as happier when you're alone.

[Maddie]

Esoteric practices aside, just a couple of very down-to-earth practical tips re: loneliness. Two fundamental arts.

 

1) Learn to cook.

 

2) Learn a musical instrument + sing.

Music is one of the best ways to harmonize your emotions when you're alone, and one of the best ways to have fun with others. Everyone likes music. It's something that is endlessly rich that can last your whole life.

 

Both of these are helpful whether you're alone, looking for a relationship, in a relationship, or married w/ children.

 

If you're a serious mystic, then you're a little weird and you'll find that - as things progress - you'll have less & less in common w/ most people and more likely you'll find yourself 'socially challenged' BUT everyone likes music and everyone eats. Two ways that you can connect w/ people and that will make you much more socially viable as well as happier when you're alone.

 

 

Good down to earth advice for sure .

 

I've done a little research on this topic since posting, and have found that the homeopathic remedy Phosphorus is supposed to be good for people who get lonely easily.

[Trunk]

p.s.

The esoteric stuff, you'll be excavating the mysteries all your life and it's long work, worth doing, layers, searching, practicing...

 

To reiterate music, great therapy for being alone, and in all relationships, all stages of life...

 

[Niklas]

I don't understand you all, I have such a hard time finding loneliness and you just want to avooooid loneliness

[Maddie]

I don't understand you all, I have such a hard time finding loneliness and you just want to avooooid loneliness

 

I think what you mean is you have a hard time finding time to be alone eh? Cause being alone and loniless is not the same thing at all. You can be lonely in a large crowd of people.

[Niklas]

Aaah... Yes, not the same thing.

[garuda]