Falun Dafa thread - open discussion...

[johndoe2012]

Edited December 9, 2011 by chris d

[Seth Ananda]

@seth ananda: so do you recommend the 5 basic exercices from your own experience? or would you advise that one's psychic energy might be sucked in a detrimental group psyche by doing the visualisation part of them?

 

If I was a coldhearted strategist in the communist party, maybe I would pay some people money to behave fanatically about the movement I want to damage, so that it will be discredited in most people's eyes.

I personally Loved the Falun exercises, and moral focus. I practised daily for a couple of years and learned a lot, and gained some 'powers' so to speak. I am annoyed as It is still my favourite and the most powerful form I have so far found. But eventually I had to give it up. I want zero connection with the cultish mentality/frequency of the organisation.

 

Li Hongzhi's insane totalitarian ramblings belong in a nut house, not in the mouth of a spiritual teacher. He really should be locked up before he goes all Jim Jones.

 

Also, as far as genuine spiritual traditions go, Falun is utterly lacking. All it has, is energy and Moral development.

 

There is no proper training or guidance on opening the deeper senses, gaining presence in the other dimensions with good navigation skills, skilful means for transforming negative emotions, ability to communicate with the upper levels, ability to free the maladies of others...

 

All it is is a good form with some nutty cult leader parading around, getting his followers killed.

[Gauss]

I personally Loved the Falun exercises, and moral focus. I practised daily for a couple of years and learned a lot, and gained some 'powers' so to speak. I am annoyed as It is still my favourite and the most powerful form I have so far found. But eventually I had to give it up. I want zero connection with the cultish mentality/frequency of the organisation.

 

Li Hongzhi's insane totalitarian ramblings belong in a nut house, not in the mouth of a spiritual teacher. He really should be locked up before he goes all Jim Jones.

 

Also, as far as genuine spiritual traditions go, Falun is utterly lacking. All it has, is energy and Moral development.

 

There is no proper training or guidance on opening the deeper senses, gaining presence in the other dimensions with good navigation skills, skilful means for transforming negative emotions, ability to communicate with the upper levels, ability to free the maladies of others...

 

All it is is a good form with some nutty cult leader parading around, getting his followers killed.

 

 

Again, you slander Li Hongzhi.

 

Any person can do that and such ill manners do not match the respectful manner of a cultivator(or even an ordinary person for that matter) at all.

 

Every action(good or bad) counts, especially for a cultivator.

 

I quote Immortal4life:

 

"When someone talks a lot of smack about others, it tells you more about the person talking than the people they are talking about."

 

Where do you think all that energy comes from during the Falun exercises?....

 

It never crossed your mind that Li Hongzhi(with his Fashen and Falun), who is the Master, gave you that energy?...

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

[Seth Ananda]

Again, you slander Li Hongzhi.

 

Any person can do that and such ill manners do not match the respectful manner of a cultivator(or even an ordinary person for that matter) at all.

 

Every action(good or bad) counts, especially for a cultivator.

 

I quote Immortal4life:

 

"When someone talks a lot of smack about others, it tells you more about the person talking than the people they are talking about."

 

Where do you think all that energy comes from during the Falun exercises?....

 

It never crossed your mind that Li Hongzhi(with his Fashen and Falun), who is the Master, gave you that energy?...

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

I will warn anyone away from a deluded and manipulative dangerous cult. And I will make sure people know the true colours of its leader.

 

I am sorry that you do not like this, but for me, Its a form of service to warn people.

 

Li could have been a wonderful teacher.

Instead he chose to put himself in a a position of absolute unquestionable Authority, and seems to have no ability to question his Insane assertions.

 

True Mysticism demands the ability to see the subjectivity of ones experiences.

Having the experiences is one thing, but to not be able to see the filter that they come through, ie yourself, is when Mysticism heads straight into ego Inflation, dogma and Delusion.

 

Its fairly obvious to me from Li's writings, that he really believes that what he see's is 100% 'fact' and this is the sign of a weak and unstable mind, that has little of value to offer the world.

 

He is a dangerous man. And a fairly Stupid man. And he is too arrogant to see his faults, and his students will pay dearly for this.

[Jetsun]

 

Where do you think all that energy comes from during the Falun exercises?....

 

It never crossed your mind that Li Hongzhi(with his Fashen and Falun), who is the Master, gave you that energy?...

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

 

Does Li himself say that whatever energy you get from the Falun Qigong comes directly from him rather than just from the exercises on their own? or is that something you individually believe?

[Gauss]

Does Li himself say that whatever energy you get from the Falun Qigong comes directly from him rather than just from the exercises on their own? or is that something you individually believe?

 

Among practitioners it is wellknown and immediately felt when you get the Falun inside your body for the first time. It keeps spinning all the time and it is felt during the exercises.

 

I have seen many people when it happened for them the first time, they were all surprised and some people got dizzy from the sudden effect.

 

/Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever

Edited April 18, 2011 by Gauss

[Gauss]

I will warn anyone away from a deluded and manipulative dangerous cult. And I will make sure people know the true colours of its leader.

 

I am sorry that you do not like this, but for me, Its a form of service to warn people.

 

 

In my opinion I believe people have the capacity to figure out truth on their own. Their truth might be very different from yours.

[Gauss]

The last sentence is highly subjective. That is an opinion, not a absolute truth.

 

 

 

Questioning everything and gaining your own experience is a very sound way of cultivating.

 

 

I agree on your first sentence. Everything I say here is just my opinion and no "truth" whatsoever.

 

One can question anything by oneself during the raising of one´s cultivation level, that is natural. As it stands in Falun Dafa it is a cultivation form where one must enlighten to higher and higher truths and levels by oneself by raising one´s xinxing(mind nature) and body cultivation.

 

If a cultivator openly slanders the Master(or any other people), where is the level of his xinxing? That is a display of self, emotions and jealousy as I see it. As a cultivator you must have compassion for all people("enemies" included).

 

I am not saying Falun Dafa is going to fit all people in the world. But it fits many people and Master Li and his disciples deserve their due respect just like other genuine cultivators do.

 

In fact I reckon Falun Dafa must be experienced, otherwise one knows nothing about it.

 

Nobody can cultivate in Falun Dafa without an iron will and certainly nobody can be forced into it. You are right there too.

 

If one cultivates in Dafa one can not try any other practice as the Gong will be messed up in no time.

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

Edited April 18, 2011 by Gauss

[Seth Ananda]

 

 

I am not saying Falun Dafa is going to fit all people in the world. But it fits many people and Master Li and his disciples deserve their due respect just like other genuine cultivators do.

 

 

Master Li deserves no respect whatsoever. He is a Dangerous cult leader.

 

That is not a position worthy of respect. In fact he embodies some of the most Ignoble and worst traits available to humanity, such as the willingness to be seen as an absolute Authority...

 

Despicable.

[Immortal4life]

When someone hates on something, it's because they already have that hate inside themselves.

[Seth Ananda]

"When someone hates on something, it's because they already have that hate inside themselves."

 

Really Immortal, is that your reply?

 

lol We actually all have everything inside us.

 

This lets even an enlightened person continue to use anger in its righteous expression.

 

Your lame ass attempt to try to make my issues about Falun 'all about me' just failed.

 

A person can see Injustice and corruption, and be appalled in any spectrum of awareness.

 

Only the Corrupt and cowardly will try to use a 'mirror' analogy to make it seem like the corruption is really just within the person who see's it clearly for what it is.

 

People like yourself fear awareness for It shines a Harsh light on the places you dare not look. All you are really Interested in is protecting your own Be[lie]fs.

Beliefs are so not Interesting. What is Interesting is Direct experience, and expanding Awareness.

This is where li Hongzhi could have been great. He has a potentially great system.

He could have said, this is great look what happens when...

Lets see what happens if we...

How much can we be certain about the effects of...

 

In other words he could have approached his teaching as a scientist and a philosopher.

Instead he chose the path of Totalitarian Dictator and supreme Authority.

Which is laughable at best, as he is not even a good teacher, let alone an Enlightened one.

 

Now his sock puppet devotees spent their time cluttering up the Internet with pseudo science, praying on the gullibility and Ignorance in people with random and unrelated prophesy, and hideously dishonest attempts to make any fact that suits them stretch to fit their be[lie]fs.

[Gauss]

A Master is a Master, he runs his cultivation school and as a disciple you follow him or you exit that school - end of story.

 

@Sethananda:

 

Since you have no benevolence, sources or objectivity whatsoever behind your statements about Master Li I believe you do good promotion for Falun Dafa here.

 

I believe people will start to take notice of Dafa when you go into a frenzy spraying all that negative energy around you about the biggest cultivation school on planet earth.

 

Falun Dafa means being kindhearted in your daily life´s actions, caring about all people no matter how bad they are.

 

__________

 

Speaking about why people in general(I am not referring to SethAnanda) become bad people is interesting.

 

As I see it people become bad because their minds have been filled up with dirt(thought karma) over time and then they loose control over their main spirit(which is fundamentally good, kindhearted and innocent).

 

Over time after alot of wrongdoing karma finally rolls all over their body coverring up their little amount of virtue(De) that is left. Finally they loose all contact with the universe´s fundamental characteristics(Truth-Compassion-Forbearance).

 

That is a terrible destiny indeed, and one must feel compassion for such a person.

 

A video about Cultivation, Falun Dafa and being True, Good and Endure:

 

 

 

Let us see a different perspective of Master Li Hongzhi, from a pure, sincere and genuine perspective without any bad thoughts or bad notions.

 

The higher level the more near to absolute truth, that is an absolute principle in this universe as I understand it.

 

This perspective comes from a very high level of a young Dafa practitioner:

 

What a Young Practitioner Saw in Another Dimension While Sending Righteous Thoughts

 

Verbally narrated by a young disciple; edited by the grandmother (also a practitioner)

 

(Clearwisdom.net) My granddaughter Chen Chen is seven years old this year. She is a young Dafa disciple who just started practicing a year ago. Recently she became very diligent in studying the Fa. She quit watching her favorite TV programs. Master opened her celestial eye. Below are some scenes she saw while sending forth righteous thoughts.

 

When Dafa disciples sit cross-legged (in the lotus position) and enter into a tranquil state while sending righteous thoughts, in another dimension, their bodies appear in a sacred state. The gong column above their head shines brightly. The true body sits cross-legged on a lotus flower, flying upwards on the top of one’s own gong column. Some practitioners' whole body itself is a huge, golden, shining gong column that is shooting into the cosmos, towards the main battlefield between good and evil. For other practitioners, their gong column rises up to a certain extent; then a pair of wings appear behind their backs, and they continue to fly upwards.

 

The main battlefield between good and evil in the universe is magnificent. All the positive and negative beings as well as all elements in the universe gather there, forming two major opposing forces. The positive elements have gained the upper hand. Firstly, in front of my eyes, I saw our Master appearing huge and mighty in the cosmos, wearing dazzling, golden clothes. He is turning the Falun with his huge arm. Below, countless righteous gods are gathered, wearing all kinds of attire and carrying different weapons. Their expressions are serious yet sacred. Yet, even more magnificent are the Dafa disciples who have come to assist Master. Their numbers are even greater, too numerous to count. Some come stepping on clouds, some fly with their wings, most arrived sitting on lotus flowers. The lotus flowers are exceptionally beautiful, in all sorts of colors. The lotus flowers also have different layers. Some have a maximum of 10 layers. Generally, Dafa disciples sit on lotus flowers with four to five layers. These are the ones who are more diligent.

 

Although there are many evil, rotten beings and the evil specter of Communism gathered in the battlefield, they are very weak and have lost the battle. Many of them have been destroyed. Dafa disciples engage in battle with these evil beings, holding in their hands all kinds of extraordinary weapons. Some use bows, swords, whips, flying daggers, arrows, and so on. Working together, they destroy the evil. When these evil elements are destroyed, their remains become grey ash floating in the sky like black fog.

 

When sending righteous thoughts, if disciples states of mind are pure and righteous, their backs and palms are held erect, their minds are alert and focused, and in another dimension, their supernormal abilities are strong and powerful. Consequently, many evil elements will be eliminated, thus effectively assisting Master in Fa rectification.

 

When making the lotus flower hand gesture while sending forth righteous thoughts, in another dimension, something similar to a vessel appears inside the practitioner's hands in the lotus flower hand gesture. The vessel contains a sticky liquid-like material. When sending righteous thoughts using the lotus flower gesture, the grey ash remains of the evil beings that are destroyed will be collected into the vessel and dissolved into its origin using the liquid-like material, so that they will not create chaos in the human world again. Everyone gathers the remains into their lotus flower gestures and submerge them into the liquid in their own vessel. After some time, the universe appears clean and bright.

 

If the Dafa disciple minds are not alert and focused while sending righteous thoughts, then the vessels in their lotus flower hand gesture will tip over and the liquid will spill out. The remains of the evil beings will not be thoroughly dissolved and will become alive again, continuing to do evil. If the lotus flower gesture is closed like a flower bud, then the evil remains will not be gathered and they will continue to create chaos in the air.

 

The time spent sending forth righteous thoughts can be long or short. Sometimes disciples send righteous thoughts for only 10 minutes. In another dimension, even before the battle has finished, one has left the battlefield. Many Dafa disciples persist in sending righteous thoughts for 30 to 40 minutes until the universe is clean and bright.

 

Whenever Dafa disciples send righteous thoughts, in another dimension, there is a pen and book used to record the details of sending righteous thoughts, such as the time spent, how much effort is put in, etc. The tip of the pen is shaped like a feather, and the color varies. The color of the book is the same as that of the pen.

 

When Dafa disciples send righteous thoughts, their true bodies dash into the universe to take part in the battle between good and evil, and the pen begins to record the details until the end of sending righteous thoughts. It is the same every time. If one neglects to send righteous thoughts, the pen and book will just stay put.

 

The above is what Chen Chen saw in another dimension and described in detail. The purpose of re-organizing and writing this is to encourage fellow practitioners to put great emphasis on and become serious about sending righteous thoughts, so that we will surely do better in future.

 

_____________________________________

 

Just my two cents at my level, no truth offered whatsoever.

Edited April 19, 2011 by Gauss

[Gauss]

Speaking of expressing inner beauty on a stage Shen Yun(initiated by Master Li Hongzhi) is a remarkable show touring the world as we speak.

 

I link some video clips here, amazing stuff:

 

http://www.shenyunperformingarts.org/videos

 

 

/Truthfulness-Compassion-Forbearance is good

Edited April 21, 2011 by Gauss

[paulno]

The fact that Falun Dafa believes in a racially segregated afterlife sounds a lot like apartheid. Bothered me greatly when I read that.

 

I could be wrong, but in my view, that's not what an enlightened leader should be teaching people.

[C T]

Hi Mr Gauss,

 

Really.... life is quite simple. Spirituality? Even simpler still.

 

Why all the stories? Why all the words?

 

The more you expound, the greater the potential for remaining defensive, not to mention open you to ridicule and inaccuracy.

 

What i do not grab is why this fervent 'aggrandization' (word?) of your path? Speak your truth, and it will be heard when its kept quiet and infused with simplicity.

 

Each time i read your post it feels as if i am being pounded by an invisible, yet tangible battering ram. Not nice.

 

Why not try acceptance and forbearance for a change, in real time, with real affection, and embrace what others say, without elevating your master as if he was some sort of luciferian figure? From where i stand, its not clear that you are making any attempt to empathize with your fellow brothers and sisters here, and this shortcoming needs to be examined if you are to continue making acceptance and forbearance the cornerstones of your belief.

 

I sincerely apologize for my failure here. Had resolved not to comment on this thread anymore, but seeing the manner in which you had responded to Seth Ananda's views, which happens to be valid on the whole, i found it hard to remain silent, knowing full well that that is the most viable and benefitting option.

[Gauss]

The fact that Falun Dafa believes in a racially segregated afterlife sounds a lot like apartheid. Bothered me greatly when I read that.

 

I could be wrong, but in my view, that's not what an enlightened leader should be teaching people.

 

The heavens have their conditions of life and everything in this universe exists for a reason.

 

How can people judge the "heavens" based on the current life conditions of modern human society?

 

A Master teaches truth, a higher form of truth, whether people can accept it or not is up to them. When one ascends in meditation one will see truth about the heavens and having notions is useless in my opinion.

 

 

I remember the Hopi indians talked about different tasks in the cosmos for the different races.

 

The conditions of the heavens has nothing to do with current society and Falun Dafa has many practitioners with mixed marriages, tolerance is an important aspect of cultivation.

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

[Gauss]

[adept]

[Gauss]

How does Zen discuss or refuse to discuss ?

What, in your opinion, is the Dharma ?

What is Zen ?

Who is dragging this corpse around ?

 

I should not talk about Zen Buddhism here but it is well known they want people to enlighten by themselves through meditation. Bodhidarma made some interpretations of the Buddhist teachings and that is how Zen came about.

 

My Dharma("Fa" in Falun Dafa) is Zhuan Falun with all other scriptures from Master Li Hongzhi as a complement.

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

 

PS: THE ZEN monk Bodhidharma asked, "Why explain Sutras?"

 

A teacher, "To end birth and death."

 

Bodhidharma said, "The words are black and the paper is white. How does this teach people to end birth and death?"

 

The other reddened and raged, "You are slandering the Dharma!" struck him across the mouth with an iron rod and knocked loose two teeth.

[Immortal4life]

Happy World Falun Dafa Day!!!

[Seth Ananda]

A Master is a Master, he runs his cultivation school and as a disciple you follow him or you exit that school - end of story.

 

@Sethananda:

 

Since you have no benevolence, sources or objectivity whatsoever behind your statements about Master Li I believe you do good promotion for Falun Dafa here.

 

I believe people will start to take notice of Dafa when you go into a frenzy spraying all that negative energy around you about the biggest cultivation school on planet earth.

 

Just my two cents at my level, no truth offered whatsoever.

 

Fantastic reply!

No Gauss, through my benevolence I bring awareness to the true Nature of a manipulative cult [which I have direct personal experience with], thus protecting Innocent seekers from the clutches of people like you, who would have someone cease all ability to rationalize and think for them selves.

You Gauss, who write prolifically, yet demonstrate no ability to actually dialogue with another, by truly engaging each point brought up in healthy discussion, you would lead people into a Dodgy cult, and have them give all their power away to the perceptions of a megalomaniac lying unstable cult leader.

 

In the many valid points made against Falun, you fail to seriously look at them, or discuss the finer points of them to see if they really have merit - or none. Instead you just deny the point, and then spew out some mindless dogma, or a stupid quote from the Epoch times rubbish magazine.

 

In other words you are an unthinking fanatic, incapable of discourse.

 

What's more, you hide behind your false humility and virtue, and use it to denigrate anyone who dissagree's with your perspective.

My Virtue is somehow wanting, because I continue to warn people on your thread about the Cult you represent.

 

Falun focuses heavily on developing the virtues, and that is admirable. I will never disparage that. Unfortunately, It also offers mindless obedience, a whole host of socially negative attitudes, an Inability to question the Infallibility of the crazy leader. I am sorry but the negatives far out way the positives.

 

Falun also tells people it is a complete system of development which it is not even close to being.

No one not even the master, will ever become enlightened by practicing Falun.

As a system It is seriously lacking. Only someone who has explored the many rich and diverse traditions on our planet, and who has got to see the Incredible depth that these traditions have, Including the specific stages of Instruction for Students at the different levels of Consciousness, will be able to clearly just how massively undeveloped Falun is, as a spiritual system.

 

 

Seth Ananda.

[paulno]

The heavens have their conditions of life and everything in this universe exists for a reason.

 

How can people judge the "heavens" based on the current life conditions of modern human society?

 

A Master teaches truth, a higher form of truth, whether people can accept it or not is up to them. When one ascends in meditation one will see truth about the heavens and having notions is useless in my opinion.

 

 

I remember the Hopi indians talked about different tasks in the cosmos for the different races.

 

The conditions of the heavens has nothing to do with current society and Falun Dafa has many practitioners with mixed marriages, tolerance is an important aspect of cultivation.

 

Just my two cents, no truth offered whatsoever.

Again, so all the people of mixed race are just in limbo? Segregation is ignorant and hurtful. BTW I'm not saying you or your master are racists.

 

But, segregation certainly is (racist) without a doubt. I have trouble believing the afterlife is about as advanced as 1940s Louisiana.

[Oolong Rabbit]

For the record, I have no affiliation with Falun Dafa, nor do I plan to. I have heard many bad things said about the organization and Li Hongzhi, and I have no idea if any of it is true or not. Instead I opted to read Zhuan Falun with an open mind. I just finished the first chapter, and in my opinion Li Hongzhi is definitely sharing very high level teachings. I can understand how some of this information would really piss off people that hold attachments to certain views.

 

Anyhow, this is just my opinion. I am not looking for a debate or argument.

[Guest sykkelpump]

Why use so much energy on li Hongzhi and what he says.The system itself is easy to learn free and imo very very good.People can just practice from the videos on youtube and dont care about the rest.Seth Ananda even said he got some siddhis (superpowers) from practicing Falun Gong

[time to change]

Why use so much energy on li Hongzhi and what he says.The system itself is easy to learn free and imo very very good.People can just practice from the videos on youtube and dont care about the rest.Seth Ananda even said he got some siddhis (superpowers) from practicing Falun Gong

all i got to say is falun dafa is the real deal u just got to meditaate or u wont get any results