Chi into Shen

[Guest paul walter]

Hey,

Awesome post Paul... I will do just that stay natural, stay with it. Stillness... I noticed the other day, the longer I layed or sit there. The better I felt, like something growing, and dissolving, at the same time... Thank you Melanie

 

 

Yes, that's exactly it, it's very convincing the more you let go. If you were quite screwed up like I was it can be very confronting, you can feel much resistance to "letting go" cause you are afraid of moving on and finding yourself possibly adrift from your known place (even if that place is hell it's still more comforting for most in some ways rather thanthe unknown that comes with change ). Many things can happen, like your body starts spasming as the long-held tension releases deep in your muscles/viscera. A lot of my 'process' was like walking on rusty sharp razor blades while having sharp needles jabbed into my consciousness at first, then like blunt razor blades without the rust, then just things that hurt, then numb pain, then lessening of it, then it takes its own rapid course of quicker/wiser dissolving of issues/psychic pain without 'you' doing much, then you break through--voila! Hope I haven't put you off . You as an empath will have some issues to face that could be rather hidden under all the 'niceness', it's difficult to 'see' this sometimes when we are giving a lot (energeticaly and otherwise) to others all the time. All the best, Paul.

Edited October 2, 2010 by paul walter

[Guest paul walter]

JINKIES! Thanks Rain! No I searched but i didn't happen to stumble upon these. Perhaps my powers of perception need more refinement Very interesting though, especially about the "inner light" thing. I've heard of people who teach this, but i've never heard anything about moving it to the dantien and up and down the front channel. VERY interesting, thank you again

 

-Astral

I take it you're only interested in the Masters of Special Effects school of Chi into Shen then Paul

[King Kabalabhati]

Paul Walter wrote: "You as an empath will have some issues to face that could be rather hidden under all the 'niceness', it's difficult to 'see' this sometimes when we are giving a lot (energeticaly and otherwise) to others all the time. "

 

Yeah this sounds familiar.. Many of us appreciate "nice" over "sincere" so much we start over-doing it and, well, pretending. One can learn/teach much more by being honest and up front, and it allows things to be processed instead of buried. Sometimes you have to hurt people with honesty simply because they have it coming anyway.

Edited October 3, 2010 by King Kabalabhati

[Birch]

"Sometimes you have to hurt people with honesty simply because they have it coming anyway."

 

Ah. Not sure I follow. Do you mean you take a nick out of someone to prevent them from getting hurt more in the future?

 

More questions:

 

- What if they won't listen to you because you hurt them?

- How do you get to the point where you are "clear" enough to make a judgement call on someone else?

- At what point do you realise that you are clear?

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

Well the first thing is to get the energy and let it open the heart, then after time this opens the head and they unite giving shen. Can be done just through emptiness/stillness. Paul

Hi Paul: Excellent observation! more importantly, accurate. While i deeply appreciate the values of 'stillness and movement', and i practice both (WuJi, ZZ, Taiji, QiGong, etc..).. there is a serene and sublime shift when we find the 'stillness IN movement' and 'movement IN stillness'.. but, between the two (even-though there is no difference), 'stillness' is the foundation..

 

Be well..

[King Kabalabhati]

"Sometimes you have to hurt people with honesty simply because they have it coming anyway."

 

Ah. Not sure I follow. Do you mean you take a nick out of someone to prevent them from getting hurt more in the future?

 

More questions:

 

- What if they won't listen to you because you hurt them?

- How do you get to the point where you are "clear" enough to make a judgement call on someone else?

- At what point do you realise that you are clear?

 

Well, for myself I prefer people to be honest with me even if it's a bitter truth. Im not saying they have to be RIGHT just SINCERE

 

Hmmm... whatever you do, whether you "go along " with people or you "take a nick" out of people, you have to trust your judgment.

Edited October 3, 2010 by King Kabalabhati

[goonis38]

Yes, that's exactly it, it's very convincing the more you let go. If you were quite screwed up like I was it can be very confronting, you can feel much resistance to "letting go" cause you are afraid of moving on and finding yourself possibly adrift from your known place (even if that place is hell it's still more comforting for most in some ways rather thanthe unknown that comes with change ). Many things can happen, like your body starts spasming as the long-held tension releases deep in your muscles/viscera. A lot of my 'process' was like walking on rusty sharp razor blades while having sharp needles jabbed into my consciousness at first, then like blunt razor blades without the rust, then just things that hurt, then numb pain, then lessening of it, then it takes its own rapid course of quicker/wiser dissolving of issues/psychic pain without 'you' doing much, then you break through--voila! Hope I haven't put you off . You as an empath will have some issues to face that could be rather hidden under all the 'niceness', it's difficult to 'see' this sometimes when we are giving a lot (energeticaly and otherwise) to others all the time. All the best, Paul.

 

Hey Paul,

You are a good down to earth guy... You are a great part of this forum in my opinion... I have been so happy to share in all your experiences. You have been through a lot... But you are doing good now. This is hope for us all. I love the way you keep thing uncomplicated. This is good. At first when people don't understand and hear a bunch of words that they don't understand they can get confused, you where one of the many good ones that lead me to understand to look deeper than a word, and then I could look deeper into myself.

 

I am so happy for all the help people and I have received from this forum it is a wonderful blessing to the world....

 

You are very insightful paul to know that under all my smiles and helpful loving nature does lye some problems. I have had to learn and still am, not to take into much from people. I want to help as i can. But I am as a sponge and can take in and hurt myself. I am almost 40 now so I'm getting better. Also I notice negative people try and bring positive people down, I'm not sure if this is on purpose or just there nature. At last though they hurt there selfs so much more than they ever can me. And this breaks my heart for them...

 

Paul I stay for people like you. Thank you for your kindness and helpful words... Thats what it is all about. And i am so happy for you that you have gotten past all that pain you where suffering, it sounds as if it was a long hard journey. Now you can help others, and I know you do already. You have the healing touch... Yes? This is so good. Someone told me i had this to some extent. Just a hug to a hurting person can help so much...

Lots of love Mel

[Astral_Anima]

Also I notice negative people try and bring positive people down, I'm not sure if this is on purpose or just there nature. At last though they hurt there selfs so much more than they ever can me.

 

WARNING: The following is Astral Anima's OPINION based on his own personal experience, he makes no claim to this being the truth of things, he merely states a theory based on his observations. I'm Astral Anima and I approve this messege.

 

Thus is the nature of energteic parasitism, a new pandemic, lol. When we're cut off from the source of infinite love within, to compensate sometimes we turn to parasitism and feed off of the energies of others. Negativity is the food of an energetic parasite, and they will do anything to get their "host" to feel it. Also, as you noticed, they equally get off on their own negativity as much as others'. This is the difference between choosing life and death because when you are cut off from the source you are on the road to self destruction.

People who shift to living on negativity find love and innocent expression to be intolerable, they tend to lean toward positions of authority and power in an attempt to use to control people/things around them. They smirk and pride themselves in self destruction, while ridiculing anyone who shows self love. If, however, you are connected to your inner source and decide to choose happiness, turn the other cheek, smile, love, laugh instead of getting defensive or angry and feeding into their tactics, then they will gain nothing from you.

 

-Astral

[3bob]

Some have a razor sharp way about them and do not their mince words, and may even over-do such sometimes, does that make them negative (?) far from it if taken in the full context of a matter that requires such methods. The more important point being not to, "throw the baby out with the bathwater".

 

Also, a quote below that to me is an advanced view:

 

"Meditation in Affliction

Assailed by afflictions, we discover Dharma

And find the way to liberation. Thank you, evil forces!

 

When sorrows invade the mind, we discover Dharma

And find lasting happiness. Thank you, sorrows!

 

Through harm caused by spirits we discover Dharma

And find fearlessness. Thank you, ghosts and demons!

 

Through people's hate we discover Dharma

And find benefits and happiness. Thank you, those who hate us!

 

Through cruel adversity, we discover Dharma

And find the unchanging way. Thank you, adversity!

 

Through being impelled to by others, we discover Dharma

And find the essential meaning. Thank you, all who drive us on!

 

We dedicate our merit to you all, to repay your kindness"

 

From Gyalwa Longchenpa and Longchen Nyingtik lineage. (as copied)

[Astral_Anima]

Some have a razor sharp way about them and do not their mince words, and may even over-do such sometimes, does that make them negative (?) far from it if taken in the full context of a matter that requires such methods. The more important point being not to, "throw the baby out with the bathwater".

 

Also, a quote below that to me is an advanced view:

 

"Meditation in Affliction

Assailed by afflictions, we discover Dharma

And find the way to liberation. Thank you, evil forces!

 

When sorrows invade the mind, we discover Dharma

And find lasting happiness. Thank you, sorrows!

 

Through harm caused by spirits we discover Dharma

And find fearlessness. Thank you, ghosts and demons!

 

Through people's hate we discover Dharma

And find benefits and happiness. Thank you, those who hate us!

 

Through cruel adversity, we discover Dharma

And find the unchanging way. Thank you, adversity!

 

Through being impelled to by others, we discover Dharma

And find the essential meaning. Thank you, all who drive us on!

 

We dedicate our merit to you all, to repay your kindness"

 

From Gyalwa Longchenpa and Longchen Nyingtik lineage. (as copied)

 

3bob, Thank You for the quote, I much enjoyed it. Also you are correct in your speaking. Speaking truth for the most part is a positive force. However take an example of a child play with a rock. The child is enjoying himself when an older child comes along and calls that child "stupid" for playing with a rock. THAT is negative. When you purposely put someone down or ruin their fun just to make yourself seem superior or just to feed off their negative energy that is negative.

 

If one has a "sharp tougne" then one should be aware of that and decide whether it serves them well or not. While love is true, it doesn't try to hurt others and take pride in it's "sharpness". Intentionally hurting another cuts you off from the source within. Why do we hurt others? mostly it's just to boost our own ego, to enjoy draining their energy. But if we have infinite source within we don't need to bring others down.

 

Of course the best way to deal with such things is to love and appreciate ALL things. If someone hits you thank them for the experience, if they call you stupid thank them for expressing their opinions to you, etc. Of course without being connected to the infinite source within this can seem hard and perhaps draining.

 

It is true that people set themselves up to suffer by making attachments and expectations and overly invest(emotionally) in such things. However spreading pain in todays world is like beating a dead horse. This world needs love, not more pain. Of course when you try to help others you can't "force" things upon them, the best you can do is offer what you have and lead by example.

 

"Methods" of spreading fear, hatred, guilt, shame, etc are methods of destruction (including SELF-destruction). Perhaps I'm reading what your saying wrong, however. Could you give an example of when "negativity" would be preferable to positivity? And of course i'm no talking about blatant lying like saying to someone "oh you're already god, you don't need to change to experience enlightenment...that'll be $400 please", )

 

-Astral

[3bob]

3bob, Thank You for the quote, I much enjoyed it. Also you are correct in your speaking. Speaking truth for the most part is a positive force. However take an example of a child play with a rock. The child is enjoying himself when an older child comes along and calls that child "stupid" for playing with a rock. THAT is negative. When you purposely put someone down or ruin their fun just to make yourself seem superior or just to feed off their negative energy that is negative.

 

If one has a "sharp tougne" then one should be aware of that and decide whether it serves them well or not. While love is true, it doesn't try to hurt others and take pride in it's "sharpness". Intentionally hurting another cuts you off from the source within. Why do we hurt others? mostly it's just to boost our own ego, to enjoy draining their energy. But if we have infinite source within we don't need to bring others down.

 

Of course the best way to deal with such things is to love and appreciate ALL things. If someone hits you thank them for the experience, if they call you stupid thank them for expressing their opinions to you, etc. Of course without being connected to the infinite source within this can seem hard and perhaps draining.

 

It is true that people set themselves up to suffer by making attachments and expectations and overly invest(emotionally) in such things. However spreading pain in todays world is like beating a dead horse. This world needs love, not more pain. Of course when you try to help others you can't "force" things upon them, the best you can do is offer what you have and lead by example.

 

"Methods" of spreading fear, hatred, guilt, shame, etc are methods of destruction (including SELF-destruction). Perhaps I'm reading what your saying wrong, however. Could you give an example of when "negativity" would be preferable to positivity? And of course i'm no talking about blatant lying like saying to someone "oh you're already god, you don't need to change to experience enlightenment...that'll be $400 please", )

 

-Astral

 

Well that's a lot of things you've brought up ... as for some examples although not always or exactly negative per-se: Jesus whipping the money changers in the temple, Jesus saying to Peter, "get behind me satan", martial arts masters kicking butt or expelling students for certain screw-ups, parents telling their teenage daughters that it is stupid to get drunk, and worse so among strangers because you could end up raped and or dead, choking your dog who is trying desperately to sink their teeth into the postman, scolding the hell out of your little kid for running across the street in traffic. That's only a few, do you have a couple?

 

Om

[Astral_Anima]

Well that's a lot of things you've brought up ... as for some examples although not always or exactly negative per-se: Jesus whipping the money changers in the temple, Jesus saying to Peter, "get behind me satan", martial arts masters kicking butt or expelling students for certain screw-ups, parents telling their teenage daughters that it is stupid to get drunk, and worse so among strangers because you could end up raped and or dead, choking your dog who is trying desperately to sink their teeth into the postman, scolding the hell out of your little kid for running across the street in traffic. That's only a few, do you have a couple?

 

Om

 

3bob, you bring up very valid examples. Now that I believe myself to better understand where you're coming from I DO have a couple example myself

 

In examples of sharing truth/concerns (like the teenage daughter) I would hardly consider that being "negative" as you're not trying to put anyone down to feel good about yourself, you're trying to protect someone and help them to be informed to make the best decisions. However in these situations one must be willing to accept the choices of a person once they understand the consequences(unless of course you feel their life is in danger). Forcing one to conform to your will isn't love.

 

In terms of martial arts masters "kicking butt" and choking a dog to stop it from hurting the mailman, this falls under the category of "protection". I never said physical force itself was negative . I'm not as familiar with the two examples of Christ as I should be, but I don't look to the commercialized Bible for an account of Christ as I believe much of it has been altered.

 

Now that I believe I understand you better I think we're in agreement, but were just misunderstood. When I say negativity, I mean it in the sense of putting down others to make yourself feel better or superior. When being honest and protecting others, whether it be by force or not, I would consider each of those quite positive.

 

While there is much more that can be discussed on this topic I prefer to simply say "this is how I try to conduct myself based on my beliefs, what you believe and how you plan to act based on those beliefs is your freedom to decide" I was merely sharing my view based on your comment to my opinions on energetic parasitism. If you'd like to discuss morality and other "personal" things perhaps it would be more appropriate to do so in a "Debate" thread or via pm (although I wont debate with you, I would prefer to discuss and share).

 

-Astral

[Guest paul walter]

One can learn/teach much more by being honest and up front, and it allows things to be processed instead of buried. Sometimes you have to hurt people with honesty simply because they have it coming anyway.

 

 

The ego is such that we can't "teach" most through honesty etc, there is simply too much baggage/resistance deriving from living in cultures that saturate the individual with wayward signals for the "truth" to ever have an immediate effect-you're more likely to get bounced on your arse from doing this. One of course can learn from this for oneself but that's all one should really hope for or you'll go crazy trying to convince others there's a wall coming at them hard! And you should always be honest even and especially if you suffer the consequences cause then you dissolve another illusion and help yourself more even if you watch people fall off that cliff from a front row seat (ouch!)

[King Kabalabhati]

The ego is such that we can't "teach" most through honesty etc, there is simply too much baggage/resistance deriving from living in cultures that saturate the individual with wayward signals for the "truth" to ever have an immediate effect-you're more likely to get bounced on your arse from doing this. One of course can learn from this for oneself but that's all one should really hope for or you'll go crazy trying to convince others there's a wall coming at them hard! And you should always be honest even and especially if you suffer the consequences cause then you dissolve another illusion and help yourself more even if you watch people fall off that cliff from a front row seat (ouch!)

 

Yes people take it very personally and oftentimes indeed get hurt if you confront their culture. It's so near to our "self", like fat to the muscle, that we often cannot distuingish between the two. Well, to be able to do that we need to "realise" (both get the initial spark and then dedicate to working it) that the self is in fact empty, an ever changing flow.. And that can be a very threatening realisation.

[Guest paul walter]

Hey Paul,

You are a good down to earth guy... You are a great part of this forum in my opinion... I have been so happy to share in all your experiences. You have been through a lot... But you are doing good now. This is hope for us all. I love the way you keep thing uncomplicated. This is good. At first when people don't understand and hear a bunch of words that they don't understand they can get confused, you where one of the many good ones that lead me to understand to look deeper than a word, and then I could look deeper into myself.

 

I am so happy for all the help people and I have received from this forum it is a wonderful blessing to the world....

 

You are very insightful paul to know that under all my smiles and helpful loving nature does lye some problems. I have had to learn and still am, not to take into much from people. I want to help as i can. But I am as a sponge and can take in and hurt myself. I am almost 40 now so I'm getting better. Also I notice negative people try and bring positive people down, I'm not sure if this is on purpose or just there nature. At last though they hurt there selfs so much more than they ever can me. And this breaks my heart for them...

 

Paul I stay for people like you. Thank you for your kindness and helpful words... Thats what it is all about. And i am so happy for you that you have gotten past all that pain you where suffering, it sounds as if it was a long hard journey. Now you can help others, and I know you do already. You have the healing touch... Yes? This is so good. Someone told me i had this to some extent. Just a hug to a hurting person can help so much...

Lots of love Mel

 

 

 

Hi Melanie, thanks for the kind words. You'll do fine if you know you're not perfect (yet ) and if you maintain the humility to 'listen' to yourself most of all and to others when you perhaps can't work things out for yourself. Just remember there is a vast untapped resource within everyone that continues to grow the more you let it (which of course you know about already). The main thing is to let it be natural and to nurture it without too much control either from external sources (practices, philosophies etc ) or from the pov of your own mind. It is a real balancing act at times but it teaches you so much about yourself. I've also had the "empath" thing (and still do--it's hard not to when your heart chakra is open )and realisesd I could be a lot more help to others and other things when I am aware of the reality I'm dealing with in the world. It's not a pretty thing to find the truth about the "human condition" but I wouldn't want to be anywhere else for that would be a lie. As for suffering, it would take a book the size of War and Peace (without the Peace bit ) to convey what I've been through but what can I say?--that's where I honed my empathy and perceptions to a higher degree, so while I don't wish such a course of learning upon anyone there is the inevitability of pain every time we push against our ignorance and try to free ourselves from it and move into the light. Paul

[Guest paul walter]

Yes people take it very personally and oftentimes indeed get hurt if you confront their culture. It's so near to our "self", like fat to the muscle, that we often cannot distuingish between the two. Well, to be able to do that we need to "realise" (both get the initial spark and then dedicate to working it) that the self is in fact empty, an ever changing flow.. And that can be a very threatening realisation.

 

 

 

Yes, that's all my understanding too. I do feel it's coming to the "end times" cause of all the saturation and technology that is rapidly dislocating a person even from their own view of thenmselves as ego. It's one of the great ironies of human 'evolution' that the more we assert the self the more we lose connection with it. The consequences of this are already 'here' in the world for all to see, I can only imagine what monstrous sci-fi fantasy the human mind/ego will morph into if this keeps going on? Paul

[3bob]

Yes, that's all my understanding too. I do feel it's coming to the "end times" cause of all the saturation and technology that is rapidly dislocating a person even from their own view of thenmselves as ego. It's one of the great ironies of human 'evolution' that the more we assert the self the more we lose connection with it. The consequences of this are already 'here' in the world for all to see, I can only imagine what monstrous sci-fi fantasy the human mind/ego will morph into if this keeps going on? Paul

 

"the more we assert the self the more we lose connection with it", could you clear that up a bit Paul?

 

self as ego

Self as Spirit

 

Om

[3bob]

Hi Astral, my responses in blue:

 

3bob, you bring up very valid examples. Now that I believe myself to better understand where you're coming from I DO have a couple example myself

 

In examples of sharing truth/concerns (like the teenage daughter) I would hardly consider that being "negative" as you're not trying to put anyone down to feel good about yourself, you're trying to protect someone and help them to be informed to make the best decisions. However in these situations one must be willing to accept the choices of a person once they understand the consequences(unless of course you feel their life is in danger). Forcing one to conform to your will isn't love.

 

Agreed, and well said.

 

In terms of martial arts masters "kicking butt" and choking a dog to stop it from hurting the mailman, this falls under the category of "protection". I never said physical force itself was negative . I'm not as familiar with the two examples of Christ as I should be, but I don't look to the commercialized Bible for an account of Christ as I believe much of it has been altered.

 

I would suggest the KJV of "The Gospel According to St. John" for comparitive reference and information, instead of what sounds like just pigeon-holing all Bible texts as being nothing more than commercialized accounts. Btw, even an exactly perfect account would take an exactly perfect reader to understand such text fully, whether it be the Bible or any other spiritual teaching, east, west or whatever.

 

Now that I believe I understand you better I think we're in agreement, but were just misunderstood. When I say negativity, I mean it in the sense of putting down others to make yourself feel better or superior. When being honest and protecting others, whether it be by force or not, I would consider each of those quite positive.

 

Basically agreed, although the force part can make for a very fine and difficult line. Did you submit a couple of specific examples or mainly comment along the lines of mine which is fine but...

 

While there is much more that can be discussed on this topic I prefer to simply say "this is how I try to conduct myself based on my beliefs, what you believe and how you plan to act based on those beliefs is your freedom to decide" I was merely sharing my view based on your comment to my opinions on energetic parasitism. If you'd like to discuss morality and other "personal" things perhaps it would be more appropriate to do so in a "Debate" thread or via pm (although I wont debate with you, I would prefer to discuss and share). Astral

 

Ok, but I'm not sure where the debate threads are since at any time any where exchanges can have aspects of debate. Anyway back to this "connection to the source", for me it not all lovey-dovey and kindness, (whether you meant that or not) but also like a mighty billion volts and amps that can shock, rip and shred all of ones pre-conceptions, in other words blow one's head right off. (so to speak)

 

Namaskar

Om

Edited October 4, 2010 by 3bob

[Guest paul walter]

"the more we assert the self the more we lose connection with it", could you clear that up a bit Paul?

 

self as ego

Self as Spirit

 

Om

 

 

Well I meant the more we assert the ego's idea of self the more we lose connection with actual self. So yes it's a case of mistaken identity when we see ourselves as ego and not as perhaps as you suggest "spirit". To force things is to create something else and lose control of the natural at the same time so our identity here in the 'west' is usually based on the idea of forcing a personality, creating one and holding onto it through overly identifying with it. What seems cast in iron is quickly proved untenable when put to 'tests' cause it changes in order to adapt and survive the circumstances, thus logically proving its own lie about being 'stable'. The other way to go through life is to adapt without 'holding' patterns which feels much more natural and you and others tend not to snap as you bend like this. Paul

[Birch]

"So yes it's a case of mistaken identity when we see ourselves as ego and not as perhaps as you suggest "spirit"

 

Heh, taking on the "spiritual egotists" Paul?

 

I agree and at some point there has to be a "self-reliable" way of experiencing the difference between yourself acting "from spirit" and yourself acting "from ego".

 

I would suggest the latter involves accompanying subjective feelings of satisfaction or of dis-satisfaction while the former involves subjective feelings of, well, "wellbeing"

 

I keep harping on about the being "squeezed" feeling. I guess I could call it a small "ouch" or something.

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

I agree and at some point there has to be a "self-reliable" way of experiencing the difference between yourself acting "from spirit" and yourself acting "from ego".

Hi Kate: Consistently, i have found 'stillness' to be very truthful with 'me'.. when i suspend the thinking processes, and just observe.. i see myself in the world around 'me', physical AND spiritual.. i hear the echo of my own interactions, i feel the influence of consequences i have originated.. it is powerful medicine to be willing to see 'me' without the 'decorations/ego' we use to justify the 'me' we wish we wern't..

 

"Embracing your 'dark-side' is wisdom.. Living it is Enlightenment"..

 

Be well..

[Birch]

Thanks TJL.

 

"Emptiness"

"Stillness"

 

I often reach a point where no words or images arise in my mind but (and there is a but) there is a tense/warm feeling in my head, like something would have been coming forth had I not trained myself otherwise. When this happens, I "throw" the tension into MCO or I dissolve it. I sometimes wonder about whether this is a "good" idea or not or whether I've screwed up my neurals (much in the way that we discuss the perils of sexual retention).

[TzuJanLi]

Greetings..

 

When this happens, I "throw" the tension into MCO or I dissolve it. I sometimes wonder about whether this is a "good" idea or not or whether I've screwed up my neurals (much in the way that we discuss the perils of sexual retention).

Hi Kate: I have learned a certain ease of 'letting go', not looking back.. it is the essence of Liberation.. although, occasionally and thankfully infrequently, the "images in the mirror are closer than they appear", and 'time' taps me on the shoulder.. this usually happens when i act contrary to my nature..

 

Be well..

[Guest paul walter]

"So yes it's a case of mistaken identity when we see ourselves as ego and not as perhaps as you suggest "spirit"

 

Heh, taking on the "spiritual egotists" Paul?

 

I agree and at some point there has to be a "self-reliable" way of experiencing the difference between yourself acting "from spirit" and yourself acting "from ego".

 

I would suggest the latter involves accompanying subjective feelings of satisfaction or of dis-satisfaction while the former involves subjective feelings of, well, "wellbeing"

 

I keep harping on about the being "squeezed" feeling. I guess I could call it a small "ouch" or something.

 

 

Yeah, it aint easy (til it all becomes easy). I think the most telling and helpful thing is if you are aware of "spirit" and "ego" then you realise there is little room for both to be accomodated, the discomfort becomes such that you really want to force the issue and make a choice between 'one' and the 'other'. Problem is it's always going to be spirit that wins cause when you put the two side by side ego loses hands down and since the knowledge base you've acquired in the process doesn't allow one to lie to oneself quite so much as one did before becoming aware of 'greater' things you almost have to plump for spirit and get on with the refinement etc.

[Mark Foote]

 

Likely the saying : "Nourish a MIND by paying attention to nowhere " ("應無所住而生其心" )from the "Diamond Sutra" is what close to it . Clearly, it is not anything similar to a feeling of extreme peaceful or a feeling of finding yourself united with the universe..that many people think of. Far from those feelings, it is something much more.

 

 

Don't know about the rest, but- "Nourish a MIND by paying attention to nowhere" I think is a description of nurturing single-pointedness of mind, place of mind as the source of action as opposed to volition in mind as the source of action. Paying attention to nowhere is also excluding nothing from awareness, that's another way of saying it. "it is something much more"- it is being realized as action out of the occurrence of consciousness, that is to say: out of the place of occurrence of consciousness, out of the impact of consciousness on the fascial stretch already in existence, and out of the feeling generated by activity caused by stretch (the fascia and ligaments can generate nerve impulses to cause associated muscles to contract to relieve their stretch, and reciprocal activity generated by the balance of the body as consciousness takes place can align the spine and joints to open particular feeling).

 

woof, just drank up the Yangtze in one gulp...