I need advice on K.S.Cohen

[cloud recluse]

As a complete beginner in Chi Gung,I have been looking at Ken Cohens THE WAY OF QIGONG for some ideas on how to structure a practice.Now,I know it has been suggested that one should intuitevely feel ones way into the appropriate routine & not be afraid to play with it,instead of making practice some grim burden,& to a certain extent I concur.But for me to get started,being a bit thick & unreceptive to begin with,I really do need a few focusing 'rules' to get something real happening.

 

To this end,I was chaecking out the principles for structuring a routine suggested on p.297,& I liked the idea of Bone Marrow Cleansing before Gathering & Storing Qi,seems to make sense.But over the page,on p.299,for weeks 4-12 & thereafter,Eight Brocades comes BEFORE Bone Marrow Cleansing.Why would that be?Are the Eight Brocades not a Gathering practice as such?Why would they come before Cleansing &Standing ?Am I misunderstanding their function?

 

Any advice anyone? Regards,Cloud.

[Cameron]

You can play with it. I am mostly working with the foundation practices of sitting(in the book he calls entering tranquilty) and standing meditation.

 

I would try doing it before gathering and after and see what feels more natural .For me going from yin to yang in the morning(stillness to movement) and then yang to yin at night(movement to stillnesss) is the way to go.

 

So, brocades are a movement practice and standing is a stillness practice. I would do standing first in the morning and brocades after. Or do brocades at night followed by entering tranquility(quiet meditaiton).

 

Bone marrow cleansing comes before standing because he calls it a purification system of qigong .He also considers healing sounds a purification ystem. You purify the qi before gathering new, fresh qi.

 

I often just skip the purification stage though I like the bone marrow set.

 

Cam

[turbo]

As a complete beginner in Chi Gung,I have been looking at Ken Cohens THE WAY OF QIGONG for some ideas on how to structure a practice.

Any advice anyone? Regards,Cloud.

 

Hey,

 

I read that book a while back and while it was helpful at the time, I would recommend that you check out BK Frantizs' work. I got his Longevity Breathing DVD and Opening the Energy Gates of the Body book. I feel like these are a prerequesite to any other, especially energetically based, qiogong methods. After all moving energy around becomes a lot easier when the body is open.

 

The Longevity Breathing DVD in particular is the best "taoist" technique I've ever practiced. It opened up muscle tensions that I'd been unable to release for years, and it massaged musces and organs. Essential stuff. I start every session with at least a couple of minutes of it.

[Buddy]

I agree, but I'm partial in that I teach his method.

[Cameron]

Bruce seems pretty solid. The guy I study with now studied with Bruce and teaches some of the dissolving stuff. It's definetly a cool apprach. I personally prefer Ken's appraoch and reccomend his book first as it does give the basics and more practices to work on. As well as dealing with sexual energy which Bruce's books don't really address as far as I remember.

 

Except the water method one..something about Tofu or something...

 

Still, I would jump at the chance to train with Bruce live and probably/hopefully will at some point. His path sounds very familiar in how he started with aikido and then internal stuff on his own before going to China. Definetly one of the big characters of the Taoist world.

 

I agree, but I'm partial in that I teach his method.

 

 

Your not Buddy Trip are you?

Edited May 8, 2006 by Cameron

[cloud recluse]

Hey,

 

I read that book a while back and while it was helpful at the time, I would recommend that you check out BK Frantizs' work. I got his Longevity Breathing DVD and Opening the Energy Gates of the Body book. I feel like these are a prerequesite to any other, especially energetically based, qiogong methods. After all moving energy around becomes a lot easier when the body is open.

 

The Longevity Breathing DVD in particular is the best "taoist" technique I've ever practiced. It opened up muscle tensions that I'd been unable to release for years, and it massaged musces and organs. Essential stuff. I start every session with at least a couple of minutes of it.

 

Ok,Im going to get this stuff & compare it with Cohens.Looking to see which will be the most appropriate for my situation.If Frantizs' stuff is simple & enhances the sensitivity on which I imagine all this is based,then that would be my preference,as Im trying not to overcomplicate things at such an early stage.Who produces the Longevity Breathing DVD ?

 

Regards,Cloud.

 

... I personally prefer Ken's appraoch and reccomend his book first as it does give the basics and more practices to work on. As well as dealing with sexual energy which Bruce's books don't really address as far as I remember.

 

 

Is there anywhere in Kens book that details enhancement of initial sensitivity to chi,as that would be my priority over learning more specific practices ?

 

Regards,Cloud.

[Cameron]

Interesting question. I would say all the basic qigong meditation enhance sensitivity to qi. The main difference between Bruces stadning and Ken's is Bruce has you go trhough in dissolving process. You dissolve from the top of the ehad to your feet level by level. Ice to water to gas. It's an interesting practice. I like Ken's better because it is based more on empty mind/zen .basically you sit and stand and just watch the quality of qi and presence. After a few months probably you will have developed a real sensitivity to the qi flow.

 

For me when the qi is flwoing it is a feeling of warmth flowing through my body and a feeling of fullness of energy. Ken definetly talks about it in his book . And he adds some science and studies done at universities and stuff which I appreciate.

 

Check them both out there probably both excellent anyway.

 

Cam

[cloud recluse]

Thanx Cam,I think I will begin with Kens approach initially.If that doesnt take,Frantzis' more step-by-step Dissolving Process might be the go.

 

Turbo,Im intruiged by this Longevity Breathing DVD.Is is a stand alone practice,is it accesible to the beginner...etc.Who produces it?

 

Regards,Cloud.

[Buddy]

"Your not Buddy Trip are you?"

 

I am Buddy Tripp, yes. How do you know of me?

[turbo]

Turbo,Im intruiged by this Longevity Breathing DVD.Is is a stand alone practice,is it accesible to the beginner...etc.Who produces it?

 

 

Everyone should be doing Longevity Breathing. It is completely stand alone and will benefit any other physical/spiritual practice. It fights stress, it aids and induces deep relaxation and release of muscles. I loaned the DVD to a friend who was having panic attacks and she hasn't had one since watching the first part of the video (there are four steps and you need to integrate each before learning the next).

 

It was produced by BKF and is available from his website or amazon. As far as the production the presentation is awful (maybe its just me) BUT the information is so valuable that it must be recommended.

 

BKF's website

 

Video on Amazon (dont believe the bad review)

[Cameron]

"Your not Buddy Trip are you?"

 

I am Buddy Tripp, yes. How do you know of me?

 

We used to Instant Message all the time like 6 or 7 years ago. Remember I was living in Atlanta at the time and we would talk about your teacher and I was studying with Michael Winn at the time. You said something really funny one time on IM when I said something Michael said about Yiquan and I literally just thought about it and laughed to myself the day before you came on here. Wild coincedence/synchronicity

Edited May 9, 2006 by Cameron

[Buddy]

Ah yes, I remember you now.

 

We used to talk all the time years ago. Remember I was living in atlanta at the time and we would talk about your teacher and I was studying with Michael Winn at the time. You said something really funny one time on IM when I said something Michael said about Yiquan and I literally just thought about it and laughed to myself the day before you came on here. Wild coincedence/synchronicity

[Cameron]

Glad to have you here

[Pietro]

All this is very interesting. I am surprised people are getting so much from Bruce DVD. I find his CDs (2) on breathing outstanding. I also bought the Video which I think is the same as the DVD, saw it one time and found it less good. Basically it was bits and pieces from the lesson. But the CDs are really something

Essentially are 24 lessons, each of a few minutes, that goes through all the process. It is so deep that I have reached lesson 6 and am at the time there. You are also supposed to go through all the lessons two times. The first time just learning the phisical breathing, and the second time (after you have reached lesson 12) learning the 'mind' stuff. Each time you will need to repeat the same lesson as many times as it is needed.

 

By the time you reach lesson 24 you are supposed to have developed a 20 or 30 seconds breath (I don't remember) and then having the tools to extend it further. Some students claim minutes.

 

SO I would say, get ALSO the CD.